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On May 01 2013 18:11 Blyf wrote:In my experience Darius is terrible i ARAM. He is a lane bully, reliant on getting an early advantage from zoning/kills, but in ARAM he gets no opportunity to oppress a lane opponent and then in team fights he sucks due to the short range and lack of mobility. Pantheon falls into the same category. Poppy on the other hand is not punished from her weak laning phase in ARAM, so there is no way the other team can stop her from reaching "unstoppable" status in the mid/late game. I cannot recall playing with a Poppy in ARAM before though, so this one is just speculation  I would think that the same applies for Irelia.
Darius still has his pull that makes him semi useful in itself.
And he can build fulltank and still deal ridic damamge.
He's okay. Nothing special, but okay.
Irelia, I'm not a fan of in ARAM, but Poppy can indeed be pretty good, mostly because it doesn't really matter if you die a couple times early, lol. And her passive #1 bait world.
On May 01 2013 18:35 sob3k wrote:
How is shaco top tier at all? I can camp bushes and get a nice KD but I'm not actually contributing much in teamfights and have minimal poke....AP or AD, what am I supposed to build?
I always build AP. That solves the lack of poke somewhat.
I'd wager the top tierness comes from his strong brush control. I like playing Shaco, but his teamfighting is a bit iffy indeed. But once you get deathcap + dfg + lichbane you should be able to oneshot a dude every fight, and since you can go in deep while stealthed, you'll be able to get to the squishy carry np. Or at least one of them. usually there are more, lol.
And his boxes are decent for engagement defense, if placed with proper foresight.
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So....i have actually watched and played in aram tournaments (i know its sad ). I have to disagree with Your "worthless" list.
Tiers:
Anivia: Anivia
Semi-Anivia:voli,garen,karma,thresh, mundo, blitz and natulius (sometimes)
Diamond:any taugh guy with lots of hp/regen strong intation and strong zoning ap (like cassio)
Olaf and skarner are actually pretty decent.
Udyr sucks true.
Generally speaking u want 3-4 taugh guys and at least one strong dmg dealer. Ap/ad doesnt matter.
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Veigar is one of the top ARAM champs imo, he belongs in nidalee tier
I'd put malphite in top tier as well
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Forgot the master yi tier:master yi.
Oh someone is low?I'll take that penta thank you very much.
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Master Yi, Veigar, Zac and Anivia all deserve to be in Neoillusions tier imo. Poppy deserves a higher tier than Bronze and I'm not sure I'd put Teemo higher than Platinum.
Edit: Fiddlesticks in Neo tier as well imo - just remember the flash.
Edit2: Imo Miss Fortune is the 2nd best ADC after Varus and I wouldn't put her in gold (Twitch might be as strong).
I realize it's impossible to satisfy everyone with a tier list but these were just the champions that stood out to me.
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I actually agree with your tier-list more or less. I'm just curious as to how Jax and Poppy (irelia aswell to some extent) can be considered Bronze, when a champion like Garen can be silver? Surely Jax and Poppy will always have that kill-potential against anyone when they get items.
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France45622 Posts
Edit: also, rolled Evelynn twice. How do you do with her? ;_; She has fucking 500 range and she can't even burst, she won't do shit at all if the enemy has any kind of ranged champ, not even talking about poke, and if you don't have heavy follow-up/initiation you won't do anything either because you won't have the long fights needed for your damage to shine.
Poppy is super strong because you're almost always guaranteed a wall-stun due to the size of the map, there'll always be some useless dude to ult while you wreck the rest, and with some regen her passive is pretty good against poke. Plus she'll get farmed no matter what.
Zac is very underwhelming at the beginning (I was wondering if he was just trash, but remembering how broken he is on SR I just waited it out till 6 and bulwark) but once you're tanky enough not to explode immediatly, your ability to initiate from 1550 range with your absurdly good sustain once you're "in the place" with a bit of CDR makes you extremely good. Basically treat it as a Malphite ult that a bit slower but will force any enemy to run away if they see you channel, because if they don't you'll catch anyone of their team even when standing behind yours. And then his inherent broken-ness of having so much damage and sustain while building absolutely nothing for it will let you wreck havoc in their formations.
Olaf has me... perplexed. I guess I should just treat him like a way worse Jax or Irelia, where I don't do anything till 6 (because if I poke with Q and they engage somebody else, which happens pretty often, I won't be able to even get an assist or reach the fight easily), and hope to get some cs from our waveclear dudes. Then pile on CDR and tankiness and a Shurelya, or something like that. Ghost should be mandatory I suppose, played without it.
I'm trying to build an early Eleisa's miracle when the mp5 helps, too, since it'll get absorbed very fast and I'll get to use the summoner heal several times in a game. Not sure if worth it, I'm just experimenting.
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On May 01 2013 20:00 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2013 18:11 Blyf wrote:In my experience Darius is terrible i ARAM. He is a lane bully, reliant on getting an early advantage from zoning/kills, but in ARAM he gets no opportunity to oppress a lane opponent and then in team fights he sucks due to the short range and lack of mobility. Pantheon falls into the same category. Poppy on the other hand is not punished from her weak laning phase in ARAM, so there is no way the other team can stop her from reaching "unstoppable" status in the mid/late game. I cannot recall playing with a Poppy in ARAM before though, so this one is just speculation I would think that the same applies for Irelia. Darius still has his pull that makes him semi useful in itself. And he can build fulltank and still deal ridic damamge. He's okay. Nothing special, but okay. Irelia, I'm not a fan of in ARAM, but Poppy can indeed be pretty good, mostly because it doesn't really matter if you die a couple times early, lol. And her passive #1 bait world. Show nested quote +On May 01 2013 18:35 sob3k wrote:
How is shaco top tier at all? I can camp bushes and get a nice KD but I'm not actually contributing much in teamfights and have minimal poke....AP or AD, what am I supposed to build? I always build AP. That solves the lack of poke somewhat. I'd wager the top tierness comes from his strong brush control. I like playing Shaco, but his teamfighting is a bit iffy indeed. But once you get deathcap + dfg + lichbane you should be able to oneshot a dude every fight, and since you can go in deep while stealthed, you'll be able to get to the squishy carry np. Or at least one of them. usually there are more, lol. And his boxes are decent for engagement defense, if placed with proper foresight.
My way of dealing with Irelia in ARAM (I'm fine with rolling her really) is getting a lot of CDR/tank (Locket+Zeke's is a personal favorite) and just jam the R key as poke every time it's off cooldown. Requires a lot of patience, but enough that once I get out of the early game and there's more space to hard engage without getting kited into a turret 2 seconds later, it's not too bad.
The new guardian horn item is SO GOOD at making melees more bearable, and it's especially strong if a big fight breaks out at the very beginning of the game.
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Jesus Monte wtf. How the hell do you have so many game played??
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On May 01 2013 23:17 sylverfyre wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2013 20:00 Dandel Ion wrote:On May 01 2013 18:11 Blyf wrote:In my experience Darius is terrible i ARAM. He is a lane bully, reliant on getting an early advantage from zoning/kills, but in ARAM he gets no opportunity to oppress a lane opponent and then in team fights he sucks due to the short range and lack of mobility. Pantheon falls into the same category. Poppy on the other hand is not punished from her weak laning phase in ARAM, so there is no way the other team can stop her from reaching "unstoppable" status in the mid/late game. I cannot recall playing with a Poppy in ARAM before though, so this one is just speculation I would think that the same applies for Irelia. Darius still has his pull that makes him semi useful in itself. And he can build fulltank and still deal ridic damamge. He's okay. Nothing special, but okay. Irelia, I'm not a fan of in ARAM, but Poppy can indeed be pretty good, mostly because it doesn't really matter if you die a couple times early, lol. And her passive #1 bait world. On May 01 2013 18:35 sob3k wrote:
How is shaco top tier at all? I can camp bushes and get a nice KD but I'm not actually contributing much in teamfights and have minimal poke....AP or AD, what am I supposed to build? I always build AP. That solves the lack of poke somewhat. I'd wager the top tierness comes from his strong brush control. I like playing Shaco, but his teamfighting is a bit iffy indeed. But once you get deathcap + dfg + lichbane you should be able to oneshot a dude every fight, and since you can go in deep while stealthed, you'll be able to get to the squishy carry np. Or at least one of them. usually there are more, lol. And his boxes are decent for engagement defense, if placed with proper foresight. My way of dealing with Irelia in ARAM (I'm fine with rolling her really) is getting a lot of CDR/tank (Locket+Zeke's is a personal favorite) and just jam the R key as poke every time it's off cooldown. Requires a lot of patience, but enough that once I get out of the early game and there's more space to hard engage without getting kited into a turret 2 seconds later, it's not too bad. The new guardian horn item is SO GOOD at making melees more bearable, and it's especially strong if a big fight breaks out at the very beginning of the game.
Might as well go AP irelia.
I did that once and it was funny/useless.
Mostly useless. But also funny.
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Never had a fun game so far after 5 games, always a stomp whether I lost or won :/
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That's obviously going to happen when it starts a mode with a new MMR.
Same happened at the start of Dominion.
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Kha'Zix silver?
Cannot help but disagree. Wonderful poke, numerous reset situations. Have carried hard every single time got him.
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The fact sona isn't on Neoillusion tier already makes this guide bad.
Sona by far one of the best in Aram.
Also; Nidalee on neoilllusion tier, but not jayce?
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On May 01 2013 18:35 sob3k wrote:
How is shaco top tier at all? I can camp bushes and get a nice KD but I'm not actually contributing much in teamfights and have minimal poke....AP or AD, what am I supposed to build?
I build Athene's -> DFG -> Lich Bane -> Void Staff on Shaco. Athene's + Codex gives you the CDR you need to constantly put down boxes. DFG + Lich Bane gives you the assassination potential you need to eliminate a squishy opponent.
Also, don't underestimate the damage your clone does (300-600 + 100% AP). I typically send him into the nearest clump of brawling opponents while I chase down someone else.
On May 01 2013 23:27 WaveofShadow wrote:
Jesus Monte wtf. How the hell do you have so many game played??
PBE, although I'm 9-4 currently in the new queue (today's losses brought to you by Skarner, Irelia, and a friend who neglected to mention he had no idea how to play Rengar).
On May 01 2013 22:54 Alaric wrote:
Edit: also, rolled Evelynn twice. How do you do with her? ;_; She has fucking 500 range and she can't even burst, she won't do shit at all if the enemy has any kind of ranged champ, not even talking about poke, and if you don't have heavy follow-up/initiation you won't do anything either because you won't have the long fights needed for your damage to shine.
Rush DFG, Gunblade, Lich Bane. This is the not-so-secret assassination AP build. You just hang around the edges, and rush in when a fight happens. Always ult clumps of enemies for the shield (it's rarely worth it to ult just your kill target unless they're near full health and you don't need the shield).
Regarding the tier list, I spent 5 minutes on it. I figured people would yell at me no matter how much time I spent so I took the easy way out and I'll just move people around if I think people's complaints are valid.
So Jax, Poppy and Kha'zix just moved up. I'm not moving Veigar or Malphite up because they're good, but aren't universally effective the way Nidalee is. Master Yi stopped being Neo tier when they nerfed his resets, it's not too hard to either control him or have a setup where he's just not going to have the opportunities to get resets. Anivia isn't Neo Tier because her early game isn't anything special. Zac is strong in general, but it takes a bit for his tankiness and sustain to really kick in so he's platinum and nothing more. A well played Teemo doesn't care about Hextech Sweeper and will just dominate everything (I've had multiple games were opponents gloated in all-chat that they'd rush a Sweeper and make me useless, nope). Fiddlesticks isn't Neo tier because it's really easy to walk into team compositions where getting a good ult off is going to be difficult. Miss Fortune simply isn't as good as Ashe, Tristana, and Twitch; her poke is okay, but not great, and her damage falls off hard later on. Sona isn't Neo tier because, good as she is, she can't really compare with Alistar.
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United States37500 Posts
TIL I have my own tier.
<3 Monte
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On May 01 2013 09:43 NeoIllusions wrote:
wtf, how do you have 80+ games of ARAMs already?
You are beast.
PBE?
Either that or Monte just marathon ARAM since the patch and also did some hyperbolic time chamber training
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I'd like bring up something that I think alot of people have overlooked: Poros
Yes, the cute little things you can feed snacks to if you have the biscuit mastery. They actually have a very significant gameplay impact, as the two critters at the start will run away from you and give away your position- even if the the brush obscures you. If you have a poro biscuit, they will instead chase you until given the biscuit.
The importance of this is that the two poros start here:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/x2TOXfG.jpg)
If you go any farther into the brush then about where twitch is in that image, the poro will actually leave the brush, letting the enemy team know you've planned to surprise them. If you have a poro biscuit, (and alot of coordination with your team) you can mitigate this, as the biscuit holder can safely enter either brush and get the critters to follow them. The problem with this is that the poro responds to the nearest champion in its 'sight', so if you don't have the biscuit holder going first, and or a poro falls behind you and sees another champion they could still run out of the brush and give you away. The other thing you could possibly do (which I've only tested a little) is to use a champion with a natural teleport or jump to get on the other side of the poros, and 'push' them back to your side of the map.
If your team rushes the brush, and doesn't do anything at all to mitigate the information that poros will give the enemy this will happen: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/8QZAtaB.jpg)
TLDR:
Critters give away your position, feed them biscuits until they explode.
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United States37500 Posts
lololol, this thread is awsum. Poros actually do something, haha.
Here I thought they were just to add a cute touch to Howling Abyss.
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United States23745 Posts
On May 02 2013 03:47 Cwedhrin wrote:I'd like bring up something that I think alot of people have overlooked: Poros Yes, the cute little things you can feed snacks to if you have the biscuit mastery. They actually have a very significant gameplay impact, as the two critters at the start will run away from you and give away your position- even if the the brush obscures you. If you have a poro biscuit, they will instead chase you until given the biscuit. The importance of this is that the two poros start here: + Show Spoiler +If you go any farther into the brush then about where twitch is in that image, the poro will actually leave the brush, letting the enemy team know you've planned to surprise them. If you have a poro biscuit, (and alot of coordination with your team) you can mitigate this, as the biscuit holder can safely enter either brush and get the critters to follow them. The problem with this is that the poro responds to the nearest champion in its 'sight', so if you don't have the biscuit holder going first, and or a poro falls behind you and sees another champion they could still run out of the brush and give you away. The other thing you could possibly do (which I've only tested a little) is to use a champion with a natural teleport or jump to get on the other side of the poros, and 'push' them back to your side of the map. If your team rushes the brush, and doesn't do anything at all to mitigate the information that poros will give the enemy this will happen: + Show Spoiler +TLDR: Critters give away your position, feed them biscuits until they explode.
Wow, that information is incredibly useful. So in like a month from now we can probably expect this to be the top post on Reddit?
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EPT
