TL Mafia XLIV
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Pyo
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On August 19 2011 09:32 Kurumi wrote: If Navillus answers incorrectly or does not respond till 9:45 KST You can answer it. This crap should not be allowed... if he continues it I'll be happy to join along and vote for Kurumi. @ Navillus: In general, I have a strong suspicion of people who open up games with long policy posts - yeah it might be a null read, but they're a great way for mafia to establish town cred. The part that I find very troubling about declaring that you'll be the official lurker-tracker is that being a lurker tracker is an easy way for a mafia to maintain post counts and "contribute" without really contributing. | ||
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On August 19 2011 18:56 Erandorr wrote: Oh and lastly we should at least try to keep the fluff out of the posts. There were so many posts were you could esentially drop more then half of the text without losing any of its meaning. For some people this will be TL:DR I really wish you would take your own advice. ----------------------------------- I'm actually inclined to agree with Palmar regarding Dropbear. Policy posts at the start of games are kind of scummy. HOWEVER, I don't think there is anything about DB's posts that are more scummy than other posts, and I've seen how Palmar plays scum... | ||
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oh the irony.... | ||
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On August 20 2011 03:16 DropBear wrote: Ok so the thread so far consists of people making riddles, silly accusations and parrotting "lurkers are bad". This shit needs to stop. Noone has said ANYTHING of value yet. I made a post about this but the issue was ignored so here goes. THE GRAND DESIGN - This game has the possibility of no-lynches - No-lynches are generally anti-town - We need a system to ensure they do not happen - I propose that we elect an unofficial mayor to decide how to break ties close to deadline, should a no-lynch look likely. Such a person will be responsible for choosing who changes their votes and how it is done, or alternatively they will take on the responsibility of being the person who changes their vote to ensure a lynch takes place. - Such a person needs to be willing to cop criticism and cannot be a total fuckwit. Hopefully non-mafia as well They will not be required to do anything if a lynch looks like going ahead. - I nominate myself for the position. I am decisive, active, capable of good reasoning and most importantly I am town. I don't know if this had worked in a previous game, but this sounds like a really dangerous (or stupid) idea. I'm not really sure which is scummier, DB and his policy posts/proposal or Palmar jumping on him so arbitrarily. Especially with Palmar also preemptively defending himself in case we actually kill off DB: On August 20 2011 03:10 Palmar wrote: And of course Nard's post is hella scummy if you flip town, it means he's trying to set me up as a follow up lynch, which is potentially really good for mafia. | ||
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On August 20 2011 09:57 Foolishness wrote: I say we don't kill Palmar today. His goofy attitude can easily be explained that he's town. He just claimed mafia in Personality (let's say he's not lying), which means he just played two games as mafia recently: Personality and PTP2. Both games he attempted to be normal and blend in; there wasn't any of this odd posting. I don't think he would radically change his style like this if he was mafia again. Going to start the count because I know it's coming: # people who accuse me of defending my scumbuddy: 0 Well if you go back a little further to SNMMV, (where he was mafia), you'll see him playing like he is in this game. I'm not saying that he's mafia this game, but basing scum reads solely off of previous games is NOT a reliable way to go. | ||
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On August 20 2011 17:20 Palmar wrote: I think it's kinda scummy to call out Curu on using fuck twice in the same sentence while you have this in your signature... "life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery" By the way, BrownBear is the person I want dead today. I'm not sure how to interpret what Foolishness is saying, but at least he's right. woah, woah, woah... BrownBear? I thought you wanted DropBear dead? | ||
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On August 21 2011 03:58 hiro protagonist wrote: Voting Sevryn for now, as a no lynch is bad. how much time is there before the day ends i'll vote for him for more or less the same reason, although he certainly did look somewhat scummy. | ||
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On August 21 2011 06:42 GreYMisT wrote: It stands for "Wine in front of me" its from the movie princess bride. Though i dont understand it completely myself, its a situation that arises that is confusing because of circular logic, for example if bob is being tunneled and the person tunneling him dies at night, you could say well he must be mafia. but the mafia would want you to think that so what if they killed the tunneller to frame bob. but what if bob knew that.... if anyone has an explination that makes more sense please post it On August 21 2011 05:44 Jackal58 wrote: Which choice is that? I'm unvoting Sevryn. As I previously stated he has not set off any bells with what he had posted but by his disappearance. I'm confused. What do you mean by this? What exactly has changed that would warrant you changing your vote? The only thing I can see is that he's received the critical mass to actually have a lynch so he'll get lynched even if you change your vote. Are you trying to cover your tracks for if/when he flips green? | ||
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On August 22 2011 02:13 Curu wrote: Don't do that Palmar. We've had one mislynch, this game is far from over. At least you don't have to deal with 99999 post restrictions this game. I'm pretty sure he's being facetious... | ||
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On August 24 2011 07:02 Pyo wrote: had no internet for a day... im caught up to page 55, gonna place my vote on Mig, but i might change it if I finish reading the thread before the deadline. Wow, DT claim into medic claim? I don't think I believe him, but then again, if he's for real, he'll be dead by the hands of the mafia. I'm going to keep my vote on Mig. He's gone with the "I'm burned out on mafia" defense of his posting into one-liners, which is as scummy as anyone else here (except for DB's role claiming). That said, I don't think he's going to get enough votes to actually be lynched. | ||
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On August 24 2011 21:42 Palmar wrote: Do I have to go back to find the post? He wrote a big post about simply being fed up with mafia. I believed him because I've played quite a bit with Mig, enough to know that it's very unlike him to try and use excuses like that if he was scum. He's much more likely to be genuine and be town. In addition, his posting dramatically improved in the latter half of the last tday. but you don't find his change of heart to be scummy? Suddenly starting to put extra effort into posting after having "genuinely" stated that he's burned out – is that part of his meta too? | ||
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On August 25 2011 17:14 Mig wrote: Jackal was convinced chaos was scum and 100% would have followed along with palmar's plan to lynch chaos today. Pretty good motivation to kill someone. I am hunting you down chaos! that is total WIFOM. In fact, isn't this precisely the scenario used to explain how WIFOM in mafia games works? it feels like Mig's grasping at straws here. On August 25 2011 20:56 chaos13 wrote: Oh and in case nobody has realized, we are at LYLO right now. Seems strange with 21 players left, but 6 mafia vs. 15 town with 3 kills each night. If we don't get mafia today it's only a matter of time til it's done. Um... that's not LYLO... we have at least 2 days of no mafia lynches before lylo - not saying that we can afford to keep killing town, but there's no need to panic. "it's only a matter of time til it's done" was just as true before the game even began... Are you trying to blue-fish? Both chaoser and Mig feel scummy to me, although based on their interaction with each other I'm not sure they can both actually be scum. I'll stick with my vote from yesterday. ##vote: Mig | ||
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On August 28 2011 11:11 chaoser wrote: Alright guys, since foolishness has fallen, I fear soon for my life... I am a DT Inquisitor - welcome to TL Mafia XLIV you are High Inquisitor Scarn, here in liquidia on independent assignment to lead the actions against the cult. You are perhaps the oldest living inquisitor, and with age comes experience and wisdom . You scorn weapons as below the dignity of an Inquisitor, instead you will use your investigative abilities to crush the cult.You may check a player each night and see if he is Innocent or Guilty . Be cautious however, ever since you took a blow to the head while facing off against the Deamon Lord Sepultus in the ancient abandoned temple of the burning flame you have been unsure of the reliability of your investigative abilities and even of your grasp on reality. I checked Mig night one and got back guilty which is why I've been on his ass for so long. To check my own sanity I checked Foolishness night two and got back green so I know I'm sane. When mig flipped red it proved it beyond a doubt. I checked vain last night and got back [r]red[/r]. I say we lynch vain today over since I'm more sure of his scumminess over nard's. EDITTED: in exactly how my pm looks why would you claim now of all times... you have a whole day to push for a vain lynch and now you're dead tonight. Oh well, I guess we should at least make use of your inevitable death and lower mafia kp to 2 and force them to double tap you. #vote: Vain | ||
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On August 30 2011 14:16 wherebugsgo wrote: What info does lynching vain give us? I can't see at any point, where vain has been linked to anyone. Lynching bum first will tell us Pyo is almost definitely mafia. I guess it's just a formality on that, since if we think bum is mafia we don't need to see him flip to know Pyo is mafia, but w/e. Also, if we lynch bum first and he turns out to be the framer then what? What does bum have anything to do with me? Actually, I think it's about time I just go ahead and finally claim... I'm a DT: Inquisitor - welcome to TL Mafia XLIV you are Inquisitor Agmar, while you are fairly young, your actions against the cult of the Weeping Thorns have quickly ascended you to a position of importance, while you are not the most skilled combatant, in this case stealth and investigation, not violence is what is called for. Every night you may investigate a player and see if he is Innocent or Guilty . However ever since you decapitated the Mummy Prince Ozimandious in his tomb and were infected with plagueworms you aren't sure your investigations are reliable, as the pain may have wrapped your perception of reality. Now, I was going to wait a little bit longer to post this (I've been sitting on it for a while now - was waiting to confirm my sanity before saying anything), but I'm convinced that Wherebugsgo is scum, probably Godfather. all of his lynch candidates/pushes have been wrong... sevryn, hiro, iGrok, etc. He only went after Mig when it was extremely likely that he was going to be lynched sooner or later. His long analysis of Mig is pretty damning. Most of his arguments about Mig are really thin and hinge on WIFOM assuming Mig is "a really good player". It was also completely over-kill in terms of what was necessary to convince people at that time. Also just filtering his post you might be convinced that he was the one who initiated the lynch of Mig when in fact he's just going along with it. throughout the game he's been working his way into a leadership position for town, however in reality he's been pushing people that are now confirmed innocent or was just following along with the Mig bandwagon. And now we get to your analysis of bum, which is kind of "huh? really?" Not really sure how you get "i framed Vain" from "I assumed vain would be the good lynch to certify chaoser faster, but if hes gonna get shot tonight anyway it doesn't make a difference to me, both vain and nard are scum." In fact, that little translation was probably your biggest slip up: Translation here: "I assumed that we could lynch vain, who I framed, so that he would flip green. Then we could lynch chaoser tomorrow, and because I'm mafia I know he'd flip blue. During the night we'd kill two other townies in the case vain gets lynched. However, I don't give a shit because I know they're both town, so we can lynch nard instead of vain, chaoser will die tonight in this case and then we do a mislynch anyway tomorrow by lynching vain." so bumatlarge is mafia and knows that both vain and nard are town? Huh, really? how can you even say that? It was pretty clear that Nard is scum thanks to Foolishness. I suppose the possibility of a frame still exists for Vain, but that just seems really far-fetched since it would almost certainly be safer for the mafia to frame one of the scum to appear green than hoping someone happened to investigate your target. I encourage all of you to actually go back and read all of WBG's posts and think about what he's been posting and the timing of his posting. | ||
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On August 31 2011 00:51 Barundar wrote: You are a dt... Who thinks that his prime suspect is the godfather... lol So who did you check what nights and have you established your sanity? And why would you claim during nighttime when no mafia in their right mind would ever shoot the most hardcore lurker? My suspicion of WBG has nothing to do with my blue power, just my analysis of how he's been acting. I've only been in one mafia game that had a godfather before, and he's been acting in a similar manner. As for why claim during nighttime, well exactly because they wouldn't shoot the most hardcore lurker... and because there's another DT claim. Mafia have 2KP so they can't kill us both if there's still a medic. They can try to shoot both of us and one of us will definitely live or they can split their votes and still have one of us definitely live. Claiming right now seems to be perfectly safe. Night 1 - jackal Night 2 - Vain Night 3 - Erandorr As for my sanity, if chaoser is really a DT and really is sane, then I know my sanity as well since we checked Vain on different nights. | ||
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On August 31 2011 01:02 Barundar wrote: Yea vain is mafia, but wbg is clear town. Pyo just outted himself in an attempt to get him killed. If I were mafia and wanted WBG killed, I'd just kill him. | ||
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On August 31 2011 00:55 chaos13 wrote: I'm not liking the skepticism on Vain. It sprung up out of nowhere with very little explanation. I'm thinking mafia is behind it. skepticism on Vain came from WBG and largely due to his rather arbitrary assertion that Bum was the mafia framer who just happened to frame Vain (2 nights in a row apparently). | ||
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On August 31 2011 01:19 Barundar wrote: Shitiest fake claim I've ever seen. At least give us the results of said checks. And while you are here, I'd love to hear your thoughts on Bumatlarge, Vain, Kurumi and Rayzorflash please. bumatlarge - no idea really, I thought BB was scum, but the sub (and the need to be subbed in the first place) has thrown me off so I don't really know. WBG's analysis of him felt like bullshit though. Vain - I voted for him after having checked him, what do you think I think of him? kurumi - As far as I'm concerned he isn't even playing this game. I don't read his posts - I might have an aneurism if I actually do. Rayzorflash - I feel like he's scum. I checked errandor for more or less the same reason I am suspicious of rayzor - somewhat late bandwagon votes on mig and lurking nearly as much as me. Also, checking jackal night 1 did not confirm my sanity since naive DT's will return green for everyone. | ||
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On August 31 2011 01:43 supersoft wrote: this looks like a DB-DT-claim to me. Fake and extremely distracting. distracting from what? it's night time... there's nothing to distract from. | ||
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On August 31 2011 15:09 Barundar wrote: The only thing that bothers me about Pyo is he claim DT at night, which could be a shitty attempt of trying to draw a hit, which I didn't consider before I called BS on it. But that would mean he had to write his flavor text himself, since GM only give fake flavor to mafia, and the flavor text looks very convincing. I'm leaning mafia on him unless he make a bloody good case for his innocence. I've been ignoring VE for a long time, but I like WBG's points against him upon re-reading. I'll have to look more into him, but we might end up at a point where he is simply the only one left I don't have a town read on . Btw why the hell is mafia not RB'ing you? DING DING DING, we have a winrar. I know I had been lurking a bunch as I tried to figure out my sanity, but once chaoser came out and claimed, I knew I was a naive DT (every check, including Vain, has returned green) xtfftc returned green. I figured the best I could do was try to draw the hit away from chaoser or at least put off the death of a confirmed sane DT for another day. I am not quite sure what to make of both of us still being alive and neither of us being role blocked - my guess is that they were hunting for a medic. | ||
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On August 31 2011 22:09 supersoft wrote: well, i am not sure about BB. I think we should stick to vain who is in my eves definetely scummier. my mafialist is: xtfftc, rayzorflash, vain, BB why do you keep saying BB? BB is not in the game anymore... Pretty clear willful ignorance of what is actually going on in this game... | ||
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On September 01 2011 07:23 chaoser wrote: Case For Pyo: Pyo has posted very little, most of which have been either responses to other player's ideas, rewordings of what others have said or questions. He never took any opinions of his own and hasn't contributed to town in the least, merely posting but not actually posting. But the thing I want to focus the most on is his DT Claim. In his first part of his claim yesterday, he states: Which all seem to paint a picture that he knows exactly what sanity he is (sane). He even says he checked Vain and his result agreed with mine, suggesting that he was a sane DT and his checks were correct. What doesn't make sense is that when I stated that I checked Vain and he came out red, Pyo came up right behind the idea and voted for Vain, even though the previous day he had checked Vain himself and gotten green (since he now claims he is a naive DT). Even if he wasn't sure of his sanity, you'd think he'd be a least a little bit wary of what I said But he got behind me as quickly as I claimed, pushing for Vain to be lynched. Even now he pushes for vain's lynch even though wherebugsgo has posted his tracker list that highly suggests that bum is indeed a framer (now I understand why wherebugsgo was so sure of that argument). This added to the fact that he refused to give us his results, claimed DT at night to try to shape today's lynch to go towards Vain, and continue to push the idea after wherebugsgo has given us his track list, suggests that he is mafia pushing for a vain mislynch. We'll know for certain after this day's lynch cycle if there is a framer flip but I suggest a lynch for Pyo on the next day cycle. No you've got it wrong. I got green every time, however if I came out and said that to everyone I'm obviously naive and the whole point of claiming (to draw the hit away from you) would be completely moot. The only problem is that if I actually had gotten red read on anyone after having checked Jackal and gotten green, I'd know that I would be sane (since jackal flipped green). But in reality, I only got green so I didn't know I was naive until you confirmed yourself to be sane and revealed your check of someone I had checked. SO, if you are telling the truth and the extremely unlikely situation of Vain getting framed didn't happen then I am naive and no more useful than a green townie who had been lurking (I had been lurking because I wanted to stay under the radar since I was blue - but whatever). Long story short, I'm a useless townie who with no cred for having lurked most of the game. So I decided to try to make myself useful in some way by trying to draw a hit from a "confirmed" sane DT. I posted my flavor text to prove to mafia that I am DT (only they can get a safe claim and they know I'm not one of them). I then tried to be cryptic about what my reads actually were so they wouldn't automatically know that I am naive, while trying to imply that your read on vain was correct - note that the reason I even checked him in the first place was because I thought he was scummy, which is why I was happy to go along with your vote. I really would have liked (and still would like) to see him flip red, to confirm chaoser as being truthful and to absolutely confirm my sanity. I was truthful about who I checked because I was worried if I totally pulled something out of my ass it would look really bad, especially given the number of watchers/noisy neighbors/etc in this game (by the way, if you are a watcher and can confirm that i am telling the truth, DO NOT CLAIM - there's no point and I'm not trying to blue fish here either). Basically, mafia knew/know my claim was truthful, but mafia last night would not know whether my checks were truthful, and therefore shouldn't have been able to confirm my sanity. This at worst forces mafia to have to make a decision about whether to kill me, kill chaoser, kill neither of us, waste a role block on me, or whatever. Right or wrong, I don't think I could have played the situation any better given that I had been lurking for most of the game to that point. If you really don't believe me, go ahead and lynch me then look very carefully at the reactions (or lack thereof) to my night claim. Notice who is up front about saying "you're full of shit, mafia must be desperate" and who says, "um yeah, sure. He must be lying, yeah." Keep in mind that mafia know I am telling the truth given my flavor text. I don't want to bias your impressions by naming names yet, but I feel like there are some people who legitimately don't believe me, and others who "don't believe me" because that's the "in" thing to do. (of course there's also RayzorFlash, VisceraEyes, Navillus, and Curu who had nothing to say and have all but disappeared from the game long before I made any claim.) Finally, if you want to get an idea of where I was coming from by my claim, go look at SNMMIV. | ||
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On August 31 2011 10:57 wherebugsgo wrote: hmm... foolishness ? mig -----> jackal bum -----> vain ?? I shall vote bum. + Show Spoiler + *crosses fingers* herpaderp... just noticed this... as much as I'd like to see vain flip. ##vote bumatlarge I'm gonna totally be kicking myself if it turns out I'm actually sane... | ||
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On September 01 2011 22:51 xtfftc wrote: Why would mafia post this during nighttime and then kill WBG? Surely if mafia wanted us to believe Pyo's claim, they would have kept WBG alive or told Pyo to accuse someone else. The only way I see for both BB/Bum and Pyo to be mafia is that they are constantly arguing with each other with the hope that after one of them flips red, the other will have more town cred. But the DT claim still doesn't make sense.. If BB/Bum flips red tonight, I'd be inclined to give Pyo some more time. Seriously, where is the connection between me and BB/Bum coming from... People have been saying this all game... | ||
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On September 01 2011 22:51 xtfftc wrote: Pyo put more effort into justifying his plan than in executing the plan itself - and it sounds to me as if the idea only occured to him after some of us suggested that he was trying to draw the attention away from somebody else. He also refused to comment on Kurumi, whom I am still suspicious of. Read SNMMIV... I didn't refuse to comment on Kurumi, I refused to acknowledge that he's playing in this game. Kurumi is an obnoxious, spammy player that always seems scummy - any read on him is a null read. I don't really believe anything he's said or that he actually is what he claimed to be, but chaoser checked him and got green, so assuming chaoser isn't lying, there's nothing else to say about him. | ||
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On September 02 2011 00:51 Barundar wrote: Pyo you still haven't given your last check (the one from last night). Yes I did!!! xtffftc came back green... | ||
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First of all, the "filter" option for mafia games needs to be removed. People are being lazy and it is deteriorating the level of play for mafia game analysis. Rather than looking at the context surrounding posts (the "why" of what people are saying), people are only looking at individual posts (the "what"). And that is really bad. Take Curu's "analysis" of me No, I absolutely wasn't saying BrownBear shouldn't be lynched, I was saying "why was Palmar suddenly changing FoS target?" You would know this if you were actually reading the thread as it was happening. On September 03 2011 03:06 Curu wrote: I'm confused. What do you mean by this? What exactly has changed that would warrant you changing your vote? The only thing I can see is that he's received the critical mass to actually have a lynch so he'll get lynched even if you change your vote. Are you trying to cover your tracks for if/when he flips green? Trying to set up Jackal for a fall after Sevyrn's flip.[/QUOTE] Are you kidding? All I am doing is calling out jackal's undeclared/explained change of opinion. That isn't going to set anyone up to take the fall for anything. And if I was, why would mafia abandon this plan by kiling jackal night 2? Again, curu is reading an individual post without takign the context of the thread into account. On September 03 2011 03:06 Curu wrote: He does vote for Mig but very reluctantly and with "buts" all over the place. While voting for Mig in this post, he also tries to tell us to find someone else to lynch because he doesn't think Mig will get a majority: Again, taken out of context of the thread... This was 4 hours before the deadline and I had just gotten back from having no internet for a while. I was the 5th vote on Mig, 14 were required to lynch. In case you don't remember the night 2 vote counts. In fact, Mig wasn't even lynched that night, so yeah, I didn't think Mig would get a majority, and in fact didn't get one. As for the voting for Vain, I was the 3rd person to vote and first person to vote for vain, I just didn't change my vote, part because it didn't matter and part because vain flipping red would have confirmed my sanity. Also if you recall, the entire thread was convinced that both nard and vain were scum given chaoser's DT claim and WBG not yet having given the results of his watching. There was nothing scummy about having voted for vain if you actually consider the thread. No offense Curu, but your posts had little if anything to do with Vain being considered scummy by people. The fact that 2 DT's independently checked him means he was being plenty scummy. In retrospect, it makes sense that mafia would want to frame a scummy looking town. On September 02 2011 03:05 Curu wrote: Just got back from my trip to Montreal, still a little hungover. I'd like to lynch bum then Pyo, remember that thing I typed way back when DB fakeclaimed DT about how claiming naive/insane DT is a great play for Mafia? Yeah. Convenient that the claim comes out after he's finally being called out for lurking all game and how it perfectly gives him an excuse to be a lurker. If bum flips red I'm pretty sure Pyo is red too, especially if Vain is Town (he was one of the first/only to vote Vain over nard). Also this is the dumbest reason to soft defend anyone I've ever seen. I'll also take this opportunity to defend my assessment of WBG. I said that WBG's analysis of Bum was bullshit, and yeah it was. Everything he was saying was total grasping at straws. Basically, WBG knew that Bum was scum because of his blue power. His "analysis" was simply a way to push for bum being scum without directly coming out and saying, "hey everyone, I'm a blue and bum is scum." I interpreted it as shady analysis with an agenda, and I was right in a sense. However, I thought it was because he was mafia trying to push something - turns out he was a blue trying to push something. In any case take a look at how people responded to my claim: Lucidity: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169223 - asks for checks http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169895 - says that I got red from vain Barnudar: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169230 - asks a bunch of questions http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169325 - thinks I outed myself to get wbg killed http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169502 - pressures me to give results of checks http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169743 - says I am lying chaos13: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169261 - makes a 1-liner post 15 minutes after my claim ignoring my claim Erandorr: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169619 - thinks that me checking jackal night 1 confirms my sanity Kurumi: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169627 - random BS supersoft: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11169739 - compares my claim to DB's as being fake (note DB's wasn't fake) Varpulis: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11170060 - criticizes my claim timing xtfftc: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11170079 - thinks my claim is a mafia suiciding bumatlarge: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11170273 - going along with the bandwagon saying that my claim is fake Those are all the people to speak up to the first confirmed scum said anything. After this point anyone saying anything could possibly be scum weighing in. Now, think about this all from the mafia perspective for a second here. What do they know? They know that bum framed Vain night 3. They know I'm not lying about being a DT because I posted my flavor text. I could be lying about my checks however since they have no idea where I actually have been. Now given bum's response, it's clear that mafia has decided that they are going to direct the next lynch to me since it's clear that the momentum of town is toward not believing me. Ok, so what do we learn from individuals' reactions. Well, first of all: 1. Barnudar is probably town. He is extremely aggressive in calling me out as a liar, before I even gave my checks - scum would be at least somewhat hesitant to go after me given my flavor text. 2. chaos13 is extremely suspicious. He posted 15 minutes after my claim, which means he was at least active in following what was going on, but didn't comment on my claim at all. In fact, the next thing he posted was actually this, where he suggests lynching me over Bum. Also look at his next post. If I'm so likely to be scum, why does my claiming to be DT have any influence over anything? This is a contradiction in behavior. Also, go back further through chaos13's history and you'll find this little gem. Chaos13 was trying to make town panic by saying that we were in LYLO, when we were nowhere close to it. And if you read the thread, basically this whole LYLO nonsense came at a time where Mig was in the hotseat. Making people doubt their voting and being worried about voting the wrong person is a great way to defend another scum without actually defending them. And now finally, there's this post: On September 01 2011 21:44 bumatlarge wrote: Et tu pyo? Would scum really say somethign retarded like that about another scum member? Yeah sure you can write that off as WIFOM, but scum wouldn't put themselves in a WIFOM situation. Whatever, if you all really still think I'm scum so be it. Just after I flip, go back and actually read the thread and think about WHY people are saying what they are saying, not just WHAT people are saying. | ||
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I was going to write up more analysis of them but i ran out of time. | ||
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RayzorFlash returned innocent. I'm pretty sure now that I'm a naive DT, so I'll add Erandorr back to my suspects list. | ||
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On September 03 2011 11:13 chaoser wrote: Mafia's at 3 players right now, if we lynch another mafia today then they'll be at 1 kp. Would they want to kill 1 dude today or 2 dudes today? Think about it. especially given that they have a roleblocker, this was the obvious move on their part. | ||
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If you all are going to lynch me not much more I can do to stop it... I've stated my defense as well as I can, but when I flip blue, I think it's pretty clear who should really be lynched. ##vote: chaoser | ||
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On September 03 2011 21:01 Jackal58 wrote: Someday I hope to still be playing on page 110. You aren't missing anything. Optimal winning strategy for scum in TL Mafia: 1. Identify people who actually read the thread. 2. Systematically eliminate them 3. Act blatantly scummy and set up fake claims to mock the town that just gets sheeped around. 4. Snicker and laugh with each other in the mafia QT when no one believes a truthful DT claim. | ||
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On September 03 2011 17:01 xtfftc wrote: I am now way more comfortable with lynching Rayzor than I was before. I am actually starting to think that Rayzor might not be scum - regardless, this statement doesn't indicate scumminess unless you are dead-set on believing chaoser is town, which town really shouldn't be. I was wrong about chaos13, so I certainly could have been wrong about Rayzor. On September 03 2011 17:01 xtfftc wrote: You just defended Chaoser after Rayzor's attempt to compromise him and now you make a 180° turn. You stated that Rayzor is a likely red; then you checked him and got innocent back, which made you think that you are naive indeed - and then completely forgot about your suspect and decided to join him in discrediting Chaoser? I didn't completely forget that, but rather it just occurred to me that my biggest mistake might have been the assumption that Chaoser was telling the truth. This should allay my concerns: As a roleblocker, are you obligated to roleblock someone? If someone is roleblocked, but does not have a role, are they informed of the roleblock? On September 03 2011 17:01 xtfftc wrote: A DT wants to confirm their sanity as soon as possible. Chaoser confirming himself on Night 2 was not convenient - it was imperative. You fake-claimed and this is why you are "pretty sure" that you are naive on Day 6. what was suspicious wasn't that he had found a way to "confirm" himself, but rather that he would just happen to have investigated the target of the frame. And I didn't fake claim. On September 03 2011 17:01 xtfftc wrote: Why would a townie not want to help us reach the correct conclussions? And then why would the said townie spent most of their long post on defending himself instead of actually contributing? I don't really have any town cred, so me say "hey guys, I'm innocent and here's why..." is just as likely to be written off by people as "meh whaterver, scum just trying to manipulate town. I would rather people actually look at the game and make their decisions based on their own analysis rather than rely on it being spoon-fed to them. On September 03 2011 17:01 xtfftc wrote: I did actually read the thread before posting my analysis on you earlier. Palmar had five posts about BB already: 1 2 3 4 5, yet you only reacted to the last one. Curu was correct to point this out as mafia behaviour. What are you talking about? Here is what he said in those 5 posts you linked: On August 20 2011 03:51 Palmar wrote: Also, you seem to be advocating lynching lurkers quite heavily. Care to elaborate on that? On August 20 2011 03:53 Palmar wrote: I just want to point out I now think Brownbear is scum too. On August 20 2011 03:53 Palmar wrote: I bolded the scum-logic part. On August 20 2011 04:05 Palmar wrote: Well, I read that as any scummy asshole with a plan is going to get a free bye on day 1, because you want to lynch someone inactive? Or does, the free pass on making plans and blanket statements to avoid the lynch only extend to a specific pool of people? Why would I respond to pointless one-liners? On September 03 2011 17:01 xtfftc wrote: You were willing to lynch a townie to confirm yourself as being a naive (i.e. useless) DT? I didn't (and don't) know that Vain is town. Him flipping would inform me of my sanity, so I wasn't going to go out of my way to prevent vain from flipping. | ||
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Just go ahead and lynch me. Now start thinking about who you will lynch next. If you all are wrong, we'll be in LYLO, so you can't make anymore mistakes. If I am scum, then you should be thinking about who my scum buddies are. There are some guys who have been far bigger lurkers than I have been (even before my claim). Navillus had some crazy mayor idea at the beginning of the game, then totally disappeared when it got shot down, yet somehow manages to sort of pop in here and there. Supersoft has been extremely wishy-washy on whether he believes me or not. At one point mocking me for being bad and at one point saying he actually believed me then going back to saying that I was lying. When was the last time VisceraEyes said anything? Same with Erandorr. Look at this post and the quoted post within it: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11219469 If I am going to be lynched, you all should be demanding that everyone in the thread take a stance about me – hopefully you guys will actually start reading the thread rather than just herpa-derping while you let scum sheep you around. | ||
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On September 04 2011 09:31 RayzorFlash wrote: I was suspicious of chaoser's claim ever since he actually claimed it, check my earlier posts. The longer he stays alive without providing more "useful" information, the more suspicious I get.Especially because of the initial timing of his claim, added to the new information about bum being framer, and in his two nights since then he hasn't provided anything useful except for being roleblocked, and Kurumi coming up green which could be misdirection itself I'm also inclined to think Pyo and Navillus are scum, Pyo because of the horribly bad claim, and Navillus because of how hard he's been lurking despite being the one to propose the lurker list in the first place Would be up to vote for either Pyo, Nav, or Chaoser today, based on who's closer to majority. For now that would be ##Vote: Pyo ^traitor | ||
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On September 04 2011 15:16 supersoft wrote: pyo isn't a good target. His claim was pretty stange, but i don't think scum would claim like that. He wasn't under pressure at that time. However it's correct, that his voting behaviour and his checks don't make any sense... hmm scum distancing himself from my lynch now that he knows it's going to happen. Mafia's gonna win this game. gg. | ||
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On September 04 2011 19:06 xtfftc wrote: Just pick one of your suspects and do a more in-depth analysis. If you are town, you ought to help us catch the mafia. + Show Spoiler + On August 13 2011 08:24 GMarshal wrote: Play to win. This means you play your best to help your team win while you are alive and in the game. However, this does not mean that you should try to win by being a jerk to the other players so they all want to quit playing. Have you not read the thread, or are you just selectively ignoring anything that would stop you from saying stupid shit? Look, there's nothing left for me to say, believe me if you want, lynch me if you don't. I almost don't care anymore. As far as I can tell, the only way town wins TL mafia games is if scum is eliminated before the competent players get eliminated. Town hasn't lynched a single scum target not previously confirmed by a blue read with the possible exception of Mig. The only ones contributing at this point are xtffftc who can't/won't read, curu who can't/won't read, and two other dudes that are probably scum. I mean WTF is this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=256518¤tpage=11#216 Navillus has been lurking and ninja voting all game and now he's ninja voting someone who's already dead. I give up - my bad for claiming at a point where it was 2 mislynches to game over. | ||
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On September 04 2011 22:47 chaoser wrote: By call out BB and Mig do you mean this post? Cause that's not calling them out. He even backtracks on what he's saying. "Foolishness had a good post on BB, and he's probably town, but that doesn't mean he's right." He never calls anyone out, never gives us any of his own analysis, and always votes by following others. Aside from his vote on mig, which could have just been bussing since at that point (Day 3) mig was pretty much going to be lynched (Foolishness and I were hardcore pushing for it by then), he really hasn't done anything "pro-town". Add in his claim and I'm 90% sure he's mafia. And we have another person who either can't read or is choosing not to... and my vote on mig was bussing? given that it was the 5th of the 14 required to lynch him? Right. You are so obviously scum, it's too bad no one here is willing to pay any attention to it. | ||
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On September 04 2011 22:56 Pyo wrote: And we have another person who either can't read or is choosing not to... and my vote on mig was bussing? given that it was the 5th of the 14 required to lynch him? Right. You are so obviously scum, it's too bad no one here is willing to pay any attention to it. Like how can you even say that my votes have just been following along? Are you serious? Any also why did you check Kurumi night 4? I had claimed early enough in the night that you could have checked me. Why not confirm that I was telling the truth about my role knowing that they couldn't roleblock us both? Well it's pretty obvious, you're scum. | ||
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On September 05 2011 01:44 chaoser wrote: I was never confirmed as a DT because the only real way to be 100% confirmed is to die. My "confirmation" only comes from the fact that 1) I pushed for mig's lynch from day 1 2) foolishness said he read through every one of my past games and thought I was town: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=254174¤tpage=50#1000 and 3) My play so far has been "pro-town". Barundar caught wherebugsgo's last post and I reasoned and then argued with a few people that it's best to lynch bum because that gives us info on vain. (Vain btw is probably confirmed if you trust my check on him since I checked him, got red, and bum visited/framed him.) Look back through chaoser's posts. He says he pushed for Mig's lynch from day 1, but did he really now? Here's the list of all of his posts. His "push for Mig's lynch" wasn't until day 3 when several people were after Mig. In fact day 1 and 2 he was merely going along with Foolishness and provided no analysis of Mig to speak of. day 1 posts regarding Mig: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=10988862 (going along with foolishness) day 2 posts regarding Mig: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11013124 (going along with foolishness) http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11018099 That's it from you as far as Mig is concerned. That's perfectly consistent with you and Mig distancing yourselves from each other. Oh and don't forget this one: On August 23 2011 12:33 chaoser wrote: @mig, the only reason I'm not 100% all over your ass right now is because no one is coming to defend you at all which strikes me as odd and a bit doubtful of myself. I will continue to think on the matter Gee, I wonder why no one was coming to defend him, maybe scum had decided to bus him perhaps? | ||
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On September 05 2011 11:58 RayzorFlash wrote: 3 modkills... At least it'll be an interesting day post, even though there wasnt a lynch... We fell one vote short, xtfftc being the last one to switch from Pyo over to me causing a no lynch WTF xt, I havent thought you were scummy since any point after day 2, but this makes me reconsider it If he hadn't the game would be over if mafia used both their KP... 3 modkills means we're in LyLo so we can't afford to lynch me now - we also can't afford to no lynch. After tonight it will be 4 - 3, so if there are any traitors present at all (who will likely push for a no-lynch), it's game over. The only hope is for mafia to kill off said traitors. *crosses fingers* | ||
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On September 05 2011 14:45 Curu wrote: Wow what THE HELL Are you kidding me? Oh look Pyo posts fishing for the Traitor to claim the night before lylo. There are so many ban-worthy things I want to write right now... I'm gonna apologize ahead of time if I totally lose it. | ||
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On September 05 2011 16:04 supersoft wrote: Pyo Kurumi xtfftc Erandorr Vain chaoser supersoft Curu ________ 3 scum against 5 townies -2 nightkills :-( this looks so grim for us. are you leaving off RayzorFlash intentionally? | ||
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##Vote: Chaoser | ||
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On September 06 2011 22:35 Kurumi wrote: we have 2 dts and we are killing the one which gave us a red lynch? A false statement. No DT has given anyone anything that has led to the lynch of anyone. Remaining scum: Chaoser (too many coincidences to be legit, lied about saying he pushed for Mig's lynch, claiming timing was far more ridiculous than mine, yet everyone just ate it up) Kurumi ("cleared" by chaoser, given how he plays there's no way any reasonable host would make him town no less give him a gun... I hope) Rayzor is NOT scum. He is a traitor. He is asking us to lynch him because lynching him would secure the win for mafia. However, the fact that I am not dead and haven't been roleblocked means that scum KNOW THAT I AM NAIVE. The only way for this to happen is if one of the guys I checked revealed my sanity to them. So far I checked: jackal vain Erandorr xtffftc RayzorFlash and last night supersoft All checks came back green. The one on the list that hasn't already flipped is Erandorr I still think chaoser is scum, but I realize that the case against him isn't open and shut so I likely won't be able to convince anyone, but the case against Erandorr seems pretty dead on if you'll go out on a limb and believe me. ##Vote: Erandorr | ||
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RAYZOR IS NOT SCUM. He is a traitor. He is asking us to lynch him because lynching him would secure the win for mafia. | ||
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Doesn't seem like there's anything else I can do since supersoft has disappeared and curu doesn't want to listen (there's a guy voting for himself... why would you help him out? That's just retarded). With scum controlling 3 votes and rayzor being a traitor, it's already game over... the next (and last) 8 hours are gonna be the most painful - only hope is for Erandorr to get modkilled. | ||
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If you need any more proof that erandorr is scum: On September 07 2011 08:29 GMarshal wrote: Day 7 Votecount chaoser RayzorFlash (5) chaoser RayzorFlash Curu supersoft Kurumi Erandorr(1) Pyo With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch. RayzorFlash has a majority with 5 votes. On September 07 2011 08:42 Erandorr wrote: ##Vote RayzorFlash If there are 7 alive and 5 votes on rayzor, that means that there's at least 1 vote on Rayzor by a scum. That means that Rayzor can't be an actual scum!!!! Take your votes off of him townies - come on guys even if we're doomed to lose, don't lose because you're flat out retarded... unless there are 3 traitors and GM is just fucking with me, in which case, touché. | ||
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On September 07 2011 11:22 Pyo wrote: hmm... lol I totally thought that the game ended today. If you need any more proof that erandorr is scum: If there are 7 alive and 5 votes on rayzor, that means that there's at least 1 vote on Rayzor by a scum. That means that Rayzor can't be an actual scum!!!! Take your votes off of him townies - come on guys even if we're doomed to lose, don't lose because you're flat out retarded... unless there are 3 traitors and GM is just fucking with me, in which case, touché. Correction: if there are 5 votes on rayzor with 7 alive, there's at least 2 votes on Rayzor by scum. | ||
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##unvote erandorr ##vote chaoser | ||
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On September 07 2011 12:13 Curu wrote: The many ways you try to spin Rayzor as not scum is incredible. At least I don't have to think it's chaoser anymore. Let me explain to you why your reasoning is faulty. It's lylo for Town, not scum. So if the scumteam was going to go try to save Rayzor and try to go for a win today, they would've told the third member to bus Rayzor rather than give up both. Because lynching Rayzor doesn't lose the game for them, it just removes on of their three chances. Did you even read what you wrote? Are you serious? Your statement is inherently flawed and devoid of logic... You just said, "if scum was going to save Rayzor, they would not save Rayzor." I keep wanting to think that you're scum because it is so hard for me to accept that anyone would say something so ridiculous. | ||
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On September 08 2011 11:09 Curu wrote: Hey Pyo You hear them footsteps? They roarin' like thunder cause we comin' for you I knew the shit you were saying was too fucking retarded to be town... nobody is that stupid. I love how blatantly obvious that chaoser's claim was fake was to me once I realized that he could possibly have been fake-claiming. Unfortunately, there was absolutely no way for me to convince anyone of it. Well done to mafia for setting it up, but ultimately it was towns stupidity that won the game for mafia. Town is WAAAYYYY too dependent on blue powers. Shame on Kurumi and supersoft for actually voting for RayzorFlash on the last day. That was just absolutely retarded. | ||
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That should be banned. | ||
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