EPTThis is a shared account for Incognito and Mystlord. Mystlord hasn't played for a while (since TL Mafia XVIII), and we both have little time to actually play (I am taking 6 classes this quarter). Flamewheel has already approved this request.
TL Mafia L
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
This is a shared account for Incognito and Mystlord. Mystlord hasn't played for a while (since TL Mafia XVIII), and we both have little time to actually play (I am taking 6 classes this quarter). Flamewheel has already approved this request. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 13 2012 14:26 Ciryandor wrote: /confirm LOL I won't vote for Kitaman after XLVIII's disaster. He was an absolute derp in that. Waiting for people to put in a serious campaign with a decent policy. This is why I'm waiting for Mr. Wiggles and Cyber_Cheese to provide us with good reasons; and right now, Wiggles has the best campaign of the lot. I of course wonder if Sandroba or Palmar will try to get to the elections again. I'm running for mayor on the platform of lynching Ciryandor. There's no way you seriously think Mr. Wiggles has the best campaign. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 13 2012 15:22 Ciryandor wrote: LOL that's a good reason to get you voted in. Lynching someone for having an opinion. What does this post do? Ciryandor does not attempt to clarify his earlier position or attempt to bring us into mutual understanding. Instead, he mockingly attempts to discredit me by misrepresenting my statement and reframing it in a way that paints him in a favorable light. I never say that I want to lynch him for having an opinion, I called bullshit on his statement that Mr. Wiggles has the best campaign. Seriously, if you really believe what you said, tell us why you thought Mr. Wiggles had the best campaign. Furthermore, Ciryandor initially states that: On January 13 2012 14:26 Ciryandor wrote: /confirm LOL I won't vote for Kitaman after XLVIII's disaster. He was an absolute derp in that. Waiting for people to put in a serious campaign with a decent policy. This is why I'm waiting for Mr. Wiggles and Cyber_Cheese to provide us with good reasons; and right now, Wiggles has the best campaign of the lot. I of course wonder if Sandroba or Palmar will try to get to the elections again. While Ciryandor says that he wants to hear good reasons for Wiggles/Cyber_Cheese running, he makes no attempt to draw out information from Wiggles even though it is clear that they are both online (they are both posting until page 24). Instead, he loosely dismisses my accusations as well as GGQ's, and proceeds to babble nonsense about Foolishness and Bill Murray. Ciryandor is twisting my words. Ciryandor is bullshitting that Wiggles has the best campaign. Ciryandor shows no further interest in extracting information about Wiggles' campaign despite claiming he wanted good reasons. Ciryandor continues to babble on about useless topics (Bill Murray) after giving a strange reaction to my/GGQ's accusations. I've noticed that a lot of players are omitting my campaign for mayor in their lists of people running for mayor. But I'm not trolling. I am seriously running for mayor on the platform of lynching Ciryandor. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
The PM debate is an old one. Everyone has their opinion on whether it is town or mafia favored, and even through out-of-game debates, this is a highly controversial topic. If it can' be solved out of game, there's absolutely no way we are going to come up with a consensus in game. BC defends his claim by saying that getting everyone to contribute on this polarizing topic will help us get early reads on players. But if we can't agree on anything out of game, you won't really be able to say that someone saying "PMs good!" or "PMs bad!" will tell us anything about their alignment. Anyone can pretty much say whatever they like since they are under no obligation or pressure to have an opinion one way or the other on this issue. While it is debatable whether PMs are "good" or "bad" for town, it shouldn't be too controversial to say that PMs are elitist. They inherently favor good players who can make use of the extra channel of communication. When you are talking to someone in PMs, always keep in mind what you think the other person wants from you. Are they trying to convince you of a certain point of view? Are they trying to get you to claim? As long as you can keep in mind that the PM initiator may be attempting to manipulate you and don't give away information loosely, PMs really aren't that scary. What exactly has BC been discussing? Primarily, he has divided his attention between defending his claim, responding to attacks on the potnetial that he is red, and asking for "discussion" while pushing a particularly biased point of view. More clearly stated, he proposes a seemingly open-ended question, and answers it himself to make it appear like there was a town consensus behind it. If you look at the thread, the only real contribution to the discussion that DOESN'T come from BC is sandroba's suggestion that all the masons roleclaim. And notice BC's bias when discussing the topic. In almost all his posts, BC paints PMs in a bad light. He only seriously acknowledges that town masons have the potential to catch scum, but in the same post, quickly says that "its harder than you think": On January 14 2012 06:40 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Town masons have the potential to catch scum. Dts have the potential have finding scum. Vigi's have the potential to shooting scum. Jacks could do all 3. Of the group, masons rely on their ability to read people and read posts to get a good view of someone. Catching someone in pms is not as easy as everyone thinks it is and historically towns have town far more retarded things there than good. But lets look at a section of what BC has to say a bout PMs in his guide "TL Town Breakdown/Analysis": On January 28 2011 06:09 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Private Messaging This feature has been in a fair number of TL games. It is also an amazing tool if used properly. However, if it is not used properly, the mafia will abuse it and potentially win. They are also a function if used improperly will cause people to feel left out and like they don’t matter as players. Pm’s can and do make people elitist in games. IF Pm’s are allowed in a game they should be used properly. Role fishing, small analysis groups, alignment testing. Role fishing is straightforward so I will not go into it at this time. Small analysis groups. These groups need not be large, as you only need a few heads to flesh out analysis on people. It also means that if a red is in your group, it is easier to catch them, and it keeps the other groups safe from infiltration. Alignment testing. This is posting in a way to let you carefully analyze reactions. Townies are more inclined to answer in one way and mafia/blues another. Sometimes this will be obvious such as catching someone lying to you in pm’s or lying in thread. Other times this will be noticing subtle word choices. Regardless of how you opt to use the tool, if you do not feel comfortable in your ability to use them properly do not use them and play the game via the thread. Ask for detail from Ace on this, as he dislikes the PM feature. Quite a contradictory opinion from what he states in game. The essence of BC's out of game stance is that: "PMs are like playing with fire. Could be insanely awesome if used correctly, but could burn you if you don't. If you don't feel comfortable, don't use them". This is quite a stark contrast to his position in this game, where he seriously downplays the usefulness of town PMs, and does a bit of fear mongering in emphasizing how the mafia can screw you over with PMs. Is it possible that BC has changed his stance? I doubt it, but it certainly is possible. So lets dig deeper here. How is BC pushing his opinion? He does it subtly, and attempts to dissociate it from his personal point of view. In the beginning of his campaign to discuss masons, BC heavily uses the word "discuss" or "discussion", asks how "we as a whole" want to deal with masons, emphasizes that this is a discussion everyone should be weighing in on, and attempts to get the community involved in the discussion. He doesn't outright present his personal point of view, and frames the discussion so that it appears free and open-ended. But pretty much injects his own opinion into the discussion whenver possible. His initial point is that mafia masons are dangerous and that town needs to have a plan to deal with that. When asked for an example of PMs in action, BC drags in an example where he manipulated VE to do pro-mafia actions in just 1-2 PMs. (Reinforcing his stance on "PMs are scary") When asked behind why he thinks a mass claim will interfere with the mafia masons, he proposes in the hypothetical that if town agrees to not use PMs, then it shuts down mafia masons. A few posts later, he reemphasizes that "by making the town decide, vocally, now, we force everyone to have an opinion." While this is fine and dandy, really he is the one calling the shots here. When Cyber_Cheese suggests that we let masons use their discretion and suggests that smart town masons could cause the mafia masons to backfire, BC counters with "Mafia masons have the experience of an entire team to work manipulate someone", subtly pushing his opinion that PMs should be shunned. On January 14 2012 05:54 BloodyC0bbler wrote: I am fine with either it, or having town just say "we ignore all pms that arent host pms" Making every mason accountable / making them useless to prevent manipulation seems the best play at the moment. making them all claim however is the optimal play, it may out the group of us, but it also prevents mafia from using their ability without being in the spotlight. When asked about his opinion on a mason claim, he says he's fine with it, but takes the opportunity to inject more of his "ignore all PMs" idea into the conversation (notice that nobody else has been saying "lets ignore PMs"). BC is pushing the anti-PM agenda, in a way that is quite subtle. He constantly brings in reference to "the town needs to decide", or "this is a very important discussion that everyone needs to weigh in on", while he is really the one dominating the conversation. In other words, he is injecting his mafia bias into the discussion while attempting to pass it off as a town discussion or collective town decision. Here's something BC didn't tell you. As he has told me in the past (out of game): "keep in mind as red i rarely pm", and "my heavy pm use is town play". Now what about the "spotlight factor" brought up by Meapak? BC putting himself in the spotlight is nothing unusual, both for his mafia and town play. If you've read past games, think of BC's style as much the same as Ace's. As stated above, red BC doesn't use a PM heavy style. He uses a style that focuses on thread control, shutting down serious opposition through arguments and generally trashing the thread. BC claiming mason does not give him any +town points in my book. The general heuristic of "mafia want to avoid the spotlight" doesn't apply to BC, who is an experienced mafia player and has proven that he is well capable of taking the spotlight as red. So what is the scenario for BC being red and pushing his mason claim? BC is in fact red, and can use the mason power (chooses it for himself early in the day). As a town mason would, BC picks a mason target and starts talking to them. Once he gets the town to agree to ban masons, he is off the hook, and doesn't have to worry about PMs anymore. More specifically, he doesn't have to worry about town PMs. Like stated before, mafia BC plays a powerhouse thread control style. By banning PMs, BC doesn't lose out on much (he admits he isn't a heavy PM user), and nerfs Foolishness, sandroba, and my abilities to play a PM centric game (which we are known for). And that's what is the difference between this game and XLII (the game he refers to when he says he dominates with only 1-2 PMs). Foolishness and I are playing in this game, and are real threats. BC wants to shut down PMs before it starts, and he doesn't have to give up much information or lie at all in order to do it. Furthermore, he has not followed up on his campaign promise: "I will question, analyze and call out all those who play in what I view as bad town/mafia like. (I have already done this with foolishness, he knows better)." Ok, so maybe he called out Foolishness yesterday, but where is the scumhunting today? Its non-existent, because BC is too busy derailing the thread with mason discussions instead of scumhunting. What is even more interesting is the timing of his initial claim post. It comes an hourish after my second post against Ciryandor, which conveniently most people except for sandroba and sheth have ignored. 1. BloodyC0bbler derailed today's discussion onto the irrelevant, highly controversial, and unsolvable PM debate. 2. Because the community is split over the PM debate, discussing it tells us nothing about alignment even if people contribute to the discussion. In other words, BC is overexaggerating the importance of this discussion. 3. BloodyC0bbler is masking his intentions and his clear anti-PM agenda, [b]which is inconsistent with his previous (out of game) stance on PMs). 4. BloodyC0bbler is trying to frame the discussion as an open discussion, when he is clearly injecting his personal bias. 5. BloodyC0bbler's actions are completely consistent with his mafia style, which is to spread chaos and control the thread atmoshere and discussion. 6. BloodyC0bbler's actions are not consistent with his campaign promise to analyze and call out people. He has done none of that today BloodyC0bbler is mafia. If you vote for me I will lynch him. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
Some clarifications about my BC analysis: While yes, I did state that BC's opinions here are inconsistent with his out of game comments, this is not the foundation of my argument, they are just icing on the cake. I am glad your third game post of the thread is once again a "i am running on the campaign of lynch this player" it gives nothing on yourself and yet people think you are doing something commendable. You ignore all game discussion and opt to push your own agenda to off players. I am impressed good sir. However, you fail to realize that I am not being the lazy bored me, I am actually playing. Does the fact that I am saying "I am running on the campaign of lynching this player" really say nothing about myself, as BC so claims? No, in fact, it gives you a lot about me. It tells you that I am a no nonsense player who will get straight to the point without cluttering my posts with irrelevant details. It tells you that I am serious about finding mafia and have no interest in spreading confusion and spam in the thread. And you'll notice that I don't only say "I want to lynch X", I actually give reasons for wanting to do so. BC is trying to misrepresent me and trying to convince you that I have done nothing for the town, which is clearly false. Notice how even at this point he still hasn't commented on my case on Ciryandor. BC lies about me ignoring his game discussion. In fact, I devote the first 3 paragraphs of my post just to address the little drama BC has created. I say that his discussion is an irrelevant and unsolvable one that will get us nowhere, while stating my opinion that PMs favor good players and aren't really that scary for town if used properly. That's really all that needs to be said. Yet instead, BC has taken the mason subject and expanded over many pages of the thread, conveniently trashing it and derailing the important discussion of who the mafia is. Look at the bolded section. Pushing my agenda to off players? BC tries to make me look like some bloodthirsty/trigger happy mafia. Guess what: The town's agenda is to kill the mafia!. So yes, my agenda is to kill mafia. That is much different from wanting to "off players". BC is inflating the importance of his "discussion"'s contribution to the town's agenda and is trying to marginalize my attempts to scumhunt, which really should be the town's priority. The italicized portion is irrelevant. I do not fail to consider that you are playing the game instead of being bored, since in fact, boredom is more a characteristic of your town play, not your mafia play. So in this little paragraph, what has BC actually done? He has attempted to discredit me by ignoring all my contributions, inflated the importance of his own contributions to the thread, and attempted to paint me as a trigger happy lunatic. Misrepresentation at its finest, and something that strongly indicates a mafia. I could go on and on to detail more paragraphs, but this should be sufficient. Notice the bolded section near the top, you know, the amazing tool if used properly? How about we continue reading to where i state it is not used properly and mafia abuse it to win. This is a joke. He does not state that it is not used properly, he says that IF it is not used properly, mafia can abuse it to win. If you read BC's PM stance, it is quite moderate and reasonable. Use PMs if you are comfortable in using them properly, ignore them if you don't. In this game? "Ahhhh ignore PMs like the plaguuuuuu! They are so evil!!" I do appreciate that you are gunning for people, but you know just as well as I do that masons who are only able to talk to 1 person once over 1 day cycle when unexperienced in that field is a detriment to the town, not a positive. If you refuse to admit to this then we both know your scum alignment. Its not as simple as that. Say, as town I am able to PM with an inexperienced mafia. That is a positive, not a detriment. BC is taking the case where inexperienced townies get into PMs with mafia and get burned, ignoring the case where a capable PM practitioner is able to leverage PMs for an advantage. BC creates an ultimatum where I am branded as mafia if I do not accept his rather skewed and overly-general statement that does not acknowledge the complexity of the PM issue. What I also find amusing is you concentrate on my mafia style play but ignore my town style play which is near identical (as you well know) where the differences are pushing mafia or town objectives. Bored BC is usually townie BC. But in the case that he is playing seriously as town, a simple check on two separate games with BC as town shows that his style is much different from this game. TL Mafia XX PYP3 In TL Mafia XX, BC proposes a plan, answers questions about it, but is rather straightforward and decisive with what he wants to do. He even roleclaims before the end of the election. But what is different this time? He clearly gives an outline of how his claim was a move to get votes, and in the next post to gauge reactions. He doesn't stir the pot by saying "hey lets get a discussion going", he just states his opinions, and scumhunts. Keeps most of his opinions to himself when they aren't necessary, but otherwise its pretty clear he isn't trying to stir things up chaos here. In PYP3, BC doesn't do nonsense. He has almost all analytical posts (about setup/the drafting situation first, then followed by attacks on LSB), and again isn't posting "to stir up discussion". BC's town behavior in these two games completely contrasts with this game. He heavily overemphasizes "lets get discussion going", never gives any indication that he wants to find mafia until he counter-attacks me in his defense against my accusation, and has many contradictions in his posts. Even in the above quote, BC says the differences are when he is pushing a mafia or town objective. Where is he pushing the town objective??? BC does no scumhunting, and is content to litter the thread with nonsense while attempting to marginalize my contributions. So no. Unlike what BC wants to make you think, my case is NOT based primarily on out of game connections. Those are simply bonuses. A quick look at BC's posts show that: He does not display any attempt to find mafia, despite his original campaign promise that "I will question, analyze and call out all those who play in what I view as bad town/mafia like.". He has overemphasized creating discussion on masons and manipulated the course of this discussion while derailing from the town objective to find mafia. As shown in the first section of this post, BC deliberately misinterprets my post and attempts to discredit me by painting me as a triggerhappy who just wants to off people. Lets be honest here. Look at my posts, and look at BC's posts. Which is more important, BC's mason discussion, or my who is mafia discussion? If one of us is really trying to derail the discussion, who is it??? BC is mafia. I am shocked that so many people are still voting for him, though I suppose its natural, since mafia candidates never are lacking in votes. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 15 2012 08:37 rgTheSchworz wrote: So confused at the moment. Have the feeling we're going nowhere, even worse, several of our blues have blundered. I'm gonna vote BM, as Sandroba has the highest chance of being scum out of potential candidates.His posts have been weird enough, he runs for mayor then isnt particularly active or scum-hunting,some of his posts like the one with the eagle landing on his arm disturbed me. I'll keep an eye on the following: Risk.nuke, Palmar. I feel palmar still has a role to play. Don't lynch him day1, maybe day 2 if he continues like that. The whole mason thing started by BC was useless in my opinion.50/50 chance of being mafia/town. Bollocks, they're maybe more town masons than mafia, maybe less. You can't know that, unless maybe.. you have external information. Also, as sandro is suspicious and BC had made a sort of a deal with him, my feelings about this persona shall remain mixed at best. When the town isn't going anywhere, look for mafia interference. I clearly have been trying to give some direction to this thread, so there isn't really the excuse that the town is just newb and doesn't know what to do. Furthermore, this game isn't like some others where 2 mistaken townies pollute the thread by attacking each other on pretty thin grounds. If you look at the thread as a whole, you probably will only be able to find 1 player who really sticks out of the discussion, and that's BC. If you agree that the town isn't going anywhere, the question should be why. BC has steered the course of the discussion for the most part of this day, despite only having around 5% of the total game posts. While I have no problem with someone having this few amount of posts, an examination of BC's posts shows that he has created more ? He creates a discussion which blows up disproportionately to its significance in the game. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 15 2012 08:37 rgTheSchworz wrote: So confused at the moment. Have the feeling we're going nowhere, even worse, several of our blues have blundered. I'm gonna vote BM, as Sandroba has the highest chance of being scum out of potential candidates.His posts have been weird enough, he runs for mayor then isnt particularly active or scum-hunting,some of his posts like the one with the eagle landing on his arm disturbed me. I'll keep an eye on the following: Risk.nuke, Palmar. I feel palmar still has a role to play. Don't lynch him day1, maybe day 2 if he continues like that. The whole mason thing started by BC was useless in my opinion.50/50 chance of being mafia/town. Bollocks, they're maybe more town masons than mafia, maybe less. You can't know that, unless maybe.. you have external information. Also, as sandro is suspicious and BC had made a sort of a deal with him, my feelings about this persona shall remain mixed at best. When the town isn't going anywhere, look for mafia interference. I clearly have been trying to give some direction to this thread, so there isn't really the excuse that the town is just newb and doesn't know what to do. Furthermore, this game isn't like some others where 2 mistaken townies pollute the thread by attacking each other on pretty thin grounds. If you look at the thread as a whole, you probably will only be able to find 1 player who really sticks out of the discussion, and that's BC. If you agree that the town isn't going anywhere, the question should be why. BC has steered the course of the discussion for the most part of this day, despite only having around 5% of the total game posts. While I have no problem with someone having this few amount of posts, an examination of BC's posts shows that he has created more confusion and unanswered questions than answers and direction. The conclusion is that the mafia are interfering with the town's attempt to find clarity. In other words, the game has a mafia-favored atmosphere. As you know, my thesis is that BloodyC0bbler is at the bottom of it. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 13 2012 22:46 Macpo wrote: hi everyone! /confirm. I am a complete noob in this game, so please be forgiving to my small mistakes here and there! I'll try to share my views on this first day. Sorry if it's a bit clumsy, I am doing my best. 1. concerning the mayor election, I don't know if it's a usual thing, but I feel it's a bad idea to have too many people running for the election... in a sense, this mess is already a success for the mafia, isn't it? So, I would suggest that the persons who don't seem to be so concerned with it just stop running for the election, so that we have only a few candidates left. It doesn't mean there will be more or less scums among the left candidates, but at least, we can look more closely to who they are and clarify things. But maybe that's a bad idea! about who could be a good mayor, I am not so sure right now.(how difficult is it to ground any judgment at the moment!  ) I think the main thing is to keep in mind that whoever we elect, we are absolutely not sure of who he really is, even if we convincingly voted for him after some reasonable discussion.So let me give my two cents (not worth more!). I have to say I appreciated the candidacy of Mr Wriggles  , who has a clear argumentation and is pleasant to read. Not talking too much, making clear logical points. The only thing I am afraid of is that it may be a trick. Also, the Foolishness Bill murray candidacy sounds too big to be mafia-ish. There are claiming their "alliance" too loud, it would be way too risky for them if they were mafia, as everyone focuses on them. So, paradoxically, I would trust them more (or Bill Murray more precisely) as mayor. So I guess I will vote either Mr Wriggles, or Bill Murray; Mr Wriggles being more rational and precise in his analysis (but maybe it's a game) while Bill Murray is more a safety choice (with our very limited information, I feel it's rational to assume that he can't be mafia). But these are only very limited hypotheses and assumptions. How do you guys feel about that? I am also kind of sad that Echelon tee didn't apply, as I feel I share most of his analyses up to now . except for foolishness maybe. 2. Reading the whole 5 pages of debate, I noticed a few things. First is Cyber_cheese. What's the point of attacking Mr Wriggles from the beginning? that doesn't help for town cohesion at all (even more if it's a "joke"). it just looks like he wants to create a mess. Other people seem to have similar concerns with him, so maybe this is something worth discussing alltogether. So what do you think? Cyber, if maybe, could you say a word about this? To make it clear, it's merely an impression, I don't want to focus too much on you either. In a sense, Cyber is obviously not the only one. I feel that there are many useless agressive posts all around. So how do you guys feel about that? For instance, lthe ast one between Wherebugsgo and palmar, (as Toadesstern remarked): What's the point of being aggressive like that if you are town? Correct me if I am wrong, but I see no other reason for such a behaviour than one of them at least being scum. At the same time WBG's analysis sounds convincing for the moment. Others in similar situations would be nisani for instance. But maybe I am missing things here... Feel free to criticize my analysis, I am here to improve! and all my apologies to the misaccused persons , but from what I read in various guides, we have to go through this to find out real mafia... Macpo Notice how Macpo begins and ends his post with excuses, apologies, and emphasis on learning. His excuses and apologies function to say that he is useless and shouldn't be listened to. Not to mention, the actual content of his posts is in the middle. Why would he do this? It basically functions like this: he emphasizes his noobiness, which encourages you to ignore everything that he is going to say. And after he says it, he again emphasizes his noobiness, encouraging you to ignore everything he just said. He has no interest in having his voice count. Why would a townie want to do this? If you wanted to learn and participate in the game, you wouldn't want to be ignored. You wouldn't emphasize your uselessness, and would instead attempt to participate in the game. People may correct you, but if you haven't done anything wrong, why apologize? All the excuses and apologies do is make people ignore you. And if you look at Macpo's posts, its something he does quite well. In future posts, Macpo is ignored, and he pops up twice just to answer accusations to himself (while still apologizing). If you are really interested in learning, you wouldn't apologize when you've done nothing wrong, which is exactly what a mafia would want to do. Mafia inherently feel guilty, and see suspicion when there is none directed toward them. just a short question : how are you so sure that palmar is scum? palmar sounded a bit agressive, but saying he is easy to read? (I am not asking this with an agressive suspicious tone, just trying to figure things out) Notice how he ends his question with an excuse. Why is he so afraid of people thinking he is asking in an aggressive suspicious tone? Why is he so scared that people would think he actually holds an opinion? Macpo continues to cover up any potential suspicion on him before it even happens, which is something only mafia do. Even in his last post he states To those complaining about me being rational, it's getting obvious that they prefer random one line crap to argumentation. I'll answer back when they'll meet my standards. Nobody ever complains about Macpo being rational, but even so, why would you even deem this worthy of a response? All this statement does is "you dont meet my standards, i'll respond when you do". A completely different attitude from his first posts "I'm newb, i may be a bit clumsy, tell me if im doing anything wrong". He goes from a submissive "i am inferior to you" to suddenly thinking he has the license to ignore people because they don't meet his standards. Quite bold for someone who claims to be a newbie, don't you think? Macpo overemphasizes his newbieness, offers no real opinions, jarringly disconnected from the events that are happening in thread. Lets save BC for later and just lynch this guy. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 15 2012 09:13 Macpo wrote: I haven't been able to post my scum tells last post, here they are. Basically, I think we kind of neglect all these players, who are basically hiding. I am not saying this 100% scums; some of them are probably really not here. but I also think it's more than 20% scum in there, we should keep this in mind: - Refallen 2 empty posts. - Munk-E 1 empty post. - Brownbear 4 posts, 4lines. - d3_crescentia 3 posts 3 lines. - igabod 4 posts 4 lines. - rtgICEMAN 4 posts, and no clear position. - Maxella 2 posts. Please guys, really get into it and help town; as now you are just very embarrassingly hiding. Until you convincingly do, you are all my favorite scums tells. Also, while going through the filters, I saw the remarkable case of Jayjay, one poster, 10%of the whole thread. and to be honest, only crap in it; far from any rational standard . This annoys me, so I put him on my scummy list. We really need to have more rational stuff to clarify things. like REALLY. Oh icing on the cake! You don't really think that these players who have posted almost nothing have given "scum tells" do you? Either way, if they did, you certainly are not clarifying for us. Providing a list without any additional insight? Check. Suggesting its more than 20% scum in here without any evidence? Check. Ironically, he bolds two statements that contradict each other. Thinking there's more than 20% scum there is not remotely rational. Few # of posts does not indicate that people are hiding. Providing an empty list while passing it off as a contribution is though. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
If so, why are you pushing such a new player despite the fact that plenty of other players have played similarly to him? I'm not Foolishness, but the bolded statement is false. Nobody else has overemphasized their newbiness in an attempt to hide in their first 3 posts. Macpo is the obvious lynch at the moment. This is a textbook example of mafia. See: Misder from Ver's TL Mafia XXX Guide | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
| ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
"Denying mayor or sheriff is huge for scum, so I believe it's worth it to have as many scum run as possible." Generally wrong. Mafia don't need both spots, and generally have a hard time getting both. They just need 1, and they need a strong candidate to do so. You can generally tell just from reading the player roster who actually stands a chance before the game starts. It is far fetched to think that the mafia is going to field their entire roster just to get a higher chance of getting elected, since as you can tell, mayor elections aren't random. Running for mayor also puts you in the spotlight. For example, 3 mafia in PYP Interesting pretty much outed themselves just by giving a half-assed campaign. Denying isn't really that crucial in this game since there are no PMs. (Offices are much more powerful with PMs because now you have unkillable people who are able to coordinate behind the scenes. With no PMs, that is not an issue). General Announcement to the Mafia: I will certainly heavily analyze the two bodyguards before the night is over. Just letting you know in case you were thinking of subbing in members. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 16 2012 12:20 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Incog, you posted on the wrong account duder. Is that all you have to say about my post? That's disappointing. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 16 2012 12:22 BloodyC0bbler wrote: I haven't fully read it yet tbh, I just saw the wrong name. Your giant blocks of texts much like my own take awhile to read. Well I hope you can read it objectively. On a side note, note L's apathetic response. Lets vote for a double lynch today. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
Sandroba is obviously innocent now. ##Vote Macpo | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 16 2012 12:32 wherebugsgo wrote: 4 KP and right after deadline, Protac says "sandro is innocent because Ciryandor flipped scum" Sup scum gambit? Nah its simpler than that. Sandroba was the first person who supported my case on Ciryandor, when everyone else was ignoring it. The thread was very chaotic, and my case was otherwise being ignored. There's no reason for the mafia to resurrect suspicions on one of their members if it is long gone and buried. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
| ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
![[image loading]](http://s1.hubimg.com/u/5308476_f520.jpg) There's some bad news and some good news. The bad news is that day 1 had a horribly mafia-favored atmosphere. The good news is that the mafia didn't take advantage of it. That is to say, the mafia became complacent because they didn't need to do much to encourage chaos, and thus became lazy and slacked off. The theme of this post is apathy. The mafia are apathetic because the atmosphere is so chaotic that they don't need to do much to stay under the radar. After all, why work hard when you can be lazy? L On January 15 2012 00:41 L wrote: So I decided to take a good read of the thread from the start in one burst because hey, I'm a day late. A few things stood out as odd: 1) There are a LOT of mayoral candidates. Many of them seem to have prepared their candidacy prior to the game. Candidacies prepared prior to the game don't give us any information (insofar as submitting candidature goes) because they are done in the absence of role or alignment information. The surplus of candidates as well as the pre-prepared quality of many indicates that candidacy itself is devalued in this game. 2) Of those 'immediate' candidacies, Foolishness's is the most peculiar on its face, I honestly don't understand why someone would prepare a post to push for someone in the absence of role information, but my best guess is that he wanted to run himself, then got masoned or masoned someone else. 3) Mattchew releases a pm between him and Foolishness that states straight up that Bill Murray will be easy to control. No one comments on this. 4) On page 39 its stated that roles who get elected cannot be roleblocked; All of the current candidates for mayor are crumbing or have claimed roles that don't benefit from this. This issue is brought up a grand total of ONCE in the 12 pages since then and not discussed any further. 5) There are a LOT of chaff posts in this thread. A lot of larger posts are similarly filled with repetitive content. 6) The most interesting of the semi-chaff posts are the cloaked kingmakers. Posts like "Oh, the race is already over, X or Z is going to win". Why are they interesting? Because the leading candidate currently has 10% of the popular vote and mafia's potential to swing votes is grossly disproportionate to the amount of votes cast thusfar. 7) No one seems particularly 'pressed' with respect to the vote totals, which indicates that everyone's roughly happy with the way things are or at least not hurried enough to make a play yet. Given how strong the election roles are, this means mafia has likely captured at least one of the frontrunner spots at this point in time. This also means that mafia is doubly happy to throw out cloaked kingmakers as they clutter the thread, remove an incentive for people to participate AND lead them to an election result that they're comfortable with. 8) A grand total of one post stands out in my memory regarding the timing of votes and stated that people should be throwing down their votes asap to prevent the election from getting hijacked by a mafia swing. No one picked up on it and there was a burst of posting to bury it. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ So, what does this tell me? Tells me two things: 1) People need to vote. Now. 2) I'm voting for me. L for Mayor. 3) The best defensive votes statistically are on players who currently aren't winning but posted pre-canned candidacies. The best offensive votes are on players who have crumbed a role that isn't mason. P.S. Rainbow text is fucking hard. In his campaign post, he gives a laundry list of 8 things that he finds "odd", but these points cast doubt and provide more questions than answers. L makes up the term "cloaked kingmakers", although there really is no reason to believe that the people saying that "X is going to win" are mafia. L is just making up a catchy phrase to avoid having to explain anything. In point 7 L suggests that mafia have one of the front running spots, but doesn't put any effort into figuring out who it is, and just casts doubt to make the voters fearful. How does he conclude his laundry list of 8 points? He tells people to vote for him. Now. Besides providing no content except doubt, the tone of this post is quite interesting. L's first post is large and basically says and screams "I am full of energy, care about the town, and am providing valuable insight", when in fact, he quickly falls off the radar, shows his apathy, and gives no such insight. The rest of his posts are incoherent and don't provide direction. His posts don't command attention, and even when he prods people, he doesn't do it in a way that draws attention. Even though he appears perky and full of energy, as a whole they are apathetic. L says that he would choose to lynch Mattchew based on a flimsy sentence (and by calling him a "cloaked kingmaker"). He also tosses his vote on VisceraEyes without much thought. L is apathetic and has done nothing for the town while attempting to hide that he is doing so. Jackal I have no idea why Foolishness thinks he's town. Jackal is not playing his usual gung ho strongly opinionated town style. His play is quite similar to his play in TL Mafia XLVIII as mafia. Jackal isn't actively involved in the game. He never pushes a strong opinion (highly uncharacteristic), and just sits back while making irrelevant comments on random posts. Clearly, he is reading the thread. Clearly, he doesn't care to contribute. And why should he? The thread is in chaos, so its easy to just get lazy as mafia. kingjames In this game, kingjames proposes that bodyguards be made public, posts a consideration that BC may be the mafia jack, and then disappears. On January 14 2012 09:14 kingjames01 wrote: Also, consider for the moment, that BC may be mafia Jack. If he uses his Mason power on Day 1 to establish his credibility and then is subsequently elected to office, we will not be able to find the mafia Jack. It is a risk, but I know that BC will take that risk. He is very much a medium-risk, high-reward player. EVERYONE! WHAT HAPPENS IF BLOODYC0BBLER IS MAFIA JACK? I consider this scenario involving BC to be within his bag of tricks, and I will not vote to elect him into office. A fear mongering post that asks what happens if BC is red, with no opinion or followup. Another case of apathy. Contrast this with TL Mafia XXXVIII where instantly gives strong opinions on some of the proposed policy plans (random lynching, zodiac lists), immediately jumps into trying to find mafia, posts some detailed analyses, and does a lot of poking and prodding. In this game, kingjames does not attempt to find mafia. He instead discusses outing bodyguards, and casts doubt on BC without providing any opinion. The key thing to note is that in contrast to his town play where he is outgoing and analytical, his posts in this game are very subdued, seem artificial and feel overly planned. Macpo Here we revisit Macpo. I won't restate my previous analysis. However, I think people are not seeing the subtle differences in how Macpo is different from some of the other newbies or lurkers. The key is overemphasis on inexperience to the point that he is begging to be ignored. This is a textbook case of mafia. But for all of you doubters, here is a new piece of information. Look at Macpo's 4th post here: On January 14 2012 20:02 Macpo wrote: It's getting clear that Bill Murray is the way to go. Mr Wiggles, a good town, but he just doesn't want to be on the stage too much, so I guess the mayor role doesn't suit him very well. BC: way too unclear and risky for me; he is trying too much stuff, going for a thousand contradictory stuff, taking back what he said and so on. Bill has shown a lot of presence, and has made reasonable analyses, plus he is not afraid. That's enough for me up to now, I think we won't have better than that. To those complaining about me being rational, it's getting obvious that they prefer random one line crap to argumentation. I'll answer back when they'll meet my standards. Also, I changed my mind on Cybercheese, as he opened my eyes on the the BC case. To bill: some people here have NOT posted yet at all!! I feel fine about lynching sandroba, as he acts quite scummy, but I suggest that if you are elected, you lynch someone who has not talked yet. statistics we'll be that it is mafia. and compare to his first post, where he overly emphasizes his newbiness. See the difference? Macpo doesn't apologize at all in this post, and spews a bunch of opinions. Previously, he stated that "I just feel that being confident in my claims on day 1 is kind of stupid, as there is almost no rational basis for being so." Huge contrast. Its as if its a different person posting. Its pretty obvious that Macpo is getting coaching from his mafia friends. Then his next post: On January 15 2012 09:13 Macpo wrote: I haven't been able to post my scum tells last post, here they are. Basically, I think we kind of neglect all these players, who are basically hiding. I am not saying this 100% scums; some of them are probably really not here. but I also think it's more than 20% scum in there, we should keep this in mind: - Refallen 2 empty posts. - Munk-E 1 empty post. - Brownbear 4 posts, 4lines. - d3_crescentia 3 posts 3 lines. - igabod 4 posts 4 lines. - rtgICEMAN 4 posts, and no clear position. - Maxella 2 posts. Please guys, really get into it and help town; as now you are just very embarrassingly hiding. Until you convincingly do, you are all my favorite scums tells. Also, while going through the filters, I saw the remarkable case of Jayjay, one poster, 10%of the whole thread. and to be honest, only crap in it; far from any rational standard . This annoys me, so I put him on my scummy list. We really need to have more rational stuff to clarify things. like REALLY. Besides the fact that Macpo doesn't follow his own advice and really doesn't "get into it and help town", notice the pleading tone. I bet its a different coach this time! LOLOLOLOL GGQ On January 15 2012 12:02 GGQ wrote: havent caught up, I'm at page 57, but I skipped ahead. don't vote in Protractinium. Seriously, don't. Macpo is pretty clearly a newb town imo For not having caught up yet, GGQ has a shockingly strong opinion that Macpo is newb town. What's even more interesting is that this read is his basis for urging people not to vote me in. Why does GGQ have such a strong attachment to Macpo? He never once discusses lynch targets or inquires about who the other mayoral candidates is going to lynch. But for some reason he really wants to save Macpo. Without even considering whether or not I am otherwise a good candidate for mayor. He doesn't attempt to persuade me not to lynch Macpo, he just flat out says that I shouldn't be voted in. In short, GGQ is apathetic both about who becomes mayor and who gets lynched. But for some reason he really cares that Macpo doesn't get lynched. GGQ is also lurking hard while providing no content. Contrast to Responsibility Mafia where he is active, expresses interest in finding a good target for the lynch and gives a few detalied analyses on GMarshal and Mr. Wiggles. Ciryandor In sharp contrast to his previous posts (and future posts, I might add), where he has a defiant tone, "LOL that's a good reason to get you voted in.", and "LOL says the guy whose first post is to criticize bad posts.", Ciryandor switches to a submissive tone in an attempt to gain sympathy as one who has been wrongly accused. His argument is that there are other players who fit the same criterion, and posts a list of half-hearted "reads" to attempt to appease. But it is all a ploy. Note how he never mentions who he wants lynched. He is way too apathetic and seems more concerned about saving himself (less antagonistic tone) rather than actually believing in any his reads, or any of anyone elses, for that matter. But here's the kicker: Right now I'm torn between Proact and Sandroba in voting, because at least they're concrete in promising ONE NAME to lynch instead of being wishy-washy in getting a list of targets up, and that I think they have plans for town after Day 1 that don't need to be publicized yet. He is torn between voting for me/sandroba, but then in his next post, states: Same thing here; I only read the blue post saying 9 minutes to deadline with 4 minutes to go, so I just chucked in a vote at Bill seeing that Proact is in the lead (as of the last votecount update I saw), and that I don't like BC to get sheriff because he and Proact are at odds with each other. Two things wrong here. First, he doesn't vote for me/sandroba. He also non-chalantly "chucks" a vote at Bill. Not a verb you'd associate with someone who "is torn between" two other candidates, huh? While he may say that he didn't want BC and me to both be in office, his vote is way too casual. Second, notice the sudden difference in tone between this post and the previous one. No more puppy eyes "I'm being unfairly fingered out despite there being many other people acting like me" talk. Ciryandor changes from calm to careless and aloof, and basically just throws his vote down without much forethought. Of course, when I end up losing the election, Ciryandor says nothing about the result. Only that On January 15 2012 12:37 Ciryandor wrote: Yes, Miller is townie that checks as scum. If thats not apathy, I don't know what is. evantrees I agree with Foolishness that evantrees is mafia. His first post is so incoherent it begs to be skipped, but this post in particular is bad: On January 15 2012 09:44 evantrees wrote: to quote VE out of context at the modkill + attempted day vig bit late but anyways. ~OpZ~ not sandroba otherwise correct, bc masoned sandroba OpZ masoned bc jitsu masoned VE mattchew masoned foolishness according to whats been said at least. Doubt I typed anything useful going through this mess but I will check. Posting a useless list without any opinion? Check. Even worse is that he doesn't even verify that the information is correct, and states that what he wrote is probably useless. This is apathy at its finest. Furthermore, evantrees is lurking hard core. We know he's reading the thread, as he posts a null comment on Palmar's flip before randomly requesting that repalcements are relfected in the OP. The argument that evantrees is just a bored townie doesn't hold here. Bored townies don't ask the mods to indicate replacements in the OP. evantrees is completely apathetic and pretends to contribute to the town when he in fact is not. Well those are my thoughts in the event that I am shot in the face. Start by lynching Macpo (he's too obviously mafia, and his flipping red will strengthen the cases on GGQ and Ciryandor). 6 reds should be enough given that its only day 1 and we can't kill them all right away anyway. Just make sure these don't get spammed away by some of the aggressive posters. Also please don't do something dumb like lynching someone who is really putting in the effort to figure stuff out. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 05:37 Nisani201 wrote: Protactinium begins by running for mayor on the platform of lynching Ciryandor. But there is no way that Protactinium actually had a case against Ciryandor this early. Especially since, at the time Protactinium wrote that, Ciryandor only had one post in the game. So from this we can deduce that Protact is either bad town, or scum. This is just flat out wrong. You dont need a lot of posts to tell that someone is mafia. Ciryandor was bullshitting about Wiggles having the best campaign. Thats it! Mafia trying to make something out of nothing right there. I don't need pages and pages of spam to prove someone is mafia. All it takes is a few posts to show they're making stuff up because they're not town. Strangely enough you think that my early accusation means I am bad or mafia. Lol. On the contrary, it just means I'm good. I didn't need followup questions. The rest of his posts revealed his colors without the need for questioning. As for why Macpo over Ciryandor, Macpo is just a worse poster. I can't kill 7 people at once. Only 1. On January 17 2012 06:02 p4NDemik wrote: Nisani your argument is actually pretty compelling. I'm also extremely suspicious of Protactinium now. Especially considering that Ciryandor actually was "torn" about voting for him after he came on so hard for his own lynch. Prot came on hard with a long accusation, to which Ciryandor posted no reply for 2 days. I don't understand why Prot wouldn't find it suspicious at all that someone who he so adamantly accused a day ago was now considering his corner without even speaking to his accusation. I feel like one thing that very consistently annoys town (especially someone who is trying to be high-profile and win an election) is when their questions go unanswered, and we have a clear cut case of it here. Even if your focus changes to another person who you think is more likely mafia you still don't let someone completely off the hook like that. I addressed that in my post that perhaps you missed since it was on the wrong account. Of course, I posted it only right before the daypost, but given that I was already under suspicion the day before, I figured I might as well just wait til right before the deadline to post to take advantage of the fact that my suspicion would hopefully get the mafia not to shoot me. GGQ is mafia, but Macpo is better today. In his latest post, most of it is focused on saving himself, while only the end is a "sidenote" (very weak case) on JayJay. Macpo isn't interested in scumhunting, he is just popping in to save himself while making it look like he's attempting to be productive. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 06:39 Nisani201 wrote: Why would a scum use bullshit to support a townie campaign? To make it look like they're contributing and having an opinion when they're actually not. Note how Wiggles never actually stands a chance of winning. His support of Wiggles is not relevant in the grand scheme of things, but it still makes him look contributing. Its not untypical for mafia to appear to butt heads with each other in attempt to dissociate themselves. The thing is, if they are both mafia, Ciryandor knows how GGQ is going to respond, so that is one less unknown variable you have to worry about. Notice how GGQ never mentions Ciryandor. Why? Because, Ciryandor was never being serious about his accusation in the first place. Surprise! Again note the theme of laziness here. Mafia were too lazy to keep up the act. Lets stop discussing Sandroba/BC being mafia for now. There are bigger fish to fry (all the apathetic people). | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 13 2012 15:48 Ciryandor wrote: LOL says the guy whose first post is to criticize bad posts. In a more productive light, where is Bill? Does he actually want to be mayor? I'm starting to wonder why Foolishness is pushing for him to be mayor. Are there any other candidates besides Kita and Wiggles that want to step up? I realize that it's only the third hour or so from game's start, so we'll probably have activity pick up in the next nine or so from EU people waking up. Read: "What I just said was not useful, ignore it plz". I honestly think GGQ has just as bad a posting history as mine, and that he has escaped scrutiny by creating an FoS on me just because I was asking why I should be believing the early candidates like Cyber_Cheese instead of Mr. Wiggles during that time. For Ciryandor to think that GGQ "escaped scrutiny" must mean that he really did think GGQ was suspicious. Right? Well, the previous post says otherwise. His previous accusation is not made in a serious tone, and he even tries to cover it up by adding "In a more productive light" (followed by useless stuff) after. Ciryandor really isn't interested in lynching GGQ. Its just a distraction to save himself, or perhaps GGQ in the event that he does get killed. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 07:24 Toadesstern wrote: That's something I've got problems with. Why to you want to lynch into apathetic people at all. Those people are the kind of people you lynch when you've got nothing going on and need to get at least something going. Just let our vigis shoot into lurkers and deal with them once we run out of obvious targets like sandroba. That's what our vigis are good for after all. Apathy is not inactivity. Apathy does not mean that a player is unreadable. On the contrary, look at how this game has unfolded as a whole. Day 1 is full of chaos. The thread explodes to 75 pages, and hardly anyone is looking for mafia. You have some hardline players like WBG and company who want to throw Palmar off a cliff, and a bunch of useless mason discussion. The mafia have no reason to be actively at the front of the stage because it inherently carries risk. The town is already in a natural state of chaos anyway. Thus, the mafia are the ones who are going to be slacking off. A sandroba lynch is absolutely ridiculous and the amount of support it is getting is shockingly disturbing. On January 14 2012 04:26 sandroba wrote: 1) Proactinum post is the best one so far. Fuck yes I like it. Cyriandor is my top candidate for lynch if I get elected. On January 14 2012 16:34 sandroba wrote: I think I talked about this already. He's ugly and smells bad. Also protact's case was the best thing to land on this thread so far. Also I might lynch a bg instead. Who knows. No mafia digs up a case on a fellow mafia when it is dead and buried. Lets look at one of your posts about sandroba: On January 16 2012 08:20 Toadesstern wrote: as promised (sry took longer because I completly forgot it ) about sandroba:I don't like the fact that BC lynched Palmar at all. Sandroba was the guy who made BC lynch Palmar instead of whoever he wanted to lynch first. I asked BC and Sandroba to show me their pm logs, neither one did it and I don't like the coincidence of bc masoning sandroba although I have to agree that that one point probably is circular reasoning because I think it's something that makes bc scummy Sandroba's budding with Palmar (without a reason) and with BC (without giving an explanation). Also he voted BC. If you now look at what I posted about bum and BC you realize that there's a lot of mentioning each other within this circle of BC-Bum-Sandroba. I've got the feeling sandroba is trying to trick me/ us his picks and his style obviously is not helping at all. My highest priority to lynch right now would be sandroba, followed by bum. I won't support a bc lynch although I think he's leaning scum for me right now because I'm not sure about my judgement of bc yet. I'd say he's got a 30-50% of flipping red instead of true 10 out of 50. Explain how you know Sandroba made BC lynch Palmar, when he never said such a thing. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 16 2012 08:20 Toadesstern wrote: Sandroba was the guy who made BC lynch Palmar instead of whoever he wanted to lynch first On January 16 2012 13:15 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Sandroba skype messages which will contain both game and unrelated game content. + Show Spoiler + [13/01/2012 4:02:56 AM] Sandro Maculan: Yo james [13/01/2012 4:03:14 AM] Sandro Maculan: I just got a pm saying you masoned me [13/01/2012 4:03:59 AM] Sandro Maculan: -_- [13/01/2012 4:04:09 AM] Sandro Maculan: going to bed ttyl [13/01/2012 11:57:17 AM] james: rawrrrrr [13/01/2012 11:57:22 AM] james: lol [13/01/2012 11:57:33 AM] james: i wasn't up at like 4am, its all good  [13/01/2012 11:57:39 AM] james: i sent my pm and went to bed [13/01/2012 1:19:40 PM] Sandro Maculan: hey you there? [13/01/2012 1:19:43 PM] Sandro Maculan: just woke up [13/01/2012 1:20:00 PM] james: that I am [13/01/2012 1:20:15 PM] james: I am now about to shoot myself in the foot, but well, i honestly think its needed [13/01/2012 1:21:03 PM] Sandro Maculan: ? [13/01/2012 1:21:07 PM] Sandro Maculan: i need to catch up [13/01/2012 1:21:12 PM] Sandro Maculan: I'm on page 26 [13/01/2012 1:21:28 PM] james: oh, i am going to be using the mason mechanic [13/01/2012 1:21:30 PM] Sandro Maculan: why did you choose to mason me so early btw? [13/01/2012 1:21:31 PM] james: as a way to generate discussion [13/01/2012 1:21:32 PM] james: tbh [13/01/2012 1:21:41 PM] james: you are one of the few people I talk to frequently in games [13/01/2012 1:21:42 PM] james: or about games [13/01/2012 1:21:45 PM] james: in the last 6 months [13/01/2012 1:21:55 PM] james: of anyone else you will have a better read on me than most [13/01/2012 1:22:17 PM] Sandro Maculan: well you are a tricky one for me to read tbh [13/01/2012 1:22:25 PM] Sandro Maculan: I somehow always think you are mafia [13/01/2012 1:22:30 PM] james: most people do [13/01/2012 1:22:31 PM] Sandro Maculan: unless you are not [13/01/2012 1:22:32 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol [13/01/2012 1:22:53 PM] Sandro Maculan: this game I'm leaning town on you so far -_- [13/01/2012 1:23:21 PM] Sandro Maculan: based on something silly tbh [13/01/2012 1:23:41 PM] Sandro Maculan: like when i was typing my post of mayor campaign [13/01/2012 1:23:50 PM] Sandro Maculan: you wrote something similar [13/01/2012 1:24:04 PM] Sandro Maculan: like "mafia I'm comming for you"lol [13/01/2012 1:24:18 PM] james: lol [13/01/2012 1:24:19 PM] james: well [13/01/2012 1:24:24 PM] james: im pretty sure the post im writing now [13/01/2012 1:24:32 PM] james: will make people far easier to read [13/01/2012 1:24:37 PM] james: including myself [13/01/2012 1:24:50 PM] Sandro Maculan: k let me read the thread brb [13/01/2012 1:25:18 PM] james: i havent put it up yet [13/01/2012 1:25:25 PM] james: but as I am doing it [13/01/2012 1:25:26 PM] james: im claiming mason in thread [13/01/2012 1:25:33 PM] james: not revealing that i mason'd to you yet however [13/01/2012 1:25:46 PM] james: I am doing it purely to generate discussion and primarily get people like foolishness [13/01/2012 1:25:50 PM] james: or palmar, etc... [13/01/2012 1:25:53 PM] james: all the vets [13/01/2012 1:25:54 PM] james: to post [13/01/2012 1:25:57 PM] james: they have to [13/01/2012 1:26:02 PM] james: failure to mucks them badly [13/01/2012 1:26:17 PM] Sandro Maculan: why hide that you masoned me? [13/01/2012 1:26:35 PM] james: I'm not claiming it in the post [13/01/2012 1:26:46 PM] james: im using this post as my claim post [13/01/2012 1:26:53 PM] james: and will say I mason'd you in a one after it [13/01/2012 1:26:58 PM] james: which you can confirm [13/01/2012 1:33:32 PM] james: brb going to check on my foodstuffs [13/01/2012 1:34:53 PM] Sandro Maculan: k wait mafia can sub in all bgs [13/01/2012 1:35:05 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol that fucking sucks [13/01/2012 1:47:40 PM] james: and now to see how people [13/01/2012 1:47:41 PM] james: take my claim [13/01/2012 1:48:12 PM] Sandro Maculan: i can't find in the op [13/01/2012 1:48:18 PM] Sandro Maculan: how many bgs there will be [13/01/2012 1:48:21 PM] james: bgs [13/01/2012 1:48:24 PM] james: there are 2 [13/01/2012 1:48:25 PM] james: it states 2 [13/01/2012 1:48:30 PM] james: and says mafia can sub in [13/01/2012 1:48:33 PM] Sandro Maculan: i can only see mafia can sub in max 2 [13/01/2012 1:48:35 PM] james: 0 1 or 2 [13/01/2012 1:48:37 PM] Sandro Maculan: yeah [13/01/2012 1:48:51 PM] Sandro Maculan: but where does it say it's 2 total? [13/01/2012 1:49:05 PM] Sandro Maculan: if it's only 2 that's way too fucking imba [13/01/2012 1:52:13 PM] james: worked fine in the lounge game [13/01/2012 1:52:42 PM] Sandro Maculan: I'm going to incorporate jackal's plan [13/01/2012 1:52:43 PM] Sandro Maculan: seems good [13/01/2012 1:52:52 PM] Sandro Maculan: I'm going to lynch 1 or 0 bgs [13/01/2012 1:54:11 PM] james: well, if i dont get elected ill prob be the day 1 lynch now, however [13/01/2012 1:54:14 PM] james: if i'm not [13/01/2012 1:54:19 PM] james: mafia get to have fun dealing with me [13/01/2012 1:55:02 PM] Sandro Maculan: on one hand being mason prob makes you more likely to be mafia [13/01/2012 1:55:17 PM] james: on the other [13/01/2012 1:55:19 PM] james: if im town [13/01/2012 1:55:19 PM] Sandro Maculan: on the other hand mafia isn't likely to claim that shit [13/01/2012 1:55:27 PM] james: it limits what other masons can do [13/01/2012 1:55:31 PM] james: as in if i die and flip blue [13/01/2012 1:55:32 PM] james: other mafia go [13/01/2012 1:55:41 PM] james: "oh shit if we mason we might die" [13/01/2012 1:55:42 PM] Sandro Maculan: on an extra third alien hand it's you and you are crazy so who knows [13/01/2012 1:55:51 PM] james: as i lower the possible pool [13/01/2012 1:55:54 PM] james: im figuring [13/01/2012 1:55:59 PM] james: there are 3-4 masons at most [13/01/2012 1:56:03 PM] james: and at least 1 is red [13/01/2012 1:56:17 PM] james: by outing myself now [13/01/2012 1:56:22 PM] james: if i dont get elected [13/01/2012 1:56:33 PM] james: mafia shooting me becomes annoying as it removes the cover [13/01/2012 1:56:35 PM] james: they have for their player [13/01/2012 1:56:43 PM] Sandro Maculan: I dunno about how many masons there are [13/01/2012 1:56:45 PM] james: it also forces them potentially to waste a frame on me [13/01/2012 1:56:48 PM] james: i dont know for sure [13/01/2012 1:56:51 PM] james: im speculateing [13/01/2012 1:56:55 PM] Sandro Maculan: fw wanted a pm game so maybe there is more [13/01/2012 1:56:56 PM] james: I know fw took the lounge mafia setup [13/01/2012 1:56:57 PM] Sandro Maculan: I would think [13/01/2012 1:57:04 PM] james: and tweaked it slightly [13/01/2012 1:57:45 PM] james: do you agree it is something people should have actively discussed however? I mean, with only a select group of players being able to pm others [13/01/2012 1:58:04 PM] james: thats a huge amount of potential issues [13/01/2012 1:58:06 PM] james: late game [13/01/2012 1:58:12 PM] james: if its not dealt with early [13/01/2012 1:58:43 PM] Sandro Maculan: we should keep discussion in thread as much as possible I agree [13/01/2012 1:58:58 PM] Sandro Maculan: we can bump off ideas here and the post before you off me at night [13/01/2012 1:59:00 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol [13/01/2012 1:59:19 PM] james: lol [13/01/2012 1:59:23 PM] james: why would I off you [13/01/2012 1:59:36 PM] james: day 1 lynch on a complete asshole [13/01/2012 1:59:39 PM] james: or scum player [13/01/2012 2:14:38 PM] Sandro Maculan: man [13/01/2012 2:14:51 PM] Sandro Maculan: this mason claim looks promissing [13/01/2012 2:15:19 PM] Sandro Maculan: I think mason mass claim could work [13/01/2012 2:15:34 PM] Sandro Maculan: mafia will have to claim it if they ever want to use it [13/01/2012 2:15:43 PM] james: yep [13/01/2012 2:16:04 PM] Sandro Maculan: and it will generate a lot of discussion [13/01/2012 2:16:11 PM] james: the discussion is key [13/01/2012 2:16:14 PM] james: you have to have an opinion on it [13/01/2012 2:27:10 PM] Sandro Maculan: k I'm caught up [13/01/2012 2:36:54 PM] james: its an annoying read[13/01/2012 2:37:00 PM] james: like 6 pages popped up when i went to bed for 6 hours [13/01/2012 2:41:34 PM] Sandro Maculan: k let's think for a bit [13/01/2012 2:41:49 PM] Sandro Maculan: what can mafia do if masons massclaim [13/01/2012 2:42:09 PM] Sandro Maculan: they can claim alongside with the other townies [13/01/2012 2:42:11 PM] james: fuck ton more scruitiny [13/01/2012 2:42:13 PM] james: of their actions [13/01/2012 2:42:20 PM] Sandro Maculan: or hide their mason an never use it [13/01/2012 2:42:20 PM] james: they can claim to be town [13/01/2012 2:42:23 PM] james: and never use a mason use [13/01/2012 2:42:31 PM] james: which prevents them from manipulating behind scenes [13/01/2012 2:42:32 PM] Sandro Maculan: yeah [13/01/2012 2:42:36 PM] james: or they claim mason [13/01/2012 2:42:44 PM] james: and potentially die as everyone will be looking at us [13/01/2012 2:42:45 PM] james: at all times [13/01/2012 2:42:48 PM] Sandro Maculan: and honesttly [13/01/2012 2:42:53 PM] Sandro Maculan: fuck masons [13/01/2012 2:42:53 PM] james: as they will have the entire mason pool [13/01/2012 2:42:56 PM] james: pretty much [13/01/2012 2:43:05 PM] james: potentially there is the chance [13/01/2012 2:43:06 PM] Sandro Maculan: it's not that important role to protect it from hits [13/01/2012 2:43:08 PM] james: that every mason is town [13/01/2012 2:43:17 PM] james: but how many townies [13/01/2012 2:43:20 PM] james: can actually use it well? [13/01/2012 2:43:32 PM] james: its such a high skill required role [13/01/2012 2:43:33 PM] Sandro Maculan: yeah and it's nice and all [13/01/2012 2:43:36 PM] james: and in its current form [13/01/2012 2:43:38 PM] james: only benefits mafia [13/01/2012 2:43:48 PM] Sandro Maculan: but I'd rather lose a mason than any other blue [13/01/2012 2:44:01 PM] Sandro Maculan: so if mafia wants to waste kp on them be my guest [13/01/2012 2:44:05 PM] james: pretty much [13/01/2012 2:44:20 PM] Sandro Maculan: i don't see any drawbacks [13/01/2012 2:44:21 PM] Sandro Maculan: aside from a possible mason witchunt [13/01/2012 2:44:35 PM] james: why do people think [13/01/2012 2:44:36 PM] james: im relying on my role [13/01/2012 2:44:39 PM] james: to get elected? [13/01/2012 2:44:42 PM] james: i already stated [13/01/2012 2:44:45 PM] james: it doesnt matter if i do or dont [13/01/2012 2:44:46 PM] Sandro Maculan: man [13/01/2012 2:44:47 PM] james: rofl [13/01/2012 2:44:53 PM] james: i never once said [13/01/2012 2:44:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: if you are mafia fuck you [13/01/2012 2:44:58 PM] james: "im not going to get elected [13/01/2012 2:45:02 PM] james: vote for me cause im mason" [13/01/2012 2:45:02 PM] Sandro Maculan: i'm almost sure you are town lol [13/01/2012 2:45:11 PM] james: i do some ballsy shit as red [13/01/2012 2:45:14 PM] james: i will give that to people [13/01/2012 2:45:17 PM] james: but out myself [13/01/2012 2:45:20 PM] james: so blatently [13/01/2012 2:45:24 PM] james: and fuck my entire team over? [13/01/2012 2:45:40 PM] james: theres no gain in that as im now so heavily in the spotlight [13/01/2012 2:45:47 PM] james: i am now more likely to get offed by town [13/01/2012 2:45:49 PM] Sandro Maculan: man [13/01/2012 2:45:59 PM] Sandro Maculan: you would prob get elected either way [13/01/2012 2:46:06 PM] Sandro Maculan: why would you ever do this as mafia [13/01/2012 2:46:08 PM] james: yea [13/01/2012 2:46:11 PM] james: also [13/01/2012 2:46:13 PM] james: cybercheese [13/01/2012 2:46:15 PM] james: and toad [13/01/2012 2:46:16 PM] Sandro Maculan: -_- [13/01/2012 2:46:17 PM] james: are shifty as fuck [13/01/2012 2:46:22 PM] james: -_- responses to my [13/01/2012 2:46:23 PM] james: claim [13/01/2012 2:46:27 PM] james: are exactly the shit i was hoping for [13/01/2012 2:46:28 PM] Sandro Maculan: i like the ciryandor case [13/01/2012 2:46:47 PM] Sandro Maculan: cyber seems shifty too [13/01/2012 2:46:48 PM] james: i want to see ciryandor post more [13/01/2012 2:46:50 PM] james: tbh [13/01/2012 2:46:54 PM] james: because he seems red [13/01/2012 2:46:57 PM] james: but due to such shitty play [13/01/2012 2:47:02 PM] james: most likely a red will coach him [13/01/2012 2:47:03 PM] Sandro Maculan: i'm actually okay with toad [13/01/2012 2:47:06 PM] james: to make him sound not terrible [13/01/2012 2:47:15 PM] james: and gives me a read on his coach [13/01/2012 2:47:16 PM] james: lol [13/01/2012 2:47:22 PM] james: palmar shouldn't be this apathetic [13/01/2012 2:47:24 PM] james: as a townie [13/01/2012 2:47:38 PM] Sandro Maculan: well his saving grace is agreeing with proact [13/01/2012 2:47:46 PM] Sandro Maculan: which i also agree [13/01/2012 2:47:58 PM] Sandro Maculan: but yeah he needs to step up [13/01/2012 2:48:16 PM] Sandro Maculan: i'll give him time to do it on his own before I push for him [13/01/2012 2:48:34 PM] Sandro Maculan: he usually gets to posting midway through day1 if he is town [13/01/2012 2:52:42 PM] james: yea [13/01/2012 2:52:44 PM] james: this is true [13/01/2012 3:04:25 PM] Sandro Maculan: brb [13/01/2012 3:26:29 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol shit [13/01/2012 3:26:40 PM] Sandro Maculan: man why don't epople think like i do [13/01/2012 3:28:57 PM] james: bum saw [13/01/2012 3:29:05 PM] james: exactly the reason why id be nervous of red masons [13/01/2012 3:29:07 PM] james: from OP [13/01/2012 3:29:29 PM] Sandro Maculan: typing a post sec [13/01/2012 3:41:10 PM] Sandro Maculan: and why is that [13/01/2012 3:42:13 PM] james: they choose [13/01/2012 3:42:31 PM] james: if they fail to by end of day 1 [13/01/2012 3:42:34 PM] james: its random'd [13/01/2012 3:43:08 PM] Sandro Maculan: prb not an issue though [13/01/2012 3:43:16 PM] Sandro Maculan: why would they ever fail to choose it [13/01/2012 3:43:32 PM] james: exactly [13/01/2012 3:43:33 PM] james: lol [13/01/2012 3:44:46 PM] Sandro Maculan: i think mafia would prob have their mason(s) selected soon [13/01/2012 3:45:22 PM] Sandro Maculan: and if this movement gets strong they will quickly mason someone [13/01/2012 3:46:48 PM] james: yea [13/01/2012 3:46:50 PM] james: they will have to [13/01/2012 3:47:31 PM] Sandro Maculan: fuck man i'm liking this plan more and more [13/01/2012 3:47:43 PM] james: i was thinking on it last night [13/01/2012 3:47:45 PM] james: and like [13/01/2012 3:47:50 PM] james: I could die because of it [13/01/2012 3:47:58 PM] james: but its still so solid [13/01/2012 3:47:59 PM] james: for town [13/01/2012 3:48:06 PM] james: my death to fuck mafia in the ass with a rake? [13/01/2012 3:48:12 PM] james: seems legit trade with 40 townies [13/01/2012 3:49:14 PM] Sandro Maculan: nah man [13/01/2012 3:49:28 PM] james: there are enough big namers [13/01/2012 3:49:29 PM] Sandro Maculan: i won't let anyone important get lynched day1 [13/01/2012 3:49:30 PM] james: in this game [13/01/2012 3:49:37 PM] james: well i could easily get shot' [13/01/2012 3:49:38 PM] james: as well [13/01/2012 3:49:40 PM] Sandro Maculan: look at what happened last huge game [13/01/2012 3:49:47 PM] james: -_- i was so wrong [13/01/2012 3:49:49 PM] james: that game [13/01/2012 3:49:52 PM] james: except on a few gut shot reads [13/01/2012 3:49:56 PM] Sandro Maculan: mafia raped all vets night 1 [13/01/2012 3:50:50 PM] Sandro Maculan: we have to wait a bit for them to thin out / get medic ' ed etc before going into that pool [13/01/2012 3:50:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: it's the best play [13/01/2012 3:51:39 PM] james: i didnt see any downsides [13/01/2012 3:51:50 PM] james: then again i could be missing a giant hole somewhere [13/01/2012 3:59:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: nah I've thought it through [13/01/2012 4:00:00 PM] Sandro Maculan: there are no holes [13/01/2012 4:14:36 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol you seem quite popular now [13/01/2012 4:19:42 PM] james: haha [13/01/2012 4:19:43 PM] james: apparently [14/01/2012 1:24:40 AM] Sandro Maculan: yo [14/01/2012 1:24:45 AM] Sandro Maculan: I'm back you here? [14/01/2012 1:24:54 AM] james: yea typing up a post now [14/01/2012 1:25:21 AM] Sandro Maculan: I'm catching up [14/01/2012 1:25:25 AM] Sandro Maculan: still on page 40 [14/01/2012 1:25:29 AM] Sandro Maculan: and quite drunk [14/01/2012 1:26:16 AM] Sandro Maculan: wow [14/01/2012 1:26:25 AM] Sandro Maculan: proactinum thinks you are scum [14/01/2012 1:26:34 AM] Sandro Maculan: are you mafia? [14/01/2012 1:26:44 AM] Sandro Maculan: tell me I wont remember tomorrow [14/01/2012 1:26:52 AM] Sandro Maculan: i promise not to check logs [14/01/2012 1:27:17 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 1:27:17 AM] james: im not [14/01/2012 1:27:19 AM] james: protrac [14/01/2012 1:27:22 AM] james: just outed himself [14/01/2012 1:27:23 AM] james: hard [14/01/2012 1:27:23 AM] james: though [14/01/2012 1:27:27 AM] james: so fucking obvious [14/01/2012 1:27:41 AM] james: i say this because [14/01/2012 1:27:42 AM] Sandro Maculan: I really thought he was town though [14/01/2012 1:27:45 AM] james: if anyone thinks thats mystlord [14/01/2012 1:27:47 AM] james: they are dumb as hell [14/01/2012 1:27:48 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 1:27:52 AM] Sandro Maculan: from his frist post and second [14/01/2012 1:28:03 AM] james: the post against me [14/01/2012 1:28:05 AM] james: is incog [14/01/2012 1:28:11 AM] james: and incog is firmly in [14/01/2012 1:28:15 AM] james: the anti pm bandwagon [14/01/2012 1:28:15 AM] james: for town [14/01/2012 1:28:22 AM] Sandro Maculan: no [14/01/2012 1:28:25 AM] james: no i mean [14/01/2012 1:28:27 AM] Sandro Maculan: he is against the anti pm [14/01/2012 1:28:29 AM] james: if you talk to him [14/01/2012 1:28:33 AM] james: outside of this game [14/01/2012 1:28:35 AM] Sandro Maculan: he thinkis you are for it [14/01/2012 1:28:37 AM] james: he hates pm [14/01/2012 1:28:39 AM] Sandro Maculan: and thus mafia [14/01/2012 1:28:45 AM] james: which is how he outed himself [14/01/2012 1:28:54 AM] james: his belief in people properly using pms [14/01/2012 1:28:55 AM] james: is fucking horrid [14/01/2012 1:29:02 AM] james: fw [14/01/2012 1:29:04 AM] james: and I [14/01/2012 1:29:06 AM] james: are the top 2 people [14/01/2012 1:29:08 AM] james: who like pms [14/01/2012 1:29:08 AM] Sandro Maculan: man [14/01/2012 1:29:13 AM] Sandro Maculan: this discussion [14/01/2012 1:29:13 AM] james: in general [14/01/2012 1:29:15 AM] james: i hate masons [14/01/2012 1:29:19 AM] Sandro Maculan: is fucking useless day1 [14/01/2012 1:29:21 AM] james: nah [14/01/2012 1:29:24 AM] james: incog [14/01/2012 1:29:25 AM] james: just [14/01/2012 1:29:26 AM] james: outed himself [14/01/2012 1:29:29 AM] Sandro Maculan: maybe he is mafia for not realising that [14/01/2012 1:29:31 AM] james: to me anyway [14/01/2012 1:29:35 AM] james: to me [14/01/2012 1:29:39 AM] james: thats a hugeeeee [14/01/2012 1:29:39 AM] Sandro Maculan: vets are going to get shot the fuck out [14/01/2012 1:29:40 AM] james: bit [14/01/2012 1:29:41 AM] james: also [14/01/2012 1:29:42 AM] Sandro Maculan: fast [14/01/2012 1:29:43 AM] james: adam [14/01/2012 1:29:45 AM] james: + wbg [14/01/2012 1:29:48 AM] james: link to protrac [14/01/2012 1:29:51 AM] james: so does ciryandor [14/01/2012 1:29:55 AM] Sandro Maculan: ? [14/01/2012 1:29:57 AM] james: do i think all are red? no [14/01/2012 1:29:59 AM] james: but they all link [14/01/2012 1:30:08 AM] james: protrac has done nothing to garner votes [14/01/2012 1:30:09 AM] james: but tunnel people [14/01/2012 1:30:09 AM] Sandro Maculan: man [14/01/2012 1:30:12 AM] Sandro Maculan: protact [14/01/2012 1:30:16 AM] james: first people to jump on his nuts [14/01/2012 1:30:20 AM] Sandro Maculan: if he is mafia he has balls [14/01/2012 1:30:20 AM] james: with 0 grounds [14/01/2012 1:30:23 AM] james: well [14/01/2012 1:30:25 AM] james: it is incog [14/01/2012 1:30:29 AM] Sandro Maculan: he is the most out there mothefucker [14/01/2012 1:30:45 AM] Sandro Maculan: you + him are my strongest town reads atm [14/01/2012 1:30:55 AM] Sandro Maculan: balss =/= mafia [14/01/2012 1:31:23 AM] Sandro Maculan: even you when red you play more conservatively [14/01/2012 1:31:31 AM] Sandro Maculan: of course i can be fooled and mistaken [14/01/2012 1:31:38 AM] Sandro Maculan: but i gotta go with my guts [14/01/2012 1:31:49 AM] Sandro Maculan: and they say you plus him are town right now [14/01/2012 1:38:25 AM] james: i appreciate that, I now have to dig [14/01/2012 1:38:29 AM] james: through friggen aim logs [14/01/2012 1:38:29 AM] james: on incog [14/01/2012 1:38:32 AM] james: fuuuuck [14/01/2012 1:39:20 AM] Sandro Maculan: ? [14/01/2012 1:39:29 AM] james: to quote his view [14/01/2012 1:39:30 AM] james: of pms [14/01/2012 1:39:31 AM] Sandro Maculan: he masoned you too?\ [14/01/2012 1:40:00 AM] Sandro Maculan: just made a beatiful post [14/01/2012 1:40:02 AM] Sandro Maculan: I'm quite proud of it [14/01/2012 1:59:06 AM] james: the obvious drunk post? [14/01/2012 1:59:17 AM] Sandro Maculan: man [14/01/2012 1:59:23 AM] Sandro Maculan: it all makes sense [14/01/2012 1:59:33 AM] Sandro Maculan: being drunk is very enlightening [14/01/2012 2:00:13 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:00:28 AM] Sandro Maculan: seriously [14/01/2012 2:00:29 AM] james: more like it makes everything more fun [14/01/2012 2:00:57 AM] Sandro Maculan: are you still playing lol btw? [14/01/2012 2:01:05 AM] james: eh not really [14/01/2012 2:01:08 AM] Sandro Maculan: been some time since i last messed with it [14/01/2012 2:01:08 AM] james: star wars has stolen my time [14/01/2012 2:01:18 AM] Sandro Maculan: haven't had the time [14/01/2012 2:01:23 AM] james: play so much star wars now [14/01/2012 2:01:33 AM] Sandro Maculan: man [14/01/2012 2:01:48 AM] Sandro Maculan: I'm studying human behavior [14/01/2012 2:01:54 AM] james: that sounds useful [14/01/2012 2:02:04 AM] Sandro Maculan: and chicks were never that easy [14/01/2012 2:02:27 AM] Sandro Maculan: I'm lacking time to foucs on other shit [14/01/2012 2:03:03 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:03:05 AM] james: chicks are dumb [14/01/2012 2:03:11 AM] james: booze = make them easy [14/01/2012 2:03:29 AM] Sandro Maculan: nah man [14/01/2012 2:03:33 AM] Sandro Maculan: they are like dogs [14/01/2012 2:03:40 AM] Sandro Maculan: they respond to standard shit [14/01/2012 2:03:58 AM] Sandro Maculan: if you behave a certain way they jump on you [14/01/2012 2:05:21 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:05:28 AM] james: and sandro is manipulating teh womenzorz [14/01/2012 2:05:32 AM] james: to spread legs [14/01/2012 2:07:05 AM] Sandro Maculan: it's pretty exciting if you ask me [14/01/2012 2:07:14 AM] james: hahaha [14/01/2012 2:07:15 AM] james: aye [14/01/2012 2:07:18 AM] Sandro Maculan: =P [14/01/2012 2:08:15 AM] Sandro Maculan: man where the fuck is l [14/01/2012 2:08:23 AM] Sandro Maculan: is he supposed to be really good? [14/01/2012 2:08:26 AM] Sandro Maculan: isn't [14/01/2012 2:09:02 AM] Sandro Maculan: fucking mafia always kills me b4 i get a chance to do anything [14/01/2012 2:10:53 AM] james: L is an oldschool vet [14/01/2012 2:10:59 AM] james: who is usually meh town [14/01/2012 2:11:02 AM] james: and solid mafia [14/01/2012 2:11:05 AM] james: the thing is [14/01/2012 2:11:06 AM] james: in this setup [14/01/2012 2:11:13 AM] james: the only people who excel at pms [14/01/2012 2:11:22 AM] james: would all fuck town sideways as red [14/01/2012 2:11:23 AM] james: in pms [14/01/2012 2:11:36 AM] james: if anyone of them is red, regardless of who the red mason is [14/01/2012 2:11:41 AM] james: pms can be easy crafted [14/01/2012 2:11:46 AM] Sandro Maculan: who would those be? [14/01/2012 2:12:05 AM] james: incog, myself, meapak should be able to, L [14/01/2012 2:12:06 AM] Sandro Maculan: only you and rafiled have fucked me over pms so far [14/01/2012 2:12:09 AM] james: bum should be able to [14/01/2012 2:12:21 AM] james: d3 should be able to [14/01/2012 2:12:26 AM] Sandro Maculan: d3? [14/01/2012 2:12:33 AM] james: d3_crentia [14/01/2012 2:12:37 AM] james: hes played for ages] [14/01/2012 2:12:39 AM] Sandro Maculan: never heard of him [14/01/2012 2:12:42 AM] james: was in the latest lounge mafia game [14/01/2012 2:12:49 AM] james: where he got manhandeled in pms [14/01/2012 2:12:51 AM] james: and irl [14/01/2012 2:12:56 AM] james: by his betters [14/01/2012 2:13:01 AM] james: but his ability to play [14/01/2012 2:13:05 AM] james: is far above most of tls members [14/01/2012 2:13:06 AM] Sandro Maculan: man [14/01/2012 2:13:16 AM] Sandro Maculan: i think you have to really like being mafia to be good at it [14/01/2012 2:13:29 AM] james: at pm manipulation? [14/01/2012 2:13:36 AM] Sandro Maculan: like when i roll mafia I feel like giving up [14/01/2012 2:13:38 AM] james: the "core" group of vets [14/01/2012 2:13:42 AM] Sandro Maculan: like mafia xlviii [14/01/2012 2:13:43 AM] james: who can manipulate learned it [14/01/2012 2:13:52 AM] james: via testing eachother like mad [14/01/2012 2:13:54 AM] james: in pm circles [14/01/2012 2:13:54 AM] Sandro Maculan: i don't even like winning as mafia [14/01/2012 2:13:56 AM] james: to play find the red [14/01/2012 2:14:00 AM] Sandro Maculan: doesn't feel as good [14/01/2012 2:14:05 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:14:10 AM] james: i like proving [14/01/2012 2:14:15 AM] james: tl towns are bad when im red [14/01/2012 2:14:22 AM] james: since tl towns win a game using shitty reasoning [14/01/2012 2:14:24 AM] Sandro Maculan: i like proving they are good! [14/01/2012 2:14:27 AM] Sandro Maculan: =P [14/01/2012 2:14:33 AM] james: and keep doing it because it fluked once [14/01/2012 2:14:35 AM] james: or twice [14/01/2012 2:14:38 AM] james: then a vet come sin [14/01/2012 2:14:40 AM] james: and goes [14/01/2012 2:14:44 AM] james: "rawrrrr raped you hard" [14/01/2012 2:14:57 AM] james: then town doesnt learn -_- [14/01/2012 2:14:58 AM] james: other than [14/01/2012 2:15:00 AM] james: vets = op [14/01/2012 2:15:01 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:15:03 AM] Sandro Maculan: hmm you hurt my ego by saying that [14/01/2012 2:15:10 AM] james: your an exception [14/01/2012 2:15:14 AM] james: but like [14/01/2012 2:15:16 AM] Sandro Maculan: i like to think we are pretty decent =P [14/01/2012 2:15:18 AM] james: you can see what I mean right? [14/01/2012 2:15:25 AM] james: that faultly reasoning is getting used [14/01/2012 2:15:27 AM] james: frequently [14/01/2012 2:15:30 AM] james: by the same people? [14/01/2012 2:15:37 AM] Sandro Maculan: yeah i ignore 80% of people's opinions in game [14/01/2012 2:15:53 AM] Sandro Maculan: some players i don't even bother to read what they post [14/01/2012 2:16:04 AM] Sandro Maculan: but there are some that i can really tell apart [14/01/2012 2:16:34 AM] Sandro Maculan: if you are bad as town it feels like it's too easy to be mafia [14/01/2012 2:16:44 AM] Sandro Maculan: cuz no one expects any better from you [14/01/2012 2:17:07 AM] Sandro Maculan: so whenever i roll mafia it's like a burden [14/01/2012 2:17:25 AM] Sandro Maculan: and when i roll town it's like vacations =) [14/01/2012 2:18:17 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:18:23 AM] james: i view being mafia a challenge [14/01/2012 2:18:37 AM] james: and honestly have learned more by being red [14/01/2012 2:18:38 AM] Sandro Maculan: dunno [14/01/2012 2:18:39 AM] james: than from town [14/01/2012 2:18:43 AM] Sandro Maculan: i view town as a challenge [14/01/2012 2:18:50 AM] Sandro Maculan: nailing scum feels so good [14/01/2012 2:18:55 AM] james: oh it does [14/01/2012 2:19:01 AM] james: pyp3 was the more infuriating / gratifying experience [14/01/2012 2:19:04 AM] james: i have had as town [14/01/2012 2:19:07 AM] james: nailed every red [14/01/2012 2:19:10 AM] james: traitor [14/01/2012 2:19:12 AM] james: and both sk's [14/01/2012 2:19:23 AM] Sandro Maculan: yeah you feel like a boss\ [14/01/2012 2:19:37 AM] Sandro Maculan: most games i do okay [14/01/2012 2:19:59 AM] Sandro Maculan: I get good day1 reads and after i realise I was right i fell so good [14/01/2012 2:20:03 AM] Sandro Maculan: it's awesome [14/01/2012 2:20:18 AM] Sandro Maculan: when mafia i just feel people were fools not to catch me [14/01/2012 2:21:00 AM] james: eh [14/01/2012 2:21:13 AM] james: im always surprised when im not catched [14/01/2012 2:21:18 AM] james: although My style ensures i die [14/01/2012 2:21:19 AM] james: always [14/01/2012 2:21:57 AM] Sandro Maculan: next time i roll mafia [14/01/2012 2:22:12 AM] Sandro Maculan: I'm going to be the summiest mofo on earth and not give a fuck [14/01/2012 2:22:49 AM] Sandro Maculan: like my first games i didn't care what people would think [14/01/2012 2:23:40 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:23:44 AM] james: good policy [14/01/2012 2:23:58 AM] Sandro Maculan: man seriously [14/01/2012 2:24:07 AM] Sandro Maculan: why would people not vote for me [14/01/2012 2:24:21 AM] james: your not being the typical convincing roba [14/01/2012 2:24:22 AM] Sandro Maculan: so far i got like 1 vote [14/01/2012 2:24:25 AM] james: you appear really halfassed [14/01/2012 2:24:27 AM] james: so far in thread [14/01/2012 2:24:31 AM] Sandro Maculan: lol [14/01/2012 2:24:37 AM] Sandro Maculan: that's the typical me [14/01/2012 2:24:43 AM] james: or that you are making the round of running for office [14/01/2012 2:24:45 AM] Sandro Maculan: i don't care for walls [14/01/2012 2:24:46 AM] james: with 0 effort [14/01/2012 2:24:47 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:27:53 AM] Sandro Maculan: hmmm [14/01/2012 2:28:07 AM] Sandro Maculan: i think i put in effort when it's needed [14/01/2012 2:28:10 AM] Sandro Maculan: i don't like discussing random shit that leads nowhere [14/01/2012 2:29:26 AM] james: didnt you use to post more, or is it that we just talk alot that i assume you do? lol [14/01/2012 2:29:37 AM] james: also brb [14/01/2012 2:30:44 AM] Sandro Maculan: the time i dedicate to mafia is proportional of the time I'm at home doing nothing [14/01/2012 2:30:59 AM] Sandro Maculan: so yeah when there is less good shit to do i post more [14/01/2012 2:32:15 AM] james: lol [14/01/2012 2:48:59 AM] james: that post was more boss [14/01/2012 2:49:54 AM] Sandro Maculan: =) [14/01/2012 2:56:32 AM] Sandro Maculan: fuck palmar man [14/01/2012 2:56:37 AM] Sandro Maculan: he is taking too long [14/01/2012 2:56:44 AM] Sandro Maculan: maybe he is mafia [14/01/2012 2:58:08 AM] james: hes realllllly apathetic this game [14/01/2012 2:58:10 AM] james: for some reason [14/01/2012 2:58:12 AM] james: not like gms game [14/01/2012 2:58:13 AM] james: at all [14/01/2012 3:00:28 AM] Sandro Maculan: rofl [14/01/2012 3:00:34 AM] Sandro Maculan: did you watch [14/01/2012 3:00:48 AM] Sandro Maculan: the uszat dude interviewing players? [14/01/2012 3:06:28 AM] james: nope [14/01/2012 3:06:33 AM] james: i rarely watch streams or vids on tl now [14/01/2012 3:06:52 AM] Sandro Maculan: rfo [14/01/2012 3:07:00 AM] james: rfo? [14/01/2012 3:07:13 AM] Sandro Maculan: rofl [14/01/2012 3:07:15 AM] Sandro Maculan: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=303115#6 [14/01/2012 3:07:20 AM] Sandro Maculan: watch this [14/01/2012 3:07:26 AM] Sandro Maculan: will not dissapoint [14/01/2012 3:14:15 AM] james: thats carmac trolling people? rofl [14/01/2012 3:14:55 AM] james: or someone that carmac [14/01/2012 3:14:59 AM] james: just found vids of? [14/01/2012 3:37:35 AM] james: and heading to bed, ttyl [14/01/2012 3:06:50 PM] Sandro Maculan: man I have 1 hour before i go out again and need to catch up [14/01/2012 3:06:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: you here? [14/01/2012 3:07:17 PM] james: -_- [14/01/2012 3:07:18 PM] james: ve claimed jack [14/01/2012 3:07:24 PM] james: mattchew was modkilled [14/01/2012 3:07:25 PM] james: for being a dumbfuck [14/01/2012 3:07:32 PM] james: we are no where closer to getting shit solved [14/01/2012 3:07:38 PM] Sandro Maculan: I', still on page 50 =( [14/01/2012 3:07:45 PM] Sandro Maculan: and don't quite remember last night [14/01/2012 3:07:51 PM] james: you were kinda drunk [14/01/2012 3:07:54 PM] james: drunk man mc drunk [14/01/2012 3:08:01 PM] Sandro Maculan: i was kinda totally drunk [14/01/2012 3:08:05 PM] Sandro Maculan: out of my mind [14/01/2012 3:08:06 PM] Sandro Maculan: =P [14/01/2012 3:08:16 PM] james: lol [14/01/2012 3:08:21 PM] james: thats not normal? [14/01/2012 3:08:37 PM] Sandro Maculan: it's quite standard for my weekends =P [14/01/2012 3:08:45 PM] james: lol [14/01/2012 3:08:46 PM] Sandro Maculan: i do enjoy my vodka [14/01/2012 3:12:09 PM] Sandro Maculan: who are you lynching btw [14/01/2012 3:12:36 PM] Sandro Maculan: i need to vote cuz i won't have the time later [14/01/2012 3:17:17 PM] james: most likely incog [14/01/2012 3:17:21 PM] james: unless someone fucks up in thread [14/01/2012 3:17:23 PM] james: between now and then [14/01/2012 3:17:32 PM] james: 3 posts since the start of a game day [14/01/2012 3:17:34 PM] james: is inexcusable [14/01/2012 3:17:34 PM] Sandro Maculan: -_- [14/01/2012 3:17:40 PM] Sandro Maculan: then I'm not voting for you [14/01/2012 3:17:50 PM] james: where 1 was a purposeful misrepresentation of facts [14/01/2012 3:17:55 PM] james: and continued a discussion round me [14/01/2012 3:17:57 PM] Sandro Maculan: it's quite silly to lynch him day1 man [14/01/2012 3:17:59 PM] james: as opposed to around masons [14/01/2012 3:18:00 PM] james: eh [14/01/2012 3:18:09 PM] james: take you rpick, its him or foolishness [14/01/2012 3:18:11 PM] Sandro Maculan: and he ddoesn't seem to give a fuck [14/01/2012 3:18:14 PM] james: both are performing badly [14/01/2012 3:18:16 PM] james: there are 2 [14/01/2012 3:18:17 PM] Sandro Maculan: which is a townie trait [14/01/2012 3:18:17 PM] james: fucking people [14/01/2012 3:18:18 PM] james: on [14/01/2012 3:18:19 PM] james: 1 [14/01/2012 3:18:20 PM] james: account [14/01/2012 3:18:27 PM] james: 3 posts [14/01/2012 3:18:30 PM] james: is totaly inexcusable [14/01/2012 3:18:38 PM] Sandro Maculan: well sure [14/01/2012 3:18:51 PM] Sandro Maculan: let's give him one more day and watch him closely [14/01/2012 3:18:52 PM] james: given that he has not contributed anything and is solely being disruptive? [14/01/2012 3:19:00 PM] james: and foolishness? who openly admitted [14/01/2012 3:19:02 PM] Sandro Maculan: lynching him day1 is an statistical mistake [14/01/2012 3:19:07 PM] james: that he wants a mayor in power [14/01/2012 3:19:08 PM] james: that he can manipulate? [14/01/2012 3:19:19 PM] Sandro Maculan: man even so [14/01/2012 3:19:28 PM] Sandro Maculan: that's not something mafia would say openly [14/01/2012 3:19:36 PM] Sandro Maculan: it's like your claim [14/01/2012 3:19:46 PM] Sandro Maculan: it draws suspcion onto you [14/01/2012 3:19:51 PM] Sandro Maculan: which makes you less likely mafia [14/01/2012 3:20:22 PM] james: foolishness [14/01/2012 3:20:24 PM] james: didnt say it openly [14/01/2012 3:20:26 PM] james: he said it in pms [14/01/2012 3:20:28 PM] Sandro Maculan: let's wait for day 2 to lynch those guys [14/01/2012 3:20:29 PM] james: and his mason [14/01/2012 3:20:32 PM] james: gave out the pms [14/01/2012 3:20:45 PM] Sandro Maculan: chances are if they are town mafia will shoot them regardless of how suspicious they are [14/01/2012 3:20:46 PM] james: had mattchew not shared his pms before modkilled [14/01/2012 3:20:48 PM] james: no one would have known [14/01/2012 3:20:51 PM] james: possibly [14/01/2012 3:21:01 PM] james: near no one has posted though [14/01/2012 3:21:07 PM] james: primarily only known names [14/01/2012 3:21:11 PM] Sandro Maculan: i'm guilty of that too [14/01/2012 3:21:16 PM] Sandro Maculan: i have no time on weekends [14/01/2012 3:21:48 PM] james: haha [14/01/2012 3:21:58 PM] james: of the people who have posted day 1 [14/01/2012 3:22:02 PM] james: both of them are the most suspicious to me [14/01/2012 3:22:06 PM] james: palmar is a handicap [14/01/2012 3:22:10 PM] james: kurumi is trolling [14/01/2012 3:22:15 PM] james: as kurumi always does [14/01/2012 3:22:27 PM] james: the only "neutral" lynch i have is him [14/01/2012 3:22:29 PM] james: for doing fuck all [14/01/2012 3:22:31 PM] Sandro Maculan: kurumi trolls way less as mafia [14/01/2012 3:22:39 PM] Sandro Maculan: it's a pretty good tell on him [14/01/2012 3:22:40 PM] james: the only troll i abide by [14/01/2012 3:22:42 PM] james: is chez [14/01/2012 3:22:43 PM] james: lol [14/01/2012 3:22:46 PM] Sandro Maculan: sure [14/01/2012 3:22:48 PM] james: he actually contributes [14/01/2012 3:22:51 PM] james: as a troll [14/01/2012 3:23:10 PM] Sandro Maculan: kurumi is disrupitive, but if he is trolling a lot chances are he is town [14/01/2012 3:24:00 PM] Sandro Maculan: we have to lynch not likely day1 targets [14/01/2012 3:24:15 PM] Sandro Maculan: like cc and ciry [14/01/2012 3:24:30 PM] Sandro Maculan: high chance to flip mafia and low chance to get shot if town [14/01/2012 3:24:39 PM] Sandro Maculan: and we have to deal with them at some point [14/01/2012 3:26:13 PM] james: eeh both have high chances [14/01/2012 3:26:19 PM] james: of being shot [14/01/2012 3:26:20 PM] james: atm imo [14/01/2012 3:27:04 PM] Sandro Maculan: being shot by who? [14/01/2012 3:27:06 PM] Sandro Maculan: vigis? [14/01/2012 3:27:34 PM] Sandro Maculan: dunno vigis normally like to save it for later [14/01/2012 3:28:34 PM] james: ve claims hes shooting cc [14/01/2012 3:28:36 PM] james: or was anyway [14/01/2012 3:31:51 PM] Sandro Maculan: what [14/01/2012 3:32:05 PM] Sandro Maculan: i'm still on page 58 [14/01/2012 3:32:15 PM] Sandro Maculan: why did he claim who he is shooting [14/01/2012 3:32:23 PM] Sandro Maculan: and why did he claim in the first palce? [14/01/2012 3:33:36 PM] Sandro Maculan: rofl [14/01/2012 3:33:40 PM] Sandro Maculan: seriously [14/01/2012 3:33:49 PM] Sandro Maculan: he cclaims jack and doesn't eve know how it works [14/01/2012 3:33:52 PM] Sandro Maculan: -_- [14/01/2012 3:35:43 PM] Sandro Maculan: I want to vote for you cuz i don't really like the other options besides protact [14/01/2012 3:35:44 PM] james: yea [14/01/2012 3:35:47 PM] james: lol [14/01/2012 3:35:48 PM] james: see [14/01/2012 3:35:53 PM] Sandro Maculan: but he wants to lynch you and you him [14/01/2012 3:35:57 PM] james: eh [14/01/2012 3:36:02 PM] james: i have a list of like 4 people [14/01/2012 3:36:03 PM] Sandro Maculan: that's dumb as fuck =P [14/01/2012 3:36:04 PM] james: id lynch [14/01/2012 3:36:06 PM] james: tbh [14/01/2012 3:36:10 PM] james: he went for me [14/01/2012 3:36:14 PM] james: on the shadiest shit [14/01/2012 3:36:15 PM] james: in the world [14/01/2012 3:36:19 PM] james: incog reads the OP's [14/01/2012 3:36:21 PM] james: carefully [14/01/2012 3:36:23 PM] james: and he misread it [14/01/2012 3:36:28 PM] james: needed to pull a post I made [14/01/2012 3:36:31 PM] james: outside of the game [14/01/2012 3:36:35 PM] james: that he misrepresented? [14/01/2012 3:36:42 PM] james: theres no way in hell [14/01/2012 3:36:45 PM] james: thats a town incog [14/01/2012 3:36:47 PM] james: he knows better [14/01/2012 3:36:57 PM] Sandro Maculan: he's pretty good mafia then [14/01/2012 3:37:05 PM] Sandro Maculan: cuz i got a strong town lean on him [14/01/2012 3:37:10 PM] james: he has 3 posts [14/01/2012 3:37:14 PM] Sandro Maculan: based on the way he posts his shit [14/01/2012 3:37:14 PM] james: and has support [14/01/2012 3:37:16 PM] james: on a stance of [14/01/2012 3:37:24 PM] james: "ill lynch ciryandor" into "ill lynch bc" [14/01/2012 3:37:31 PM] james: he posts [14/01/2012 3:37:34 PM] james: analysis posts [14/01/2012 3:37:42 PM] james: mafia thats easy to do [14/01/2012 3:37:47 PM] james: he fucks up day 1 [14/01/2012 3:37:52 PM] james: whoops day 1 analysis dudes [14/01/2012 3:37:54 PM] james: my bad [14/01/2012 3:38:31 PM] Sandro Maculan: k if you really have a good case on him being scum and get elected you can push it day2 since you will be alive [14/01/2012 3:38:56 PM] Sandro Maculan: i'll vote for you if you don't lynch into vets day1 [14/01/2012 3:39:48 PM] james: and who would you recommend? [14/01/2012 3:39:53 PM] james: a random non talker? [14/01/2012 3:39:57 PM] james: which we have a million of [14/01/2012 3:40:11 PM] Sandro Maculan: i'd recomend a flip between one of your bgs [14/01/2012 3:40:15 PM] Sandro Maculan: and ciryandor [14/01/2012 3:40:30 PM] Sandro Maculan: maybe you can even say in thread [14/01/2012 3:40:50 PM] Sandro Maculan: that you will lynch one of the bgs 50% of the time [14/01/2012 3:40:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: and don't even roll [14/01/2012 3:41:21 PM] Sandro Maculan: that's because mafia can sub bgs in and kill both elected roles without outing anyone [14/01/2012 3:41:23 PM] james: .................... [14/01/2012 3:41:25 PM] james: i can't [14/01/2012 3:41:26 PM] james: lynch [14/01/2012 3:41:27 PM] james: a bg [14/01/2012 3:41:35 PM] james: the mayor lynch choice [14/01/2012 3:41:37 PM] james: has to be in [14/01/2012 3:41:37 PM] Sandro Maculan: you can threaten [14/01/2012 3:41:38 PM] james: when you get [14/01/2012 3:41:40 PM] james: elected [14/01/2012 3:41:40 PM] Sandro Maculan: treathen [14/01/2012 3:41:45 PM] james: ITS FULL OF SHIT [14/01/2012 3:41:49 PM] james: bgs are chosen after lynch [14/01/2012 3:41:56 PM] james: its a god damn lie [14/01/2012 3:41:57 PM] Sandro Maculan: oh [14/01/2012 3:42:06 PM] Sandro Maculan: i didn't know that [14/01/2012 3:42:11 PM] james: fw always makes the mayor candidates [14/01/2012 3:42:14 PM] james: send in the lynch choice [14/01/2012 3:42:16 PM] james: like [14/01/2012 3:42:19 PM] james: 1 hour ahead [14/01/2012 3:42:20 PM] james: of the post [14/01/2012 3:42:30 PM] james: so that someone dies within 5 minutes of deadline [14/01/2012 3:42:36 PM] james: mafia then decides to sub in or not [14/01/2012 3:42:37 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol then you need to out one of your bgs to me [14/01/2012 3:42:38 PM] james: based on election results [14/01/2012 3:42:45 PM] james: was pretty sure [14/01/2012 3:42:50 PM] james: that I was going to do a cipher [14/01/2012 3:42:57 PM] james: and hand 1 half to you, and the other half elsewhere [14/01/2012 3:43:16 PM] james: in the event I die [14/01/2012 3:43:21 PM] Sandro Maculan: yeah seems like a plan [14/01/2012 3:43:27 PM] Sandro Maculan: and tell the thread that i know [14/01/2012 3:43:36 PM] Sandro Maculan: and whoever is the other person that know [14/01/2012 3:43:37 PM] Sandro Maculan: s [14/01/2012 3:43:50 PM] james: openly telling thread who the people are [14/01/2012 3:43:53 PM] james: just means they die as well [14/01/2012 3:43:53 PM] james: kik [14/01/2012 3:43:55 PM] james: lol* [14/01/2012 3:43:58 PM] Sandro Maculan: no man [14/01/2012 3:44:11 PM] Sandro Maculan: unless you trust me and this other dude 100% [14/01/2012 3:44:24 PM] Sandro Maculan: you have to tell the thread who has the info [14/01/2012 3:44:41 PM] Sandro Maculan: not who are the bgs [14/01/2012 3:44:45 PM] Sandro Maculan: that would be dumb [14/01/2012 3:44:55 PM] james: its pretty obvious [14/01/2012 3:45:01 PM] james: who id be handing it out to [14/01/2012 3:45:19 PM] Sandro Maculan: yeah the other dude that mason you [14/01/2012 3:45:25 PM] Sandro Maculan: do you trust him? [14/01/2012 3:45:46 PM] james: eh? enough with half a cipher [14/01/2012 3:46:10 PM] james: say im elected and im town + sheriff is town [14/01/2012 3:46:12 PM] james: i hand you + opz [14/01/2012 3:46:15 PM] james: the info [14/01/2012 3:46:19 PM] james: if both bgs die night 1 [14/01/2012 3:46:23 PM] james: you are both obviously red [14/01/2012 3:46:35 PM] james: if myself + sheriff die night 1 [14/01/2012 3:46:37 PM] james: both bgs are red [14/01/2012 3:46:47 PM] james: if you or opz dont come forward with the info [14/01/2012 3:46:50 PM] james: we snagged another red [14/01/2012 3:47:07 PM] james: if both bgs die while myself + sheriff are still alive [14/01/2012 3:47:12 PM] james: likely 1 of is red [14/01/2012 3:47:26 PM] james: or you and opz are [14/01/2012 3:47:27 PM] james: regardless [14/01/2012 3:47:34 PM] james: its either 1 or 2 reds [14/01/2012 3:47:41 PM] james: in the case [14/01/2012 3:47:42 PM] Sandro Maculan: man [14/01/2012 3:47:46 PM] james: and having the names out [14/01/2012 3:47:47 PM] Sandro Maculan: I can't be elected [14/01/2012 3:47:49 PM] james: works as a deterent [14/01/2012 3:47:54 PM] james: to shooting / subbing them [14/01/2012 3:47:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: I won't be here for the lynch [14/01/2012 3:48:34 PM] Sandro Maculan: yeah seems good enough [14/01/2012 3:49:22 PM] Sandro Maculan: day ends today right? [14/01/2012 3:50:29 PM] james: uh let me check [14/01/2012 3:51:02 PM] james: yea [14/01/2012 3:51:20 PM] james: aksi [14/01/2012 3:51:23 PM] james: also [14/01/2012 3:51:27 PM] james: interesting move foolishness [14/01/2012 3:51:40 PM] james: he voted me [14/01/2012 3:51:41 PM] james: not bm [14/01/2012 3:51:45 PM] Sandro Maculan: you are lynching protact 100%? [14/01/2012 3:52:13 PM] james: not 100% no [14/01/2012 3:53:12 PM] james: i have foolishness, palmar, protact, brownbear and wiggles [14/01/2012 3:53:16 PM] james: on a list of possible red vets [14/01/2012 3:53:21 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol [14/01/2012 3:53:28 PM] Sandro Maculan: i want to lynch none of those [14/01/2012 3:53:35 PM] james: most wont [14/01/2012 3:53:41 PM] james: brownbear hasn't posted that I remember [14/01/2012 3:53:47 PM] james: if i had to choose former mayor candidates [14/01/2012 3:53:50 PM] james: is shoot slardar [14/01/2012 3:53:51 PM] Sandro Maculan: bb might even get mkéd [14/01/2012 3:53:53 PM] james: but hes so obviously not red [14/01/2012 3:54:12 PM] james: so many vets have done [14/01/2012 3:54:13 PM] Sandro Maculan: tbh i don't even remember reading his posts [14/01/2012 3:54:15 PM] james: dick fuck all [14/01/2012 4:01:44 PM] Sandro Maculan: man I'll compromise don't lynch fool or incog then you get my vote [14/01/2012 4:04:25 PM] james: fine, ill agree to that [14/01/2012 4:05:49 PM] Sandro Maculan: k gotta roll [14/01/2012 4:05:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: I'd totally support palmar [14/01/2012 4:06:00 PM] Sandro Maculan: fuck him he is scum [14/01/2012 4:07:01 PM] james: lol [14/01/2012 4:17:56 PM] james: off to work be back later [12:05:56 AM] Sandro Maculan: i'm back [12:06:01 AM] Sandro Maculan: who got lynched [12:11:43 AM] james: palmar flipped miller [12:11:47 AM] james: and you almsot got modkilled i think [12:11:55 AM] Sandro Maculan: yeah [12:12:00 AM] Sandro Maculan: just checked that [12:12:03 AM] Sandro Maculan: =/ [12:12:16 AM] Sandro Maculan: i didn't even realize there was a voting thread [12:12:23 AM] james: lol [12:12:36 AM] Sandro Maculan: i saw plenty of people voting in thread [12:12:39 AM] Sandro Maculan: and never checked [12:12:54 AM] Sandro Maculan: fucking palmar man [12:12:59 AM] james: least he was miller [12:13:07 AM] Sandro Maculan: yeah [12:13:11 AM] Sandro Maculan: not as bad [12:13:12 AM] Sandro Maculan: but sitll [12:13:20 AM] Sandro Maculan: i was pretty sure he was mafia [12:14:12 AM] james: im more comfortable with my read still [12:14:14 AM] james: on incog [12:14:50 AM] Sandro Maculan: incog is my second strongest read this game [12:14:52 AM] Sandro Maculan: as town [12:14:59 AM] james: why his flop [12:15:02 AM] james: with no real reason [12:15:08 AM] Sandro Maculan: man [12:15:09 AM] james: from me [12:15:11 AM] james: to someone else? [12:15:13 AM] Sandro Maculan: i did read that [12:15:19 AM] Sandro Maculan: that's pretty normal as town [12:15:23 AM] james: nah [12:15:28 AM] james: his campaign run [12:15:30 AM] Sandro Maculan: and pretty danm wierd if e is mafia [12:15:30 AM] james: that picked up steam [12:15:32 AM] james: was offing me [12:15:41 AM] Sandro Maculan: mafia wants to keep their story straigh [12:15:50 AM] Sandro Maculan: and draw the least amount of suspicion [12:15:55 AM] james: eh? depends on the player [12:15:58 AM] Sandro Maculan: nothing about his play screams mafia [12:15:59 AM] james: doing things that are [12:16:06 AM] james: "non standard cause they are bad" [12:16:12 AM] Sandro Maculan: i read that game curu played in [12:16:13 AM] james: is a valid strat [12:16:14 AM] james: lol [12:16:21 AM] Sandro Maculan: sure [12:16:33 AM] james: vets routinely do things that are "wtfish" because they can get away with it when no one else can [12:16:34 AM] Sandro Maculan: but they neve pull it off [12:16:42 AM] Sandro Maculan: they always keep somewhat neutral [12:17:05 AM] Sandro Maculan: dunno i used to thin k that way [12:17:20 AM] Sandro Maculan: and thought you were mafia 2 games in which you were not [12:17:26 AM] james: to be fair [12:17:32 AM] james: regardless of my alignment [12:17:37 AM] Sandro Maculan: mafia behaves similarly no matter how good they are supposed to be [12:17:37 AM] james: people typically view my play [12:17:38 AM] james: as red [12:18:01 AM] Sandro Maculan: all my conspiracy theories [12:18:16 AM] Sandro Maculan: like these guy is incredible mafia and must be doing yx [12:18:22 AM] james: lol [12:18:25 AM] Sandro Maculan: always prove to be wrong [12:18:42 AM] Sandro Maculan: the simplest thing is most likely truth [12:18:52 AM] james: usually [12:18:59 AM] james: the exception is vet players [12:19:10 AM] Sandro Maculan: nah [12:19:11 AM] james: most vets dont play [12:19:13 AM] james: fucked up [12:19:14 AM] Sandro Maculan: they aren't [12:19:15 AM] james: ace does [12:19:23 AM] Sandro Maculan: that's hat i'm saying [12:19:30 AM] Sandro Maculan: even ace [12:19:31 AM] james: lol [12:19:35 AM] james: ace does ballsy shit [12:19:36 AM] james: in the open [12:19:40 AM] Sandro Maculan: acts way more calmly when mafia [12:19:47 AM] james: until you provke him [12:19:48 AM] Sandro Maculan: when town he is way more out there [12:19:54 AM] Sandro Maculan: nah man [12:20:07 AM] james: im saying from experience [12:20:13 AM] james: you can pressure him [12:20:13 AM] james: hard [12:20:18 AM] james: and by pressure i mean [12:20:18 AM] Sandro Maculan: yeah maybe you are right [12:20:20 AM] james: argue like a champ [12:20:26 AM] Sandro Maculan: i'm saying form experience too [12:20:27 AM] james: till he gets super pissed [12:20:28 AM] james: lol [12:20:30 AM] james: it takes alot [12:20:32 AM] james: and I mean alot [12:22:13 AM] Sandro Maculan: man i need to sleep [12:22:16 AM] james: haha [12:22:17 AM] james: then crash [12:22:37 AM] Sandro Maculan: i got woken up 4 hours after i hit the sac today [12:22:57 AM] Sandro Maculan: i got home early toay cuz i was like a fucking zombie [12:23:13 AM] Sandro Maculan: gnight man [11:27:44 AM] Sandro Maculan: yo [11:27:49 AM] Sandro Maculan: can we still talk? [11:27:59 AM] Sandro Maculan: or it's only for the day? [11:29:08 AM] Sandro Maculan: fucking. hung over. [11:29:26 AM] Sandro Maculan: need. more. drinks. [5:16:33 PM] james: we can yes Nice try, but no. Look at the timing of these posts. You claim that sandroba made BC lynch Palmar 5 hours before before BC posted his chat logs. I don't believe that you are clairvoyant. The only information that you should have had access to was the post you quoted from the thread. On January 15 2012 06:05 sandroba wrote: Palmar you need to try harder, you are too easy to spot as scum nowadays. I'd rather not lynch any vets day1 but you make it so hard not to lynch you. Please go die in a corner. I'll vote BC since we came to a compromise in pms. Gotta roll. ##Vote: BloodyC0bbler But I seriously doubt that as a townie you would be bold enough to claim that Sandroba forced BC to lynch Palmar, when his in thread post is quite ambiguous. ESPECIALLY when wherebugsgo was THE #1 vocal proponent of lynching Palmar. If you were a townie, I highly doubt that you would ignore wherebugsgo's BLATANT support for the Palmar lynch and instead attempt to pin it on sandroba. Your story does not match up. You posess information that you should not have had at the time and are trying to hide it. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 08:33 wherebugsgo wrote: ##vote Protactinium On my phone; in short, massive slip. When the "day 1 summary" was posted by Protactinium, it suggested that there was pre-knowledge that the chaos was town-induced. Note how Protactinium never questions that the people who pushed Palmar for lynch (WBG and other hardliners) were anything but town. It's not possible to make absolute generalizations like Protactinium is doing unless there's knowledge that those generalizations are true. That knowledge is only available to scum. I'll post more about this shortly when I get comp access. This is not a slip, it is a deduction based on the state of the thread. It would not surprise me if there are 1-2 mafia actively posting and creating chaos in the thread. However, given the general atmosphere, it is highly likely that a majority of the mafia are lazy and apathetic, which means that the people trying to figure stuff out are likely town. At this point, there's no reason to focus on the active posters when clearly the thread is in chaos, which incentivizes mafia to just skate by. I am making generalizations not based on an absolute statement that there are no mafia among the active posters, but that there will be a lot of mafia that are hiding. There is nothing to suggest that I have knowledge that only the mafia know, all I have done is made an educated deduction, one that is apparently quite unpopular. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 09:45 Toadesstern wrote: I thought sandroba made BC lynch Palmar because of his post yes. No I do not have clairvoyant. BC said he wants to lynch A => sandroba says he discussed with BC and they both agreed to lynch Palmar => BC lynches palmar. I think it's pretty straight forward. Even if you don't believe you, just consider what you're saying. You think I've got information I should not have? You think that I KNOW that sandroba (because I'm talking about red sandroba all the time) told BC to lynch Palmar instead of someone else because I am mafia as well. And that's the reason I come in this thread to tell you sandroba is scum, because I as a scum myself know what he and BC talker about? That's just not making sense at all. The bold is bullshit. Sandroba discussed with BC and said they came to a compromise. What is this compromise? You don't know. I don't think you're mafia bussing sandroba. You're just bullshitting hard in order to get a town sandroba lynched. Everyone is talking too much about bussing when it doesn't really make any sense at this point. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 09:50 hiro protagonist wrote: Yo protac, you never answered my question. also, All I see from you doing is defending sandroba, with no scum hunting. What gives? Could you give me an opinion on my analysis on sand, or tell me who you want to lynch today? Read my posts to see who I want to lynch. I don't have to repeat myself. As a general announcement, if you want to talk to me or ask me questions, please read my posts first so you don't ask me to waste time repeating myself. On January 17 2012 09:51 Scamp wrote: Did anyone else notice Protact's long post on page 92 that makes a case against Ciryandor as if he's still alive? Another example of people who don't read. That post was a re-post of a post I posted on the wrong account before Ciryandor flipped red. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 10:02 ~OpZ~ wrote: Protactinum, Incognito/Mystlord, again, for the umpteenth time, many in the thread, myself, Lanaia, BC, and I'm sure others, have asked you to head your posts with the person posting. It does not matter who is posting. A shared account is a shared account. It is not two voices battling for dominance. It is one voice with one opinion. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 16 2012 08:20 Toadesstern wrote: Sandroba was the guy who made BC lynch Palmar instead of whoever he wanted to lynch first BC said he wants to lynch A => sandroba says he discussed with BC and they both agreed to lynch Palmar => BC lynches palmar. I think it's pretty straight forward. BC said he wants to lynch A => sandroba says he discussed with BC => BC lynches palmar instead of A. I think it's pretty straight forward. On January 15 2012 06:05 sandroba wrote: Palmar you need to try harder, you are too easy to spot as scum nowadays. I'd rather not lynch any vets day1 but you make it so hard not to lynch you. Please go die in a corner. I'll vote BC since we came to a compromise in pms. Gotta roll. ##Vote: BloodyC0bbler Nope its not what you thought, its what you said Everybody note the bold and see how the story changes each time. You know what a compromise is right? It means both parties give up part of their demand to come to some mutual ground they can agree upon. It does not mean that one party gets their way. But for some reason you conclude that sandro "made BC lynch Palmar" from "we came to a compromise"? You are pretty obviously stretching things. I hope people can see that. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 10:28 hiro protagonist wrote: Whoops, I missed your vote on Macpo. my bad. However reading though your filter, I dont see a response to my question, which is what do you think of my analysis I posted on sandroba? His Modivation for these post is not one of getting scum lynch, but as a set up should Cyriandor flip later (whitch he knows is scum) to put him in a strong position. If he was town, He would have both tried harder to get elected and pushed Cyriandor harder. Sandroba is not WBG. He is not a player who spam posts "KILL X" through every page of the thread. You also don't see me saying "Kill X" in every single post, but that doesn't mean I am convinced about my reads. There is no reason to believe that Sandroba did not want to lynch Ciryandor, that is just speculation. You say that sandroba does no scumhunting. That's irrelevant, because quite emphatically supported my read on Ciryandor, in fact, calling my post "the best post so far". Sure, he didn't come up with original analysis, but at least he recognized which analyses were correct. Not everyone can be the first to state something. So unless you're going to make up some convoluted story about how my wish to lynch Macpo (who Foolishness first mentioned) is really an elaborate plan to bus my own teammate (you can hopefully see how this is getting ridiculous), you can't say much about Sandroba not writing original analysis. In all honesty, writing up an original analysis and supporting an original analysis when the post is buried and nobody else is supporting or even talking about it are at the same level in terms of how much it says about alignment. You claim that sandroba is more interested in self-preservation than finding scum. I see no evidence of that. In fact, if you read over sandroba's posts as a whole they give off more of a spontaneous unplanned feeling, suggesting more that he isn't really concerned about how he looks. In short, as Meapak said, the cases on sandroba are forced. There is no way he is a better lynch than any of the people on my red list. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 10:35 Toadesstern wrote: exactly that's my point. It's a compromise so sandroba made BC do something he would not have done without that compromise. I'm not saying he forced BC to do so but he obviously said "if you do X I will vote you" and that made BC change up whatever he changed. You're agreeing it's a compromise and that's what Sandroba said. That IS influence someone. All I'm saying is that Sandroba was influencing BC and made him do something. That somethign was lynching palmar. Nope. For all you know, it could have been "you can't lynch X". You are basically claiming have an amazingly accurate sense of intuition that I doubt you actually possess. But in any case, I don't need to go on this further. People can decide what they want about this. However, there's no reason why sandroba should be fingered out for this "forcing" Palmar's lynch when there were multiple people in the thread asking for his head. Stop tunneling sandroba on thin reasons. Macpo/GGQ are much better lynches. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 10:53 kitaman27 wrote: Really Incog/Mystlord? Have I been invisible listed? You could at least refuse my request with an explanation rather than ignoring me twice. Lets not spam the thread more than it needs to be. One you share, I can move on to much more important things  Its the same answer. It does not matter who is posting. A shared account is a shared account. It is not two voices battling for dominance. It is one voice with one opinion. And thus by extension, we are one person. What we post is what our thoughts are. There's really no need for you to wade through fragmented brainstorming. Its not relevant. I'm not responding because its not relevant. Can we please ask relevant questions instead of pestering people for irrelevant details? Nothing against you personally, but I can't be responding to everything. We all need to focus on what's important, which is figuring out this lynch. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
Actually, I beat you all. No worries though. It seems pretty clear who is on the right track and who is not at this point. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 11:40 Toadesstern wrote: this guy wants to lynch GGQ, someone incog thinks to be scum as well. So one of those 2 got to be wrong? What is your point. Care to give any analysis? (other than sandroba, we've already heard enough of that). | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 11:59 Toadesstern wrote: you two say meapak is scum and you say GGQ is scum. Meapak wants GGQ to die. Something's wrong there unless meapak is know to do this. Hi, you've again just told me nothing. No conclusions, only doubt. "Oh noes something is wrong here, but I don't know what it is!" Also, I never say Meapak is mafia so quit planting words into people's mouths or making baseless assumptions (hey you're doing it again!). | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
Your case is basically "sandroba is trolling, and he isn't playing like a saint." Doesn't mean he's mafia. You also ignore the fact that sandroba supported my case on a confirmed mafia. As for the rest, I've already explained why the sandroba case is bad (responding to hiro progatonist's analysis). I really don't need to respond to every analysis on sandroba. Come back only after you've read my posts thoroughly. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 12:33 Toadesstern wrote: see what I'm talking about? Either lies or misinterpreting No my case is not about trolling it's about the fact that he dodging everything he can. He does not give explanations, he gives only very little reads and used humour to cover his lack of explanation. That's why I am mentioning the trolls because they're in places were you should simply write 2 or 3 lines to explain his thoughts. He refuses to do so. And no I am not ignoring the case that he supported that case. He did that as well with annul and VE last game I was mafia with him. He is known to do that to screw with peoples reads. If people think he's mafia they think sandrobas reads are wrong => therefore saying a mafia is mafia makes people think his mafia buddy is town because people think he is town. He does that. Interestingly, you never once mention in your analysis that sandroba is "dodging". If your case isn't about trolling, why do I see a bunch of random sandroba quotes followed by the commentary "troll". You never definitively give a conclusion to your analysis as to what the summary points of your case are, because quite frankly you are all over the place and its hard to get your main points. And yeah, that just means sandroba isn't playing like a saint. Sandroba doesn't explain Ciryandor in much detail, but he doesn't have to. I already analyzed him. No need to repeat the same stuff over and over. You are also wrong that this is the same case as TL Mafia XLVIII. The important thing is not that he attacks Ciryandor, but HOW he does it. In XLVIII, Sandroba jumps on annul when annul is already a big topic of discussion and he is already getting votes. In this game, Sandroba jumps on Ciryandor when the case is dead and buried. HUGE difference there. Quit saying that I'm lying and misinterpreting when you don't even properly conclude your "analysis" or attempt to clarify your main points. If all you're going to say about a post is "troll" don't even mention it. It just distracts from your argument. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 17 2012 13:28 Foolishness wrote: READ CAREFULLY! DON'T LOSE THIS POST! REPOST MANY TIMES I am making this post as a way of compiling the thoughts of the few people in this game who are making sense and posting good analysis. A lot of it will be my own thoughts, but it's heavily based on a few people (should be obvious) who are the most transparent and the most obvious townies. 9 Mafia remaining. Here's the preliminary suspects: Macpo, GGQ, L. These are the people I feel we have the best case for and most of the transparent people in the thread seem to agree about these 3. Personally I think GGQ is town and we should avoid lynching him for now. Protact already gave viable reasons why Macpo is better than GGQ today, and I feel there is little to argue there. sandroba pointed out how L is acting like in Ver's game, and I couldn't agree more. We also have Incog's analysis against L. Secondary suspects: Bill Murray, chaosquo, evantrees. These 3 people have garnered attention from a few people but not from everyone, so they are listed as secondary candidates. I am of the belief that all 3 of these people are mafia. evantrees is already mentioned by Incog. I think Cyber_Cheese highlighted a good summary of chaosquo here. Most of it is similar arguments to Macpo. Bill Murray as red? I think so. Others have cast suspicion but there's not been a full analysis anywhere. A few people have commented that the election "feels" weird in some way, and I definitely sympathize. The votes for Bill Murray come across as the most suspicious: lots of random votes there. Personally I was surprised he even got into office (remember I was out all day so I saw the results without reading the previous 20 pages). I do realize I may have initially pushed him into candidacy, but I shall take responsibility for that and see to it that he's lynched in the near future. But to be simple: Bill Murray posted a lot, and got into office. Since then he's been pretty passive at the helm (so has BC I realize). That's good enough reason to warrant a ton of suspicion, as he should be actively scumhunting and posting without fear at this point. Remaining mafia candidates: Jackal, Opz, kingjames, zeks. Incog has an analysis against Jackal as we know. I am not on board with him being mafia yet. Traditionally when he is mafia he posts paragraphs, and not one-liners. However he warrants suspicion for having an apathetic attitude. Opz is someone who I believe Sheth was the first to cast doubt on, and I must say Sheth is definitely onto something. I know of the past Opz as a town player who is aggressive, not afraid to call people out on their bullshit. That's something we aren't seeing much of this game. He's posted a few of his own thoughts, but there is a clear lack of effort. Bored townie who is facepalming at having to read 100 pages? Possibly. Mafia hiding in the shadows? Fits better. kingjames is called out on by Incog, and there's further analysis by BC. His last sentence is the perfect sum to kingjames: "The key thing to note is that in contrast to his town play where he is outgoing and analytical, his posts in this game are very subdued, seem artificial and feel overly planned." kingjames has yet to do anything to contradict this. zeks I felt strongly about yesterday, he made a bad post which is nothing like his normal outspoken attitude (though it's been a while since he's played I think). He has since asked for a replacement and hasn't posted, but should still be looked at in the future. Meapak_Ziphh is someone I would like to throw out there as a candidate (which shouldn't be a surprise from the few of my recent posts). What has Meapak done this game? Tried to get GGQ lynched, and unfortunately that's about all he's tried to do. There is a very aggressive push from him to kill this guy, which I find a little suspicious and slightly out of character. Mafia: Macpo, GGQ, L, Bill Murray, chaosquo, evantrees, Opz, Kingjames, Meapak_Ziphh. Substitute a few off candidates and I think we've found our 9: Jackal, BrownBear, zeks, Munk-E, other random inactive player goes here. DONT LOSE THIS POST ITS SO IMPORTANT! Writing all that I think the usefulness of this post is immediately made clear. The most prominent townies and the ones doing the analysis are all right on most of their reads. It's just each person has found 2-3 mafia on their own, and most of the time they are all different. Pooling this information together I realize it's hard to call anyone and their analysis wrong, as when you analyze the big picture everything fits together. Anyone in their right mind would look at this game and think "wow this atmosphere is perfect for the mafia". Ver once told me that lots of times it's easier to find the mafia when the town atmosphere sucks because they will not be the ones causing chaos and disruption. Instead they will be sitting on the sidelines enjoying the show while the townies flail around. Look at all the names I've listed above. Everyone (yes everyone on that list) is guilty of apathy and does not have the interests of the town in mind. They are not thinking long term, or analyzing the big picture. They aren't playing the game, they are watching. Macpo Many others have said so, and though I may be biased, I still think it's best we lynch him today. I believe his case is still by far the strongest we have at the moment, especially since he has responded to his threats (with even more reason to kill him). At the time of writing GGQ has yet to say anything. We kill him (Macpo) today and spend the night figuring out who has the next best case. In the meantime, I'm going to be looking for connections between the above players to see if anyone can be ruled out or automatically included. IF YOU HAVE FINISHED READING AND YOU ARE A COMPETENT TOWN PLAYER PLEASE READ AGAIN Also, after sifting through this information, I feel we have a strong enough lead to start killing like there's no tomorrow. ##Vote: double lynch What do you mean by Meapak being out of character? For me it seems to fit his "I'm going to be the town hero" attitude. Contrast with PYP Interesting where as mafia he just spreads doubt and isn't assertive in the thread besides a half-assed mayoral campaign. Good post for the most part. I put Jackal and kingjames as better candidates over Bill Murray though (whos colors will show as the game progresses, I'm not sold on him now. Why would a mafia mayor give away the list of bodyguards? Why is L so intent on spreading doubt among the 3 top mayor candidates (BC/BM/me)?) Chaosquo is almost certainly mafia, as is kingjames. Notice kingjames' recent out of place post speculating about the night kills (who cares at this point, anyway?) Furthermore, he recently posted a list of people he is suspicious of with no analysis: 4. Slardar 15. L 22. rgTheSchworz 27. BloodyC0bbler 30. blahz0r 39. hiro protagonist 49. Scamp claiming that he won't push these candidates "in the interest of not fracturing the town". Note how he never actually says anything about the current lynch candidates. I wouldn't be surprised if a couple of the more inactive players were mafia instead though, but this should be a good list to start out with. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 18 2012 12:21 Foolishness wrote: To add to that, I think this night will show where Bill Murray lies in relation to his alignment. If he jails the right person then KP will be reduced (and if he's been reading the thread it shouldn't be too hard to figure out who to jail...) Jailing a mafia is KP -1. Jailing a high profile townie who is likely to get shot can potentially block more KP AND save an important player. (Hint: Foolishness or Protactinium) (Obviously Bill shouldn't say who he is jailing until after the day post). | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
BM please incarcerate L. Medics, protect Foolishness/me, obviously. Hopefully jailing L will -1 KP and deter the mafia from shooting Foolishness/me from lowered KP and the fact that medics could completely screw them over. If BM chooses to jail randomly again, then something is wrong. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 18 2012 13:12 GGQ wrote: Yeah so I hard defended macpo because I thought he posted like I did when I was new. It's probably better to vig me tonight instead of wasting a lynch. Mafia don't send out reminders that they defended mafia. Mafia also don't ask to be vigged, since they can't influence vigs, but they certainly can influence lynches. Nobody lynch him today, keke? Here's the new list of mafias. L kingjames BM Toadesstern SANDROBA Jackal bumatlarge opz chaosquo Now this list is too big for them to all be mafia, but is the best place to start. Brief explanations on the new people on the list: BM. In contrast to BM's day 1 posting, his day 2 is abyssmal. Its also become less frequent too, which exactly fits my prediction if he is mafia, as his mafia play deteriorates rapidly (for cross reference, TL Mafia XXII where he is the mafia GF). And yes I should be one to know this read as I was mafia with him in that game. Toadesstern On January 19 2012 10:56 Toadesstern wrote: I'd actually willing to lynch BM + GGQ tomorrow. I still think my case is good but I don't like the arguments of the people joining me :p However I don't like the people telling me it's wrong either because there's nothing they got to say. The only ones I like right now are people you are not commenting it at all but that's not helping me at all :p Filter all of Toadesstern's posts. Search for all instances of GGQ. Confirm that Toadesstern has never made a case on GGQ, and has in fact been preventing his lynch all yesterday. "I still think my case is good"? Lol. Bullshit. See a trend here? Also combine with my pressure yesterday, which showed that Toadesstern somehow knew what happened behind the scenes with sandroba influencing BC with Palmar's lynch. Sandroba. Again, abyssmal day 2 posting compared to day 1. The case totally makes sense if you consider that Toadesstern somehow knows what goes on between sandroba/BC. As for explanations related to Ciryandor, yeah, mafia usually don't do that. But they do avoid pushing too hard where they can avoid it. Sandroba was never a viable mayor candidate, never votes for mayor (neutral, I suppose, but he doesn't vote for the person who brought up the Ciryandor case - read: me), and influences the Palmar lynch. Over Ciryandor, the person whose death he has supposedly been calling for all game in thread. Combined, these points outweigh his in thread support of Ciryandor. I know I vocally said he was town yesterday. But I lied. I only said that because I needed to get macpo lynched first lol. bumatlarge. His apathetic posting and general lack of enthusiasm is strikingly different from his usual active town play. And now I'm out of time. Need to post this before I potentially bite the dust. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 18 2012 13:12 GGQ wrote: Yeah so I hard defended macpo because I thought he posted like I did when I was new. It's probably better to vig me tonight instead of wasting a lynch. Mafia don't send out reminders that they defended mafia. Mafia also don't ask to be vigged, since they can't influence vigs, but they certainly can influence lynches. Nobody lynch him today, keke? Here's the new list of mafias. L kingjames BM Toadesstern SANDROBA Jackal bumatlarge opz chaosquo Now this list is too big for them to all be mafia, but is the best place to start. Brief explanations on the new people on the list: BM. In contrast to BM's day 1 posting, his day 2 is abyssmal. Its also become less frequent too, which exactly fits my prediction if he is mafia, as his mafia play deteriorates rapidly (for cross reference, TL Mafia XXII where he is the mafia GF). And yes I should be one to know this read as I was mafia with him in that game. Toadesstern On January 19 2012 10:56 Toadesstern wrote: I'd actually willing to lynch BM + GGQ tomorrow. I still think my case is good but I don't like the arguments of the people joining me :p However I don't like the people telling me it's wrong either because there's nothing they got to say. The only ones I like right now are people you are not commenting it at all but that's not helping me at all :p Filter all of Toadesstern's posts. Search for all instances of GGQ. Confirm that Toadesstern has never made a case on GGQ, and has in fact been preventing his lynch all yesterday. "I still think my case is good"? Lol. Bullshit. See a trend here? Also combine with my pressure yesterday, which showed that Toadesstern somehow knew what happened behind the scenes with sandroba influencing BC with Palmar's lynch. Sandroba. Again, abyssmal day 2 posting compared to day 1. The case totally makes sense if you consider that Toadesstern somehow knows what goes on between sandroba/BC. As for explanations related to Ciryandor, yeah, mafia usually don't do that. But they do avoid pushing too hard where they can avoid it. Sandroba was never a viable mayor candidate, never votes for mayor (neutral, I suppose, but he doesn't vote for the person who brought up the Ciryandor case - read: me), and influences the Palmar lynch. Over Ciryandor, the person whose death he has supposedly been calling for all game in thread. Combined, these points outweigh his in thread support of Ciryandor. I know I vocally said he was town yesterday. But I lied. I only said that because I needed to get macpo lynched first lol. bumatlarge. His apathetic posting and general lack of enthusiasm is strikingly different from his usual active town play. And now I'm out of time. Need to post this before I potentially bite the dust. Yes this is a double post. For some reason I am always cursed with posting when my post will end up at the bottom of a page. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
| ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 19 2012 12:10 Toadesstern wrote: As there's actually some people who are willing to lynch sandroba I'm going to try it again and prove my innocence. I'll vote for GGQ and sandroba. I said several times yesterday that I think BM is scummy and weird but I'd much rather not lynch into an office that early but given that noone was listening to me or willing to lynch sandroba I was accepting to lynch BM. That apparently has changed: ##Vote GGQ ##Vote Sandroba Sorry, but sandroba flipping red doesn't help you at all, given your hilarious slipup yesterday (you certainly do remember, right?). You clearly saw my post, and yet conveniently ignore that GGQ is town. We are just going to lynch down my list today. ##Vote BM ##Vote kingjames | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
Oops. You're off it now. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 19 2012 12:19 Toadesstern wrote: I just told you I'm a VET and I was shot tonight. Just believe me god damn it. I did not make a slip. READ that part again PLEASE. Look for a post where I was like "sry guys it's 3 am in the morning and I'm going to bed now" I think the important part is one above that. I'm going to look for it myself and quote it. It explains exactly why it can't be a slip no matter how strange you believe it to be. Nah I only looked for the red part (flashy flashy), asnwered, opened my pm and still haven't read the past about GGQ in your post (or anyone else but me). I'm going to do that right after I found the post I'm looking up for you right now. Vote BM and kingjames plz, thx. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 19 2012 12:22 Toadesstern wrote: protact, read it: If my logic is flawed somewhere tell me but I don't think what you're telling me is possible, AT ALL. Now reading your post. If you vote for BM and kingjames your ugly posting will be forgiven. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 19 2012 12:22 Toadesstern wrote: protact, read it: If my logic is flawed somewhere tell me but I don't think what you're telling me is possible, AT ALL. Now reading your post. You are funny. But innocent. Don't sweat bro. Also everyone please vote for double lynch again. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 19 2012 12:40 VisceraEyes wrote: Something doesn't feel right. BM didn't incarcerate L. Toad got shot. I got shot. Bill needs to get in here and tell us who he incarcerated. I'm totally not ruling out the possibility that a vig tried to shoot Toad, but that means that there are only 3 Mafia KP...which means that Bill incarcerated scum last night. I don't know...something smells fishy. If BM is mafia, anything is possible. We can't deduce anything unless we can trust the sheriff (because if he's red he will just lie about incarcerations). | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 19 2012 12:45 blahz0r wrote: I think I agree with Protactinium's list of lynching Bill Murray but not sure who I want to vote for 2nd lynch. The following was posted before his Night 2 post... Did BM do that? Does incarcerate only work on one hit? Need answers... Incarcerate prevents you from dying period. So L was not incarcerated. Since nobody so far has claimed to be incarcerated, I'm going to assume Bill incarcerated someone random. Which isn't something he'd do as town. For the second lynch, kingjames is our target for today. I think Foolishness/BC and I have all done an analysis on him so read our filters if you're not certain yet. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
Considering voting sandroba instead, gotta read thread though. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
Also please stop voting people who are not on my list. WBG is a non-sensical lynch. supersoft is likewise. the people still voting for GGQ are ... ima look at the vote lists later when i get out of class. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 21 2012 04:25 kingjames01 wrote: There you are. Consider if you will the following: Why is BloodyC0bbler trying so hard to avoid taking a stand on p4NDemik? In fact, at the moment, they are attempting to distance themselves from each other. It is one thing to invalidate someone's analysis, it is another ENTIRELY to refuse to analyse. If you flip town, we'll reconsider. But until then, stop cluttering the thread with your useless spam thanks. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 21 2012 04:35 p4NDemik wrote: Proact I trust your judgment based upon your actions so far this game, why is supersoft a non-sensical lynch? I have already kept an open mind and told myself I would switch (most likely to kingjames if someone could really convince me I am in error) but I have seen some of the most respected TL mafia players step to the plate in you and BC and do nothing to dissuade me. Please tell me where I have gone wrong and why this vote wouldn't be extremely beneficial to town. No time to think about it, but supersoft is CURRENTLY nonsensical. Lets lynch sandroba first. I'll look over it later when I have time although I do recall supersoft being quite useless this game. The thing is, there's no reason to deviate from my list right now. We'll take care of the rest later. Lets just consolidate our votes. This day seems to have produced some interesting information. But right now is the time to lynch, not the time to insist on getting information. I'll sort through all this later if I'm not dead by that time. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
BrownBear would also be a good lynch. BC/Foolishness please just pick someone to lynch and focus on that. Don't waste time arguing with people who won't listen. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
| ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 21 2012 09:13 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm here and my votes are for sale. Protact pushing Sandroba so hard is SOOOOOOOO suspicious to me. Like, think about it: he's been "scumhunting" all game - why lynch Sandroba? There's no new information (although arguably that is part of Protact's problem with him), so what makes him more likely to flip red today than yesterday BEFORE Macpo got lynched? I mean, if it's about his activity, why not go after someone like BrownBear or evantrees or something? Because Sandroba "should know better"? So should bum! Where the hell is bumatlarge during all this? No idea - but I suspect that it has to do with Sandroba's complete absence. This is a town decision, with everything hanging in the balance and the fact that this is a double-lynch day, I feel like this is an important lynch. What's it gonna be guys? If you notice, bum is on my list too. But of course, we can only lynch 2 people today. And yes, sandroba's post-day 1 posting is utterly atrocious, which is the primary motivation behind his lynch. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
The hatter claim makes sense given that nobody has claimed to have been incarcerated last night. Now while it is possible that a mafia BM just didn't incarcerate anyone, it doesn't make sense given the night kills. Neither Foolishness or I were shot, and if BM were mafia, he would have known that. Why would he not take the opportunity to show he is pro-town by actually jailing us then? BM misses an opportunity to show he is pro-town, when the mafia agenda is to look pro-town. Thus, BM's hatter claim makes sense. Furthermore, I was #1 on BM's long list of "Lynch lynch lynch!" candidates. So that bomb placement makes sense from his viewpoint. Finally, his activity has picked up today and he has been throwing around reads. While they are pretty atrocious, mafia don't just pop out and volunteer a bunch of information. Given these factors, I'm willing to give BM the benefit of the doubt for today. Lynch Sandroba/kingjames please. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 21 2012 09:23 p4NDemik wrote: Don't lynch lurkers over people we have made enormous headway in analyzing today. BM gave up on this game at two different points, and had been expressing an incredible amount of apathy and irrational thought processes up until this play to go for sandroba. This is the last ditch effort of someone who decided he finally wanted to give a shit. Not the defense of genuine town. Throwing this away in favor of going for a lurker sandroba is irresponsible and can give a mafia BM another day to do as he pleases with immunity. Don't allow him this luxury. He has NOT earned it. This is not about luxury. BM is known for being an irrational player. BM "gave up" twice, but he didn't just give up. He spilled information while "giving up". Not something mafia does. His argumentation needs work, but he doesn't seem to be hiding anything. BM is far from a clear lynch. His reappearance since yesterday makes his alignment uncertain. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 21 2012 09:22 EchelonTee wrote: Hold off on sandroba for now... there's nothing conclusive on him. From his filter, he does hardline against L at one point, in a short post. atm, I don't think scum engaged in a massive bussing scheme involving multiple players and what not... he's just playing lurky. flips will give a lot more information on people leading the lynch, because atm, there are a lot of people with town influence who are relatively unquestioned. meh. He doesn't hardline against L, he just makes one comment about him. L was already under suspicion from my first big post anyway. This has nothing to do with bussing. It has to do with the fact that sandroba's day 2-3 posting is far off from his day 1. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 21 2012 09:54 risk.nuke wrote: Let me tell you what happend. Scum decided BM was doomed, and decided to just go along with it to avoid suspicion. Which caused a few townies unease because everyone were agreeing on BM (aka seemed to easy). Combination with BM's bullshit-claim, which is just the worlds worst dumbest lie. Because you don't let yourself get elected mayor as a Mad Hatter to begin with. It's like getting elected when you're a veteran... ONLY MUCH WORSE. The only reason he bloody said it was fearmongering that we might loose protact who was looking pro-town. Comeon If he actually were a mad hatter why on earth would he even had set a bomb on protect. And do you think he would had missed the damn second night action if he had an that important role? LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES, + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://zambooieproductimgprod.s3.amazonaws.com/446/953/full.jpg) And 15 votes on sandroba. What? Where is the reasoning and logic to support 15 votes. the guy is leading jesus. and you're worried about reds wagoning BM!! + Show Spoiler + Townies, get of Sandroba or start singing why? Because if sandroba flips town I'll be going after sandroba voters with apocalyptic fury. TLDR: Get the damn votes back on BM & get your damn votes off sandroba or give me a satisfying reason to lynch him. Incorrect. Getting elected as hatter is good given hatters need time to get their reads right. On top of this, pretend you're a DT and it can be quite hilarious seeing mafia try to rip through the BGs to find out that they've been duped. Like I said in my previous post, BM as a hatter makes complete sense from his point of view. I have to leave soon though. If BM flips hatter and I go boom, please remember to look closely at all the people who pushed hard for BM's lynch after BM posted that he placed a bomb on me (That would be, anyone who pushes BM hard after 20 Dec 11:00 KST), as the mafia would be overjoyed to get me killed without having to worry about medics/jail (if BM is town). Not too much we can infer about the day 1 vote lists yet, except that so far we have no confirmed mafia voting for me yet, and a bunch of townies (bumatlarge is probably mafia though). | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 21 2012 17:33 Foolishness wrote: Mafia list has to be something like: Meapak, Munk-E, Bill Murray, evantrees, BrownBear, Kenpachi. Substitute in glurio, Opz, EchelonTee, vaderseven, Slardar for the ones that flip town. On January 21 2012 17:49 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Foolishness amend the list please. I strongly believe atm WBG has a high chance of flipping red. I would place glurio higher on your list. I also believe that based on play, opz is far more likely to be red. Disagree here. I don't see why Meapak is a strong case yet. I'm sticking with Bill Murray OpZ bumatlarge Don't see wbg either. His play fits his town play more than mafia even if he is wrong a lot. Then go on to inactives. I don't think Kenpachi is red based on L's statements suggesting that Kurumi shot Ciryandor. I'm going to guess that L truly did think Kurumi would shoot Kenpachi, and thus didn't roleblock him that night, but it backfired (nobody else claimed the Ciryandor shot). L also was pushing Kenpachi strangely, so it doesn't fit strongly in my book. evantrees feels town to me for his earlier response to my accusation. It feels pretty spontaneous and unplanned. Everyone else is fair game. Bill Murray dies tomorrow, and we vote for double lynch. OpZ and bumatlarge die the next day. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
On January 24 2012 14:58 ~OpZ~ wrote: 3 meds, 2 dets, 4 vigs, 2 jacks, 2 vets, 6 masons. 18 blues.... Masons can't really count as blues unless its like, BC as mason. By day 4, mafia were getting steamrolled in the thread but still had 6 members vs. 25 townies, with all the vigs either dead or had their shot used, which is pretty even with the usual 30 player game to start (with no extra KP for town). Basically, the game was close even though the first accusation of the game was on mafia, 7 mafia outed by day 3, and the top 3 players in the game all know each other is innocent. If you just sacrifice some KP to stack Foolishness/me, its pretty much GG as town is left headless/off trying to do their own thing. Especially after I was unable to post at deadline the last day (you would have double stacked Foolishness, leaving me alive with a short list of 3/3 mafia and a red DT check on Munk-E), you still would have had a good chance if not for the 2 modkills. After BM is lynched, you just stack Foolishness and off the BGs + BC. My post is pretty much dead and buried, the only live DT can be perma-roleblocked, and everyone else is pretty far off on all counts. Unfortunately 2 modkills cut your KP, but it certainly wasn't a completely unwinnable scenario given how lopsided the play was. | ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
| ||
|
Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
The mafia was unable to save their members despite the fact that there was a bunch of noise made by wrong-track townies advocating lynches on townies, which shows that mafia really didn't have the thread presence to save themselves. Coming to the conclusion that the lynch is being controlled by a mafia-infected triumvirate just doesn't make sense. More likely is that the mafia are just getting steamrolled. As for people getting suspicious about the BM->sandroba switch, there's nothing suspicious there at all. Sandroba was not a new candidate, and a red flip is a red flip. Given the whole list of viable lynch targets, a safe red lynch is better than a potential misstep. Saying that lynching sandroba gives no information is just silly. None of the other proposed candidates (BM, supersoft, GGQ) would have given any more information had they flipped green, and BM flipping red doesn't really implicate anyone given his play style. Statements like "a switch to sandroba isn't pro-town because he was going to be modkilled anyway" is really bad. If sandroba wasn't up for lynch, he would have just posted last minute and been fine. Which brings me to modkill policy. I notice hosts aren't consistent on ban list policy when a player is lynched when a modkill would occur. Sometimes there is a ban, sometimes there isn't, but in the future I think it should count as a ban, since otherwise it motivates mafia to lurk last minute with the idea that town is going to get scared and say "he's going to get modkilled anyway no need to lynch him". | ||
| ||
