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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 06 2010 13:54 BrownBear wrote: Exactly. I COULD go through all the hassle of making sure everyone resigns up, reassigning roles, and remaking a new thread... but why bother? No I agree. Except then at least I'd have a chance at a mafia role  I'm always town-aligned, gets old after awhile. | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 06 2010 13:58 XeliN wrote: Thanks flame xD The insinutation that I have a "role" due to not being modkilled is illfounded, theres arguments for it obviously, but treating it as an assumption is flawed. That was just me misreading something entirely ~ there's really no argument for it at all (as an assumed slip-up by BB anyway). | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 06 2010 13:58 Bill Murray wrote: if we're restarting,  You know, you're not actually supposed to edit your post to introduce the | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 06 2010 13:58 Bill Murray wrote: boo not restarting LOL you're just trying to get yourself killed now.. | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
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SiNiquity
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Now good night~ | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 06 2010 14:04 fIamewheel91 wrote: Stop. Fucking. Spamming. God, every single time. Something about a hellspawn and being quiet. | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
But then again, this is mafia, where 3+ paragraphs for a simple idea are the norm | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
Alternatively a host could simply come out and confirm that the PM messages were different dependent on host, alleviating us of this meta-game aspect entirely. But if not, then the information's there, and should be taken full advantage of by the townies. Now, in short, for those that don't feel like reading the spam starting from page 29 and going really until about page 35, Bill Murray demanded players to roleclaim, but emphasized players should carefully reread their PMs before claiming. It was actually very clever, as there was an underlying secret that only town players would recognize: town players were not PM'ed the word "town" but rather "townie" as their role. XeliN sums this up nicely: On October 07 2010 16:42 XeliN wrote: My take on the whole "Town//Townie" questioning. It seems quite clear to me that the distinction Bill is trying to highlight here is not whether someone is Green or Blue, but on what a Town player was actually PM'd in their role. Seems a little bit shady as a strategy although nonetheless quite effective as I'm now fairly sure he is legitimately Town. On October 07 2010 16:47 XeliN wrote: In fact it's not even "my take" it's blatantly what he actually means as he frequently say's "go back and look at your role PM, then tell me Town//Townie" Him being established town (here's where "my take" is appropriate, you can make up your own minds!) doesn't mean he is correct in calling for bloody's lynch, but I'm going to need to go over the thread more purely with that in mind. OpZ is also suspect to me, along with BC, for missing Bill's intention which was quite blatant, although ofc if they were mafia they would miss it as their role PM would not make his intention blatant. Ironically, Bill, either in a burst of genius or insanity, incessantly insisted the correct answer was "town." And, best of yet, some people fell for it: On October 07 2010 14:02 DoctorHelvetica wrote: town but i'm more confused by your plan than anything On October 07 2010 14:49 infinitestory wrote: I claim town. I have no idea where you could possibly be going with this. On October 07 2010 14:53 BloodyC0bbler wrote: I'm town, and you already know that. (Note: BC is especially guilty in this regard, as he kept referring to the town post in the OP as his point of reference). In fact the only player that correctly roleclaimed as far as I can surmise is OpZ: On October 07 2010 15:16 ~OpZ~ wrote: Really? my role PM says townie. It was also sent by Artanis. Was yours sent by Artanis? -_- Even now Bill maintains "town" is the correct answer, and his vigilance for this charade is admirable yet simultaneously disturbing on some deeper level. However, props to him for maintaining it for so long (I'd certainly be convinced). Now there is the caveat that there were different wording in the PMs based on the host. On October 08 2010 05:41 BrownBear wrote: Both Artanis and I sent out role PMs, to make our workload easier. As such, take the following conclusions with a grain of salt: Confirmed players from my perspective:
Suspect players from my perspective:
Still need to look at the votes over the past day to see if there's anything worthwhile there. But I'm certainly curious as to what one of the "town" players will flip ~ if town, then there's possibly a host discrepancy. If not, then this only confirms my suspicions. It's the strongest lead we've got and I see no reason not to pursue it. Anyway I'm off to bed to mull this over. | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 09 2010 11:32 CynanMachae wrote: What is this? I'm pretty sure we only have two double lynches Ack you're right. In that case I don't think we should be using them just yet. Going to go change it... | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 09 2010 11:41 LSB wrote: Interesting... Anyways, why not use one now, we got a good plan to go with for BM Wait. So we're double lynching just to lynch BM "for free" tomorrow? | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
On October 09 2010 12:02 LSB wrote: cSc is the only one who hasn't voted yet. That's why I voted for double lynch. See this post http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=151150¤tpage=37#733 That's terrible. If BM's not mafia, there's no guarantee that Mafia won't gamble that he's not a VI and we waste our double lynch. I also don't believe there's more than 1 VI (protact), but that's just a hunch on my part. Look, now that I understand BM's plan, I agree it was utterly and ridiculously stupid (seriously - "Hey guys I'm town, so what are you, town/townie, oh and btw if you're blue answer 'town' since that's the super-secret right answer, but otherwise tell me are you town/townie" Gee I wonder what -mafia- would respond with?). From my perspective (i.e. OpZ's), I thought it was all a clever trap.. too clever for BM though, and I should've realized that. But even as bad as his version was, I think it's a stretch to suggest a non-town player would initiate such action relying on some "correct" wording of town PMs which, if wrong, would mean his doom (as it turns out, there was more than one "correct" wording so either way he was right, but he couldn't have known that). So in short, no, I don't think we should double lynch just to lynch BM, and I'm not convinced we're going to have enough information tomorrow to justify using one of our (two) double lynches. Also james is correct ~ I've only voted for double lynch so far (and now unvoted). Still weeding through the thread to find my vote candidate. | ||
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SiNiquity
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SiNiquity
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On October 09 2010 13:10 Protactinium wrote: So where is BrownBear... Er I could technically flip you since I know what you are, and I think there are modkills to be made. Where are the hosts? BrownBear said the night post would be coming late since it's Friday. idk 'bout Artanis | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
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SiNiquity
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no, infinitestory or whoever was saying we should hold the mafia hostage with the VI, and I was pointing out that was a stupid idea over and over again. I'm absolutely thrilled that you've somehow taken that and twisted it into making me look like a moron. I hope the rest of your post isn't like this. (b) "worthless post about protacts smurf" smurfing hurts town. Lynching hurts smurf. I thought putting more pressure on protact would get him to fess up. If you were smart you'd have seen that I threatened him, he ignored me and just kept posting, and then I voted to put him in the lead and tried to keep the pressure on him, but he didn't budge. Yet you think posting "10 minutes left" with protact having a single vote lead, one of them being me, and protact actively posting, is worthless. Ironically, the fact that he did nothing was the biggest tell that he was VI: On October 06 2010 13:41 SiNiquity wrote: I'm down with the game being over. It doesn't take a genius to figure out someone who's headed to the gallows and has the ability to escape but doesn't (i.e. was leading only by one vote and could remove one vote by telling me who he was) is the VI, and I was perfectly content with that possibility. (c) SiNiquity: "[BB: let's continue.. why bother restarting?] No I agree. Except then at least I'd have a chance at a mafia role I'm always town-aligned, gets old after awhile." Why say this? Because I'm always town aligned and it gets old after awhile, which is why I was perfectly content with protact being VI and rerolling  (d) "now ALL THE WAY from page 22 to 39 he spams one-liners with NO information" you sir are a dirty little liar. I didn't post after page 25 until page 39. Not that this mischaracterization is out of line with anything else you've said. You're just as bad as BC in the last game I played when he analyzed me. Yeah I spammed a bit on 22-25 when nothing important was going on, during twilight and immediately after protact was pronounced VI. Sue me. Points (e) through (l) are referencing my large post on page 39 (e) "he claims he doesn't want to encourage durther discussion of the PM's but yet his entire post is centered around discussing EXACTLY that." I didn't want people to discuss to reveal additional PM knowledge as that was clearly banned, but wanted to reference the claims people had already made, as I thought we had some actual concrete evidence to work from, and ignoring that would be stupid. Hence the disclaimer. (f) "It had already been confirmed some pms were sent by artanis and that they were worded differently." Up until that point, there was no confirmation of different wording in the PMs. There was however confirmation that multiple hosts PMed people. Silly me for thinking anyone in this thread would need such a distinction pointed out. Oh wait, I did. In the point you're rebutting. + Show Spoiler [Blue posts from pg 33 to my pg 39] + On October 07 2010 15:22 BrownBear wrote: I just logged in and saw this. What the fuck. BM... stop. On October 07 2010 15:28 BrownBear wrote: BM, the next time I see this level of spam, it's a modkill. You've taken up like 60% of the last 3 pages BY YOURSELF. ffs stop spamming, or at least consolidate it all into one post. On October 08 2010 00:53 BrownBear wrote: Let's pleast stop talking about the PMs. It's a slippery slope, and as you all know, quoting all or part of them is illegal. Get back to scumhunting based off of analysis, not stupid PM-based shit. On October 08 2010 05:41 BrownBear wrote: It really pisses me off that role PMs are STILL being discussed here. Since this seems to be a sticky point, and since some people know this and others don't, I'll clarify it for everyone here. Both Artanis and I sent out role PMs, to make our workload easier. We had no clue it would be so much of a federal fucking issue when we did so. Now STOP TALKING ABOUT IT AS THOUGH IT'S A PART OF THE GAME. On October 08 2010 06:10 BrownBear wrote: RoL has very kindly given kane]deth[ back his role. kane will continue the game on double super-secret probation: if he gets modkilled for missing another vote, I will be very sad (g) "complains about spam despite being a terrible spammer himself." Yes, let's take an outright lie from point (d) and use it to draw a conclusion. (h) "BM's plan was clever despite the fact that it was totally useless because not every role PM was worded the same way. SiNiquity either doesn't know this or is feigning ignorance" See point (f). (i) bill maintained town was the correct answer because that's the PM he received. people received different PM's so none of what you just said matters in the slightest bit. there was no trap. See point (f). (j) (In reference to: caveat ~ PM wording may have been different) do you even realize this sentence makes your ENTIRE post fall apart? Yes which is why I put it both at the top and bottom of my post. Because it was that important. (k) (In reference to: "Take the following with a grain of salt") oh i will: Oh you're a clever one. (l) you agree with BM's methods and come out with compeltely different conclusions. there are two scenarios that makes this possible.
Or I received a role PM that said townie which meant BM was parading town as the correct answer to catch other people. But that would depend on the PM wording being the same huh. I wonder if I should, idk, make a disclaimer about that? The next post you quote even elaborates on this, but naturally you ignore that.Look, now that I understand BM's plan (i.e. he really did mean "town"), I agree it was utterly and ridiculously stupid (seriously - "Hey guys I'm town, so what are you, town/townie, oh and btw if you're blue answer 'town' since that's the super-secret right answer, but otherwise tell me are you town/townie" Gee I wonder what -mafia- would respond with?). From my perspective (i.e. OpZ's), I thought it was all a clever trap.. too clever for BM though, and I should've realized that. (m) What is this post about? Protecting BM and explaining his late vote. Mafia like to vote late so that they make sure to have the least conspicous vote possible. ~ Taking this in turn
(n) He says "I understand BM's plan" yet in his previous post he interpreted CLEARLY in the exact opposite way BM did. Seriously, this is getting old. Thank God I'm almost done with this. Read your paraphrase, read the quote in point (l) and honestly tell me if they're the same. If English is your 2nd language, I forgive you.(o) If that is the case there is no way he understood what BM was doing unless they communicated or unless SiN has really really bad reading comprehension. The irony of your words is seeping from my monitor. If <false paraphrase> is true, then <draw conclusion> unless <conclusion #1 out of 2 from (l) is true> or <completely unrelated yet highly ironic possibility is true> (p) (Referring to me thinking Misder/XeliN are not mafia) Would you like to explain? Misder didn't end up being mafia, just a bad townie. Yeah it was totally Misder's fault for getting lynched. Stupid bad townie (q) (Continuing from prev. point) But why even say this if you aren't going to provie a reason? Not only does he not back up his defense but he doesn't propose an alternative. He isn't scumhunting which is what town should be doing. Lynching mafia. His late posts convinced me he wasn't scum which is why I didn't vote for him - I'm sorry that this wasn't obvious based on the fact that I posted that right after Misder posted. I don't think XeliN is mafia because he was the first to articulate BM's tactics, which I already stated in my "long analysis post." But you read that and picked it apart already, so you'd know this, right? As for why I didn't make a case for someone else, all of this was 15 minutes or something like that before the lynch, so no, I didn't make a case for someone else, because there wasn't enough time.[Summary]: (a) misrepresentation (b) stupid (c) (d) lies (e) misunderstanding (f) lies (g) conclusion from lies (h) unsubstantiated claim (i) unsubstantiated claim (j) (k) clever jab (l) incomplete analysis due to conclusion from unsubstantiated claim (m) misrepresentation (n) misrepresentation (o) misrepresentation / stupid (p) (q) misrepresentation / I don't even know. Stupidly high expectations? | ||
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