EPTIf it depends on the lane opponent, when will you get the Grail?
[Champion] Orianna - Page 8
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DarkwindHK
Hong Kong343 Posts
If it depends on the lane opponent, when will you get the Grail? | ||
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nyxnyxnyx
Indonesia2978 Posts
opposing magic damage jungler opposing double AP lost control of jungle / own blue buff plan to build DFG | ||
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.ImchEEzy
Canada123 Posts
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Bladeorade
United States1898 Posts
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Zabad
United States23 Posts
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upperbound
United States2300 Posts
W I think is better to prioritize lots of roaming, though, even though I think it's slightly worse in lane. | ||
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.ImchEEzy
Canada123 Posts
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Craton
United States17237 Posts
On October 12 2012 19:09 DarkwindHK wrote: For orianna is Grail first a good idea or death cap first better? If it depends on the lane opponent, when will you get the Grail? Grail first is ridiculously strong on Orianna. She has huge mana consumption and it really makes a tremendous difference. The added MR is a nice bonus, since mids are almost always AP. You also want to auto generally and in order to maximize the ball effectiveness, you need to be able to walk in and take a bit of damage. MR/Armor also synergize with shields. DCap is nice, but Orianna is really more about her large utility than just straight up damage. Cup into Cap is really solid. On October 17 2012 14:55 Mystic_Starcraft wrote: can any high elo shed some light on AP vs MS quinte on Orianna. Lately i've been favoring 2 MS quinte, I can dodge and kite much better but my early game dmg is low Matter of preference, really. Orianna can kite extremely easily with her kit, since you can slow or haste (or both) as needed. It's most likely a placebo effect. You could probably have someone swap them without telling you and you would never notice. I don't like to go 2/1 of something. Either do it or don't. On October 15 2012 04:03 upperbound wrote: I like maxing Q first because it's less mana intensive in lane. It's a lot easier to harass your opponent with Q max because you're using 1 skill instead of 2 most of the time . Yes, it's less damage, but it's way easier to keep your ball positioned ideally when you have those 3, 4, or 5 extra W activations worth of mana. W I think is better to prioritize lots of roaming, though, even though I think it's slightly worse in lane. I've had the best results doing a mix of Q and W, generally leveling Q over W. I like to get level 3 Q then 3 W. When W is level 1 there isn't much fear from the laner when the ball is laying about and you're too far to use Q. You get more damage out of W than Q, but at the cost of higher mana. However, W has a much longer CD and leveling Q reduces its CD. A mix of the two lets you hit nice QW combos for good damage, while points in Q let you hit a follow up faster and for more overall damage (QW, chase/kite, QRE ignite). With proper presence of mind, you can time your ult such that it throws them in a way that allows you to then E for more damage (though generally you aim to throw them in whatever way is best for the fight, e.g. further from you if to save yourself from a gank). If you only level W then you have to first land a Q for minimal damage and then land a W (which isn't always possible). If you only level Q then you're really relying on being able to chain back to back Qs (on CD and without missing) to make up for not having W -- this is impractical. Level 3 Q is 120 + .5AP -- Level 3 W is 160 + .7AP Level 5 Q is 180 + .5AP -- Level 1 W is 70 + .7AP | ||
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.ImchEEzy
Canada123 Posts
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h3r1n6
Iceland2039 Posts
On October 19 2012 15:04 Mystic_Starcraft wrote: orainna vs talon mid seems so hard, anyone got tips on that Run armor yellows, max shield and auto him out of lane. | ||
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DarkwindHK
Hong Kong343 Posts
On October 19 2012 15:04 Mystic_Starcraft wrote: orainna vs talon mid seems so hard, anyone got tips on that just switch with your top lane. Usually top lane is a tanky champion which directly counters Talon set of skills. | ||
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On October 15 2012 03:48 Zabad wrote: So I just picked up orianna and was wondering whether to max q or w first. The threads I have read have been saying to max w for easy clearing but then I saw TPA Toyz maxing q first in the finals so im wondering is it something that varies by enemy team comp/lane matchup or what? I prefer to alternate q/w. this is my skill order. q>w>w>q>e>r>w>q>w>q>w etc This way they both scale pretty evenly. | ||
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On October 17 2012 14:55 Mystic_Starcraft wrote: can any high elo shed some light on AP vs MS quinte on Orianna. Lately i've been favoring 2 MS quinte, I can dodge and kite much better but my early game dmg is low I recommend MS quints Mpen marks MR/5 Flat or Per lvl yellows and either AP/LVL or Flat MR blues on Orianna when playing mid lane. MS quints are pretty much essential. They allow you to kite better in lane and give you more overall mobility in the game. Orianna is mainly about positioning and these help on her greatly. I use to run AP quints on her but there are so many times where I wasn't able to secure a kill or escape during engagements. I also recommend putting 4 points into swiftness. With my experience, It seems that movespeed over the 370 range is the sweetspot. | ||
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valaki
Hungary2476 Posts
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On October 19 2012 20:31 valaki wrote: I just bought Ori and I already love her. Is there any way that I can watch the Championship Finals' games from Toyz's POV? Replays or first person VODs or anything? I do believe vods from the tournament are available but i don't think its fpv, its the cast of the event. Orianna is my main if you have any questions about her feel free to send me a pm. | ||
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.ImchEEzy
Canada123 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On October 17 2012 14:55 Mystic_Starcraft wrote: can any high elo shed some light on AP vs MS quinte on Orianna. Lately i've been favoring 2 MS quinte, I can dodge and kite much better but my early game dmg is low I am pretty sure it also depends on the match up. Playing against no-MS Ori as TF and Cassiopeia makes me smile. | ||
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ShamTao
United States419 Posts
On October 19 2012 17:15 ReachTheSky wrote: I prefer to alternate q/w. this is my skill order. q>w>w>q>e>r>w>q>w>q>w etc This way they both scale pretty evenly. So the way I build orianna's abilities overall is r > q > w > e, but my early game skill order is variable. The reason why I think q should be maxed first (as opposed to W as a wave clear) is for two reasons: at higher levels of q, its CD decreases and it is less mana hungry than W. If you're trying to effectively zone an opponent in lane (say a melee mid), Q's low CD and mana cost will allow you to effectively poke repeatedly - the damage is less than a W at equal levels, but your ability to constantly move the ball to and fro makes your opponent less sure of when a QW poke will be coming, and you can wear opponents down in lane as opposed to using a rather mana-hungry nuke repeatedly. Also, I have little trouble farming/wave clearing with Q because of that same lower CD. At early levels by level 5 I want to have three ranks of Q, one W, and one E, but the order is very dependent on the jungler. -Say they have lee sin, who can gank as quickly as level 2. I would go Q-E first, because it gives you much more ball control. If I took Q-W by level 2, I would be tempted to throw my ball out for a QW harass. If a gank comes in, it's harder to get the ball back soon enough to either W you or your opponent for slow. Now, if I feel very safe early game, I'll go Q - E - Q - W, giving me a more effective poke harass. The safest early game combination is Q-E-W, and then onto maxing the other ranks. That way, if a level 3 or 4 gank comes in, you'll be able to recall the ball and W away immediately - this combo alone has allowed me to walk away from constant ganks. ____________ As for a final note, I had first started playing orianna maxing W, but the low CD and decent damage of Q at high ranks proved to be dramatically more effective at zoning my lane opponent. Add a blue buff in there close to the max rank of Q, and your opponent (especially if melee) will have a ball thrown in their direction at every attempt to CS, at virtually no mana cost. Especially with blue, you can continually poke with Q and shield to discourage your opponent's aggression - say you poke a katarina, if you shield immediately her predictable retaliatory Q will do insignificant damage. If you can keep that ball moving at all times, your opponent will have a harder time reading when you will W, and when they can get a free harass. Ori's my favorite champ if you couldn't tell :D Edit: just explained a little thing differently. | ||
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ShamTao
United States419 Posts
On October 20 2012 06:55 Sufficiency wrote: I am pretty sure it also depends on the match up. Playing against no-MS Ori as TF and Cassiopeia makes me smile. I'm not a very high level (1300 solo q), but I think this would depend also on the right combination of masteries and runes - my standard ori uses AP quints but I put 4 points in mobility in the utility tree, since I don't find myself as mana regen-needy. Obviously mana gets low, but after my first buy of 2 dorans rings and an eventual blue I like taking the MS in the masteries in favor of taking AP quints. That's just me though. | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
Are people just still bad at Orianna after all this time or am I missing something and did S3 changes ruin her somehow? I realize that my personal experience is likely just me beating up on bads or getting lucky or maybe my Orianna is just above the level of all my other champions. Been doing boot+3pot or Flask+pots openings depending on lane into Chalice -> Dcap -> Athenes -> Void -> situational. Sometimes I get early chain vest if against AD lane for later Zhonya's. I still think she's pretty damn strong though but maybe I'm just stupid. | ||
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