On December 23 2011 08:12 Vaporized wrote:
what would be better then?

you can farm up the tear so fast manamune provides a ton of ad + what might as well be unlimited mana. add the wits end and you are beastmode suddenly 20-25 minutes into the game.

I'd rather just get an early sheen and glacial shroud after my gp5's&boots. Just those 2 items solve pretty much all mana problems, I rarely if ever have to b because of mana after getting that. Sheen's proc is pretty much up every 2-3 auto's, and glacial gives much needed cdr. Glacial also let's you dive towers with relative safety. I don't know the numbers, but I'd imagine that both sheen and glacial are more cost effective than manamune dps-wise. I build tanky skarner with the only dps item being a late trinity and sometimes wit's end though, so suit yourself.

chalice

United States1945 Posts

December 26 2011 02:56 GMT

#183

i've been rushing wit's end on skarner, would it make sense to pick up sheen after recurve bow instead of finishing wit's end first?

edit: went back and read the whole thread, had no idea people built rageblade on skarner, first game with it seemed to hit a nice damage power level much, much earlier than triforce and with the gold for defense left over not seeing any real faults in it

TiBe

Mexico200 Posts

December 28 2011 14:59 GMT

#184

I have tried many builds but the best at least for me, if im tanking is:

Philo -> Boots -> HoG -> mercs or tabi ->rushing to trinity (starting with sheen) -> shurelia's reveire -> raduins -> force of nature and finally warmogs or another health item

Have never had mana problems.
If I have a good tank on the team the best is changing nature and warmogs for rageblade and wit's end

Shiv.

3534 Posts

December 30 2011 16:53 GMT

#185

Okay, he's my most played champ in ranked now and I think I got a good grip on how to build him for my own playstyle.

Double AP: Philo > Boots > HoG > Wit's End > Mercs > Shurelya's > FoN > Triforce. Maybe throw in a Sheen after your Negatron.

Bruiser top: Philo > Boots > HoG > Sheen > Tabi > Shurelya's > FH > Triforce / Randuins.

Might do some adjustments here and there, but so far, that's what I like. Still struggling with runes, though :/ I'm currently running 7 ArP, 2 AS Reds, Armor Yellow, MR/lvl blue, 2 AS Quint, 1 ArP quint. Still wondering if the ArP is actually worth it or I'd be better off using MS Quints and 9 AS reds.

Edit: anyone else feeling like Rageblade is EXTREMELY good on him in longer midgame fights, but you just don't have the time to build it?

Haasts

New Zealand4445 Posts

December 30 2011 19:56 GMT

#186

On December 31 2011 01:53 Shiv. wrote:
Edit: anyone else feeling like Rageblade is EXTREMELY good on him in longer midgame fights, but you just don't have the time to build it?

I still swear by Rageblade as my only offensive item on Skarner. I find TriForce too expensive coming out of the jungle, and I feel GRB has the edge over Wit's End due to Skarner's vulnerability to poke - I prefer grabbing an early Negatron if needed. I've also gravitated towards getting Kindlegem over HoG for CDr & an earlier Reverie (aside from the ganking advantages a quick Reverie provides during the laning phase, the mp5 jumps from 8 to15, useful when you donate your blues). Skarner does enough damage with just his kit that I find my post Philo/boots options depend on your team/your opponents - my last two or three ranked games w/him have gone something like

Philo > Boots > (Mercs / Rageblade / Kindlegem / Glacial Shroud / Negatron) > Reverie > Frozen Heart

Edit: Rune-wise, I've swapped from (IIRC) 3xArPen quints, 1xArPen red, 8xAS reds, armor yellows and AS blues to MS quints, ArPen reds, armor yellows and MR/lvl blues.

novalight

United States20 Posts

December 30 2011 22:10 GMT

#187

problem with rageblade is that it's baaaaaaaaaaaad until you complete it

deskscaress

United States399 Posts

December 31 2011 04:03 GMT

#188

On December 31 2011 07:10 novalight wrote:
problem with rageblade is that it's baaaaaaaaaaaad until you complete it

i disagree. 1260 might be better spent on a sheen than 860 is on a blasting wand, but the blasting wand isn't BAD. you're still getting extra damage on either spells or autos from the components, and as soon as you complete it, the AS is fking awesome.

Craton

United States17249 Posts

December 31 2011 05:49 GMT

#189

Issue with rageblade is that it's sort of meh overall. You usually only get 1 offensive item like triforce/wits, both of which have attack speed like rageblade, but also defensive things like mr/hp/additional slow/movespeed. AD/AP is rather meh on Skarner.

deskscaress

United States399 Posts

December 31 2011 09:08 GMT

#190

comparing triforce to guinsoo is dumb
it's double the cost of rageblade
wit's is a fair comparison but i think skarner can (a)max the stacks easily enough on rageblade and (b)make use of fully stacked rageblade over the MR from wit's better

chalice

United States1945 Posts

December 31 2011 10:46 GMT

#191

i feel like rageblade + frozen heart/FoN beats triforce + chain vest/negatron all day

i guess it's a testament to the strength of skarner though that you can open wriggles, wit's end, rageblade, or sheen and do great with any of them.

Morphx2

147 Posts

January 03 2012 05:16 GMT

#192

ive been noticing that whoever has skarner usually wins the game

i was jungling today

i went top, killed top, went right to mid, killed mid, then went right to bottom and killed bottom!!

it was freaking amazing, this was pretty early, I believe i was around level 4 at the time.

We were losing before that point

Then i just ganked top and mid and usually we got a kill off of them or sent them recalling. Successfully denied them exp the whole time and we just steamrolled.

skarner is just so strong with his slows and ult it makes him great. Get a kill or 2 early, and it is even more hectic.

mordek

United States12704 Posts

January 04 2012 20:48 GMT

#193

So what situations do you want rageblade vs wits vs triforce first? After philo/boots/hog.

Tyrran

France777 Posts

January 04 2012 21:15 GMT

#194

Nowadays i go wits end+sheen in 90% of the game. The attackspeed makes a HUGE difference, and coupled with sheen you get enough damage. I almost never finish triforce tho because i focus on shurelia+randuins before finishing triforce.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

January 04 2012 21:29 GMT

#195

Played my first game with rageblade as my first/core offensive item instead of my typical wits end. Felt really good as long as I remembered to press Q a few times before a fight broke out.

Shiv.

3534 Posts

January 06 2012 01:00 GMT

#196

Could we discuss the issue of Wit's End vs. Sheen as an early offensive item? I discarded the idea of Rageblade first and foremost because I feel I sacrifice too much just building it (neither Pickaxe nor Blasting Wand are exactly good on their own) and I like the side effects the other two have, mainly being MR (WE) or Mana + the option to build into something (Sheen). I feel like an early WE benefits my jungling speed much more than Sheen does, plus the MR is pretty nice in teamfights and ganks. Sheen just gives me the option to roam around much more, abusing the ridiculously low respawn timers on jungle mobs those days.

I mean, yeah, when their teamcomp is double AP, Wit's is a no-brainer, but I'm really not sure what to get when they have a bruiser top.

The reason I'm not getting both is because I feel like I sacrifice too much survivability. I usually Shurelya-Flash-Ult fools and need to survive their teams initial burst for doing so.

Also, what do you guys think about Aegis on him? Personally, I don't like it all that much because I'd rather have a Shurelya's and a Glacial.

Mogwai

United States13274 Posts

January 06 2012 20:06 GMT

#197

Wit's always. If you are a character that scales off of AS and has no reason to build multiple offensive items (Skarnar with his passive and needing to be in the middle of everything), Wit's End is basically a no brainer if you ask me. if you're getting stupidly fed and need to carry more of the offensive load, go get that triforce, but for the staple offensive item, it should always be wit's end IMO.

Vaporized

United States1471 Posts

January 07 2012 00:00 GMT

#198

is skarner op? i just got counterjungled hard by a WW, i was lvl 6 when their mid akali was lvl 10. i died twice before 6 too. but i got one kill and then another and suddenly i was 12-3 and had triforce and atmogs. and a 2-8 start for our team turned into a 40-25 victory. that moment when you get sheen\mercs\philo is one of skarners strongest imo. the dps combined with the perma slow is crazy.

Nightmare1795

United States222 Posts

January 07 2012 00:13 GMT

#199

I start Regrowth and pot, i do wolves then my blue with a leash, then i usually counter jungle the opponents doubles or wraiths and doubles. Then I go back to my jungle and clear it fully. My build is Philo's, Heart of Gold, Merc Treads, Trinity Force, Frozen Heart, Force of Nature/Wit's End if I'm dying to magic damage, then Gunblade and Rageblade.

I usually get really big just by farming my jungle and having two Gp5's. I don't gank until lvl 6 unless they are very overextended/stupid. I do get early kills sometimes when I catch people in their jungle. Skarner is a great counterjungler cause of how fast he can clear camps and his ability to shield and speed boost away if he gets caught.

In teamfights I just run at their carry and ult him then do my permaslow. He will need to flash or use a blink ability to stay out of your ult range, so he will either die or burn a spell just to leave the fight. Only carry I have a problem getting is Ashe cause of her supreme kiting skills.

IMO he competes with Rammus for being the best jungler right now.

I haven't tried him solotop but I hear he wins most toplane matchups easily if you already have a jungler on your team.

Shiv.

3534 Posts

January 07 2012 01:48 GMT

#200

On January 07 2012 09:00 Vaporized wrote:
i just got counterjungled hard by a WW

how.