EPTThe last option is that it is simply time-based, which might be the best option since in that case many will choose simply not to play at all if they are the kind of player that only plays ranked; however in that case they should just be temp-banned instead (though maybe here I start to see Riot's reasoning: if you temp ban someone they either make a smurf and ruin low-level games, which in turn scares off new players, or they stop playing for a while and potentially forget about the game/get into a different game like DotA and that means a potential customer loss for Riot).
[Patch 4.16] Azir General Discussion - Page 92
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Goragoth
New Zealand1065 Posts
The last option is that it is simply time-based, which might be the best option since in that case many will choose simply not to play at all if they are the kind of player that only plays ranked; however in that case they should just be temp-banned instead (though maybe here I start to see Riot's reasoning: if you temp ban someone they either make a smurf and ruin low-level games, which in turn scares off new players, or they stop playing for a while and potentially forget about the game/get into a different game like DotA and that means a potential customer loss for Riot). | ||
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Lmui
Canada6207 Posts
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IMoperator
4476 Posts
inb4 riot makes a language filter and autobans anyone that swears or calls people a noob, etc. | ||
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ketchup
14521 Posts
On September 24 2014 12:27 IMoperator wrote: They're exaggerating the "toxicity" problem so much and making such a big deal about it. inb4 riot makes a language filter and autobans anyone that swears or calls people a noob, etc. I'm pretty sure the toxicity problem isn't exaggerated. I don't think you are the best source on what toxicity means when you've been banned in a few different places already.. | ||
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asymptotech
United States295 Posts
On September 24 2014 12:27 IMoperator wrote: They're exaggerating the "toxicity" problem so much and making such a big deal about it. inb4 riot makes a language filter and autobans anyone that swears or calls people a noob, etc. Sadly, I'm not sure that they are. The internet has bred such horrid interaction between [actual] people for so long that those who spend a large amount of their time online are simply desensitized. People are horrible to each other online...LoL is more of a microcosm of this than an outlier on the 'bad' side. It's standard at this point to be jaded/cynical/etc towards it and tell others to grow a thick skin or don't show up. And absolutely no one is better for it being that way. I'm not trying to say that Riot should be praised and entered into cooperate sainthood; but I would rather try to see the good in their efforts than shrug them off and say "this is simply how it is and you guys should learn to deal with it." But they wouldn't be that way if it wasn't for the sake of making more money? Maybe, maybe not. I don't know any of them well enough to judge their character and I think it's beyond presumptuous to do so. Of course it would be ridiculous for everyone who said 'noob' to get banned. But I think that is more because it's proven that negative reinforcement leads to less change than positive reinforcement -- otherwise what exactly would be bad about that? There's nothing that forces a person to spout their anger/frustration/belittlement/whatever at others. If that guy in top lane is 0-4, I'm fairly certain he knows he's having a bad game, and the last thing he/she needs is someone beating the obvious over their head. If someone is an asshole to you, what is there accomplished by being one in return? Especially in an online, mostly anonymous, context. If even a portion of the negativity within a general set of games could be purged...well, it's likely a pointless dream. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
On September 24 2014 13:10 asymptotech wrote: Sadly, I'm not sure that they are. The internet had bred such horrid interaction between [actual] people for so long that those who spend a large amount of their time online are simply desensitized. People are horrible to each other online...LoL is more of a microcosm of that than an outlier on the 'bad' side. It's standard at this point to be jaded/cynical/etc towards it and tell others to grow a thick skin or don't show up. And absolutely no one is better for it being that way. I'm not trying to say that Riot should be praised and entered into cooperate sainthood; but I would rather try to see the good in their efforts than shrug them off and say "this is simply how it is and you guys should learn to deal with it." But they wouldn't be that way if it wasn't for the sake of making more money? Maybe, maybe not. I don't know any of them well enough to judge their character and I think it's beyond presumptuous to do so. Of course it would be ridiculous for everyone who said 'noob' to get banned. But I think that is more because it's proven that negative reinforcement leads to less change than positive reinforcement -- otherwise what exactly would be bad about that? There's nothing that forces a person to spout their anger/frustration/belittlement/whatever at others. If that guy in top lane is 0-4, I'm fairly certain he knows he's having a bad game, and the last thing he/she needs is someone beating the obvious over their head. If someone is an asshole to you, what is there accomplished by being one in return? Especially in an online, mostly anonymous, context. If even a portion of the negativity within a general set of games could be purged...well, it's likely a pointless dream. I'm afraid its the opposite. Instead of, "those who spend a large amount of their time online are simply desensitized" it is, those who spend a large amount of time online are estranged and detached from normal competitive environments (sports, drinking games, courtship, or even Smash Bros with friends), that they are hypersensitive and react to things that 10 year old boys playing 5 on 5 would laugh at. Lol isn't a microcosm of internet toxicity, Riot is a microcosm of (inventing a term here, maybe) "outrage culture" plus the fact that chat logs are, well, logged. Its basically the Redskins team name phenomenon/controversy where a vast majority dont care (or are even pro Redskin), a small number actually really care, and significant number (~15% in the Redskins case) comprise professional agitators and those who are then duped/shamed by those agitators into thinking the same thing. Its the same with Reddit, the "I usually agree with the rager in my game and generally dont care" post doesn't get picked up by the people who troll /new, so it never reaches the frontpage, and there is this false narrative created that it is an issue. The reality is its an issue for a few crusaders and their lemmings who go along. | ||
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
On September 24 2014 12:27 IMoperator wrote: They're exaggerating the "toxicity" problem so much and making such a big deal about it. inb4 riot makes a language filter and autobans anyone that swears or calls people a noob, etc. Nobody gets banned for swearing. | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On September 24 2014 13:33 cLutZ wrote: I'm afraid its the opposite. Instead of, "those who spend a large amount of their time online are simply desensitized" it is, those who spend a large amount of time online are estranged and detached from normal competitive environments (sports, drinking games, courtship, or even Smash Bros with friends), that they are hypersensitive and react to things that 10 year old boys playing 5 on 5 would laugh at. Lol isn't a microcosm of internet toxicity, Riot is a microcosm of (inventing a term here, maybe) "outrage culture" plus the fact that chat logs are, well, logged. Its basically the Redskins team name phenomenon/controversy where a vast majority dont care (or are even pro Redskin), a small number actually really care, and significant number (~15% in the Redskins case) comprise professional agitators and those who are then duped/shamed by those agitators into thinking the same thing. Its the same with Reddit, the "I usually agree with the rager in my game and generally dont care" post doesn't get picked up by the people who troll /new, so it never reaches the frontpage, and there is this false narrative created that it is an issue. The reality is its an issue for a few crusaders and their lemmings who go along. Thats not true at all. You can say all sorts of stuff, you just can't be an asshole. Same as everywhere. You can tell someone they are bad, but tell them a real reason why and dont harrass them all game for the sake of harassing them. I tell people they are bad all the time, never been reported once as far as I know, much less banned or chat banned. Yet so many people bitch about the system being overly harsh, when fact is you just need to not act like a total asshole. The other thing is, no one gets banned for trash talking an opponent unless it is totally ridiculous, same as in regular sports, you get banned for trashtalking your teammates. Go join any sports league you want, tell all your teammates they are trash and make them feel like shit. See how long you are in that sports league. Say those same things to your opponent you might get a game misconduct penalty, if that. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On September 24 2014 12:27 IMoperator wrote: They're exaggerating the "toxicity" problem so much and making such a big deal about it. inb4 riot makes a language filter and autobans anyone that swears or calls people a noob, etc. is this coming from a guy who got like perma ip banned from twitch? | ||
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IMoperator
4476 Posts
On September 24 2014 13:48 wei2coolman wrote: is this coming from a guy who got like perma ip banned from twitch? that was for making a ton of accounts to spam someone though and i got unbanned like a month or so later | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On September 24 2014 13:50 IMoperator wrote: that was for making a ton of accounts to spam someone though and i got unbanned like a month or so later totally not toxic | ||
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IMoperator
4476 Posts
not at all i have been banned a lot in league though, but i dont even play anymore so none of this really bothers me. | ||
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
On September 24 2014 13:57 IMoperator wrote: not at all i have been banned a lot in league though, but i dont even play anymore so none of this really bothers me. Aren't you the guy who got banned, then came on here to brag it and then got banned here as well? | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On September 24 2014 13:53 Ketara wrote: My favorite part of the "real life sports players talk shit to each other all the time so it's okay to do in LoL" argument is the part where you think that professional atheletes are role models of social virtues. It's not even that. No professional athletes flame their own teammates, not a single one. Sure most of them trash talk, but no one in LoL gets banned for trash talking they're opponents. | ||
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
On September 24 2014 14:03 iCanada wrote: It's not even that. No professional athletes flame their own teammates, not a single one. Sure most of them trash talk, but no one in LoL gets banned for trash talking they're opponents. You can't seriously think that. It definitely happens. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On September 24 2014 14:06 GolemMadness wrote: You can't seriously think that. It definitely happens. I mean, sure I bet it happens occasionally, but there is a different tone when the enemy top laner tells you you suck then when your teammates do. It's much more playful from the other team, there is also considerably less cross team chat regardless. | ||
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IMoperator
4476 Posts
On September 24 2014 14:01 GolemMadness wrote: Aren't you the guy who got banned, then came on here to brag it and then got banned here as well? yeah probably | ||
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
On September 24 2014 13:53 Ketara wrote: My favorite part of the "real life sports players talk shit to each other all the time so it's okay to do in LoL" argument is the part where you think that professional atheletes are role models of social virtues. Social virtues? No. Knowledge of competitive values? Very often yes. Do I think that excessive flaming, etc is and can be a problem that eventually should be addressed? Probably. I just have some issues with the overwhelming focus on it, which is why I brought up the Redskins name controversy. First of all, in both, I don't think the world would be worse off if both were changed. But if you asked me, "would the world (or LOL) be better. I would probably say no. I would say yes, change the Redskins name and implement draconian punishments if I thought the people who talk about these mildly important (all of LoL's issues are mildly important, but its still not on like a top 5 list) would then stop agitating or start focusing on issues that matter. Instead, history tells use that they will not start talking about things that actually matter. Instead, they will focus on other inane things. For instance, in the Redskins case, the same/similar groups tried to attack the University of Illinois Illini, and Chicago Blackhawks before, as well as the Seminoles, and Atlanta Braves. The stupid Redskins are basically saving thousands of mascots around the country from facing stupid scrutiny that would waste everyones time. In the end, its about finite resources, and that its good to have these stupid issues for this subset of the population to be mad at. In life, I still get to cheer for my Chicago Blackhawks 25 years from now because the Redskins keep their name for the next 15 years. In LoL I dont know what they will get mad at, but maybe I get to keep skyping with my brother while we play the game together (3rd party voice op!), simply duo queue in ranked, or roleplay as Jar Jar Binks for a few extra years while they are occupied with "toxicity". | ||
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