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On September 22 2014 20:17 kongoline wrote:
is jax vs riven a one sided rape fest right now? dont think i've been able to win a single lane vs riven as jax even after 6 i get pooped on only can beat her after i finish trinity/bortk and randuin but at this point game is usually decided, i dont have half as much trouble even vs ryze which is supposed to be a hard counter
As long as you hit your stuns you should be fine.
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On September 22 2014 20:43 Sufficiency wrote:
Lol.
That reminded me of a game a few days back where my Jax gave up first blood vs Leona at level 2 one on one on the top lne. I was dumbfounded. ..
Minions hit hard you know...
Actually speaking of that, I played a game as Jayce vs Galio yesterday. He rushed fucking greedily an athenes but I wasn't able to push him out of lane at all. Trying to harass him I'd just take a lot of minion aggro, trading with him he'd just heal a shitfuck with his shield... That was so frustrating to play damn. I might be awful though.
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On September 22 2014 21:21 -Zoda- wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 20:43 Sufficiency wrote:
Lol.
That reminded me of a game a few days back where my Jax gave up first blood vs Leona at level 2 one on one on the top lne. I was dumbfounded. .. Minions hit hard you know... Actually speaking of that, I played a game as Jayce vs Galio yesterday. He rushed fucking greedily an athenes but I wasn't able to push him out of lane at all. Trying to harass him I'd just take a lot of minion aggro, trading with him he'd just heal a shitfuck with his shield... That was so frustrating to play damn. I might be awful though.
Meh. SOunds like bad lane management. That said, Minions might be too strong right now in the botlane. Its and ebb and flow with them vs. earlygame sustain and it seems the dominant strategy is pushing and getting minion advantages.
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Ya with him buying Chalice first, I ended up with the minions banging at my tower quite often, that was part of the problem. Jayce having a bit short range makes it not easy to harass without taking minions damage back, I should play more with the bushes probably.
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Guys, I need some advice on how to auto-harass in lane.
As support Zilean today I tried Q bomb and auto harass but the second I move up I get harassed down to half health.
Am I suppose to use E to weave in and avoid skill shots?
Also which mastery is better for support Zilean? I've been going 0-9-21 always for all my supports.
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Depends on the match-up, Zilean's bombs have 700 range and his autoattacks about as much, so for example you outrange Lulu or Taric hard, but against Zyra or Nami (esp. because your auto animation is slow) you risk eating some cc to the face whenever you do that.
It's also riskier going in if you're with a Vayne against a Caitlyn than with a Cait against Graves, obviously. But you shouldn't need to use E to get harass in, and you can abuse your attack range to harass the enemy champion when he goes for a last hit (because even if he responds to your harass he'll have to give up on his minion).
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On September 22 2014 12:37 Lmui wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 12:34 Slusher wrote:
laning with people who picked up Janna because they saw it at worlds is pretty maddening On the other hand, duoQ with Janna is amazing. Lucian/Vayne with a Janna can shit on almost anyone.
Vayne/Janna used to be one of the worst lane in the game because you just get pooped on early and it was incredibly greedy.
Thank god Riot made it so everybody had the same power curves ! :D
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On September 22 2014 23:34 mr_tolkien wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 12:37 Lmui wrote:On September 22 2014 12:34 Slusher wrote:
laning with people who picked up Janna because they saw it at worlds is pretty maddening On the other hand, duoQ with Janna is amazing. Lucian/Vayne with a Janna can shit on almost anyone. Vayne/Janna used to be one of the worst lane in the game because you just get pooped on early and it was incredibly greedy. Thank god Riot made it so everybody had the same power curves ! :D
Just another case of short sighted balancing by Riot. They nerfed all the punishing ADC until they were no longer played, MF/Graves. While buffing the early game of hypercarries and not reducing their lategame.
What could possibly go wrong.
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I don't know if that's true. Apart from Tristana being too strong I disagree completely. Vayne is still a niche pick at best, Kog'maw is barely played and still dies if you breathe in his general direction lategame. Twitch is only really played in pick comps. Jinx doesn't see much play either.
And then lane bullies like Cait, Graves, (Draven?) get played sometimes.
I'd say apart from Tristana being way too strong, and Lucian just straight up being too good at everything ADC are in a pretty balanced state right now.
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Yeah I think if anything what's keeping the other "lane bully ADC" champs out is still just Lucian being better at it than them.
Lucian still gets played a lot.
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On September 22 2014 20:28 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +V4.11:
Stats
Base health reduced to 450 from 463.
Health per level reduced to 85 from 98.
Armor per level reduced to 3 from 3.5. Any "balanced" or "slightly unfavourable" physical match-up before that became worse for Jax, at least until you can overcome the difference in stats with items (considering that neither Triforce nor BotRK give enough defensive stats for it, and the higher you get the more stats you lose since armour has been hit in its scaling). At least 6 you lose 3 armour and 78 HP, that's a bunch against Riven's all-in for example.
Yeah I noticed that I beat Jaxes top with my rengar now on a regulgar basis, I mean its 50/50, while before I had to really outplay them or I hug the turret
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On September 22 2014 23:56 Ketara wrote:
Yeah I think if anything what's keeping the other "lane bully ADC" champs out is still just Lucian being better at it than them.
Lucian still gets played a lot.
Lucian basically has everything you want in a "lane bully ADC" while still having decent late game. I wonder how they'll try make him not better than everyone else at that. They could buff the others to make them fulfill certain niches more.
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I tough that one of the reason for Vayne's popularity was that she had an okayish lane against Lucian... Which is better that what a lot of adc can aspire to
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It would be great to have seperate threads to discuss certain lanes/roles only. I have few questions about top lane. I actually like tank meta in top lane, and I love to play shyvana/maokai/mundo. But Nasus give me a lot of trouble becuase its hard to kill him when i want to build defence, and he just outpushes and can easily kill me 30 minutes into the game. If we can forget about junglers for a minute (most of the time they dont know what theyr doin), is picking any tanks into Nasus is a horrible idea?? And if i end in this MU what to do? Also is going bork first against dog as shyvana is mandatory?
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I'm sure you'd be welcome to make lane/role threads in the strategy forum, and nobody would post in there just like how nobody posts in the champion threads.
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Is there a place to find champions listed by CD on their ult? I've been climbing out of silver elo decay #thedream on Kha and Rengar since every time their ult is off CD it is a free double kill bot lane, but Rengar's ult is kind of long and I'm looking for a replacement (also sometimes those champs are banned).
Either that or any recommendations?
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Most globals/semi-globals have 150-180 seconds cooldown on rank 1.
"Vanilla" ultimates are 90 to 120 seconds (newer champions tend to have shorter CD). Support ultimates are usually 120-150 seconds (Leona is a huge exception)
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On September 22 2014 20:17 kongoline wrote:
is jax vs riven a one sided rape fest right now? dont think i've been able to win a single lane vs riven as jax even after 6 i get pooped on only can beat her after i finish trinity/bortk and randuin but at this point game is usually decided, i dont have half as much trouble even vs ryze which is supposed to be a hard counter
It's a skill-based matchup, but Jax > Riven after level 8 or so and once he builds some tank items. As Jax, you should definitely play passive until you get post 6 with some health armor items.
Riven can out-trade you because she doesn't have mana. When she dashes onto you, try to postpone the attacks until her shield wears off.
Honestly, I would give a slight edge to Jax right now.
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On September 21 2014 19:01 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2014 14:27 krndandaman wrote:On September 21 2014 12:49 kongoline wrote:On September 21 2014 12:39 krndandaman wrote:On September 21 2014 12:22 JazzVortical wrote:On September 21 2014 08:33 kongoline wrote:On September 21 2014 08:18 nafta wrote:On September 21 2014 08:16 JazzVortical wrote:On September 21 2014 07:54 krndandaman wrote:
although my experience with azir has been pretty underwhelming (I have yet to see an azir in ranked win) I do think he'll be rather good once people actually learn to play him well.
also I'm rather happy with the spot zilean is in atm. he's not in OP territory but he's also a very strong pick. I remember the days people would bitch at me for picking zilean lol. anyone know if he's going to get nerfed or reworked? Haven't really heard much talk about zilean in terms of nerfs. also morg snare is still bullshit. He's super popular in picks and bans at Worlds at the moment, so prepare for nerfs. Before he became popular, Riot was talking about reworking him. Riot was talking about how they want to remove global passives since they did it for tf and zilean still has his.It is just a load of crap. didnt they talk about it in the context zil is going to have his removed too They also brought up the 'problem' of him only having one damage skill, and that being frustrating to play against because it is so powerful. thats such bs. zilean hasn't been changed for so long and now people are starting to complain about him. i do think a rework would be nice to make him more 'modern' but no nerfs pls. its not even like tristana where all her counters got nerfed. zilean didnt change but game around him has, if u havent noticed game is totally different compared to s2 i've played zilean since s3. ive been called a troll until faker played zilean. imo mid zil became strong once the tank meta died out. support zil has always been ok imo but got a little better once the lane bullies got nerfed. On the contrary, Zilean's ult is powerful versus few damage threats (because there's less damage to expand across the team to kill someone) and versus assassins (because it "burns" the damage from a champion in particular). There's still a "tank meta", cf. top lane, unless you run something like Lulu offlane, and even then a shield comp is akin to a tank.  The most important part is IE's comeback, same as in s2, it puts the focus on the marksman again. Show nested quote +On September 21 2014 15:11 wei2coolman wrote:On September 21 2014 15:00 schmutttt wrote:
So I played rumble vs jax (I don't rate myself on Rumble) and destroyed him, is this indicative of the matchup or was the jax just more terrible than me? It's indicative of you being a douchebag and playing Rumble. Nah, that should be a winning matchup for Rumble as far as I know. Jax will have an impossible time farming early levels. I think post 6, if Jax didn't get shit on, it becomes harder for Rumble. Rumble was always strong versus Jax, Phage change awhile ago made it worse (because of the slow+MS buff Rumble has), and Jax getting shat on his base HP recently (and the change to dblade sustain) made it even worse.
I feel like a good Zil can be a game-changer. My only gripe with him is that he doesn't make a great support since he's too mana-heavy to harrass, but needs the gold for support items & survivability & a bit of AP.
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On September 23 2014 01:04 parkufarku wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2014 20:17 kongoline wrote:
is jax vs riven a one sided rape fest right now? dont think i've been able to win a single lane vs riven as jax even after 6 i get pooped on only can beat her after i finish trinity/bortk and randuin but at this point game is usually decided, i dont have half as much trouble even vs ryze which is supposed to be a hard counter It's a skill-based matchup, but Jax > Riven after level 8 or so and once he builds some tank items. As Jax, you should definitely play passive until you get post 6 with some health armor items. Riven can out-trade you because she doesn't have mana. When she dashes onto you, try to postpone the attacks until her shield wears off. Honestly, I would give a slight edge to Jax right now.
Jax has absolutely no business winning that matchup until he gets 2 items. And that's assuming he doesn't get absolutely styled on by Riven
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EPT
