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You all are getting a big caught up in CreamyButter's Mafia strategy post. I asked him to post that to see how much thought he would put into the game.
If you guys honestly found it helps Mafia then I hope you were joking because (no offense CB) it was godawful. Leaving a DT alive so he can help you find the traitor? lolwut?
How apologetic he was is a tell though.
I'm more wary right now of people who have posted but made it meaningless crap in a joking manner. Namely Nisani, VE and Kurumi. Trying too hard to blend in. Kurumi's feels more natural to me than the other two, who just seem to be putting on a show.
Nisani, VE, Kurumi, start contributing something real plzkthx.
Also:
On July 18 2011 17:16 supersoft wrote:
hi guys, I am Blackgate Criminal. I was told to lynch everyone of the Asylums employees as well as batman moblike style. Therefor:
##VOTE Coagulation
Rol and Kurumi didn't influence me there. I already decided to vote him when I read his post earlier: He's just giving us this list without any further comment. Pressurevote!
Can we lynch this guy? Pretty please? He obviously either hasn't read the thread at all and just came in to bandwagon or chose to blatantly ignore everything in there about why claiming green is extremely bad for Town and did it anyways once it seemed like we wouldn't be throwing gtrsrs and Kenpachi to the wolves for doing so.
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you guys are against claiming.. green? are you obliged to believe the claim?
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ok halt
i'm voting for mig based on a very short pm conversation i had with him which lasted 3 pms in total
Original Message From Mig: Hm that is kind of strange reasoning. I would think it would be mafia who would be much more afraid of leaks than town. The only information mafia can get from town is their role, and as long as you never claim to anyone that isn't possible. You should be stating your opinions and who you think is suspicious anyway. So what is there that can be leaked? On the flip side mafia has a huge amount of information they can potentially leak. Show nested quote +Original Message From youngminii: yes i dunno, i dislike pms in general because of the potential for leaks Original Message From Mig:
Hello!
Are you town? How active do you plan on being in pms?
that's just dumb
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United States4714 Posts
On July 18 2011 20:56 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
Ok this is what happens:
Mig asks for a list, knowing that giving lists is a way for mafia to blend in and that lists are generally a scum tell.
Coag replies
Coag gets fossed and bandwagoned
mig dissapears...
People that are accusing Coag are accusing the wrong guy i think.
Ah I see. So apparently I asked for a veteran list to be made, so the new town players would know who everyone was and what they were working with (what a sick anti town motivation), so that whomever did make the list would be accused of being scum and bandwagoned on. I would then disappear and laugh as he took all the blame for the list. I even took the risk of saying I would write the list myself if no one else would. What a tricky guy I must be.
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United States4714 Posts
On July 18 2011 21:31 youngminii wrote:ok halt i'm voting for mig based on a very short pm conversation i had with him which lasted 3 pms in total Show nested quote +Original Message From Mig: Hm that is kind of strange reasoning. I would think it would be mafia who would be much more afraid of leaks than town. The only information mafia can get from town is their role, and as long as you never claim to anyone that isn't possible. You should be stating your opinions and who you think is suspicious anyway. So what is there that can be leaked? On the flip side mafia has a huge amount of information they can potentially leak. Original Message From youngminii: yes i dunno, i dislike pms in general because of the potential for leaks Original Message From Mig:
Hello!
Are you town? How active do you plan on being in pms? that's just dumb
Huh what is dumb about what I said lol? Mafia should be much more afraid of pms than town. I don't think townies should be afraid of pms at all. They are a tool used to help determine other peoples alignments. Which the mafia don't need to use and risk giving up information if they do.
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Actually yeah supersoft is scummy as hell to me.
On July 18 2011 17:25 supersoft wrote:
wtf, what's wrong about roleclaiming green D-:
anyone could do this, it's completely pointless, I thought everyone knows that, I just wanted to back up my votingbehavior with my task to lynch moblike style :-/
Your voting behavior should be to vote for who you think is scum not a "mob style" that lets you mindlessly bandwagon. Know who would love to mindlessly bandwagon (while making sure everyone knows it's just a bandwagon - wouldn't want you to be able to held accountable for a mislynch)? Scum. Are you already making excuses for why you're not going to providing anything insightful or analytical already?
Copying someone else's reason and then saying that you didn't copy someone else's reason to vote for someone is also pretty lols.
On July 18 2011 21:27 Kenpachi wrote:
you guys are against claiming.. green? are you obliged to believe the claim?
I explained why it's bad. You are either lying or hurting the blues by claiming green. Neither helps Town.
I can see Kenpachi does it every game though and I don't even know what to make of gtr. He came in with a brutal OMGUS and chainsaw defense but I think that's just how he is. gtr it's nothing personal but like I said earlier if you really want to help Town then shape up dood.
Nothing going for supersoft. From what I see of his claim:
gtrsrs claims VT. I go after him a bit for it. gtrsrs engages in flame war, I call him likely (misguided) Town. We ask everyone not to claim VT any more with reasons why.
Kenpachi claims VT, but this seems to be just part of his starting game routine.
supersoft jumps in with his claim ("olol hai guys you said the last guy who did this was likely Town so here I go with my claim!") despite pages telling him not to do it.
On July 18 2011 21:31 youngminii wrote:ok halt i'm voting for mig based on a very short pm conversation i had with him which lasted 3 pms in total Show nested quote +Original Message From Mig: Hm that is kind of strange reasoning. I would think it would be mafia who would be much more afraid of leaks than town. The only information mafia can get from town is their role, and as long as you never claim to anyone that isn't possible. You should be stating your opinions and who you think is suspicious anyway. So what is there that can be leaked? On the flip side mafia has a huge amount of information they can potentially leak. Original Message From youngminii: yes i dunno, i dislike pms in general because of the potential for leaks Original Message From Mig:
Hello!
Are you town? How active do you plan on being in pms? that's just dumb
That's a weak reason to vote for someone. Are you worried your suspicion lists will get you killed? One man's suspicion doesn't mean anything unless he can convince others to form a lynch based on that suspicion.
I haven't played with PMs before but it's pretty obvious that they can only help Town by allowing them private communication which is normally only available to Mafia.
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90% of pm games i've played town got destroyed because they relied on pms too much, there's a reason people don't like pm games
you cannot comment on pm games if you haven't played them, yes they may seem good for town on paper but if you form a pm circle with just one mafia then you're just absolutely screwed
mig should be good enough to know this, if a newer player had said what he pm'd me i'd just dismiss it as a newbie thing but there's no way an experienced player would ever say something like that
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On redFF's behavior
You're on Coagulation's list as a veteran, but all of your posts have been fillers. They're like repetition of something someone else already said, advice you don't follow yourself, self contradictory or you're trying to start a fight with someone. I assume that you can do a lot better than that so why don't you?
On the Coagulation bandwagon
It's weird that Coagulation would post one liners and lists since it's basically setting him up for being day1 lynch target. A bandwagon can easily be formed in a game full of noobs especially when Ver's town guide kinda says on page1 that behavior like Coagulation's is a clear scum tell.
On CreamyButter
I think his logic has been pretty good and a new guy on scum team would probably wait until some of the more experienced players had layed down some sort of a strategy in the QT. I think that generally he's been doing very well and played the noob card very little considering that this is his first game. Also all the votes on him has been based on Palmar's pretty terrible 2 line analysis.
On my vote
I think that RebirthOfLegend should know that Coagulation would not do silly first-game mistakes and he's just trying to form a bandwagon in an environment where a bandwagon can easily be formed. He is trying to be the champion of the noobs, who will probably have a lot to say in this game.
##Vote RebirthOfLegend
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Something like what? That PMs can help Town because there's more potential for leaks from Mafia?
I really don't get where your case is coming from bro.
Forming PM circles shouldn't absolutely screw you. You aren't sharing your heart and soul in it, you're just using it as a way to get more information. Your suspicions and case forming should still be in the thread foremost for everyone to see.
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also, mig you are clearly going after everyone through pms, this is an illogical path to take if you are town
we as town want everything to be written down so everyone can see
only scum don't want things to happen in public, if they slip in pm land then oh it's only one person he might not see it, anything that happens in the thread is under the scrutiny of town and up for analysis, anything that happens in pm land is private and mostly lost
basically pm land is detrimental for town unless you can form a huge safe town circle which will never happen and if you are contributing to the game (especially on day 1) mostly through pms, it means you want to hide your actions so nobody can go back through the thread and create a good analysis of you, mig
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On July 18 2011 21:49 prplhz wrote:
On redFF's behavior
You're on Coagulation's list as a veteran, but all of your posts have been fillers. They're like repetition of something someone else already said, advice you don't follow yourself, self contradictory or you're trying to start a fight with someone. I assume that you can do a lot better than that so why don't you?
On the Coagulation bandwagon
It's weird that Coagulation would post one liners and lists since it's basically setting him up for being day1 lynch target. A bandwagon can easily be formed in a game full of noobs especially when Ver's town guide kinda says on page1 that behavior like Coagulation's is a clear scum tell.
On CreamyButter
I think his logic has been pretty good and a new guy on scum team would probably wait until some of the more experienced players had layed down some sort of a strategy in the QT. I think that generally he's been doing very well and played the noob card very little considering that this is his first game. Also all the votes on him has been based on Palmar's pretty terrible 2 line analysis.
On my vote
I think that RebirthOfLegend should know that Coagulation would not do silly first-game mistakes and he's just trying to form a bandwagon in an environment where a bandwagon can easily be formed. He is trying to be the champion of the noobs, who will probably have a lot to say in this game.
##Vote RebirthOfLegend
can i say that i think youre mafia?
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United States4714 Posts
On July 18 2011 21:46 youngminii wrote:
90% of pm games i've played town got destroyed because they relied on pms too much, there's a reason people don't like pm games
you cannot comment on pm games if you haven't played them, yes they may seem good for town on paper but if you form a pm circle with just one mafia then you're just absolutely screwed
mig should be good enough to know this, if a newer player had said what he pm'd me i'd just dismiss it as a newbie thing but there's no way an experienced player would ever say something like that
So you are really arguing that pms are naturally mafia favored? Really? Then why are mason's even a town power role in normal games? Clearly pms favor town. Can town's be destroyed if they used them wrong? Of course. So can stupid Vigs. That doesn't mean Vigs are bad for the town. I am actually laughing at your argument, it is so ridiculous. As long as townies don't auto trust everyone and don't give out their role how can it possibly be bad to gain extra information by talking to people? And that isn't even mentioning being able to form town circles once there are confirmed townies. Just lol.
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if we get through this game without anyone claiming through pms and/or leaks to mafia through pm land i will personally apologise to you after the game
it's going to happen and it won't change the fact that most of your actions are still being hidden
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United States4714 Posts
Sure I agree completely my actions are being hidden. And if I don't post enough in the thread you should call me out on it. But I rarely post very much on day1. I have already posted more today than I almost ever do this early in the game. I am using pms to supplement the information I am getting from the game to determine players alignment's. And somehow this makes me mafia.
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United States4714 Posts
EBWOP supplementing the information I am getting from the thread*
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okay you look pretty green
unvoting but will keep an eye on you in case you completely vanish into pms 
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Put that vote on supersoft for me!
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United States4714 Posts
But it should be common sense that it is more likely for mafia to leak anything than it is for townies to leak anything. The mafia has 500x the amount of information to hide. Leaking information isn't what really kills towns. It is poor players auto trusting the wrong people and getting manipulated. But I am not exactly worried about that so I am going to continue to use pms to try and figure out who the mafia are.
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@youngminii:
Wasn't the original zodiac list idea from someone named Ace? w/e
@Curu: I apologize for nothing. I wrote a full answer to your question assuming that you were trying to spark discussion, which is a good premise. I am completely, utterly convinced that I have not said anything at all that would legitimately mark me as scummy, and I discount all arguments otherwise as wrong.
I would like to cast some doubt on Palmar:
Sticking to one random outspoken person and repeatedly attacking him with basic arguments benefits scum. It draws attention away from real scum and gives the scum someone easy to bandwagon against. He basically just waited for someone vaguely controversial to pop up (a newb in his first game ever, apologizing for being a newb, which was bound to happen. Ver's first day 1 argument in his guide says that calling yourself a noob is an obvious scum tell, so who could disagree with that?) and then latched onto it. He's in a very cozy scum situation right now.
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EPT
