EPTGame took no skill, anymore.
LotV Beta Balance Update — September 3 2015 - Page 9
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Daswollvieh
5553 Posts
Game took no skill, anymore. | ||
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wjat
385 Posts
I rather have no macro booster than auto cast. As Blizzard said, they want to make SC2 more open to new players: I doubt new players will understand why their units are doing stuff alone. "Hey I didn't press any key and a mule is coming down from the sky?" | ||
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Wrath
3174 Posts
On September 04 2015 19:52 wjat wrote: This patch is by far the most disappointing since a long time... Auto Cast mechanics are not interesting at all in my opinion. I rather have no macro booster than auto cast. As Blizzard said, they want to make SC2 more open to new players: I doubt new players will understand why their units are doing stuff alone. "Hey I didn't press any key and a mule is coming down from the sky?" Wait the community feedback. Based on what they were doing, we saw nothing yet... The true horror still lies before us... | ||
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SimoN999
Poland21 Posts
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JackONeill
861 Posts
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Little-Chimp
Canada948 Posts
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On September 04 2015 15:37 Firkraag8 wrote: The new chronoboost is pretty fucking terrible to manage with multiple nexuses, their goal was to make it less mechanically challenging but they actually made it harder. If I want to change a single chrono boosted building to something else I have to redo all of them anyways since there's no way I'll remember which nexus is doing which building and bother to manually select a nexus to change it. Please just give us back the old one, it was fine as it was. Even the worst players knew how to chrono boost out their tech and stuff.. This is the first patch where I really really lost appetite to ladder in the beta.. Don't even get me started on automatically triggering Immortal shields on first hit lol.. I didn't think of this :D (I'm Terran and I thought the new chronoboost was the best of the 3 new mechanics). But surely once you've played some more games, you'll be used to having your first nexus always chronoing the same thing, your second nexus always chronoing this other thing, your 3rd yet another pre-defined building and so on (like control groups), right? | ||
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KeksX
Germany3634 Posts
On September 04 2015 21:29 ZenithM wrote: I didn't think of this :D (I'm Terran and I thought the new chronoboost was the best of the 3 new mechanics). But surely once you've played some more games, you'll be used to having your first nexus always chronoing the same thing, your second nexus always chronoing this other thing, your 3rd yet another pre-defined building and so on (like control groups), right? Which would still require you to actively think about chronoboost and apply it through clicking on the correct nexus(that you thought of first). And if you fuck it up, you gotta do it for all nexus again. So I'm pretty sure this is at least the same work as before. | ||
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Elendur
Canada43 Posts
I believe that Blizzard should strongly reconsider implementing more "unit action" at the expense of "macro mechanics" in this game, and instead wait for a Warcraft 4 game which will surely release at some point. It is much more in line with "hero units" and that type of interaction and playstyle (think LOL viewers). Simply as an example, trying to change CS:GO into Call of Duty because more people watch it and play it would make the entire game fail, in my view. The CS:GO player base will just walk away and say: "If I wanted COD, I would play COD". I believe that the same concept applies for SC2/Warcraft 4/LOL. We do not watch SC2 games because the graphics and sounds are that much better than Warcraft 3. It is the uniqueness of the SC2 franchise that draws us to it (the most demanding macro mechanics game). We love our average APM spam. Otherwise, we would still be all over Warcraft 3 on Twitch. LOL has that market covered - unit control and constant micro surprises/action. You are not going to take people away from LOL in a game where people will still mass roach or mass hellion now and then. | ||
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DeadByDawn
United Kingdom476 Posts
On September 04 2015 21:29 ZenithM wrote: I didn't think of this :D (I'm Terran and I thought the new chronoboost was the best of the 3 new mechanics). But surely once you've played some more games, you'll be used to having your first nexus always chronoing the same thing, your second nexus always chronoing this other thing, your 3rd yet another pre-defined building and so on (like control groups), right? I mentioned earlier that the Nexus should show a faint line to what it is CB'ing (like the unit targeted by a WM). Of course as a Terran if Blizz do not implement this then whatever  | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3371 Posts
You'd think Nexus 1 changes Chrono target, but actually it just applies the one closest by UNLESS you do it really fast. So if you have 6 Nexus the only way to get Chrono on 6 Gates with all of the Nexus in the same group you MUST use rapid fire. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20285 Posts
On September 04 2015 17:48 avilo wrote: I really hate this direction of SC2. It's everything SC2 is not supposed to be. Not talking about balance changes like 100 nrg scan (which is ridiculous btw) but the macro mechanic removal...never needed to happen. And they know it. You know it. I know it. We all know it. They're just band-aid patching this game and making it worse with the automation and refusing to revert the game back to the SC2 we all know and love. Mules, chrono, and inject fundamentally are a part of SC2's identity as a game. What makes the game fun is not the game being easier or automated - but new units, new abilities, that stuff that blizzard should have been focusing on the entire time. I wonder how much of the SC2 community is really ok with how LOTV is going. I honest to god hope most TL veterans get their opinions out there because i feel like most old school SC1 players and a large majority of TL are going "wtf" on the inside right now even if their opinion is not front and center. Autocast does not belong in SC2, the macro mechanics do belong in SC2, they were great and i think the version of SC2 we all had played for the last 4-5 yrs was amazing fundamentally with those mechanics. It was not always amazing from the balance side of things because blizzard patched way too infrequently and poorly (making units faster randomly is not an appropriate balance fix to every situation). I'm just gonna quote some posters here who's sentiments i agree with too and make really good points: I'll add more as i see em, but yeah...i wish more TL people were up in arms over the automation of SC2 tbh. When most people said they wanted lots of changes to SC2, i believe everyone meant balance, metagame, and generally fixing things that were perceived really annoying or broken...not completely re-designing the game to be Warcraft 4 from scratch. People wanted to see things like nukes more viable, nydus worms viable, offensive mech possible, no swarmhost turtle games, sentries tweaked, and new units like lurkers/liberators, new abilities, etc...why the hell in the first place is blizzard messing with the fundamental rule set of the game via mule/chrono/inject? It's arbitrary. Another thing that really annoys me about this entire beta is blizzard's unwillingness to ever test the DH9/DH10 economy models on the live beta servers. They never once let it go live and let players test it and see how it changed the game in a live environment. Instead, they chose their way of removing all macro mechanics for no reason and then realizing that that is going to go horribly and now bringing them back with automation... What is going on... I agree with pretty much everything said, really worried for the game ATM especially with some of blizzards attitudes towards some of the real changes that i would like (engine improvements, double harvest etc) Multiple bases and incentive to expand happens from dropping income per worker as you make more, not 100% income with no loss of efficiency to 44-66 workers (2-3 base) but mining out every 5 minutes. They completely missed the entire point of an economy model change here. I think LOTV should be delayed another year to try more stuff and rethink about what exactly the game should be. I'm happy that Blizzard is trying new things. But I want this game to be great, not good. Add 6 months to the clock and REALLY think about getting it right. Redesign, iterate. We'll be on Legacy for half a decade at least. You do NOT want to fuck up the first impressions and lose half of the playerbase before fixing it. | ||
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Magnifico
1958 Posts
You have to individually select the nexus if you want to put that nexus's chronoboost in some place. Imagine doing that with three or more nexi. And you do have to remember which nexus is chronoing which structure. EDIT: After playing more games I'm more confident about my early judgment. The activity of using chronoboost now is fairly similar to the mechanics of inject in the sense that you need to move your camera to a specific location, then select a unit(queen) or building (nexus), and use a ability (inject/chrono) on some building. In fact, chronoboost seem to be harder once you consider that the building being chronoboosted can be screens away from the nexus. When you inject the building being injected is usually right next to the thing that injects. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20285 Posts
The main difficulty with chrono boost was remembering to use it frequently and mentally timing when it would expire and when you had new ones available, which wasn't critically important to playing the game at a bronze-diamond level and became second nature if you were a sharper player than that. | ||
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deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On September 04 2015 22:08 ejozl wrote: Also if Nexus 1 Chrono a thing, then Nexus 2 Chrono another thing and you then apply to a third thing. You'd think Nexus 1 changes Chrono target, but actually it just applies the one closest by UNLESS you do it really fast. So if you have 6 Nexus the only way to get Chrono on 6 Gates with all of the Nexus in the same group you MUST use rapid fire. I really hope they implement this, because then we all could see how stupid they are, because thsi way you would need to follow the line from your, lets say, 4th to your main, where the chronoed buildings usually are. They just failed at testing this properly so they haven;t fixed this control issue. (I still hope this is not intended) | ||
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RenZ
Singapore65 Posts
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shid0x
Korea (South)5014 Posts
Photon overcharge Overcharge can only be cast on Pylons. Has an attack range of 7. Yay, i can't wait to be canon rushed / overcharged in my own base.  Has confirmed first GSL champ.Scanner Sweep cost increased to 100 from 50. Somehow the DT-Banshee-burrow puches are a lot scarier. Siege Tank Now has a 0.75 second delay before firing when unloading from a Medivac while in siege mode. Thank you for killing one of the few thing that was fun as hell blizz. | ||
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summerloud
Austria1201 Posts
if you think about what one dedicated person can do with the map editor, and then consider that what we are getting is one or two half-broken patches per month, thats just sad, especially considering this is supposed to be a beta, where stuff is tested. for example - they fixed the immortal display bug. why not fix charge if its obviously broken? its embarrassing enough that it was put in the patch in the first place, just shows how incompetent blizzard really is. give me one person that actually understands the game and knows his way around in the map editor over the entire blizzard team any day. this patch is just... i have no words for it really. it was all said plenty of times, but with people overreacting to kind-of shitty patches it is hard to find words drastic enough for this trainwreck of a patch without being insta-banned. right now i feel like i did halfway through hots beta. i dont know if its better to hope for good changes, or just hope that they ruin the game so thouroughly that the community moves to a mod that is actually good. | ||
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The_Masked_Shrimp
425 Posts
 I am almost sure the devs didn't even consider that. They introduce easy auto defense mechanics that require the simple push of a unique button to defend almost any early agression (and now also create more dangerous early aggression). And on the other side they nerf micro intensive mechanics like tankivac; if you execute it accurately yes it's scary or deadly, but back at home your macro will be lacking in the meantime, and if it's not then you are very good. If you are GM or silver, you will use photon overcharge exactly in the same way. | ||
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Cricketer12
United States13974 Posts
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