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On August 21 2014 07:53 Thermia wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2014 06:57 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 06:51 Thermia wrote:On August 21 2014 06:31 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 03:50 RouaF wrote:
I don't see the problem with this faker stream, it's pretty convenient if you want to spec kr solo queue. I'm not sure if the guy is really making big bucks out of this but if he does then good for him, he was the first to think of this. Do you think he deserves less than camwhores and idiots like trick2g ? Daaymn, talking about being salty. Someone giving entertainment for the masses while teaching lower elo players and trying to erase the typical noob mentality from them, but let's hate him because he's getting $$$ for it and not acting like a priest. I usually just watch him when he soectates low elo plays, because that shit is ridiculous, but lately my favourite part about his stream when people tell him their success stories. I can relate to that because I like to help lower elo players and it's great to hear you actually did something to influence them in a good way, and I couldn't care less if it was "his way" or not, what's important is the message. Yeah he hasn't ruined way more games than he's helped players when people try to do the "hehe i go really fast and splitpush and feed" udyr style that probably 90% of people that I've seen play udyr do (and suck at, and lose the game with). Lata! xD Okay, so if I start to pick up Zed because Faker is so good and I go 0-10 because I actually suck with him, can I blame Faker? You can't be serious blaming him for people's lack of knowledge and/or skill to understand how and why he does what he does, especially since he is basically explaining it over and over again. My experience with the trick-army is that every goddamn game vs them is a pain in the ass and it's a joke how many easy wins I lost because that 1-3-1 Udyr just splitpushed his brain out. Not to mention how easy it is to carry with that playstyle in bronze and silver if someone pays attention. Also, he spectates his subscribers (not just junglers) and points out their mistakes as well, while enlightening the stream viewers that "see, this is why blaming your team is pointless, because you made this and that grave mistake, you just failed to realize it". I don't know what level you're playing at, but where I've been playing these days (high plat-mid diamond smurfs) I have yet to run into a single trick wannabe that has been remotely useful to the team. There's a place for trying that stuff out and it isn't in ranked. Your faker analogy is also flawed because faker doesn't play zed in a very specific way that involves building items that are absolutely worthless for any purpose other than with his playstyle that also requires the rest of the team to at least have some idea of what to do with it (and he usually is playing with either people that know how to play along with it on his main, or is on a smurf where it doesnt matter because you can win with anything when you play far below your level). It's just a cancerous playstyle when used by his legions of terrible followers ends up (again, in my experience) trolling their own team far more often than carrying. The rest of it sounds fine, I have no problem with him being instructive towards peoples mistakes and teaching them to have better attitudes but I'm pretty sure the brainless splitpushing feeding LATA udyrs dwarf the amount of people he's legitmately helped.
I won a game like 3 days ago due to a trick style Udyr when we were far behind.
Honestly though who cares if there are people trying to imitate him and failing. They stop pretty fast because losing and getting picked off repeatedly trying to split isn't fun. I'm just happy that he is at least teaching new players the value of objectives. A bad udyr isn't half as frustrating as an entire team that repeatedly refuses to take a single turret after a won teamfight.
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People are actually mad that someone's streaming Faker games and making a bit of money from it? I find this so weird.
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On August 21 2014 08:12 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2014 07:53 Thermia wrote:On August 21 2014 06:57 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 06:51 Thermia wrote:On August 21 2014 06:31 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 03:50 RouaF wrote:
I don't see the problem with this faker stream, it's pretty convenient if you want to spec kr solo queue. I'm not sure if the guy is really making big bucks out of this but if he does then good for him, he was the first to think of this. Do you think he deserves less than camwhores and idiots like trick2g ? Daaymn, talking about being salty. Someone giving entertainment for the masses while teaching lower elo players and trying to erase the typical noob mentality from them, but let's hate him because he's getting $$$ for it and not acting like a priest. I usually just watch him when he soectates low elo plays, because that shit is ridiculous, but lately my favourite part about his stream when people tell him their success stories. I can relate to that because I like to help lower elo players and it's great to hear you actually did something to influence them in a good way, and I couldn't care less if it was "his way" or not, what's important is the message. Yeah he hasn't ruined way more games than he's helped players when people try to do the "hehe i go really fast and splitpush and feed" udyr style that probably 90% of people that I've seen play udyr do (and suck at, and lose the game with). Lata! xD Okay, so if I start to pick up Zed because Faker is so good and I go 0-10 because I actually suck with him, can I blame Faker? You can't be serious blaming him for people's lack of knowledge and/or skill to understand how and why he does what he does, especially since he is basically explaining it over and over again. My experience with the trick-army is that every goddamn game vs them is a pain in the ass and it's a joke how many easy wins I lost because that 1-3-1 Udyr just splitpushed his brain out. Not to mention how easy it is to carry with that playstyle in bronze and silver if someone pays attention. Also, he spectates his subscribers (not just junglers) and points out their mistakes as well, while enlightening the stream viewers that "see, this is why blaming your team is pointless, because you made this and that grave mistake, you just failed to realize it". I don't know what level you're playing at, but where I've been playing these days (high plat-mid diamond smurfs) I have yet to run into a single trick wannabe that has been remotely useful to the team. There's a place for trying that stuff out and it isn't in ranked. Your faker analogy is also flawed because faker doesn't play zed in a very specific way that involves building items that are absolutely worthless for any purpose other than with his playstyle that also requires the rest of the team to at least have some idea of what to do with it (and he usually is playing with either people that know how to play along with it on his main, or is on a smurf where it doesnt matter because you can win with anything when you play far below your level). It's just a cancerous playstyle when used by his legions of terrible followers ends up (again, in my experience) trolling their own team far more often than carrying. The rest of it sounds fine, I have no problem with him being instructive towards peoples mistakes and teaching them to have better attitudes but I'm pretty sure the brainless splitpushing feeding LATA udyrs dwarf the amount of people he's legitmately helped. I won a game like 3 days ago due to a trick style Udyr when we were far behind. Honestly though who cares if there are people trying to imitate him and failing. They stop pretty fast because losing and getting picked off repeatedly trying to split isn't fun. I'm just happy that he is at least teaching new players the value of objectives. A bad udyr isn't half as frustrating as an entire team that repeatedly refuses to take a single turret after a won teamfight.
I do when they're on my team and are completely useless.
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Got a couple practice games with Gnar, now that his IP's dropped to 6300. I feel there's only two ways to build him from the top lane: as a split pusher (like Jax or Shen) or balls to the wall dps. Either build will center around BotRK + Triforce. I suspected BotRK was good on him, and it is, but I was surprised at how effective Triforce was on him. The Sheen passive gives him that little extra 'oomph' that he needed to be a split pusher, or someone who can do a surprising amount of damage in a team fight.
Bloodthirster is a trap item on him, don't get it. His defensive stats leave a bit to be desired, as even in Mega Gnar form with the usual buys of Randuins + BV I felt I was taking a lot of damage and was blowing a lot of stuff to try and stay alive. Granted, the stuff I was blowing was on their back line after leaping in with E while at full Rage, so I guess I was doing my job.
In terms of a team comp for him, I feel you almost want a poke team, as the boomerang Q actually has some decent range on it, and once you build up the Rage you can engage on the weakened team with his mini E leap into mega Gnar E pound. Most of his damage will come from his passive in mini form, so maxing that second (with Q max first) will let him become a split pusher.
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Hmm Gnar seems terrible from what I've seen :/ Probably not worth buying. It's really lame to me that his cooldowns are shared between forms. Would personally prefer them to be individually weaker but not share cooldowns...
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I think the tentative buffs to Gnar on PBE, should they stick, will help with the sense of him lacking damage in team fights in his Mega Gnar form. The boomerang Q changes I think are needed, as it's pretty hard to grab it on the way back unless you stand on the return line and sit there, which leaves him easy pickings for the other top laner or someone else to harass him with.
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On August 21 2014 08:17 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2014 08:12 sob3k wrote:On August 21 2014 07:53 Thermia wrote:On August 21 2014 06:57 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 06:51 Thermia wrote:On August 21 2014 06:31 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 03:50 RouaF wrote:
I don't see the problem with this faker stream, it's pretty convenient if you want to spec kr solo queue. I'm not sure if the guy is really making big bucks out of this but if he does then good for him, he was the first to think of this. Do you think he deserves less than camwhores and idiots like trick2g ? Daaymn, talking about being salty. Someone giving entertainment for the masses while teaching lower elo players and trying to erase the typical noob mentality from them, but let's hate him because he's getting $$$ for it and not acting like a priest. I usually just watch him when he soectates low elo plays, because that shit is ridiculous, but lately my favourite part about his stream when people tell him their success stories. I can relate to that because I like to help lower elo players and it's great to hear you actually did something to influence them in a good way, and I couldn't care less if it was "his way" or not, what's important is the message. Yeah he hasn't ruined way more games than he's helped players when people try to do the "hehe i go really fast and splitpush and feed" udyr style that probably 90% of people that I've seen play udyr do (and suck at, and lose the game with). Lata! xD Okay, so if I start to pick up Zed because Faker is so good and I go 0-10 because I actually suck with him, can I blame Faker? You can't be serious blaming him for people's lack of knowledge and/or skill to understand how and why he does what he does, especially since he is basically explaining it over and over again. My experience with the trick-army is that every goddamn game vs them is a pain in the ass and it's a joke how many easy wins I lost because that 1-3-1 Udyr just splitpushed his brain out. Not to mention how easy it is to carry with that playstyle in bronze and silver if someone pays attention. Also, he spectates his subscribers (not just junglers) and points out their mistakes as well, while enlightening the stream viewers that "see, this is why blaming your team is pointless, because you made this and that grave mistake, you just failed to realize it". I don't know what level you're playing at, but where I've been playing these days (high plat-mid diamond smurfs) I have yet to run into a single trick wannabe that has been remotely useful to the team. There's a place for trying that stuff out and it isn't in ranked. Your faker analogy is also flawed because faker doesn't play zed in a very specific way that involves building items that are absolutely worthless for any purpose other than with his playstyle that also requires the rest of the team to at least have some idea of what to do with it (and he usually is playing with either people that know how to play along with it on his main, or is on a smurf where it doesnt matter because you can win with anything when you play far below your level). It's just a cancerous playstyle when used by his legions of terrible followers ends up (again, in my experience) trolling their own team far more often than carrying. The rest of it sounds fine, I have no problem with him being instructive towards peoples mistakes and teaching them to have better attitudes but I'm pretty sure the brainless splitpushing feeding LATA udyrs dwarf the amount of people he's legitmately helped. I won a game like 3 days ago due to a trick style Udyr when we were far behind. Honestly though who cares if there are people trying to imitate him and failing. They stop pretty fast because losing and getting picked off repeatedly trying to split isn't fun. I'm just happy that he is at least teaching new players the value of objectives. A bad udyr isn't half as frustrating as an entire team that repeatedly refuses to take a single turret after a won teamfight. I do when they're on my team and are completely useless.
It's really no different from any other useless player outside of they might backdoor and win you the game, I guess.
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My problem with the trick2g army is that they always do it wrong. You can't half ass that style. They will try to hold turrets 1v3 without realizing how awful udyr is at that, they chase people that kite them too easy, they try to force ganks that won't work, they don't go for early dragon. They finish feral flare around 18 minutes instead 11 or 12, and they don't split push almost at all, maybe they push one wave. They don't understand pressure. They dance around mid instead of forcing the other team to respond to a side lane. Or they push one wave and go back to wolves at 40 minutes in.
If an udyr wants to play that style, I would be okay with it in principle. The lanes aren't entitled to ganks, and we can play safe until he is farmed enough. It isn't ideal, but udyr is pretty weak in a 5v5 with moderate cc anyway so you might as well let him split push and use that pressure to take objectives. But.they.always.do.it.wrong.
So now my heart sinks every time I see an udyr and I'll probably dodge.
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the problem with split push udyr is that you pretty much necessarily need to go mobo/trinity/zephyr-->frozen heart which is pretty awful in a lot of comps for teamfights. then again i dont think you can split push with a regular build that well but you can teamfight pretty well as long as you're not underfarmed
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On August 21 2014 08:12 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2014 07:53 Thermia wrote:On August 21 2014 06:57 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 06:51 Thermia wrote:On August 21 2014 06:31 Volband wrote:On August 21 2014 03:50 RouaF wrote:
I don't see the problem with this faker stream, it's pretty convenient if you want to spec kr solo queue. I'm not sure if the guy is really making big bucks out of this but if he does then good for him, he was the first to think of this. Do you think he deserves less than camwhores and idiots like trick2g ? Daaymn, talking about being salty. Someone giving entertainment for the masses while teaching lower elo players and trying to erase the typical noob mentality from them, but let's hate him because he's getting $$$ for it and not acting like a priest. I usually just watch him when he soectates low elo plays, because that shit is ridiculous, but lately my favourite part about his stream when people tell him their success stories. I can relate to that because I like to help lower elo players and it's great to hear you actually did something to influence them in a good way, and I couldn't care less if it was "his way" or not, what's important is the message. Yeah he hasn't ruined way more games than he's helped players when people try to do the "hehe i go really fast and splitpush and feed" udyr style that probably 90% of people that I've seen play udyr do (and suck at, and lose the game with). Lata! xD Okay, so if I start to pick up Zed because Faker is so good and I go 0-10 because I actually suck with him, can I blame Faker? You can't be serious blaming him for people's lack of knowledge and/or skill to understand how and why he does what he does, especially since he is basically explaining it over and over again. My experience with the trick-army is that every goddamn game vs them is a pain in the ass and it's a joke how many easy wins I lost because that 1-3-1 Udyr just splitpushed his brain out. Not to mention how easy it is to carry with that playstyle in bronze and silver if someone pays attention. Also, he spectates his subscribers (not just junglers) and points out their mistakes as well, while enlightening the stream viewers that "see, this is why blaming your team is pointless, because you made this and that grave mistake, you just failed to realize it". I don't know what level you're playing at, but where I've been playing these days (high plat-mid diamond smurfs) I have yet to run into a single trick wannabe that has been remotely useful to the team. There's a place for trying that stuff out and it isn't in ranked. Your faker analogy is also flawed because faker doesn't play zed in a very specific way that involves building items that are absolutely worthless for any purpose other than with his playstyle that also requires the rest of the team to at least have some idea of what to do with it (and he usually is playing with either people that know how to play along with it on his main, or is on a smurf where it doesnt matter because you can win with anything when you play far below your level). It's just a cancerous playstyle when used by his legions of terrible followers ends up (again, in my experience) trolling their own team far more often than carrying. The rest of it sounds fine, I have no problem with him being instructive towards peoples mistakes and teaching them to have better attitudes but I'm pretty sure the brainless splitpushing feeding LATA udyrs dwarf the amount of people he's legitmately helped. I won a game like 3 days ago due to a trick style Udyr when we were far behind. Honestly though who cares if there are people trying to imitate him and failing. They stop pretty fast because losing and getting picked off repeatedly trying to split isn't fun. I'm just happy that he is at least teaching new players the value of objectives. A bad udyr isn't half as frustrating as an entire team that repeatedly refuses to take a single turret after a won teamfight.
I have seen it a few times in low plat and most of the time the udyr is a no factor. Either his lanes win without his ganks and pretty much win 4v5 fights while he takes the enemy base or his lanes get crushed because the other jungler goes godlike on somone like vi or eve and all udyr does is turn a 20 min surrender game into a 30 min game because he spiltpushes dragging the game out
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But you guys are all whining about the imitations and not the real thing right? Just so I'm clear?
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On August 21 2014 10:06 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
But you guys are all whining about the imitations and not the real thing right? Just so I'm clear?
Yes, but one causes the other.
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Well this got out of hand, all I meant to say is that you should not blame trick for people failing with his playstyle. That bronzie could just look up a mobafire guide and go 0-10 with it, and that plat guy probably jungles even worse when he tries to play standard stuff, because that splitpushing game got him where he is in the first place, he just apparently failed to adapt to higher elo gameplay. Maybe in gold people did not ward drake as early but they do in plat, who knows. You can't possibly think it did more harm than good to bad players. And exclude the part where you find it frustrating, I hate splitpushing with a passion, but that's a legit playstyle, and if me and my team fail to do anything against it, we deserve to lose.
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Edit:: wait a sec == random patch?
Oh I see Bugfixes
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fiddle not listed? is he still fucked or was he already fixed?
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On August 21 2014 11:26 Volband wrote:
Well this got out of hand, all I meant to say is that you should not blame trick for people failing with his playstyle. That bronzie could just look up a mobafire guide and go 0-10 with it, and that plat guy probably jungles even worse when he tries to play standard stuff, because that splitpushing game got him where he is in the first place, he just apparently failed to adapt to higher elo gameplay. Maybe in gold people did not ward drake as early but they do in plat, who knows. You can't possibly think it did more harm than good to bad players. And exclude the part where you find it frustrating, I hate splitpushing with a passion, but that's a legit playstyle, and if me and my team fail to do anything against it, we deserve to lose.
It doesn't matter. Building retardedly because of a mobafire guide annoys me, it's actually what I call it when people build stupid shit with my friends(We got a Mobafire over here.) I dislike everybody that writes bad mobafire guides and their shitty rating service that allows awful guides to remain the highest rated. Do I go out of my way to look up stupid builds and know who penned them? No, it's a waste of time.
The fact of the matter is that there's this one Udyr build that makes its way around soloqueue that I can specifically trace back to the creator. The people that fail hard with it are so in your face dumb and spout it as if it was divine permission for them to suck ass.
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it's a good build for doing what it is designed to do, but if you've already locked in something that doesn't rush athene's for waveclear when you see that yung tp/smite Udyr lock in, you better snowball 1v1 or rest in peps
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On August 21 2014 12:13 krndandaman wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2014 12:11 Gahlo wrote:On August 21 2014 11:26 Volband wrote:
Well this got out of hand, all I meant to say is that you should not blame trick for people failing with his playstyle. That bronzie could just look up a mobafire guide and go 0-10 with it, and that plat guy probably jungles even worse when he tries to play standard stuff, because that splitpushing game got him where he is in the first place, he just apparently failed to adapt to higher elo gameplay. Maybe in gold people did not ward drake as early but they do in plat, who knows. You can't possibly think it did more harm than good to bad players. And exclude the part where you find it frustrating, I hate splitpushing with a passion, but that's a legit playstyle, and if me and my team fail to do anything against it, we deserve to lose. It doesn't matter. Building retardedly because of a mobafire guide annoys me, it's actually what I call it when people build stupid shit with my friends(We got a Mobafire over here.) I dislike everybody that writes bad mobafire guides and their shitty rating service that allows awful guides to remain the highest rated. Do I go out of my way to look up stupid builds and know who penned them? No, it's a waste of time. The fact of the matter is that there's this one Udyr build that makes its way around soloqueue that I can specifically trace back to the creator. The people that fail hard with it are so in your face dumb and spout it as if it was divine permission for them to suck ass. am I the only one who have never seen these trick 'wannabe's? I must've played 1000+ ranked games and haven't seen one ever. what's his retarded build anyway? tear, swifties, zephyr, etc.?
Madred/Spirit Stone powerfarm into normal Udyr stuff. The build isn't dumb. It's got very clear goals. The issue is some of the people that play it don't know how to play it correctly.
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EPT
