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On March 25 2010 05:57 Abenson wrote:
My suspect list: Xelin and haster27
It is standard scum behaviour to jump on a new bandwagon. Suppose that L is mafia, and they don't want him to get lynched (obviously). When iaaan randomly voted for me due to inactivity, they were quick to jump on it and propose that I get lynched. I find this suspicious, as he has been switching votes for a while, seemingly trying to get a bandwagon going.
I am not stating that L is mafia, but I was surprised at how fast Xelin and haster27 were quick to start voting for me once it seems that I have garnered some votes.
People don't want to see L lynched not only because of possible family relations. For example, I think that it would be interesting to see what he can come up with after he's unbanned, hence I didn't vote for him.
Now, on the other hand you just voted for him, without having much of a real reason. Inactivity doesn't apply, I can assure you that he'll be plenty of active after he comes back. He can't even defend himself, there's no reason to vote him off while he's banned, unless you're afraid he'll muck up your game later.
Combine that with the relative unlikeliness of ~OpZ~ being lynched today, you are the most sensible nominee with enough votes to get lynched.
##Vote: Abenson
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## I Change my vote to JohnnySpazz
Abenson should be confirmed soon enough. I'll RC, or he will in a minute. I figured I would die earlier, so I simple breadcrumbed his name into a post for him to reveal on my death.
I will not vote for a confirmed townie over someone unconfirmed. Consider I'll likely be another lynch candidate tomorrow, I might as well save you all some trouble. The post his name is in is on page sixteen.
On March 24 2010 11:57 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Good point Zona...
....
Also, we need to focus on a good lynch target. Be aware that we aren't near a lynch. Even though a few of us have been posting we need the whole towns participation. Not talking is bad for the town. Stuff like that will get you lynched and it's bad for use to not post. One liners don't help. Now please, start posting some content people.
.....
I propose Phrujbaz along with Zona. (Should he actually be modkilled right now? Has he confirmed to ace, or in the thread? Game's been up for 24 hours right?)
Whether you all want to take this as confirming him, whatever. I gave him strict instructions to only post this on my death to save himself from a town lynch. He seems to be afk a lot, and I will not support his lynch.
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##Vote: no lynch
Will post something about what has just been posting.
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my issue with voting absenson: L was the first person to suggest him. and now L's gone, but magically all these people are still pushing for his death?
if it was only the inactivity claim, i could roll with that, but that combined with him being L's lynch choice doesn't sit well with me. it's too convenient.
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On March 25 2010 06:15 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Abenson should be confirmed soon enough. I'll RC, or he will in a minute. I figured I would die earlier, so I simple breadcrumbed his name into a post for him to reveal on my death.
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I will not vote for a confirmed townie over someone unconfirmed.
...
Whether you all want to take this as confirming him, whatever. I gave him strict instructions to only post this on my death to save himself from a town lynch. He seems to be afk a lot, and I will not support his lynch.
Wait - did you just claim masons with Abenson? Because I presume you did read the rules and otherwise wouldn't be talking to him privately.
I'm willing to switch my vote to someone else if you clarify this claim, at least for day 1. The problem is I'm not sure if the town's momentum can be changed.
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Care to explain in detail ~OpZ~?
All you did here was confuse me. I remember a "confirmed townie" being referenced, as tree.hugger made a crack about it being me, but I do not see HOW someone can be confirmed this early. Seems impossible to me.
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On March 25 2010 06:22 Zona wrote:
Wait - did you just claim masons with Abenson? Because I presume you did read the rules and otherwise wouldn't be talking to him privately.
I'm willing to switch my vote to someone else if you clarify this claim, at least for day 1. The problem is I'm not sure if the town's momentum can be changed.
Wait. Where did he even RC Mason? Don't be so assuming.
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Alright, here's the deal. I'm not close to being impressed by what Abenson is contributing. But if he and you, OpZ, are claiming masons, I'm willing to try to lynch someone else for now.
As of last post:
Zona: 32
~OpZ~: 19
XeliN: 16
Versatile: 16
Amber[LighT]: 14
haster27: 14
Elemenope: 13
JeeJee: 12
Fishball: 9
iNfuNdiBuLuM: 9
meeple: 9
Caller: 9
johnnyspazz: 7
Iaaan: 7
d3_crescentia: 7
nemY: 6
Nikon: 4
Abenson: 4
tree.hugger: 4
RebirthOfLeGenD: 3
Phrujbaz: 2
L: 2
As of now, Rebirth of Legend has the lowest amount of posts (ignoring L), and not one of his three posts is useful. Even L's 2 posts has contributed to the shaping of the town's no-nuke-initiation plan. The other end is the odd argument that he was an extra player added, that probably is town or third party, but that was shot down as we shouldn't make any assumptions on how Ace is laying things out. So I will switch my vote to him.
##Vote: RebirthOfLegend
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On March 25 2010 06:24 Elemenope wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2010 06:22 Zona wrote:
Wait - did you just claim masons with Abenson? Because I presume you did read the rules and otherwise wouldn't be talking to him privately.
I'm willing to switch my vote to someone else if you clarify this claim, at least for day 1. The problem is I'm not sure if the town's momentum can be changed.
Wait. Where did he even RC Mason? Don't be so assuming.
He has claimed that him and Abenson are "confirmed town". He also implies that he has spoken with Abenson, and speaking out of thread with other players is explicitly prohibited unless your role allows it. Now mafia can speak with each other as well but it'd be pretty dumb for them to reveal that. So the conclusion to be reached is a role with mason abilities.
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US and Canada ? Just a guess.
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For everyone reading who doesn't know what I'm referring to, check out here:
http://mafiawiki.four-horsemen.com/index.php/Masons
Or basically, in games where private out-of-thread discussion is not allowed for most non-mafia players, sometimes there are a few town members who are given the "mason" special role - which lets each of the players in the mason group know that the others are town members, AND allows them to speak to each other out of thread. It's like a mini-cell of town members who can work together privately to try to hunt scum and coordinate their public posts.
Too bad the roles in this game went to Abenson...and Opz.
If analysis-type players, or players who are good at reading behavior end up as masons, they get a tremendously beneficial boost as they can bounce ideas off other players who they know are town and thus get their ideas critiqued without having a chance of mafia taint. As well, the group of them can subtly work together to push their cases or vote, slightly countering the town's disadvantage of players not able to work together at first.
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On March 25 2010 06:28 Zona wrote:
He has claimed that him and Abenson are "confirmed town". He also implies that he has spoken with Abenson, and speaking out of thread with other players is explicitly prohibited unless your role allows it. Now mafia can speak with each other as well but it'd be pretty dumb for them to reveal that. So the conclusion to be reached is a role with mason abilities.
Except he could be lying about the whole thing.
If he's going to RC, let him do it himself. Don't assume he's a certain role because that's just the way things have been done before or that it'd be dumb for a different role who has the same ability to do that [This is a tricky game for the second part]. Don't be so assuming that people who say they did one thing or can do one thing actually can do that one thing.
Abenson hasn't even confirmed that they spoke to each other. Are there any rules against lying to people that you've communicated outside with anyone? The rules only state that outside communicate is not allowed, not claims of such.
Until he makes a role claim himself, we can't go anywhere with it really as it could be a ploy to just shift votes away temporarily and force a no lynch.
On top of that
He hasn't even responded to my post where I specifically point out how he would use nukes just to save himself and how he in general was acting scummish. If he elected to not even bother to read that, then he hasn't even read your post which specifically pointed this out, and instead, his only post after that is trying to get Abenson off the lynch train.
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I didn't assume that his role was entirely just a Mason. I clarified with my subsequent post that his claim involved a role with mason abilities.
Of course anyone can lie. But I'm willing to put of lynching those who role claim right away as:
- the claims can be tested easily later
- there's still a fuckton of other inactive players that are as much deadweight as Abenson was.
I do agree Abenson needs to confirm that the spoke with each other. But it would be pretty silly for OpZ to throw himself out there for Abenson if they weren't on the same team.
I totally agree how his earlier post to use nukes if he was lynched was an anti-town declaration. Still, I think the claim, once confirmed by Abenson, is enough to put me off voting for them day 1. Of course we should keep a very close eye on them for the coming days.
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Abenson hasn't even confirmed that they spoke to each other.
and he may not ever, as he barely posts.
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I don't really know what to say right now other than wtf are you guys thinking? If both of you do have roles that confirm townies and enable you to talk outside of the game you think rolecalling them on the first day is beneficial to the town in any way? You have some of the most powerful roles in the game, Abenson, all you would need to do is actually post something vaguely useful to have people not vote for you, it was the only reason I changed as someone highlighted you had made one post and that included a Lynch vote.
##Remove Vote (Abstain) for now.
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As to elaborate on why I'm willing to overlook an anti-town statement. Players on TL are on average, pretty bad. Looking through past games, you see townies all over the place making horrible statements with very bad ideas. It's something you have to keep in mind, playing here. Otherwise most of the players in most games would be instant lynch targets.
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On March 25 2010 06:48 Zona wrote:
I didn't assume that his role was entirely just a Mason. I clarified with my subsequent post that his claim involved a role with mason abilities.
Of course anyone can lie. But I'm willing to put of lynching those who role claim right away as:
- the claims can be tested easily later
- there's still a fuckton of other inactive players that are as much deadweight as Abenson was.
I do agree Abenson needs to confirm that the spoke with each other. But it would be pretty silly for OpZ to throw himself out there for Abenson if they weren't on the same team.
I totally agree how his earlier post to use nukes if he was lynched was an anti-town declaration. Still, I think the claim, once confirmed by Abenson, is enough to put me off voting for them day 1. Of course we should keep a very close eye on them for the coming days.
And the way we resolve this is generally, we lynch one. First day roleclaims are the shittiest thing ever as they detract discussion.
If Abenson and OpZ are on the same side as you imply, why not lynch one and we get the validity of the other? The claims can be tested later yeah, but what if we simply don't have time later due to future complications? It'd be better to get rid of one now and then now where the other stands.
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and then know where the other stands*
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Just because they're masons or lovers doesn't mean they're not treacherous.
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Assuming, they're masons, can we be sure that they're only 2? There probably is a third person in the circle. Just saying...
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EPT
