Incognito's TL Mafia XVI
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citi.zen
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On January 20 2010 13:23 meeple wrote: just for future reference/consideration: citi.zen's quote "Aut viam inveniam, aut faciam." means I will either find a way or make one. It's taken from a Greek War Commander named Hannibal. Let me help you out there: Hannibal was Carthaginian, not Greek. Back to the clues that stuck to me: * The "strongly caffeinated" tea cups were already on the desk when the bad guys arrived - it is hard for me to see how they are connected/lead us the mobsters. * "lifting his fists and taunting them with strange barbaric noises" seems important. * "swiftly proceeded to shove the remains of the apple down Kennigit's throat" should have some meaning, otherwise it would be superfluous with the throwing out of the window. * It was Qatol the 2nd killer called "Vile, dirty scum", not Incognito or Kennigit. Does he have enemies in this game? Feuds? Former mafia co-players? Something with the meaning of his name perhaps? * The 2nd assassin pulled out a "thin" knife. * The already mentioned calculated/neat body disposal. | ||
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For bad guy 1 we have the barbaric noises, raised fists, fridge/apple down the throat. For bad guy 2 the words said to Qatol, the neat/calculated nature, the thin knife. General guesses, noting they are quite weak thus far: bad guy 1 - keit. bad guy 2 - magicbullet, Ng5 | ||
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Perhaps, but there should still be a reason 2nd guy calls Qatol vile, dirty scum. | ||
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On January 20 2010 14:22 meeple wrote: Bad guy 1 could be a cookie monster... he has a habit of stuffing cookies down his throat. Why are you guessing keit? The cookie monster, nothing else. I like the Beatles connection too, but seems a bit more tenuous. Maybe because I didn't know about the record label :-) | ||
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On January 20 2010 23:10 magicbullet wrote: "lifting his fists and taunting them with strange barbaric noises" Definitely a clue in here, it does not go naturally with the rest of the sentence. But how is these related to Hobbes or the Leviathan ? Look at Hobbes' picture - raised fists, could be interpreted as taunting + tiger could account for noises. | ||
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On January 20 2010 17:20 t_co wrote: I just read dreamflower's post. I apologize but I can't edit my above post. If a mod would like to take that down it would be much appreciated. I vote for t_co. You made a long campaign speech, but you apparently still have not bothered to read the rules: 4. You cannot vote for yourself or anyone dead or outside the game. Attention to detail will matter in this game. | ||
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Btw meeple, your quote makes me think of assassin 2, even though there is little "proof": Into the fray my friends, may our feet be swift, our hands be sure, and our necks keep a firm grasp on our heads. | ||
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As to Hobbes, I am not saying he has a bad personality in the cartoon, but than again the stories are written by someone with limited knowledge of that sort of thing, who may have just been descriving the picture literally. Still my best guess, but of course nothing is 100% certain on day 1! | ||
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Hyperbola, you also left out the apple as a defensive object - [NyC] clan tag before the name. Maybe this is incorrect, I don't know. With so little to go on, this reminds of those posts about getting from one word to another on wikipedia with the fewest number of clicks. You can get almost anywhere starting anywhere with 4-5 clicks. | ||
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skronch - Really no other reason than his name. As he does not have any text or images in his profile, his name is the only thing that could be used as a clue. And “skronch” sounds like the sound one makes when eating the apple. The_Master – A little weak but blocking a knife attack with a fruit and then killing the assailant with it takes a lot of skill. Besides his name, his quote is: “[CPL]Master on team Prodigies!” I am puzzled. | ||
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Back to the clues it is! | ||
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On January 21 2010 04:44 DoctorHelvetica wrote: I mean, let's say citi.zen is elected mayor. We eventually suspect him of being mafia and lynch him and it turns out he is. Then we should examine who voted for him as probably a few of them are mafia. Then we can compare that list to clues and such That's a good point. Does this mean mafiosi are more likely to bandwagon to "blend in"? | ||
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On January 21 2010 04:46 t_co wrote: My mistake. Still, the point is, rushing to ask people to lynch off the voices of a substantial minority and 1 day's worth of clues is kind of suicidal. It takes 2 points to draw a line, after all. With 4 mafia clues per day and only 8 mafia total, it shouldn't take that long for more mafia clues to pile up that point us in a better direction. Cruel as it may sound, the first day lynch matters little in the long run, because the town is still at 34 members and the mafia only at 8, which means there is a substantial margin of error available to us. I guess you lost me: 1st paragraph is saying "lets not rush with the lynching"; 2nd paragraph says "we have a substantial error margin". Am I reading it wrong? | ||
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On January 21 2010 06:15 DoctorHelvetica wrote: No. And the detective can't just come out and say "derp im a detective and i rolechecked Ng5 and yeah he's mafia." 1. Why should the town believe him? He could be mafia trying to divert attention away from a real mafia member. 2. If he is a real detective, the mafia will probably kill him that night. I guess wondered whether an update would be posted by admins recapping who was investigated and so on. I guess not much new info coming out for a while! | ||
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On January 21 2010 06:42 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Well, that's why we need to make sure the mayor goes along with the town consensus. Also, a mafia mayor may do that, since mafia killpower will still be 3 regardless of whether there are 6 or 7 mafia left. What does a KP of 3 mean anyway? Mob gets to kill 3 people per night? | ||
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At any rate, I offered my opinions for this round, voted in the election, I guess time to lay back until more information is forthcoming. | ||
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So my conjecture is this: one and only one of the candidates is a mobster. So far the candidates are: myself, DoctorH, meeple, 789 and t_co. I think one of us, and only one, is a mobster. PS: I also realize that I am an idiot for continuing to offer my best guesses to the public: if these guesses are right, the mob will kill me to get rid of a troublesome player. Who else would they go for? If I am wrong, I will move to the top of the list for getting lynched by the town, since I argued my points clearly and strongly and got innocent people killed (say... [NyC]Hobbes gets lynched but turns out to be innocent this round - who would you all blame?!?). | ||
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t_co moved to the top of my suspect list. | ||
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On January 20 2010 14:16 citi.zen wrote: How about this: one of Qatol's quotes is: "guns make you stupid." We have a player called magicbullet - who could resent that and call him vile, dirty scum. Who thinks I will not survive the night??? | ||
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On January 20 2010 17:14 t_co wrote: My Fellow Liquidians, We face the threat of extermination. Within our ranks, there lurks members whose sole driving focus is to kill us all (and hopefully leave a few clues behind). Individually, all we are armed with is our wits. That will not be enough, for our enemy strikes unseen while we must cast our votes openly. The answer is trust. We must learn to trust one another even as we fight an unseen enemy in our ranks, and that is impossible without someone to lead the way. That is why, today, I am running to be your Sheriff. I will strive to discover and work with Blues in the best manner possible, so that we can all make it out of here alive. I've played in good mafia games, bad mafia games, and served time in the psychotic morass known as Caller's Red Army, so I know how to be a man and do the right thing. Vote for survival. Vote t_co for your Mafia XVI Sheriff. Then, after falling way behind in the election: On January 21 2010 08:06 t_co wrote: This, coming from the same person who said seems kind of odd. I find this sudden tightness between meeple and DH kind of suspicious. But the main topic here should be that we should lynch the mayor regardless of whether we think he is mafia or not. The mayor role is actually quite overpowered compared to the sheriff, but the power only helps if the mayor is mafia. Consider that the extra three votes of the mayor don't really start kicking in until later in the game, when vote total gets smaller and smaller. By then, most of the bodyguards may be dead. If the mayor is town, then the mafia can kill him. If the mayor is mafia, the mafia get an additional 2 votes to use when there aren't that many actives left. In this case, the mayor is a pretty useless role for the town to keep and should be lynched ASAP. It would also allow the meeple DH duo to be verified, as if one of the two shows up clean, the other ought to be clean as well. | ||
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On January 21 2010 12:23 Abenson wrote: I'm so confused right now.... The clues don't seem to tell anything in the Day 1 post... D; Anyways.... I think that we should stick with hard facts for now, and I really think T_co is extremely suspicious like most of you, but I think we should observe before doing anything rash. The fact is we must lynch someone, these are the rules. It is simply a matter of who is the best candidate. | ||
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Needless to say if I flip green/blue then doctorH/meeple are in doubt. Don't forget me too! Not only that, but I would think the people who voted for you might be relatively safe. It would be one heck of a strategy for the mob to put up 3 competing candidates, but what the heck, it could happen! On the other hand, if we lynched you and you turned out red, we'd have a lot to talk about. Basically I think lynching is about revealing information. I don't think killing anyone else would give us as much to go on as lynching t_co. We could go with Hobbes based on clues, but even if he turned red, that would be a dead end. | ||
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Lynching Hobbes on the other hand... not so useful, even if he is guilty/red. Same KP for the mob, no new info. | ||
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Look, I have no reason now to trust anyone. However, you t_co just make nonsensical arguments and change your story every paragraph. I find it really hard to belive this is accidental, as opposed to deliberate misinformation. Either way I find you hard to work with, despite your 13 post "experience" from the red mafia. | ||
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a. mandatory under the rules; and b. meant to reveal to us information we previously did not have, to help test theories, people and alliances. Don't waste it with random killings. | ||
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If t_co turns out red on the other hand, I think magicbullet, faronel, 789 and Stimilant would have to be on the shortlist next to Hobbes. Perhaps meeple as well, since t_co has made a deliberate effort to convince us that if one of them is lynched and found guilty the other is clean - so I would want to be careful if t_co turned red. Plenty to talk about. | ||
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On January 22 2010 02:59 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Has anyone considered the whole possibility that the mafia doesn't even have a candidate? We've been going on this whole shitstorm assuming someone running for office is red. The mafia could see that and just think "well wouldn't it really fuck with them if none of us ran? They'll tear each other apart and probably end up lynching their elected candidates" That's kind what is happening too. Well, the mayor or sheriff cannot be role checked by a detective. Also, they can put people in jail (to silence or protect them) and they get extra votes. So it seems pretty valuable for the mob to have elected official(s). Running with "mob support" could be easier if you can build some sort of critical mass + confusion and wait for people to bandwagon. I am not saying that is what happened, just that it would be worth a shot, if you were the mob. Finally, removing non-mob officials from office is hard for the mob initially, because the bodyguards are alive. So if they do not get elected, the mob could have to live with an "honest" official for a while. Just a few thoughts. Of course, there is a chance I am wrong and they were indeed very patient. | ||
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On January 22 2010 05:11 Phrujbaz wrote: I've been thinking, how can we find confirmed innocents to help coordinate town? Detectives can sort of confirm an innocent with a rolecheck. It could still be the godfather though. Medics can confirm someone by saving that person. Are there any other ways? Good questions but not sure I have any answers. For example, the medic could inadvertently save a lynched mobster, no? | ||
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More importantly, I need to stop talking. You all know where I stand by now. | ||
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On January 22 2010 11:33 DoctorHelvetica wrote: I'm starting to think that all the candidates are green/blue and that the mafia were satisfied with the disruption happening anyway. After all, why would mafia want mayor/sheriff when the town has been saying for pages now that those two people are going to be scrutinized the most? Let's say myself/meeple/you is mafia. Any mafia member would have known t_co is green and that lynching him would cast suspicion on one of us. So I think anyone in the mafia would have either tried to convince the town not to lynch t_co (assuming the mafia has a candidate) or dropped out of the race altogether. Is it fair to look closely at people who switched their votes TO t_co after I accused him then? Perfect cover-up move if they knew he wasn't mafia and was top of the list for being lynched, no? | ||
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Detective You have the ability to make night investigations. Once per night phase, you may PM me to ask one of the following, which I will answer: 1. Does X contain a clue? (Where X is part of a Day post) (called a "Clue Check") 2. Does X contain a clue that points to Y? (Where X is part of a Day post and Y is a player's name) (called a "Clue Check") 3. What is Y's role? (Where Y is a player's role) (called a "Role Check") X can be no larger than one sentence. We should try to help the detectives come up with good question ideas to ask during the night. | ||
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Does "With that, he launched himself forward at the three town leaders, lifting his fists and taunting them with strange barbaric noises." point to [NyC]Hobbes? Anyone else have anything? | ||
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1. The day one clues. Possible link to a number of players. Maybe strongest link to Hobbes. 2. Suspicion of other candidates, now that t_co turned green. Even t_co thought there was mafia interest in getting elected. 3. When t_co became the lead lynching candidate, the mafia of course knew he was in fact green. We can go back and look at people's posts and voting record keeping this in mind. 4. PMs. Be careful who you talk to and keep notes. Think critically. When more clues surface, use some combination of the above. | ||
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I guess a clue-check in these cases is better than a role-check, since the godfather cannot hide their role? | ||
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On January 23 2010 02:32 789 wrote: Also the problem with my idea is the relay of information. A mafia could say DoctorH is red to get him lynched. If he flips green/blue the person who relayed the information becomes a lynch target. He could be mafia or innocent, duped by the mafia. A detective could follow through on this, send his PM to a mafia. This could potenially cost us a detective AND sherrif. If DoctorH ends up being lynched and flips red, the person who relays the information is a target to be hit. Whether the detective himself or the person he sent a PM too. Right, which is why it is critical to remain calm and not overreact as a detective, even if you find juicy information. Only share with people you are really sure you can trust, then jointly decide how to proceed. | ||
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Either way, early on the dts should try to build these networks, rather than attempt to solve the mystery. Stay safe and out of sight, your time will come! | ||
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1. Use your role-checks to find people you can trust. 2. Only discuss your thoughts in PMs with these people. 3. Don't try to solve everything in the early-game. FE, don't 4 pool - nobody scouted! 4. In the mid-late game, use and abuse clue-checks - they are stronger than role-checks at that point. 5. Only share findings with trusted people. Am I forgetting something? Is this useful to help coordinate the dts? | ||
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On January 23 2010 05:12 Faronel wrote: I added in the 2nd paragraph about how lynching the mayor is awesome. At what point does this sort of thing become grounds for a ban? | ||
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On January 23 2010 08:02 DoctorHelvetica wrote: 3 hours until the next day. I'm a bit nervous : / You have bodyguard protection. I wish people were a bit more careful in their PMs. That is the biggest takeaway thus far: just be careful. | ||
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I repeat: if you are a blue, keep quiet and stay alive, unless you are sure of those you can trust. Will take a look at the clues now... | ||
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He thought Jugan had to be in the clear since he told Bill "I hope I'm not the miller". I have no idea why this would be evidence for anything, or why in general he would trust anyone he did not role-check. | ||
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Could kane]deth[ by a suspect for Bill killing too? kane = sledge-hammer, used to kill Bill? | ||
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From the darkness, a figure appeared just outside the garage, advancing on him with what looked like a sledgehammer. The figure moved quickly, wearing a large helmet resembling an old rusty pail. This seems waaaay too specific to be accidental. | ||
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On January 23 2010 13:13 citi.zen wrote: This seems waaaay too specific to be accidental. God damn it, I can't figure it out. The closest thing is Ng5, via knight - helmet - scepter / hammer. That's weaker than the Hobbes connection I would think. | ||
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On January 24 2010 23:04 meeple wrote: And there's a stronger link to him than to really any of the others... He was in the middle of the whole Bill.Murray fiasco, and yeah you can chalk that up to the Mafia catching on, but you gotta admit its still pretty incriminating. Yes, this bothers me a lot. He also seemed to think t_co was innocent when we were discussing it, and has revealed private information about a rolecheck to another player. Not saying any of this is definite, but it does raise questions in my mind. | ||
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I am not claiming this incriminates you beyond any reasonable doubt, it does not. But it does make your argument about willingly sharing your connection with Bill a very weak one. | ||
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On January 26 2010 00:00 flamewheel91 wrote: flamewheel I agree though: until we get the next set of clues, it would be prudent for us to look based on players' actions and interactions. Seeing as how I cannot actually dissuade people from logic since clues are there, I invite persons who have suspicions about me to interrogate me further. I don't see how we are saying the same thing: you are suggesting looking at people's actions instead of clues, I am stating that we tried tha with t_co and kane, and it has not worked out very well. | ||
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I still like Hobbes and keit for example. They are the best fit for the night 1 killed 1, and they certainly don't seem interested in solving this thing or contributing. When accused, they quickly sprung to action, then faded back into the crowd. Just my 2c. | ||
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I don't mean to single you out, keit, hyperbola, free and a few others are in the same boat. | ||
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789 - interesting find! | ||
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Zona noticed that even the air was gradually growing harsh and stifling. He was starting to have difficulty breathing. The thick air stuck to the back of his throat and filled his nostrils, making him feel dizzy and drowsy. He tried to fight the sensation but couldn't and keeled over, unconscious. A man with a scarf wrapped around his face appeared above him, looking perfectly at home in the oppressive atmosphere. | ||
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Finally a live one! Any guesses on the above Dr? | ||
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Zona noticed that even the air was gradually growing harsh and stifling. He was starting to have difficulty breathing. The thick air stuck to the back of his throat and filled his nostrils, making him feel dizzy and drowsy. He tried to fight the sensation but couldn't and keeled over, unconscious. A man with a scarf wrapped around his face appeared above him, looking perfectly at home in the oppressive atmosphere. + possible connection with "eye'm the strongest" quote from earlier. | ||
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On January 27 2010 06:45 Ng5 wrote: Wait a minute... I don't know much about wrestling, but... Someone could look into it. A wrestler! It's usual in wrestling to grab the other's face trying to hit them to solid objects, no? Or some kind of modern-age gladiator 'reality show'? There was also one with... Bucket heads and blunt objects trying to push each other off of planks into water, no? It could fit the... Geez. It could fit the PAIL! There was this gladiator or what show. They had bucket-helmets like those from rugby and they tried to kick each other off of planks (pails) into water or nets or whatever. And then there's the wrestler thing. It could be two mafia members, but both worth researching I think. With keywords like... Sledgehammer... Barbaric... Or animalistic? Again it takes a lot of strength to grab someone by the head... Wait... I just google image findered Mystlord and what did it drop right off the bat? Mystlord Hammer. Bucket helm. Even if the post wasn't made by a user called Mystlord. It was dropped to a Mystlord search. This post is what clue checking is about. Excellent work. | ||
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I submit to you our first real plan to clean up our town. I am going to make the argument that we need to lynch DoctorHelvetica. Also, we need to vote for a double lynching, so we can move quickly once he is gone. The arguments below come primarily from my own doubts, strengthened by an alleged detective who contacted me on their own. Two other players contacted me with an independent effort to lynch DoctorHelvetica. Together, these bits of information paint a pretty strong case. At this time, all participants will remain anonymous (even to each other), for safety reasons. Facts: 1.Clue from day 1 - "He pulled out a thin knife and ran forward to stab Qatol in the chest." was checked and confirmed to point to DoctorHelvetica, according to the alleged detective. I have not had much contact with this source, but if it turns out they are lying, I will post their name on the forum and we go from there. 2. I’ve had a PM exchange with DoctorHelvetica, after he privately told Zona I had been checked by a detective and came up green. At that point in time he had no reason to trust Zona, but he chose to share that information with him nonetheless. DoctoHelvetica himself admits he was careless – either because he was a green making an honest mistake, or because he is mafia who did not have any reason to care/worry about another player's safety and the town's ability to coordinate their efforts. Given his otherwise careful nature and active behavior in this thread, you need to decide for yourselves which version makes more sense. Note how, towards the end of the exchange, when he runs out of arguments, he ends up trying to convince me to lynch keit instead. Read from bottom to top, my posts are in green and any bold highlights were added by me: Original Message: I can post my PM conversation with Zona if you'd like. Something like that would be pretty hard to fake. Also, keit has strong clues from day 1 connecting to him, has been mostly inactive, and just popped in the thread out of nowhere: not to defend himself, but to point his finger at me. That screams mafia to me. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Right, I think night two I am a prime target for a mafia hit, thanks to that postmortem post. In the end I would love to think you just made an error and took a chance. However, if your communication with Zona (and maybe others?) was deliberate/mafia, nobody will pick-up on that once I get killed. Once again, I wish there was a safe I could lock information in and make it available if I die, just so it does not get lost. Anyway... why keit? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: That's a fair point. However, killing someone who is confirmed to the entire town as green, because of Bill Murrays post-death post, they might suspect other blues will network through you and hit you for that reason. Once medics start dying, I'm guessing you'll be a prime suspect. That being said, I won't ask you to trust me, but I would ask you to reconsider pushing for my lynch. At the very least, I'll submit to you keit is a better and more sure target for the town as of now. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Again, I think this is wrong: yes, I would have made a good target IF THEY DID NOT KNOW WHO THE DETECTIVE WAS. If they did know, they could sever that trust/information link by just killing him. This is what happened, so I became rather useless. Now, Bill did post after death that I was green, but this should not have happened - it was a violation of the rules. In principle I should have been useless to the town at that point, who cares if I claimed to be green, nobody would have believed me, exactly as the mafia would have intended it. And they could use another hit on someone else with a chance of hitting a blue. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I suppose that is true. However, you were not hit. You certainly would have made a better target than Abenson if the mafia had reason to suspect you were co ordinating with blues. Although I do admit it was something I shouldn't have done, I guess I was a bit too trusting there. We're probably both suspicious to the town at this time, since we are the only two people who 100% knew BM was a detective. That being said, I find it strange you're voting for my lynching on those grounds. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Its not important if the mafia knows I'm green - that is true. It IS however important if he knows other greens/blues know it too, because then they would want to stop any coordination and/or information flow. The best situation for the mafia is when greens/blues know nothing and suspect everyone. So if the mafia knows I a in contact with a blue, even if they don't know who the blue is, it DOES make me a target. By killing me they can sever that link and annul any role-check advantage. So I continue to be puzzled as to why you chose to make that information known to someone who was not role-checked. Of course, I guess if it was an honest mistake, there is no way to argue /defend it, it just happened. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: hm? I didn't talk to zona much. like I said before, whether or not he knows your green isn't a big deal. I never told him Bill Murray was the detective or anything like that. From the way he posts and the way he talked to me, I'm pretty sure he is pro-town, i can't be 100% certain and that is why I didn't reveal any information that would be critical to mafia lynching decisions. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: The thing I still don't get is why you decided to trust Zona without any proof whatsoever. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I've posted in defense of myself multiple times. I'd think people would think again before moving to lynch the most active townie, but I suppose not. The mafia really hurt me by killing Bill Murray, even though it was easily detectable that he was a blue from his public posts :/ ----------------------------------------- Original Message: There is a growing movement to lynch you next. I would really love to hear your side of things and believe you are green/blue. 3. Bill Murray connection. As far as I can tell, Bill told two people he was a detective: DoctorHelvetica and myself. Others may or may not have suspected it, but there was no way of being sure. 4. Posting behavior: in the last analysis DoctorHelvetica posted on page 67, I believe he clearly leaves out many obvious clues and chooses to focus, yet again, on keit, hobbes and flamewheel. On page 68 I specifically ask for his opinion on this clue: Zona noticed that even the air was gradually growing harsh and stifling. He was starting to have difficulty breathing. The thick air stuck to the back of his throat and filled his nostrils, making him feel dizzy and drowsy. He tried to fight the sensation but couldn't and keeled over, unconscious. A man with a scarf wrapped around his face appeared above him, looking perfectly at home in the oppressive atmosphere. You’ve all seen DoctorHelvetica's response – he cannot think of ANY suspect for the above clue. I find the connection to Mystlord obvious - decide for yourself how strong or weak it is, but it is undeniably there! Furthermore, he continues to ignore references to Mystlord for the next few pages - he does not even acknowledge others picked him as a likely suspect. This is just not balanced behavior from an honest Sheriff, who also happens to be our most active poster and a past keen reader of clues. In summary: there are clues pointing to DoctorHelvetica; there is a report from a player claiming a clue-check confirmed he is indeed mafia; he chose to share potentially sensitive information with players he had no reason to trust; his posting behavior seems shaky. One more thing I want to reiterate: if we lynch DoctorHelvetica and he turns green, I will reveal the name of the supposed clue-checker, as well as make public conversations with other players who privately argued strongly in favor of lynching DoctorHelvetica. This is an important junction in our game - we are finally close to solid leads rather than endless speculation based solely on vague clues. We need to vote for a double lynch today so we have it available after we lynch DoctorHelvetica - regardless of how it turns out he is the key information node. I am coordinating with an alleged vigilante as well, so we should be able to get the mafia KP down to 2 one way or another. My votes: YES to double lynching; YES to lynching DoctorHelvetica. | ||
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I've made my case as clearly as I could, please read my post carefully and decide for yourselves. | ||
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On January 27 2010 12:47 Mystlord wrote: It's a fair case to lynch DH, but we HAVE to consider the possibility that the DT who clue checked DH is mafia. Earlier, we saw a fair case to lynch DH based off of the thin knife clue brought up by keit, but it never gained traction considering how much steam the kane]deth[ idea had. At this point, a mafia member could have thought to sow the seeds of confusion and make a plot to lynch DH. At this point, the fact of the matter is that either keit or DoctorHelvetica is innocent. One is absolutely a townie, because we cannot have two people making such great pushes for each other to be lynched as both mafia. Therefore, the possible combinations are: mafia vs townie and townie vs townie. I personally highly doubt a townie vs townie situation because of the fact that by lynching the other, the person pushing for the lynch will almost certainly appear innocent. Therefore, I believe that we have a mafia vs townie situation. In that line of thinking, confirming the identity of one will confirm the identity of the other. By lynching DH, we'll know keit's true colors, and by lynching keit, we'll know DH's true colors. Therefore, the question now becomes who to lynch? My personal vote is for keit. Here's my reasoning: If we lynch DoctorHelvetica, we lose a vital power that will almost certainly confirm whether a person is mafia or not, as well as protect a vital blue or townie (if things get that desperate). Therefore, in this situation, where we're unsure as to the guilt or innocence of either player, we have to make the decision to try and save our powers as best as possible, especially considering the fact that we have lynched no mafia. Therefore, we have a lot more to lose from lynching DoctorHelvetica and finding out that he's green/blue, versus lynching keit and finding out that he's green/blue. One final point on this. We have to realize that at this point, we for sure for sure have at least two clues on one mafia member. We have 8 clues for 7 mafia, so we're looking for repeating themes. If there's one repeating theme that I've seen, it's almost certainly referring to the cookie monster. Whether it's the apple shoving down the throat from day 1, or the barbarous nature of either the 2nd or 3rd attack from day 2, we've seen a lot more evidence pointing to keit than to DH. Therefore, I again emphasize my vote to lynch keit. In case you haven't been reading between the lines Myst, I will either use the vigilante hit or one of the double lynches against you if DrH turns red. The fact that you (again) agree with DrH thus fails to impress me much. | ||
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On January 27 2010 13:23 Mystlord wrote: I still don't see the reasoning behind the fact that keit brought up the clue reference in the first place. If it wasn't for him, DoctorHelvetica would never have been accused. Why would a mafia initiate the charges against DH? It would make sense if DH was already under heavy suspicion and keit become the primary advocate of lynching DH and brought up that clue reference, but that isn't the case here. However, I do see your point. I still feel that if we lose the incarceration power, we're in some deep shit. @citi.zen: Yes, I could tell that you would vote to lynch me if DoctorHelvetica flipped red. I know that you won't believe me when I say that my argument is in favor of the town, but it is. Regardless of whether or not you agree, I'd at least like for you to respond to my argument rather than merely brush it off as an attempt to save my own skin. I acknowledge that DoctorHelvetica might be guilty, but I fear rushing into lynching an important townie much more. Wait a second... If the Sheriff gets lynched, do we have another election to vote for a new Sheriff to replace DH? If so, then my argument is moot. Hobbes answered you already, and you seem to acknowledge that above (bolded): keit is not on the critical information path. His lynching will not even give us useful information about DrH, let alone yield 2 other clear suspects. | ||
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On January 27 2010 13:37 derfboy wrote: Ng5's right. this next decision will determine the outcome of the game. we can't afford to go about this hastily. We also can't waste any time, as long as mafia has 3xKP we're in pretty deep. i think we should double lynch mystlord and flamewheel first. the thick air strongly suggests mystlord (although the spelling is off, i'm sure most people have interpreted myst as mist). the evidence against keit doesn't incriminate him perfectly, but it works to some degree. i don't think we need to lynch him because he isn't active or a major contributor + he doesn't want to play, so he'll probably get modkilled. i don't remember what the flamewheel clue was, but it seems like a lot of people agreed that it pointed to him. if we lynch dochelvetica before all of them and he turns out blue, it would hurt us more. although the thin blade clue from night 1 seems to point to doc, the other clues are just as incriminating imo. A detective used a alleged clue-check to confirm the day one clue points to DrH. Either this is correct or not: either the "detective" is mafia or DrH is. No more vague and confusing clues, this lynching brings an actual answer. so if we don't get any mafia members in the double lynch, we'll go for dochelvetica, since the next most obvious clue points to him. if dochelvetica turns out red, it'd put us back into the game. if he's actually blue, gg. if we get 1 or 2 mafia in the double lynch, we can still go for dochelvetica if the new clues point to him or if someone provides an impeccable argument incriminating him. I think we actually need 3 mafia dead by the end of the double lynch to stand a decent chance. We need the KP lowered to 2. We have to use the hard information, not place our hope in a multi-step vague process predicated on future clues which may or may not be stronger. i might be too trusting of DocH, but from what he's contributed, i think he deserves more time to prove himself innocent. also, even if dochelvetica is red, it won't matter that much if we keep him alive for another day or two because he's still a major contributor. if we can interpret what he says for ourselves, he'd still be helping us win. as long as we can lower the KP by interpreting the strongest clues, we'd be heading in the right direction. As a matter of fact, DrH's interpretation of the day 3 clues leaves a lot to be desired. He failed to acknowledge obvious connections even when asked point blank. You can call it consistent behavior, but to me it is suspect precisely because I hold him in higher regard than this - he is a smart guy. There is no way he would miss the Mystlord connection here: On January 27 2010 02:32 citi.zen wrote: Finally a live one! Any guesses on the above Dr? On January 27 2010 02:57 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Clue 2, I don't have any suspect for it. | ||
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On January 27 2010 14:06 [NyC]HoBbes wrote: derfboy, why do you suddenly start being active right now to defend DrH, and to instead accuse someone while admitting you don't know why you're accusing them. Seems to me to be not only suspicious, but just plain nonsensical That's why it has been a fun day watching people on the forum, both before and after my big post. Also why we must lynch DrH. | ||
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On January 27 2010 14:06 Mystlord wrote: So you're going to lynch based on the fact that my name is "close enough" to the word "mist"? I cannot see the logical connection that you're making there. This is what my name is actually referring to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myst I'm posting that link because it seems that people are stymied as to an alternative interpretation of the first half of my name. You are very likely red if DrH turns red. It is your behavior, as much as the clues that raise questions at this time. Even now you are trying to suggest stalling and going after keit/free/etc. instead of following the hard evidence obtained by lynching DrH. You are further trying to confuse matters by suggesting that either keit or DrH, but not both, have to be red - when this is clearly not the case at this point int the game. I just don't see it, sorry. It is not personal, I never even really suspected you before today. | ||
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On January 27 2010 14:41 Mystlord wrote: I'm only advocating a keit lynch because I believed that it would almost certainly reveal who was mafia and who wasn't. Please explain who your other suspects are if keit flipped red. I am willing to keep an open mind. Note that we will have a double lynch, and possibly a vigilante to use. We need 2/3 or 3/3 hits to get mafia kp to 2. | ||
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DoctorHelevitca just took back his double lynch vote - no surprises there either. | ||
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Jayme was on my short list for the next lynching, but we got him mod-killed, which is also fine - it means we have 5 mafia left. Remember, we will use a vigilante hit next night cycle, and a double lynching is coming up after that next. If we go 1/3 mafia is down to 2KP. If we go 3/3 they are are down to 1 KP. Tonight we party. | ||
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On January 28 2010 08:21 Nikoner wrote: I'd also like to point out how Phrujbaz said that I should be lynched without giving any further information on his decision. You mean this: On January 22 2010 10:57 Nikoner wrote: Yeah, day ends in 3-4 minutes. Personally, I think we should lynch Phrujbaz, he beats me 1v1 too much to be an upstanding citizen > On January 22 2010 21:03 Phrujbaz wrote: I think we should lynch Nikoner. It's obvious he is Mafia. | ||
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A useful exercise now is to go back from the top and read DrH's posts again. See which accusations are suspect, which are not, which clues he ignored or discounted when brought up by others. See who agrees with him every time, and who starts transparent make-pretend "arguments". His decision to be the most active poster left a HUGE paper trail, and no matter how careful he was, in the back of his mind he always KNEW then names of the mafia. | ||
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On January 28 2010 12:00 Ace wrote: agreed. Well play Dr.H. It was pretty hard for the town to catch you imo. What I still don't get is why they did not kill me on night 2. Then none of this mess would have happened :-) | ||
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On January 28 2010 12:18 dozko wrote: Well done guys, solid performance on this day. Im keeping my fingers crossed for both our towns to get rid of the scum If you lived in my town I'd have you lynched for this suspect remark. | ||
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On January 28 2010 12:26 dozko wrote: But if I lived in your town would my remark have made any sense, so as to be speaketh? Well unless I have split personalities I guess... That Romanian thread must be rubbing off people :-) | ||
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Maybe I am wrong, but I doubt it. Please scan DrH's posts from the start and make notes. Search the page using something from his signature to make life easier. Tomorrow we can hopefully share very similar notes, and a list of 5 mafia. | ||
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GG guys. | ||
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Ok, let me answer this with respect to you. 1. Strong clue link - look at the freaking picture: On January 27 2010 06:45 Ng5 wrote: Wait a minute... I don't know much about wrestling, but... Someone could look into it. A wrestler! It's usual in wrestling to grab the other's face trying to hit them to solid objects, no? Or some kind of modern-age gladiator 'reality show'? There was also one with... Bucket heads and blunt objects trying to push each other off of planks into water, no? It could fit the... Geez. It could fit the PAIL! There was this gladiator or what show. They had bucket-helmets like those from rugby and they tried to kick each other off of planks (pails) into water or nets or whatever. And then there's the wrestler thing. It could be two mafia members, but both worth researching I think. With keywords like... Sledgehammer... Barbaric... Or animalistic? Again it takes a lot of strength to grab someone by the head... Wait... I just google image findered Mystlord and what did it drop right off the bat? Mystlord Hammer. Bucket helm. Even if the post wasn't made by a user called Mystlord. It was dropped to a Mystlord search. 2. Shady posting behavior from the start, which got a LOT worse in the past 2 days. After my post on page 74 you should have read the writing on the wall and given up on DrH. The same goes for your mafia team-mates - sadly you guys just fell apart. After the votes/evidence started to pile in, you STILL argued. You bring up repeatedly the supposed "solution" of lynching keit first to "prove" DrH is not red. Even freaking DrH had given up at that point man - he stopped posting because he knew it was over! Even after that, you continue to claim we should not double-lynch, using nonsensical arguments and pointing fingers at the same players DrH obsessively attacked for many days now. Give me a break - this is not even subtle. I don't have the patience to copy/paste - anyone interested read from page 74 onwards. You are getting vigilante hit tonight. GG man, I feel there wasn't anything you could do, the entire team strategy lost you the game. | ||
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Yes, keit. Let us track the mafia's attitude towards him in this game. The first mention of keit, after the day 1 clues, comes from our now deceased bodyguard (cheers buddy): On January 20 2010 12:24 blue_arrow wrote: I glanced through everybody's profiles as well, and I can confirm with DH that there are no obvious references to monkeys. Although, I couldn't find anything relating to apples or cooked pigs. But while scrolling through everyone's profiles, on a completely off-the-side thinking, and continuing with my possibly-incorrect golden monkeys, I'm begining to suspect keit. Here are my reasons: -keit has a bunch of pictures of the cookie monster in his profile -the golden monkey was thought to be a subspecies of Blue Monkey -the cookie monster has always reminded me of a monkey (albeit tailess, blue, and on crack) -blue monkeys and golden monkeys eat fruit, possibly referring to apples, although i'm pretty sure apples aren't part of these monkey's normal diets -the cookie monster eats his food by shoving it down his throat quickly and violently of course, this is all speculation on my part. Objectively speaking, I myself believe this 'analysis' isn't very convincing given the degree of speculation. Who responds to this man's reasonable accusation? Surprise!!! The very next post is from DrH. Now, if keit was not mafia, DrH would at least accept that there is a possible connection there. Instead, he says this: On January 20 2010 12:26 DoctorHelvetica wrote: The cookie monster isn't a monkey and he eats cookies not fruit. the cookie monster reminds me more of a retarded bear or something Um... yeah, retarded bear alright. Later on, DrH starts to feel the heat. Knowing full well DrH has left too much of a paper trail, the mafia tries desperately to build a strong alibi for him and decides to sacrifice keit. So suddenly, the entire team starts to claim that either DrH is red or keit is red. After all, they have been attacking each other. Fail. keit is mafia. | ||
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There is just too much information pointing to the mafia now. | ||
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Hyperbola 1. Clue link: please review his profile pictures, then read this: Walking home from the post-election celebration, a slightly tipsy blue_arrow was whistling tunelessly to himself in the violet dusk. After a block or two, he noticed the sound of someone shuffling behind him. Though unnerved, he tried to shrug it off and started walking faster. The shuffling did not speed up in response, and blue_arrow felt safer the further he walked from his follower. As the streetlamps flickered on one by one, he took a quick peek behind him. One glimpse of his follower's frightening appearance was enough to clear his mind and convince him the Mafia was after him. Blue_arrow took off running. Sweat dripped off his forehead and fear spurred him to achieve near-Olympian speed as he sprinted for his life. He flew past several blocks in a few minutes, but always he could hear his attacker plodding relentlessly after him. Finally, the exhausted blue_arrow slumped against a lamppost, so worn out by his headlong dash that he couldn't move another step. All he could do was watch with mounting dread as his entirely unperturbed attacker caught up to blue_arrow and strangled him to death. 2. Forum posts First mention of him as a suspect - our Mayor: On January 20 2010 12:58 meeple wrote: I think those types of classifications are too vague... Hyperbola is a math term, so that could be construed as cold and calculating as well. Guess who wrote the very next post? Why, the ever-present DrH of course! This is what he tells us: On January 20 2010 13:00 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Maybe. The apple reference is what stood out to me the most, so I think I just really want to connect that to something. Although it definitely is, something. The StimiLant/Tea connection seems the most solid to me though. Right, my mistake there are other stronger clues. Lets move it along then, since we next have Hyperbola's only "real" attempt to solev the mystery. Check out the high powered arguments he finds, many days into the game: On January 21 2010 03:34 Hyperbola wrote: Hello everybody, how's it going. As there are no real viable suspects to lynch yet I have decided to compile some clues I was thinking about: 1. “The killer blocked Kennigit's blade with an apple that had had fallen out of the refrigerator and swiftly proceeded to shove the remains of the apple down Kennigit's throat before throwing him out the window.” This clue in particular caught my eye. Something of importance along the lines of an apple, forbidden fruit maybe? Anyways... possible suspects: skronch - Really no other reason than his name. As he does not have any text or images in his profile, his name is the only thing that could be used as a clue. And “skronch” sounds like the sound one makes when eating the apple. The_Master – A little weak but blocking a knife attack with a fruit and then killing the assailant with it takes a lot of skill. Besides his name, his quote is: “[CPL]Master on team Prodigies!” 2. “Two newcomers strode inside.” This one I actually have a firm belief on. Abenson – His profile text. + Show Spoiler + Hello! I'm Abenson, an E-/D-/D zerg player who just started playing Starcraft December 2009... I'm actually a noob, so please bear with me if I ask stupid questions or seems inexperienced :D Note: Iccup ID: xNoobZerg This seems to suggest that he is very new at the game, a newcomer. 3. “With that, he launched himself forward at the three town leaders, lifting his fists and taunting them with strange barbaric noises.” citi.zen – I don't mean to infringe on anyone's campaign but his quote: Aut viam inveniam, aut faciam. Sounds like someone babbling something nonsensical. I wasn't able to find a translation so correct me if I'm wrong. StimiLant – Again, not much to work with in his profile. Sounds like the person screaming was using stimulants? 4. “The second Mafia member glared at Qatol in disgust and contempt. "Vile, dirty scum," he muttered, shuddering.” meeple – This one is a bit of long shot + Show Spoiler + A marine approached a hooker Who had once been quite the looker (Well before a thousand took her), "Carnal bride, On the planet of Tarsonis, Whores are known to earn a bonus If they cast protection's onus Far aside." That pecuniary offer From the horny private's coffer Held appeal. She let him boff her Very long. In their frenzied copulation, She released an infestation On his dong. Once their sex was interrupted With his manmeat thus corrupted, Sunken colonies erupted At its base. The marine observed his error With a look of pallid terror On his face. Having waived his sole protection, He was led by his erection By the Swarm, in the direction Of his watch. Twenty soldiers of his nation Perished in precise formation To the massive conflagration From his crotch. Should you seek a lady's graces, Plasma-shield your nether places, Sheath your psi blades, cast a stasis On your probe. If you can't resist temptation, Just resort to masturbation. Don't disrobe. The poem in the profile briefly focuses on an old prostitute that infested the marine's cock. That's all I got. I think we should really come to a decision soon though. Poor guy can't even find a translation of my profile quote! I am sure he tried to google it, read previous posts trying to find anything about it and so on, he must have tried to click that damn wikipedia page explaining the quote. Unfortunately he came up with NOTHING, so naturally the whole thing sounds nonsensical and barbaric. Good solid find, worth posting together with the other gems! Now, at the time, I read his big post and scratched my head. Guess who tried to 'splain it to me: On January 21 2010 04:00 DoctorHelvetica wrote: lol. well, the mayor will go with whoever fits best. I'd say that is hobbes at this point, maybe stimilant. I think he's trying to add new speculation rather than pontificate on old ones. We've already said about everything there is to say about hobbes/ghote/etc. at this point, so it's good that he is avoiding redundancy. Thanks DrH, that explanation really helped. Nail Hyperbola, that is. If this is not enough read his posts after page 74... see how he reacts. Byebye Hyperbola, you are getting 2x lynched with keit, right after Mystlord is getting vigilante hit. | ||
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And as I said, if you want, read everything after page 74 of the forum. Pay attention to their reaction. If you cannot figure it out I cannot help you. | ||
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On January 29 2010 02:32 Jugan wrote: So let me get this straight. You're basing your accusation of hyperbola on a short post that DrH made in attempt to look like he was analyzing and contributing? There are a multitude of better candidates at the moment than Keit and Hyperbola. You're just aggressively pointing fingers because you think you've got everything figured out, when in reality you're not looking at things objectively. You're just seeing what you want to see. Read/comp problems much? Hyperbola states he cannot find a translation of my sig quote, and thus it sounds barbaric and nonsensical (try googling it for yourself). And he is always defended by DrH. And he defends him back. And there is a clue link. Sorry to pick on you... I guess there just isn't anyone else left to argue with. | ||
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He just threw together that post to try to blend in. Look at the other people he lists: skronch - (dead now and not mafia) The_Master - he sees a connection between “[CPL]Master on team Prodigies!” and killing someone with an apple. Solid, right? Abenson - dead / blue myself - (covered above - he can't find stranslation) Stimilant - half decent at the time, but nothing since fits + DrH pretty much exhorated him in my eyes meeple – because "The poem in the profile briefly focuses on an old prostitute that infested the marine's cock." Err?!?? This is not a person ernestly trying to interpret the clues. This is a person pretending to do so to look half-active and making sure not to incriminate other mafia. If you cannot see this I cannot help you. In fact, I don't think anyone can. | ||
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At least now I'm not alone - you're ignorant too! How long to "donkey" status? | ||
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I am out the rest of the day. For posterity: hit mystlord; lynch keit and hyperbola. | ||
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On January 29 2010 06:04 Qatol wrote: All night actions go through. So even if a vigilante kills a mafia, the mafia get 3 kills tonight. Similarly, if the mafia kill the vigilante, the vigilante still gets to use his hit, if he is using it tonight. The other ways (applying hits either town first, mafia first, or according to when they are sent in) are unfair to one side, or unfair to players in certain time zones. What does this mean for clues: if a mafia is killed by a vigilante, does that mafia leave behind clues that cycle? | ||
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On January 29 2010 10:04 Jugan wrote: Maybe? He hasn't said anything correct. Just look at his argument. It makes NO RATIONAL SENSE. Yeah, Mystlord wasn't even a little bit guilty. Damn sheep. And Donkey. And other farm animals. | ||
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On January 29 2010 11:08 CynanMachae wrote: Was fun, gl town Thanks man, well played. | ||
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On January 29 2010 07:45 Mystlord wrote: + Show Spoiler + First off, @citi.zen: Finish up your analysis on the players you called out as "mafia". I'm still interested. On January 29 2010 00:03 citi.zen wrote: Ok, let me answer this with respect to you. 1. Strong clue link - look at the freaking picture: 2. Shady posting behavior from the start, which got a LOT worse in the past 2 days. After my post on page 74 you should have read the writing on the wall and given up on DrH. The same goes for your mafia team-mates - sadly you guys just fell apart. After the votes/evidence started to pile in, you STILL argued. You bring up repeatedly the supposed "solution" of lynching keit first to "prove" DrH is not red. Even freaking DrH had given up at that point man - he stopped posting because he knew it was over! Even after that, you continue to claim we should not double-lynch, using nonsensical arguments and pointing fingers at the same players DrH obsessively attacked for many days now. Give me a break - this is not even subtle. I don't have the patience to copy/paste - anyone interested read from page 74 onwards. You are getting vigilante hit tonight. GG man, I feel there wasn't anything you could do, the entire team strategy lost you the game. 1. Did you not read my post breaking down Ng5's "image search"? Furthermore, the image that comes up does not have "Mystlord" in the title. The one that comes up is further down, and it refers to the wand that Ng5 posted later, which I also argued against with no further arguments from either you or Ng5. Don't ignore posts. 2. I never argued against a double lynch. Where are you getting this one from? As for arguing for a keit lynch, ever notice how it was just me? Who are "you guys"? And honestly, neither you nor Hobbes ever argued against my point of why keit would initiate the charges against DH so early in the game, when there was no suspicion pointing towards DH? And why keit would literally shoot the mafia in the foot with that move, considering that, if I was mafia, I would rush up with a, so you say, fail argument to defend DH? By the way, this: Since our mafia guys continue to be silent (I guess at this point they have said enough/nothing left to argue), Is just silly. Some of those who you accused have lives and are perhaps living on the West Coast where we're actually at school during your posts. And while Jugan did go overboard, I would say that he did raise some valid points. Maybe not the douche part, but this: On January 29 2010 02:46 Jugan wrote: Some one can't find a translation for a quote in a foreign language and that's supposed to mean something? Clues aren't based on posts genius. And you claim DrH is defending Hyperbola when he talks about the apple and implicates Keit when he doesn't even MENTION hyperbola? I feel, has some merit. Nice try at the last minute man, was worth the try! GG. | ||
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Now you know for sure I am not the godfather, since that was our friend Mystlord. | ||
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On January 29 2010 11:13 ohN wrote: Well since citi.zen was right with the 3 mafia who are now dead, I say we lynch keit and Hyperbola. Yes, we lynch them next. Then mafia is down to 1KP and we have some time to grind it out. The "red shortlist" is not that long, medics are more effective now... blah blah. Good night and well played town. | ||
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CynanMachae was already in bed at this point, having returned home much earlier. However, he was having a hard time falling asleep due to the shouts and clamor of the rest of the townspeople rejoicing in the streets. He stared at his alarm clock and waited with mounting impatience as people gradually stopped shouting outside his house but still kept banging and thumping. Finally, he couldn't take it anymore. He stomped down to his front door and threw it open, yelling, "Go home, you troublemakers!" Instead of the crowd of people he'd expected, however, he saw only a single man on his front lawn, holding a hammer. CynanMachae peered around in puzzlement but didn't notice anything that looked like it had been beaten in. Nevertheless, he glared at the man and took a step outside, preparing to chastise him for making all that noise and keeping him awake. To his surprise, the front step crumbled under his foot and he tumbled forward, his forehead landing squarely on a sharp rock that had been placed there all too conveniently on the ground. As CynanMachae died, he heard the man snicker to himself before he turned and left. This suggests smarts, planning, anticipation to me. Something like this: The board is a mirror of the mind of the players as the moments pass. When a master studies the record of a game he can tell at what point greed overtook the pupil, when he became tired, when he fell into stupidity, and when the maid came by with tea. Weaker than I would like, but we should be getting more clues by the time we get to him. In the meantime, keit is still my no.1 for lynching. I do think treadmaster is very suspect, but no more so than Hyperbola. The plodding could fit both, but the frightening appearance and the strangling point to Hyperbola in my mind. Both have shady posting histories, much more so than Nikoner. | ||
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We are in no hurry with the last two killers, so I am open to other suggestions, but a GO player is thus far the best fit in my view. | ||
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On January 30 2010 03:56 meeple wrote: Yeah I just saw that they double lynched a green and a blue. I wonder if the Mafia will win that game... its pretty close. 15-6 I think its 11 vs 6 actually - only 17 players left. All medics are dead, so mafia should keep killing 3/night. Seems over, if the town somehow pulled it off it would be an epic comeback. | ||
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Phrujbaz in pole-position for the first one Jugan, derfboy... or a maybe for Nikoner Should we use the vigilante on Phrujbaz and lynch jugan and derfboy next day? | ||
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GG all. DoctorH, why did you let me live night 2? I had no idea I was protected by the medics - do you know? | ||
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Once he went down the other mafia did come out too strong, but really much of the damage was done. It would have been more work, but I mean... DrH wrote over 250 posts, saying things like the cookie monster did not fit the clues because it reminded him of a "retarded bear" :-) | ||
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On February 01 2010 11:44 DoctorHelvetica wrote: The mafia assumed medics would be protecting you. Our original kill list for day 1 was Bill Murray/you/zona but, I figured if medics are protecting anyone, it's gonna be citi.zen, let's kill abenson to throw people off and then we can save citi.zen until the medics are gone or we can hit him twice in the same night. I see. I had no idea, but it turns out I WAS protected by both medics that night anyway. | ||
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The "a DT roleclaimed to me" public message did not matter to me much. I knew directly from Zona of your conversation with him. The he got killed and was green - so I knew it was not edited by him, it was real. Message below spoiler... + Show Spoiler + DrH has mentioned to me that the detective who claimed to him said you were town. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Yes. Why did you ask? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: (I'm interpreting your answer to mean - yes, there are others who are asking you the same question.) Well, yes or no, has anyone contacted you claiming to be a detective? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: yes, there are others. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: There's more people asking you the same question? I'll tell you why I'm asking if you tell me yes or no. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I wonder why everyone is asking me that tonight... ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Has anyone (don't tell me who) revealed themselves to you claiming to be a detective? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: lol, his posts in the chess thread sometimes amused me in the past. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I'm now positive Bill is just a silly player. He posts inappropriately elsewhere on the site, too - like posting his own fantasy proleague team in other people's blogs. Likely town, as mafia teammates would probably tell him to shut up. Still doesn't make him an asset to the town, though. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: briefly. don't know what to think now. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Also - have you been in contact with DrH? That is when my trust in DrH slipped - not so much Bill's death. After all, this is what Bill had written to me: ----------------------------------------- Original Message: i suppose. i am an outgoing person, and if that's why i lose, that's fine. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Can't hurt for you to be a bit more careful with your pm's though. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: i just rolechecked you and you came up as a townie.... so unless you're the godfather, we should stick together Bill's after-death post did hurt, agreed, and it was a real shame. However, by then I was very suspicious of DrH already because of Zona's message/death. Meeple and flame also wanted his head. I had a chat with them on messenger + received the clue check... and it all ended up in that long anti DrH post. | ||
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On January 29 2010 13:07 [NyC]HoBbes wrote: all I know is finally the clues dont suggest me... considering the last few nights I was expecting tonight to be "his orange, stripy attacker left a great deal of fur and tuna fish behind..." | ||
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Mystlord's reaction to the "lynch DrH" post solidified my suspicions, but at that point he awas already very next on the list. | ||
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On January 24 2010 10:38 Phrujbaz wrote: Jugan asked me in a pm to post what I think of recent events. First, I'm very sad that we lost a detective early on, through what I think stupid play. What's done is done, but there is still a lesson to be learned. Blues should hide as much from the Mafia as the Mafia is hiding from the town. Don't do anything suspicious. Be careful who you communicate with in private. Make sure the public knows who you are talking to if something goes wrong. Second, as for double lynch, there is a decent chance that a new set of clues will allow us to nail at least one Mafia. However, double lynches are usually used when you have solid clues on multiple people. I don't think we have enough to go on to successfully lynch two Mafia. At this point, I think we're more likely to lynch two innocents than two Mafia. I would use double lynch later. Finally, I think some of you have a too narrow focus. Early clues are always really vague and very loosely connected to the Mafia. They could refer to anyone. Just one example: First result for "magicbullet" on google is the "magic bullet blender," which is kitchen equipment. What role do the refrigerator and the food references play in the first kill on day 1? Why are they necessary for the story? Another example, citi.zen's quote is "Aut inveniam viam aut faciam." It's Latin and means "I shall either find a way or make one." How would you describe this sentiment? Perseverance. How would you describe the character in the first kill on day two? Now I don't mean to say magicbullet and citi.zen are Mafia. I just think it's important to keep an open mind and not become too obsessed with any one reference at this point. Like "I just can't ignore how clue X seems to fit perfectly to person Y." There's a good chance the clue has to be interpreted in a totally different way from what you're thinking. That was a very good post for a mafia I thought. Vague, but also somewhat reasonable (unlike others). What I am curious is: what was your conversation with Jugan about? Did you have him convinced you were innocent? | ||
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Great job Incognito! | ||
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On January 28 2010 14:35 citi.zen wrote: Nikoner, Phrujbaz, keit, Hyperbola and Mystlord, please stand up. GG guys. On January 28 2010 15:27 Jugan wrote: I believe you are wrong on all counts. + Show Spoiler + On January 29 2010 02:46 Jugan wrote: Lol are you fucking serious? Some one can't find a translation for a quote in a foreign language and that's supposed to mean something? Clues aren't based on posts genius. And you claim DrH is defending Hyperbola when he talks about the apple and implicates Keit when he doesn't even MENTION hyperbola? I've looked at your "evidence" and you've just made a story and found posts and tried to make those posts fit into your story. Mystlord's post seems geniune - I can understand where he came from, he even explained his reasoning and how there may have been a hole in it. Does this mean he's innocent? Not necessarily, but the posts you are referring to uses semi-rational reasoning, even if it is slightly flawed. The point is: you're wrong, and stop calling people out on the thread. On January 29 2010 03:21 Jugan wrote: Yeah except that 1) citizen is fucking nuts and won't even listen at all. 2) If he is "inactive"... there are better targets. If he is "laying low"... there are better targets. [insert bad excuse to lynch hyperbola here]... there are better targets. On January 29 2010 03:07 Jugan wrote: You mean like how you're pointing fingers based on ridiculous assumptions and posts that you force to fit your story? Your evidence is shabby at best, and you're trying to convict someone because they couldn't find a translation to your quote AND you're being a douche about it. Yeah way to be ignorant man. I hope we lynch everyone that you pointed fingers at, and they turn up blue. On January 29 2010 03:28 Jugan wrote: i hope you really are mafia and kill citizen for being a donkey On February 01 2010 16:07 Jugan wrote: Your biggest mistake was leaving me alive. [...] I made 5 out of 7 correct guesses on the mafia. Well played | ||
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With a few quick punches and kicks, Abenson was left mangled before his attacker left the lynch site as quietly as he had come. That murder drove me nuts... there was so little there in terms of clues! | ||
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On January 29 2010 13:07 [NyC]HoBbes wrote: Sorry. Could not resist.all I know is finally the clues dont suggest me... considering the last few nights I was expecting tonight to be "his orange, stripy attacker left a great deal of fur and tuna fish behind..." | ||
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On February 05 2010 02:12 Qatol wrote: The problem with this policy is that you are essentially punishing the whole mafia for a few members not having a profile. And because we want the clues to be consistent, the mafia have no way of knowing that it is a problem until the game has already started (and it is thus too late to change anything) because the mafia don't know who their teammates are until the game starts. Basically, I think we need to start implementing a rule that you don't make it onto the signups list unless you have a useful profile. I specify "useful" because in BC's first game, one of the cluesets was fighting. The problem was there were like 3-4 players whose sig said "XYZ Fighting!" or "XYZ Hwaiting!" and they otherwise had an empty profile. Obviously, we need to require more than that in the future if we want to continue to play games with clues. Interesting suggestion. Perhaps a profile picture/sig quote could be made mandatory. | ||
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Edit: ah, nice. He lived through day 1, there is hope! | ||
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Incognito's game XVI is dead, long live Incognito's game XVIII. + Show Spoiler + What happened to game XVII?? | ||
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