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On September 17 2013 14:19 gonzaw wrote:
You can't have any a priori order of priority between independent bus drivings.
If I bus player A and B, and someone else busses player B and C, who is to say my bus has priority over his, or viceversa?
The two actions are equally dependent on each other, there is no priority.
FUCKING LOOPS MAN
For some interpretations of multiple bus driving
In little cases giving either priority results in the same outcome.
AB { BC { } } => The AB Bus drive operates on the BC bus drive changing actions on B to be A hence => AC{ }
BC { AB { } } => The BC Bus drive operates on the AB bus drive changing actions on B to be C hence => AC{ }
Also has the graphical analogy where performing bus drive AB{} means force a bus to travle leg AB{}
performing bus drive BC{} means force a bus to travle leg BC{}
Draw picture (ala IGROK)
There is bus trip from A to C partially created by each action combining with no priority.
The problem first arises with Gonzaws dilemma where the three bus drives create a mesh that is explainable in 3 ways.
and goes nuts with Axles Wheel where the 12 bus drives have 9 different explanations.
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On September 17 2013 08:50 gonzaw almost wrote:And how about this:6 players: A B C D E F These are the busses: AB AE AC AD AF CD CF DF Again, every node is "odd", no repeated busses. The more "complex" you get, the more you have to create ad hoc stuff and just say "well, I just say it works like this because magic". ...also I fully expect you guys to create a 10-busdriver mafia game soon 
I had been meaning to think about his one... Oh my.
Not sure you needed to put red ears on that green monster but I suppose it now is the smallest example of every problem I am aware of, as it contains a hybridization of Gonzaws Dilemma and the which cycle to delete problem. Deleting different 3 cycles either leaves (CD CF DF)=>0 A Gonzaws 5 way Dilemma or eg(AC AD CD)=>0 a double Gonzaws dilemma.
Nah I like the ears even if they do break the symmetry.
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I think the lesson here is to not host a game with more than two busdrivers unless you want to be an interesting person.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
When anyone ever questions the real life application of a major in math just point them to mafia multiple bus driver theory!
Take that Dad!
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On September 17 2013 14:31 ObviousOne wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2013 14:22 gonzaw wrote:On September 17 2013 14:08 Ace wrote:
just stop using roles that redirect actions? hurr durr But then where's the fun? The scum hunting, perhaps. ##ACE-d
Nah that's not it. Too much derp.
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##Bus Drive: gonzaw with ObviousOne.
Seems the one that was ##ACE-d is now YOU son
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Omg I got it
What you do is have a neutral third party role who, during the 1 hour night action resolution period, receives a list of all busdriving pairs that were submitted and assigns an order of priority. Their win condition is to maximize the number of "net" busdriving pairs (ie people who are in the end switched) during the game, meaning they need to figure out who all the bus drivers are and keep them alive. You could have two games with one of these controllers in each and they're competing against each other.
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So he would be the Traffic Inspector?
But what of "normal" games with just town and scum? Or if you dont want more win conditions, etc. I just want to play a 10 player-10 busdrivers-Compulsive scum KP game :_:
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do you ever get tired gonzaw?
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We could also have "role switchers".
For this imagine 5 players: A B C D E
B targets C with ability X
D targets E with ability Y
A role-switches B and D
So B ends up targetting C with ability Y, and D ends up targeting E with ability X. Basically you switch the roles and abilities of people but keep their "action" on a specific target.
Now couple that with mind controllers (who just change targets, e.g B targets E and D targets C), and bus drivers.
Mindfornication
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On September 18 2013 03:47 Coagulation wrote:
do you ever get tired gonzaw?
Nah, I drink the blood of the innocent to give me strength in times of need (i.e discussing mafia roles on the internet)
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there is a lot of innocent blood around here isnt there?
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This thread hurts my brain
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Ok, so iGrok's Solution solves the chain bussing problem, but doesn't solve explosive bussing. We need a different solution for specifically that, and then we can have two theories that kinda sorta work together, like quantum and relativity right? We don't -need- a unified theory, just two theories which solve both issues. As I have already solved chain bussing, I now need to work on explosive bussing.
First we need to determine our goals.
Explosive bussing, while hilarious, is bad (and I say this as someone who tried to get everyone killed in aperture) because it can lead to multiple deaths occuring from 1 bullet (or any variation of that). Therefore, explosive bussing solutions should find some way to negate that, without completely negating the original action.
The entire purpose of bussing theory is to eliminate RNG, so RNG cannot be involved.
Alrighty, with that determined, its time to get to work.
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
i don't see what's wrong with my version
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On September 18 2013 08:47 Blazinghand wrote:
i don't see what's wrong with my version
Because busses don't have independent priority to begin with, which is the entire reason its an issue haha
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On September 18 2013 08:53 iGrok wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2013 08:47 Blazinghand wrote:
i don't see what's wrong with my version Because busses don't have independent priority to begin with, which is the entire reason its an issue haha
wouldn't it be easier just to give them priority then >.>
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You want to see them like
Bus Driver I
Bus Driver II
Bus Driver III
And they resolve in role name order? Could be transparent to the player or not (could even do the pigs loose in a school joke and number them 1, 2, 4. Lol
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
I mean if you want them to know their orders, sure. you could also say to BD 1, "'you are priority I bus driver" and just tell the others they are non-priority I (or, if there's only one, flip a coin and tell him either) but remember the order in a spreadsheet
ez
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Or, if you have listdriving mechanics, just say that they resolve top down on the list. Adds a whole nother motivation to sign up quickly
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EPT
