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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
I hope people actually take the time to read this very rare sincere post of mine.
People in this thread really should be more open to discussion and ideas, regardless of who they come from. Not everyone here is Challenger tier, but that doesn't mean what they're saying isn't correct. Regardless of who it is, read the post before jumping to conclusions based off who the poster is. Don't automatically read PrinceXizor's name and disregard what he has to say. Today he truly put some thought and had valid examples to back up what he said. I'm not saying he's 100% right, but for some of you to blatantly disregard what he has to say is not what we should be doing as a community.
I realize there have been plenty of trolls (Shikyo, Sarah Bryant, Mathies, Jazriel, PrinceXizor, etc.) in the history of LoL GD, but honestly not everything they said was bad. Yes, the majority of what they posted was awful, but there were legitimate statements and hypotheses if you cared enough to read. What we as a community need to do is to differentiate the bad posts from the good. Don't rush to the report button simply because you don't agree with something, and please don't report someone based off his prior reputation. Shikyo is back and honestly his posts aren't entirely awful anymore. People can reform, times do change.
Be open to new ideas. It's fine to criticize, it's fine to disagree. But to not even consider his ideas valid simply because of who he is and the fact that he doesn't play the game is absurd. Yango hasn't touched this game in years, yet you still listen to what he has to say. Just because PX used to have some awful ideas doesn't mean that everything he posts is shit. You guys are better than this.
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Oh please...
People in this community are plenty accepting. I am a shit tier Gold IV jungler that just happens to like jungle Diana (a very low tier jungle) more than most and people in this forum are asking me to write guides like I am OddOne playing it. Most of my posts are me wondering what I am doing wrong and lamenting about how bad I am, yet that's fine for them because when I say things they have some actual logic (even if flawed) behind them and I actually play this game currently. I even had a discussion about Maokai with 26 AP in Runes and 21 Offensive masteries the other day lol.
I reported him under "Balance Whine" because he was. He said something along the lines of "Riot has no idea how to balance this game" which is balance whine. Many a poster has been banned for far less in SC2 and other sections as well. What he did is not allowed no matter who you are. Having a large moderation history as mention in his ban makes it even less allowed.
That guy has a history of making wild theories with no factual basis and being very argumentative. Guess what? He was being argumentative as hell yet again.....
I don't happen to know much about Mango's advice, but my bet is it's based off him actually having solid game knowledge and experience (even if not current), along with not starting a fight every post.
The reports were justified as can be, he has a trash history in this section on a site that looks down on trash history, and does not even play the game. He shows up to bash Riot and start fights, that's not being productive, it's not quality, and it's never to my understanding been allowed on TL.
The only thing this forum isn't accepting of is discussing Sejuani without comparing her to Amumu.
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Fuck sake i see PX banned in page 6 and im like "yay, no more bullshit" - end of page 10 he's still posting and arguing.
Roffles, wow. If everyone disregards PX, why wouldnt they disregard you? :D lol i JK. I dont think there was anything wrong with what PX was saying, more the way he was saying it. Using cancer as a comparison, comparing shit to flowers and being a downright stuck up condescending prick doesnt really help even if you are right to begin with. He had some valid points but his deliverance was pretty disgusting.
As for lichbane, theres a clear divide amongst us, if we take that as a solid example of the entire playerbase, there seems to be an issue there, people who thought lichbane needed a nerf arent the vocal minority and arent without reason, which makes it a problem IMO and i dont think riot were wrong to nerf it regardless of whether it was "wrong" or not, if you see what im saying.
Also who the fuck is Jazriel, i missed a troll. IMoperator and Yezzus for 2014 april troll list.
and im still unsure of roffles sincerity, but i'll give him this one D:
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
Please re-read what PX posted today. He was hardly "whining" about balance. He makes realistic posts detailing the fact that Riot has their own ways of balancing the game in which there are metas where certain champions are more viable than others. It's the same for every game out there. Not every champion is played during TI for Dota, and it's the same for League.
And his language wasn't even that bad. Yes he probably shouldn't have used cancer as a comparison, but it's pretty much a running meme in this forum by now. It's normal to be somewhat frustrated when people aren't even listening to what you have to say simply because they're prejudiced against you.
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it was quite close something like 105 out of 120 currently in cm at ti3
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Roffles how do you currently feel about the existence or myth of the Riot-approved Meta after reading the 4.4 patchnotes
I really appreciate the genuine sentiment you've displayed in your previous posts and hope we can get along better in the future.
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On March 18 2014 15:42 Roffles wrote:
Please re-read what PX posted today. He was hardly "whining" about balance. He makes realistic posts detailing the fact that Riot has their own ways of balancing the game in which there are metas where certain champions are more viable than others. It's the same for every game out there. Not every champion is played during TI for Dota, and it's the same for League.
I believe the quote I saw was "Because Riot has no idea how to balance this game". That is balance whine, I've reported probably 100+ people in SC2 threads for less and they got warnings/bans. Some of his posts were fine, some were not. I refreshed the thread after a game, it was the 1st new post I saw, I would have reported it no matter who it was.
Either way, he does nothing but start fights every time and has a bad moderation history. That's cool because once in a blue moon he posts something that's not an rambling mess?
Edit: He got 30 days instead of a warning because of his past doing this stuff. If I had posted that & been reported I would have got 2 day max but more likely a warning. Why? Because I don't post like shit, I respect the rules, and I try and post mainly quality content or just real content. He is not liked because of his actions, don't make this our fault.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On March 18 2014 15:46 Kupon3ss wrote:
Roffles how do you currently feel about the existence or myth of the Riot-approved Meta after reading the 4.4 patchnotes
There's clearly a Riot approved meta because they balance based off what they see and how they feel the state of the game should progress. There's been one since pretty much the beginning of time.
You though should stop using that term in this forum because no good comes from it when you post it.
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I've noticed, but what would you say is a better way of expressing the concept that doesn't take a paragraph every time?
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On March 18 2014 15:46 Diamond wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2014 15:42 Roffles wrote:
Please re-read what PX posted today. He was hardly "whining" about balance. He makes realistic posts detailing the fact that Riot has their own ways of balancing the game in which there are metas where certain champions are more viable than others. It's the same for every game out there. Not every champion is played during TI for Dota, and it's the same for League. I believe the quote I saw was "Because Riot has no idea how to balance this game". That is balance whine, I've reported probably 100+ people in SC2 threads for less and they got warnings/bans. Some of his posts were fine, some were not. I refreshed the thread after a game, it was the 1st new post I saw, I would have reported it no matter who it was. Either way, he does nothing but start fights every time and has a bad moderation history. That's cool because once in a blue moon he posts something that's not an rambling mess? Edit: He got 30 days instead of a warning because of his past doing this stuff. If I had posted that & been reported I would have got 2 day max but more likely a warning. Why? Because I don't post like shit, I respect the rules, and I try and post mainly quality content or just real content. He is not liked because of his actions, don't make this our fault.
And you are also one of the reasons why this GD thread blows. We need people who are willing to share ideas, who are willing to innovate and give their input. If people are not allowed the freedom of speech to express their opinions, then this shouldn't be called TL LoL GD, it should just be renamed TL LoL Chat. Yes, this gives people a lot of leeway to say dumb shit, but honestly those ideas are shot down instantly like Support Warwick. It should be about fostering a good place where people can share ideas and talk about their opinions on the state of the game and how each new patch affects gameplay.
I don't give a shit if PrinceXizor was the worst poster in the past. He sincerely has good ideas to share right now and you are blatantly disregarding them because of who he is. That makes me want to puke.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On March 18 2014 15:51 Kupon3ss wrote:
I've noticed, but what would you say is a better way of expressing the concept that doesn't take a paragraph every time?
Use your imagination Kupo. I'm sure you'll find a way.
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Riot's design philosophy?
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Re-read PX's posts, still agree he had legitimate points but inbetween it was full of condescending sarcasm, rhetorical questions and balance whine. "then you aren't worth enlightening to me." + A post that starts and ends with LOL + "dumb" in most posts + cancer + flowers + everything else i cant be bothered to remember because i has headache. He was actually self-martyring (not in a TL sense, mods) with the "Oh you dont like me thats why you arent agreeing with me!" line.
Like, if he wasnt being such an ass i think that could have been a great discussion. Instead i skipped it and am sad TL GD doesnt have reading material for me on this morn.
and dammit kupon, your posts are a broken record  Every game is "company-approved meta".
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On March 18 2014 15:52 Roffles wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2014 15:46 Diamond wrote:On March 18 2014 15:42 Roffles wrote:
Please re-read what PX posted today. He was hardly "whining" about balance. He makes realistic posts detailing the fact that Riot has their own ways of balancing the game in which there are metas where certain champions are more viable than others. It's the same for every game out there. Not every champion is played during TI for Dota, and it's the same for League. I believe the quote I saw was "Because Riot has no idea how to balance this game". That is balance whine, I've reported probably 100+ people in SC2 threads for less and they got warnings/bans. Some of his posts were fine, some were not. I refreshed the thread after a game, it was the 1st new post I saw, I would have reported it no matter who it was. Yet my "stupid" ideas don't get me endless hate because I am not a dick when I suggest them, and open to feedback, and at least try to provide logic and real reasoning and actual game results behind my ideas. All things he does not. Either way, he does nothing but start fights every time and has a bad moderation history. That's cool because once in a blue moon he posts something that's not an rambling mess? Edit: He got 30 days instead of a warning because of his past doing this stuff. If I had posted that & been reported I would have got 2 day max but more likely a warning. Why? Because I don't post like shit, I respect the rules, and I try and post mainly quality content or just real content. He is not liked because of his actions, don't make this our fault. And you are also one of the reasons why this GD thread blows. We need people who are willing to share ideas, who are willing to innovate and give their input. If people are not allowed the freedom of speech to express their opinions, then this shouldn't be called TL LoL GD, it should just be renamed TL LoL Chat. Yes, this gives people a lot of leeway to say dumb shit, but honestly those ideas are shot down instantly like Support Warwick. It should be about fostering a good place where people can share ideas and talk about their opinions on the state of the game and how each new patch affects gameplay. I don't give a shit if PrinceXizor was the worst poster in the past. He sincerely has good ideas to share right now and you are blatantly disregarding them because of who he is. That makes me want to puke.
Ok.
I have mained jungle Diana since Season 2. Shyvana was one of my most played champions in Season 3, and almost none of them were after the rework. I have been advocating for Lich Bane on Diana since the item did physical damage on it's proc. I just yesterday suggested the idea of running 26 flat ap runes 21/9/0 Maokai in real games. I spent two days trying to get TL LoL to discuss Sejuani without it turning into Mummy vs Sej debate just several weeks ago because I found her very strong after the Spirit Stone changes. I am currently writing a jungle Diana guide under the pretense that she is a very STRONG jungler (a view literally 0 good jungle pros have, and more than likely they are right) as this moment in time rushing Lich Bane as a 1st item. My main champ I play in Dominion is AD Diana. Any time since S2 I get top lane (my least desired role) I ask to 1v2 bot lane. I thrive on unique play, although I learn the "meta" play too.
This forum is very good for debate about anything. It's the best in the world imo in it. Although the skill level of the posters is never for sure (yet never questioned unless relevant to the discussion) you will almost always get someone that is willing to discuss any idea, no matter how crazy. Now if it's crazy people will tell you it is, but they will discuss why and not just call you an idiot.
That poster is shit and he broke a rule on a forum for a game he does not play and has received many moderation actions on. I know that you know TL enough to know that is enough for moderation action. Don't white knight and act like I'm trying to oppress free speech, I'm trying to get an argumentative troll to shut the hell up because I don't want to see stupid posts like "Riot has no idea how to balance this game". He is a troll when he is in this section, 110%.
If you want to have a legit discussion about ANYTHING at all in league, TL LoL is the place. There is players of all skill levels willing to discuss any stupid thing you want about this game. It's a great place, and that troll was not making it any better and nothing at all is lost with him being temp banned.
I have to go to bed now, but please stop acting like he is not violating rules on this site, and instead is being "witch hunted". He's been singled out because he is argumentative at all times in the section and has been told publicly to stop. He did not and received the consequences. End of story, he broke the rules and paid.
Edit: I always look at the post 1st. I was already on the 'report button" when I even looked who the post was by, that made the decision all the easier.
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On March 18 2014 15:46 Kupon3ss wrote:
Roffles how do you currently feel about the existence or myth of the Riot-approved Meta after reading the 4.4 patchnotes
I really appreciate the genuine sentiment you've displayed in your previous posts and hope we can get along better in the future.
I think anyone who's doing patch changes for any game runs into the sentiment of "approved meta".
It's just a matter of what each individual person's "breaking point" is for where it stands. I would say majority of Riot's changes are not usually there to "force" or to "create" a specific meta/playstyle/interaction. I think for the most part they're just fairly reactionary as to what they perceive is bad or unhealthy. Which does lead to the feel that they're forcing certain things. The top and middle tower changes are probably what you're mostly hinting at, as this is one of the bigger issues in regards to "Riot's enforced meta" that you like to spout. They did indeed specify they would like to see less 2v1's, but not necessarily eliminate it. (in regards to how they viewed it, I think they saw it like people saw 4 gate at its peak, a good strategy that was simply too prevalent). Though I don't like the way they went about doing the changes, I don't disagree with the intent of the changes. We saw too many teams trying to circumvent shitty lanes (LOOKING AT U CPTSHITTER AND SHITBOY) by gambling on lane swaps. Now a days we still get quite a few 2v1's, but not quite as prevalent, which is exactly what they wanted.
It's important to divide Riot's: intent, problem detection, solution, and result of solution; when talking about changes.
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On March 18 2014 15:40 Omnishroud wrote:
Fuck sake i see PX banned in page 6 and im like "yay, no more bullshit" - end of page 10 he's still posting and arguing.
Roffles, wow. If everyone disregards PX, why wouldnt they disregard you? :D lol i JK. I dont think there was anything wrong with what PX was saying, more the way he was saying it. Using cancer as a comparison, comparing shit to flowers and being a downright stuck up condescending prick doesnt really help even if you are right to begin with. He had some valid points but his deliverance was pretty disgusting.
As for lichbane, theres a clear divide amongst us, if we take that as a solid example of the entire playerbase, there seems to be an issue there, people who thought lichbane needed a nerf arent the vocal minority and arent without reason, which makes it a problem IMO and i dont think riot were wrong to nerf it regardless of whether it was "wrong" or not, if you see what im saying.
Also who the fuck is Jazriel, i missed a troll. IMoperator and Yezzus for 2014 april troll list.
and im still unsure of roffles sincerity, but i'll give him this one D:
You missed Jazriel? Rough bro. He's still my favorite. I look into his post history sometimes when I want a good laugh.
I agree with what Roffles was saying (and I know that's easy to say, but hey), it's natural to have a negative mindset against some posters because, well, they're simply worse posters than others, but I think PX in particular could be a LOT worse. Not really going to discuss moderation measures here, but apart from a few bannable posts he had, there were attempts at legitimate discussion which were hiveminded down. I also think we get too hyped up on making fun of IMoperator, he bitches a lot and it's annoying, but there's no reason to make sure you think so every time he posts something, even when it's a perfectly legitimate post that has nothing to do with balance whine. I don't want to sound like I'm white-knighting, even though I probably am, but it's just something that I think about.
As for Riot's patching, it sometimes seems like its going two directions at once, and I think the issue is that, internally, their statements and opinions are too nonspecific. It's too open to interpretation, which allows them to sort of bend and paraphrase (perhaps unintentionally, it's a young company) in order to justify their patching. It just feels like there's a disconnection rather than one giant nerfing entity. I don't really know what I'm talking about though. Just two cents.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
On March 18 2014 06:08 Harem wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2014 05:58 Diamond wrote:
Wonder how Naut does with 21/9/0 masteries and 5% cdr blues in this season? Having Titan's Wrath on a 16 or so sec c/d (with 5% from masteries) might be pretty badass actually.
And I say 21/9/0 because right now like no good jungle champ uses 9/21/0 or 0/21/9 anymore that I can think of. Amumu uses 0/21/9. Edit: Locicero, type thereisnourflevel into client and it works.
I personally prefer 9/21/0 on Amumu for the extra AP, the only really useufl thing you get from 9 in utility is buff duration, that imo doesn't compensate for the loss in AP and CDR.
Also wow@roffles, where has your inner batman gone
support warwick didn't get shot down instantly, it took us 2 days to mercykill that beast
why write about jungle Diana with the pretense that she's good even though you agree that that's probably not the case? Wouldn't it then make more sense to write it with the pretense that she is incredibly situational?
On March 18 2014 08:45 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2014 08:40 Slusher wrote:On March 18 2014 08:39 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:On March 18 2014 08:23 Slusher wrote:
mainly we've seen 3 champions in the last 6 months reach first pick first ban on the back of Lich bane, and every time one has gotten nerfed the next best Lich user has stepped up in their place (giving TF a pass since his ult is the bigger reason he was strong) Yeah no you're wrong lol. elaborate? the strengths of lulu/kayle/fizz/tf are all very little to do with them dealing extra damage on their autos and a hell of a lot more to do with the fact that lulu provides a toolkit of utrility, kayle provides a good heal and an insane ult as well as being a bully with her nuke and her E. Fizz has incredible mobility and can nuke squishies down with spells alone and is hard to kill. TF provides split push and insane gank utility. At no point in time people looked at these characters and thought "wow if only they did more damage on autos i could see a use for this guy:"
This isn't correct because the extra damage on AAs constitutes a massive part of their laning phase, even if it might not be AS relevant later in the game
The jungler ban reasoning of PX seems reasonable. Even though it might not necessarily be correct to think this way, a lot of people do, therefore a lot of jungle bans happen.
I think the Lichbane thing is pretty silly, there have been tons of dominant mids who use Zhonyas and Rabadons as well and had these items not been in the game, they probably wouldn't be dominant either. I don't see why should Lichbane be the target of nerfbat due to that reason.
Oh, there's more posts after that LOL. PX needs a can of chill and so do a few others
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Tbh, while I very much disagreed with virtually everything PX posted in the last 3 pages and thought his points were complete bunk, I don't think much of what he posted was bannable, except maybe the first one I responded to, which was just straight up a blatant zero content post that was just "RIOT SUX AMIRITE.
On March 18 2014 16:40 Scip wrote:
I think the Lichbane thing is pretty silly, there have been tons of dominant mids who use Zhonyas and Rabadons as well and had these items not been in the game, they probably wouldn't be dominant either. I don't see why should Lichbane be the target of banhammer due to that reason.
The difference is that Riot wants Lichbane to serve a specific niche, but its pre-nerf incarnation was so good it was being used for far more than its intended purpose. Zhonyas and Rabadons, for the most part, fulfill their intended purpose and not anything else.
While I tend to disagree with the philosophy of having things only be used for their intended purpose, in the case of Lichbane I think it was warranted. Pre-patch Lichbane is almost what pre-rework DFG (the incarnation where the nuke scaled off AP) was. It basically gives any AP caster who had the skill set to get in even just one auto attack an extra 0.75 AP nuke. This makes judging the strength of AP champions far more complicated than necessary.
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For what it's worth, I think that the TL LoL GD chat can be toxic, though it's probably close to 80-85% of the time you can engage someone (or someones) in an actual conversation about a particular topic/idea. It all boils down to two things:
1. How you phrase your idea/topic, and
2. How you respond to it.
Given enough time I feel most people here will try to write up a reasonable response, but seeing as we all have varying degrees of this thing called a "real life," not everyone can give the time needed for such a response, so this person writes a rather curt, possibly rude, response. And the person who proposed the idea takes it as an assault on their character and feels the need to defend themselves. And this is how things get toxic.
All I am suggesting is to take time with any reply, and if you don't, say the idea is good or bad, but you will expand upon it in a later post when you have free time for it.
tl;dr version: don't get your panties in a bunch if you propose an idea and multiple people poo-poo on it.
As for the talk about jungle Diana, her issue is that she can't engage too well pre-6, her shield got nerfed a ton so you can't do a Riven-esque build of full damage and have the shield keep you alive when you dive with your Q-R, and while Lich Bane is good on her, I'd probably build it after getting Spectral Wraith and another offensive AP item, like a Rabadons, Rylei's, Zhonyas or Void Staff. Personally, if she could build Tear any faster and have the AA be the second offensive item I think that would give her the "tankiness" needed to be a viable jungler again. Maybe with a build path of Machete + pots > Spirit Stone > Tear > Wraith/Golem > AA > Lich Bane > Rabadons, with the AA turning into a Seraph's around the time Lich Bane completes.
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I have such a love/hate relationship with top, i love playing it, unless i have to face darius/tryndamere/teemo/jax, then i just sit and cry at my tower for 20 minutes and those picks are all thats ever fucking picked i swear to you.
Any tips on how not to cry vs those?
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EPT
