|
Anyone who's curious I have moderate-high success rate at my elo with Sivir. I'm not very good, but Sivir is one of my best champions, because no one expects a good Sivir player.
Usually go 21/9/0 masteries, taking nimbleness in Defensive.
Armor pen reds
Flat armor yellows (you can use dodge here, but I prefer armor, since it defends against AD spells too)
MR blues, either scaling or Flat, that comes down to preference
AD quints, because Armor pen doesn't help your Q  (( (it totally should be physical damage)
Skills R>Q>W>E
Summoner spells: Flash is a must imo, but the other one is up to personal preference. I like Teleport, but you can use ghost, ignite, or exhaust too. Teleport is amazing for porting into minion waves and dropping a tower after a team fight, or just plain dropping towers and teleing out while being unblockable thanks to E.
Items:
Doran's blade x1
Brown boots
Doran's x2 + wriggles
Merc Treads
Black Cleaver
Stark's
Youmou's
Banshee's Veil
After that it's down to preference, but most games don't last that long.
Focus on last hitting in lane, don't waste your mana on harass unless you know you can hit them at least once with Q. I may take E at level 2 depending on who I'm laning against (if it's an AP carry with an easily shieldable spell? Definitely).
Use bushes to your advantage to pop out and auto attack, and never stand still unless you're in mid attack. After you land a Q double hit, your enemies will not want to trade with you any more (unless they have a death wish) so you can use the threat of it to zone them, maybe even intentionally throwing bad ones to make them over zealous.
People say Q is mana inefficient (probably true, but E is amazing for mana), and that Sivir needs tons of mana/regen to work, but I don't see it, you have spell shield for a reason, you can use it to make your opponents waste mana and win out battles of attrition in lane even when throwing out your Q almost every cooldown. Sort of like how TF can blue card all his mana back, Sivir can steal it away from enemies and this is a great asset in lane.
Don't leave your W on unless you want to push. The only time I have it on is when I'm split pushing, team fighting, farming post laning,or attacking a tower with minions nearby. I dislike using it to harass in lane because it's a huge mana hog.
When your team is defending a 5 man push, unless you're standing in the midst of it, don't fight with them, push another lane. I take wriggle's so I can ward up lanes I'm pushing and you should always have things warded so you don't miss the Xin or Irelia that slipped away from the rest of the team. Also, if you have to fight, remember that your ultimate is AoE and gives everyone on your team a very nice MS boost at the very least (although any other AD carries will be quite happy with the AS).
If your team is intelligent, they will stall until the other team gives up and tries to gank you, or until they send one back and force a 4v4. You need to be aware when you can and can't push, because if you can then you should be, and if you can't then you should be farming somewhere else.
I don't recommend Sivir to a player who complains about people not calling MIAs because you have to be aware of that on your own. I also don't recommend Sivir to a player who isn't on top of their positioning in fights, because being out of position on Sivir means death. You have to walk a fine line between being in range and being in melee range, and it's not necessarily a bad thing to attack the closest target in most situations (Yes, focus the tank if you have to), since Ricochet is not based on the initial damage, it's based on the % of your actual damage. I also don't recommend Sivir if you can't reliably hit with her Q (it's slow, but huge) or block easily blockable spells with E (you should be able to block all spells with cast times, animations, or particles. You can press E when the spell is in the air, or even as it hits you to block it)
She's really bad against champs who can easily catch her, and against champs with hard to predict or spammy spells (Vlad, Ryze, Orianna, etc.). She's amazing against champions with easy to block spells like Annie and other ranged carries (especially Caitlyn, tasty mana from traps).
Here's hoping for Sivir buffs soon though, so I don't get laughed at and queue dodged for picking her in ranked.
|
I don't see a single Bloodthirster...... I am disappoint.
|
You can go bloodthirster instead of Youmou's, wriggle's, or Black Cleaver, but I don't like them. Too reliant on not dying, which if you're split pushing tends to happen often unfortunately. Also, AS is >>> than AD at killing structures, and Lifesteal doesn't even help you there 
|
On September 15 2011 16:57 cagedknight wrote:You can go bloodthirster instead of Youmou's, wriggle's, or Black Cleaver, but I don't like them. Too reliant on not dying, which if you're split pushing tends to happen often unfortunately. Also, AS is >>> than AD at killing structures, and Lifesteal doesn't even help you there
In fact AS and AD have exactly the same effects for killing towers. If you have too much of one of them, the other is better and vice versa. They both are affected by tower armor equally.
Wriggle's, Ghostblade and Black Cleaver all add effects that don't work on towers.
|
If you split push a lot you're generally going to kill quite a few waves of creeps and fully or nearly fully stack your BT anyway. And BT's are still really strong for teamfights which you still will want to do sometimes. She already has an AS boost from her ult so generally AD benefits her more.
|
On September 15 2011 17:15 spinesheath wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2011 16:57 cagedknight wrote:You can go bloodthirster instead of Youmou's, wriggle's, or Black Cleaver, but I don't like them. Too reliant on not dying, which if you're split pushing tends to happen often unfortunately. Also, AS is >>> than AD at killing structures, and Lifesteal doesn't even help you there In fact AS and AD have exactly the same effects for killing towers. If you have too much of one of them, the other is better and vice versa. They both are affected by tower armor equally. Wriggle's, Ghostblade and Black Cleaver all add effects that don't work on towers.
Exactly why I dislike straight bloodthirsters, AS is better for Sivir's hit and run approach so you don't have to stand still to attack. This build adds AD and AS, and you won't pass 2.5 AS even with your ult up
|
But surely having more upfront damage would make it so you don't have to stand still and attack. The thing about AS is that you're doing less damage per hit, but more frequent hits, so to do more overall damage you need to stand still to attack.
Whereas for a 'hit and run' style, you want each of your less frequent hits to be doing more damage.
|
United States47024 Posts
On September 15 2011 17:43 cagedknight wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2011 17:15 spinesheath wrote:On September 15 2011 16:57 cagedknight wrote:You can go bloodthirster instead of Youmou's, wriggle's, or Black Cleaver, but I don't like them. Too reliant on not dying, which if you're split pushing tends to happen often unfortunately. Also, AS is >>> than AD at killing structures, and Lifesteal doesn't even help you there In fact AS and AD have exactly the same effects for killing towers. If you have too much of one of them, the other is better and vice versa. They both are affected by tower armor equally. Wriggle's, Ghostblade and Black Cleaver all add effects that don't work on towers. Exactly why I dislike straight bloodthirsters, AS is better for Sivir's hit and run approach so you don't have to stand still to attack. This build adds AD and AS, and you won't pass 2.5 AS even with your ult up
Except the fact that you have a natural 90% AS Steroid means that AD is 100% the best stat for you to prioritize. You need a LOT of AD before you should start considering buying any ASpd other than Berserker's Greaves--seeing as your ult is like 2.5k gold worth of pure attack speed.
The other reason for Bloodthirster is that lifesteal applies on your W bounces, so you get extra mileage out of it compared to other onhit-type effects.
|
Hit and run meaning stutter step. Much less vulnerable when your attack animation is shorter (Marines and Marauders when stimmed for an example of this). AD is good for boomerang blade hit and run, but unless you have a poke based team you're probably better off going for AS/Armor pen
Bloodthirsters aren't necessarily bad items, but I just prefer not to get them. Too much farm that you have to keep in order to use its full effectiveness, especially when you're likely to die when split pushing.
Armor penetration is Sivir's best actual damage stat for fighting people, and that's why my build has a ton of it. When you have your banshee's veil you can actually destroy people in team fights because you are nearly untouchable from spells and you can stutter step to take less damage from auto attacks.
I felt like sharing my build on her because looking at other things, people suggest weird items that really don't make any sense to me (like suggesting Sword of the Occult as a core item)
Except the fact that you have a natural 90% AS Steroid means that AD is 100% the best stat for you to prioritize. You need a LOT of AD before you should start considering buying any ASpd other than Berserker's Greaves--seeing as your ult is like 2.5k gold worth of pure attack speed.
The other reason for Bloodthirster is that lifesteal applies on your W bounces, so you get extra mileage out of it compared to other onhit-type effects.
First, yes you have a 90% AS steroid, but you still won't reach 2.5 AS with it on with my build. AS is really good for Sivir until you hit the cap, AD is not her best damage stat, armor penetration is, and I don't even build berzerker's greaves because I find that merc tread's are better in nearly every situation.
Second, no on hit effects apply to W bounces to my knowledge, including life steal. In any case with Wriggle's and Stark's you should be set in that department.
|
I thought tiamat stacking was good on her due to the bounces?
|
wtf, i dont think the bounces have ever procced on hits. i bet it works on spellvamp tho....
gunblade sivir op?
edit: regarding the item build. This looks an awful lot like my armor-reduction urgod cheese build. The problem is that once their bruisers get a certain amount of armor, you wont do shit to them and probably get bum-fucked since sivir doesnt have much in terms of escapes. bloodthirster + lw on the other hand will make sure that doesnt happen. The armor reduction cheese works best against ppl with low armor and due to sivir's range thats not terribly attractive
|
United States47024 Posts
On September 16 2011 01:16 cagedknight wrote:
First, yes you have a 90% AS steroid, but you still won't reach 2.5 AS with it on with my build. AS is really good for Sivir until you hit the cap, AD is not her best damage stat, armor penetration is, and I don't even build berzerker's greaves because I find that merc tread's are better in nearly every situation.
1) AD outdoes AS on DPS/gold WAY before 2.5 AS. DPS scales multiplicatively between them, meaning you need to balance your spending between them for maximized DPS. You have a 90% AS steroid, so you need to be spending like 3k+ on AD before AS can even be considered as a better DPS/gold stat than AD.
2) Armor Penetration is good, but under-itemized. Black Cleaver is of diminshed usefulness because you don't proc it on your Ricochet targets, and Brutalizer/GB are cost-inefficient because you're paying for CDR and Crit, which are extremely ineffective on Sivir, and because the active isn't as useful on ranged champions. Last Whisper is the only Armor Pen item that's justifiable, and that doesn't become useful until after your first BF Sword item.
3) Zerks always on Sivir. Spell Shield and BVeil/QSS cover 2 CCs. If you get hit by significantly more than that, then you need to rethink your positioning or get better at using Spell Shield.
|
i think mercs is justifiable vs a team with a shitload of slows. there are a decent # of slows that aren't affected by bveil/spellshield
|
Yes but the majority of those slows also ignore cc reduction or can be reappplied constantly as to make tenacity worthless (singed goo, ashe frost arrows, red buff, gp etc)
|
Mercs is fine on Sivir if you're building somewhat tanky after your first BT. Which is reasonable considering your low range. It means you can just stand there and lifesteal like mad.
|
The build works for me more than bloodthirsters, give it a try or don't, either way's fine with me. I do like Last Whisper over Youmou's in some situations, but I don't like getting bloodthirsters. They require you to hold farm which you won't be able to do if you're split pushing.
|
On September 16 2011 05:55 cagedknight wrote:
The build works for me more than bloodthirsters, give it a try or don't, either way's fine with me. I do like Last Whisper over Youmou's in some situations, but I don't like getting bloodthirsters. They require you to hold farm which you won't be able to do if you're bad at split pushing.
always farm never fight
|
United States47024 Posts
On September 16 2011 05:55 cagedknight wrote:
The build works for me more than bloodthirsters, give it a try or don't, either way's fine with me. I do like Last Whisper over Youmou's in some situations, but I don't like getting bloodthirsters. They require you to hold farm which you won't be able to do if you're split pushing.
What?
Split pushing is one of the best ways to get Bloodthirster stacks. You're only going to lose stacks split-pushing if you're bad at it and get caught.
|
On September 16 2011 07:01 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:55 cagedknight wrote:
The build works for me more than bloodthirsters, give it a try or don't, either way's fine with me. I do like Last Whisper over Youmou's in some situations, but I don't like getting bloodthirsters. They require you to hold farm which you won't be able to do if you're split pushing. What? Split pushing is one of the best ways to get Bloodthirster stacks. You're only going to lose stacks split-pushing if you're bad at it and get caught.
No matter how good you are at split pushing, you will get caught. I'm just going to say again, it really doesn't matter to me if you want to build bloodthirsters or not, I don't and it works for me, which is what I put in my original post.
|
On September 16 2011 09:33 cagedknight wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 07:01 TheYango wrote:On September 16 2011 05:55 cagedknight wrote:
The build works for me more than bloodthirsters, give it a try or don't, either way's fine with me. I do like Last Whisper over Youmou's in some situations, but I don't like getting bloodthirsters. They require you to hold farm which you won't be able to do if you're split pushing. What? Split pushing is one of the best ways to get Bloodthirster stacks. You're only going to lose stacks split-pushing if you're bad at it and get caught. No matter how good you are at split pushing, you will get caught. I'm just going to say again, it really doesn't matter to me if you want to build bloodthirsters or not, I don't and it works for me, which is what I put in my original post.
Not true at all. R is a brilliant escape mechanism, if you've got TP or ghost as a second summoner spell you're still fine, and to some extent exhaust.... and lets not forget flash.
You're saying 'look just listen to me' but you're not actually listening to other people. You really shouldnt be happy with yourself if you get caught split pushing as sivir with R or summoners up.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
