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On March 25 2010 06:49 Zona wrote:
As to elaborate on why I'm willing to overlook an anti-town statement. Players on TL are on average, pretty bad. Looking through past games, you see townies all over the place making horrible statements with very bad ideas. It's something you have to keep in mind, playing here. Otherwise most of the players in most games would be instant lynch targets.
But at least the ones who want to absolve themselves of suspicion will at least make some attempt at replying rather than letting it slide by. This type of behavior doesn't go unnoticed and makes people look scummy as it looks like they're trying to dodge the question, especially when somebody else has brought it up and it still hasn't been replied to.
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On March 25 2010 06:53 Nikon wrote:
Assuming, they're masons, can we be sure that they're only 2? There probably is a third person in the circle. Just saying...
Would you like to roleclaim too so we can have this discussion about you the next day?
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zona, that sounds similiar to the sibling role.
however, with the sibling role, all that is certain is that you die when your sibling dies, but it does guarantee that either player is town or mafia.
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I don't think there is any need to lynch one, It is extremely unlikely that mafia would pretend to have these roles as the roles themselves are not even disclosed, seems fair to assume they are telling the truth. If mafia were going to fake something as elaborate as this then OpZ and Abenson would not be people I would consider capable of doing so.
On this hypothesis I think people who voted for OpZ might be more suspicious, people voting for Abenson was prodominantly due to his being inactive and useless, weras OpZ actuallly contributed. If he is innocent the first place to look for mafia might be people jumping on the vote OpZ bandwagon (which I started).
I'm kinda typing as I think which is never that successful, I'll try to think through this more clearly but it seems like a good place to potentially start looking for mafia.
All this is dependant on OpZ and Abenson being the roles they//OpZ have claimed but that seems likely to me.
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I don't think that they're lovers, we haven't had a night phase yet.
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On March 25 2010 06:54 Elemenope wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2010 06:53 Nikon wrote:
Assuming, they're masons, can we be sure that they're only 2? There probably is a third person in the circle. Just saying... Would you like to roleclaim too so we can have this discussion about you the next day?
Roleclaim what?
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On March 25 2010 06:51 Elemenope wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2010 06:48 Zona wrote:
I didn't assume that his role was entirely just a Mason. I clarified with my subsequent post that his claim involved a role with mason abilities.
Of course anyone can lie. But I'm willing to put of lynching those who role claim right away as:
- the claims can be tested easily later
- there's still a fuckton of other inactive players that are as much deadweight as Abenson was.
I do agree Abenson needs to confirm that the spoke with each other. But it would be pretty silly for OpZ to throw himself out there for Abenson if they weren't on the same team.
I totally agree how his earlier post to use nukes if he was lynched was an anti-town declaration. Still, I think the claim, once confirmed by Abenson, is enough to put me off voting for them day 1. Of course we should keep a very close eye on them for the coming days. And the way we resolve this is generally, we lynch one. First day roleclaims are the shittiest thing ever as they detract discussion. If Abenson and OpZ are on the same side as you imply, why not lynch one and we get the validity of the other? The claims can be tested later yeah, but what if we simply don't have time later due to future complications? It'd be better to get rid of one now and then now where the other stands.
even if they are masons, it does not guarantee that they are both either town or mafia.
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On March 25 2010 06:53 Nikon wrote:
Assuming, they're masons, can we be sure that they're only 2? There probably is a third person in the circle. Just saying...
why?
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What in the world just happened? O.O
I think OpZ is being honest in his statement because his quoted post definitely prove there were private correspondence between him and Abenson. This means they are either Mafia or one or two of them has a role that can PM, but honestly it would be dumb move for Mafia to claim blue role just to save single Mafia (unless Abenson has Mafia special role).
This is bad because besides L, Abenson is currently the only one the town will seemingly be able to attain majority vote for. And I am emphasizing that voting out L without any in-game evidence is stupid move. I am going to skip day 1 lynch unless new suspect comes up, and I hope everyone else does the same rather than voting out L simply because he is the only notable candidate for lynch (we gain no information either way).
Either way, I am not impressed with how Abenson is playing, although it could be that he was instructed to lurk while OpZ went to the front-lines.
He vote for L out of nowhere during the lurking, and does not expect the Town to suspect him? Also I am wondering the reasoning behind his suspect list. I mean, I understand I could be seen as suspicious for initiating a bandwagon, but why Xelin? What distinguishes him from the rest of the players that chose to vote for him?
##Vote: Abstain
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Three masons seem like a good number to have out of twenty-two players. I guess my guess may be unfounded, and who knows what Ace did, but well... seems logical to me.
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On March 25 2010 06:58 Nikon wrote:
I don't think that they're lovers, we haven't had a night phase yet.
it's another name for the sibling role......
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On March 25 2010 06:26 Zona wrote:
Alright, here's the deal. I'm not close to being impressed by what Abenson is contributing. But if he and you, OpZ, are claiming masons, I'm willing to try to lynch someone else for now.
As of last post:
Zona: 32
~OpZ~: 19
XeliN: 16
Versatile: 16
Amber[LighT]: 14
haster27: 14
Elemenope: 13
JeeJee: 12
Fishball: 9
iNfuNdiBuLuM: 9
meeple: 9
Caller: 9
johnnyspazz: 7
Iaaan: 7
d3_crescentia: 7
nemY: 6
Nikon: 4
Abenson: 4
tree.hugger: 4
RebirthOfLeGenD: 3
Phrujbaz: 2
L: 2
As of now, Rebirth of Legend has the lowest amount of posts (ignoring L), and not one of his three posts is useful. Even L's 2 posts has contributed to the shaping of the town's no-nuke-initiation plan. The other end is the odd argument that he was an extra player added, that probably is town or third party, but that was shot down as we shouldn't make any assumptions on how Ace is laying things out. So I will switch my vote to him.
##Vote: RebirthOfLegend
Yes. Me and Abenson are masons. I know his role/country, he knows mine. It's the same role, just different country. Masonic order. I can talk privately with him.
Of course I wouldn't state this publically if he wouldn't die. If I was mafia I wouldn't of breadcrumbed his name. This was for later, because I feared my own death, and wanted to protect the only other person I knew was pro town.
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On March 25 2010 06:49 XeliN wrote:
I don't really know what to say right now other than wtf are you guys thinking? If both of you do have roles that confirm townies and enable you to talk outside of the game you think rolecalling them on the first day is beneficial to the town in any way? You have some of the most powerful roles in the game, Abenson, all you would need to do is actually post something vaguely useful to have people not vote for you, it was the only reason I changed as someone highlighted you had made one post and that included a Lynch vote.
##Remove Vote (Abstain) for now.
He was going to be lynched. He was confirmed to me when I got my role. I had no choice. It was too close to allow it chance, because I have to go to class. I actually left class for a sec to the comp lab to post this and read.
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If a town member was about to be lynched but thought that a role claim might get him or her a chance at life - then role claiming is the right thing to do, even day 1.
The name of the game is to lynch mafia, not people who behave poorly. However, if we have no idea who is mafia, THEN we lynch people who behave poorly because they might be mafia, and we also remove them from the game, so the next day's discussion may be better.
In any case, I think the core disagreement between you (Elemenope) and me is that you don't think the claim is worth considering (it might be a lie/it's a bad move), while I think it is (there's no good reason for Opz to do this if he's mafia/these two players haven't shown this kind of sophistication in the past). We probably won't be able to convince each other in this respect with further words.
We've laid out our reasons, it's up to the rest of the town to consider what we've posted, and hopefully ADD SOME THOUGHTS OF THEIR OWN, but if a large number of the town decides Abenson or Opz is to die tonight, I will of course move my vote to ensure that we can reach majority to get a successful lynch.
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On March 25 2010 06:51 Elemenope wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2010 06:48 Zona wrote:
I didn't assume that his role was entirely just a Mason. I clarified with my subsequent post that his claim involved a role with mason abilities.
Of course anyone can lie. But I'm willing to put of lynching those who role claim right away as:
- the claims can be tested easily later
- there's still a fuckton of other inactive players that are as much deadweight as Abenson was.
I do agree Abenson needs to confirm that the spoke with each other. But it would be pretty silly for OpZ to throw himself out there for Abenson if they weren't on the same team.
I totally agree how his earlier post to use nukes if he was lynched was an anti-town declaration. Still, I think the claim, once confirmed by Abenson, is enough to put me off voting for them day 1. Of course we should keep a very close eye on them for the coming days. And the way we resolve this is generally, we lynch one. First day roleclaims are the shittiest thing ever as they detract discussion. If Abenson and OpZ are on the same side as you imply, why not lynch one and we get the validity of the other? The claims can be tested later yeah, but what if we simply don't have time later due to future complications? It'd be better to get rid of one now and then now where the other stands.
Because the mafia will just kill the other confirmed townie at night time? It really doesn't matter, I suppose. But you are highly suspect to me right now.
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On March 25 2010 07:06 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Yes. Me and Abenson are masons. I know his role/country, he knows mine. It's the same role, just different country. Masonic order. I can talk privately with him.
Please somehow get Abenson to confirm this in the thread. You might want to figure out how to breadcrumb his country as well (and vice versa) but it might be tough now that we're looking for it.
If Abenson can't even return to confirm Opz's claim...pathetic.
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On March 25 2010 06:57 XeliN wrote:
I don't think there is any need to lynch one, It is extremely unlikely that mafia would pretend to have these roles as the roles themselves are not even disclosed, seems fair to assume they are telling the truth. If mafia were going to fake something as elaborate as this then OpZ and Abenson would not be people I would consider capable of doing so.
On this hypothesis I think people who voted for OpZ might be more suspicious, people voting for Abenson was prodominantly due to his being inactive and useless, weras OpZ actuallly contributed. If he is innocent the first place to look for mafia might be people jumping on the vote OpZ bandwagon (which I started).
I'm kinda typing as I think which is never that successful, I'll try to think through this more clearly but it seems like a good place to potentially start looking for mafia.
All this is dependant on OpZ and Abenson being the roles they//OpZ have claimed but that seems likely to me.
People voting for L are more suspicious. Let me emphasize...I BREADCRUMBED HIS NAME.
What good would that do if I was mafia?!
And stop considering yourself so superior? Jesus...
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i think the people abstaining are really dumb, you're preventing the town from getting information and we need all the information we can get since there are no clues. if it's true that opz and abenson both know each other's roles and shit, then abenson needs to confirm that in the thread so the suspicion is no longer on them.
we can have them both RC each other in the thread so that if one of them dies, atleast we know that the other one is also telling the truth since the majority of the votes are on them.
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On March 25 2010 07:10 ~OpZ~ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2010 06:51 Elemenope wrote:On March 25 2010 06:48 Zona wrote:
I didn't assume that his role was entirely just a Mason. I clarified with my subsequent post that his claim involved a role with mason abilities.
Of course anyone can lie. But I'm willing to put of lynching those who role claim right away as:
- the claims can be tested easily later
- there's still a fuckton of other inactive players that are as much deadweight as Abenson was.
I do agree Abenson needs to confirm that the spoke with each other. But it would be pretty silly for OpZ to throw himself out there for Abenson if they weren't on the same team.
I totally agree how his earlier post to use nukes if he was lynched was an anti-town declaration. Still, I think the claim, once confirmed by Abenson, is enough to put me off voting for them day 1. Of course we should keep a very close eye on them for the coming days. And the way we resolve this is generally, we lynch one. First day roleclaims are the shittiest thing ever as they detract discussion. If Abenson and OpZ are on the same side as you imply, why not lynch one and we get the validity of the other? The claims can be tested later yeah, but what if we simply don't have time later due to future complications? It'd be better to get rid of one now and then now where the other stands. Because the mafia will just kill the other confirmed townie at night time? It really doesn't matter, I suppose. But you are highly suspect to me right now.
With their super pro KP of 1 when we most likely have medics?
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EPT
