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On November 27 2013 15:28 ticklishmusic wrote:
I think the knee-jerk nerf to Targon's was too much (I know its doing a lot more than Riot seems to want it to be doing on PBE) but the new only melee/ 60 second thing is a little to weak IMO.
Assist streaks are a little too much, really favors champs like Taric who hit R and get assists for every kill. If Riot bothered programming a proper assist calculator based off of CC/ buff/ damage, it would solve a lot of the complaints about assist gold/credit is allocated.
I stand by my assertion there is no point in playing "real" games right now, just play ARAM and All for One. Who knows, maybe even play Dominion.
Join me.
It's Fast. It's Fun.
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On November 27 2013 15:28 ticklishmusic wrote:
I think the knee-jerk nerf to Targon's was too much (I know its doing a lot more than Riot seems to want it to be doing on PBE) but the new only melee/ 60 second thing is a little to weak IMO.
Assist streaks are a little too much, really favors champs like Taric who hit R and get assists for every kill. If Riot bothered programming a proper assist calculator based off of CC/ buff/ damage, it would solve a lot of the complaints about assist gold/credit is allocated.
I stand by my assertion there is no point in playing "real" games right now, just play ARAM and All for One. Who knows, maybe even play Dominion.
I think they are over nerfing it on purpose so they can get data on the other gold items. Once they have a decent understanding of how all the gold items function at all levels it will be a simple matter to tweak the numbers. That would be hard to do at this point since I doubt I am alone in never even seeing the other items after the first day of release this preseason. Expect a buff to it before provisionals.
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On November 27 2013 14:59 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2013 14:54 thenexusp wrote:Fun fact about Ashe: She has the highest level 18 attack speed in the game. This isn't counting abilities or passives though, as she obviously loses out in the steroids department. But despite having no steroids her damage isn't as bad as it might seem on first blush. On November 27 2013 14:53 Gahlo wrote:On November 27 2013 14:47 canikizu wrote:On November 27 2013 14:44 nosliw wrote:
Any ashe players on TL?
learning to play her because she is only 450 IP. What are some tips/tricks? Good guides? They chase you run, they run you chase. Use spells wisely to assist your running and chasing. pretty much it. Your arrows are like blitz hooks, but people will rage harder if you miss. Her arrow is like 3x wider than a blitz hook or varus ult though, it's hard to miss if you use it at all thoughtfully She used to be considered a hypercarry at one point. + Show Spoiler +inb4, no such thing as hypercarry in LoL
That was a combination of her kiting being very strong, ADCs being much stronger than they are now, and weaker gap closing champions in the meta.
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On November 27 2013 16:02 Velocirapture wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2013 15:28 ticklishmusic wrote:
I think the knee-jerk nerf to Targon's was too much (I know its doing a lot more than Riot seems to want it to be doing on PBE) but the new only melee/ 60 second thing is a little to weak IMO.
Assist streaks are a little too much, really favors champs like Taric who hit R and get assists for every kill. If Riot bothered programming a proper assist calculator based off of CC/ buff/ damage, it would solve a lot of the complaints about assist gold/credit is allocated.
I stand by my assertion there is no point in playing "real" games right now, just play ARAM and All for One. Who knows, maybe even play Dominion. I think they are over nerfing it on purpose so they can get data on the other gold items. Once they have a decent understanding of how all the gold items function at all levels it will be a simple matter to tweak the numbers. That would be hard to do at this point since I doubt I am alone in never even seeing the other items after the first day of release this preseason. Expect a buff to it before provisionals.
I think they actually just cave really easily to public opinion at least when it comes to nerfs. I think they actually think the changes will make relic shield balanced.
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I guess I understand why people are complaining about the game being slower-paced, but I don't understand why anyone doesn't do anything to try and change it. I mean I guess most of this falls on the jungler's shoulders since they have the most impact in terms of game rhythm since most of the time (in silver at least ^^ its 1-1-2 lanes for both teams... But why haven't any new junglers entered the pool of viability. I'm just seeing all the same junglers from s3, just with less ganking because people are sad that the level three timing is gone and decide to just farm the jungle... Why not just pick a different jungler that can gank effectively at level two with a lot of CC, and doesn't need to afk farm jungle to be effective? Just because champs like ali/leona/thresh/blitz (to a lesser extent nami and lulu) were played as supports in s3 doesn't mean they have to be supports in s4. Super frustrating to see like zero innovation with the changes and just people shoehorning old champs into new metas and giving them all shields of infinite money -.-;;
/rant
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http://euw.leagueoflegends.com/node/9022
Whyyyy.
Now people will have my Badger Teemo skin, or all those legacy skins I picked up in that grand sale. QQ.
My only consolation is that they'll decide to pick up Emerald Taric. pls, it doesn't even have fuzzy cufflets.
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On November 27 2013 15:28 ticklishmusic wrote:
I think the knee-jerk nerf to Targon's was too much (I know its doing a lot more than Riot seems to want it to be doing on PBE) but the new only melee/ 60 second thing is a little to weak IMO.
Assist streaks are a little too much, really favors champs like Taric who hit R and get assists for every kill. If Riot bothered programming a proper assist calculator based off of CC/ buff/ damage, it would solve a lot of the complaints about assist gold/credit is allocated.
I stand by my assertion there is no point in playing "real" games right now, just play ARAM and All for One. Who knows, maybe even play Dominion.
It was giving like two times more gold than the other gold items, so it makes a lot of sense...
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Is it just me or did the hotfix not go through??
BT still 3000 gold, relic/targon are the same
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Wait what, BT 3000 gold?
Maybe I should be building it more often, then. It certainly deals the most damage.
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United States47024 Posts
On November 27 2013 15:28 ticklishmusic wrote:
Assist streaks are a little too much, really favors champs like Taric who hit R and get assists for every kill. If Riot bothered programming a proper assist calculator based off of CC/ buff/ damage, it would solve a lot of the complaints about assist gold/credit is allocated.
The problem with assists is that they're not well scaled over # of participants. Pre-patch the total assist gold was fixed regardless of the number of contributors. So if it was a 2-person kill it felt like the assist was worth most of the kill, but when you had 5-person teamfight kills, the per-player assist value seemed really low overall. In fact, because of how concentrated blocks of larger amounts of gold are more impactful (since gold in and of itself is meaningless unless it gets you to an item), it felt like 5-person kills were worse than 2-person kills as far as assist value went.
Assist streaks go too far in the opposite direction--the base assist value is so low that the overall assist value is too high for 5-person kills compared to 2-person kills.
Ideally you want some happy medium where overall assist gold scales appropriately by number of players involved, so that it feels rewarding and not wasteful in all cases.
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On November 27 2013 16:28 GTPGlitch wrote:I guess I understand why people are complaining about the game being slower-paced, but I don't understand why anyone doesn't do anything to try and change it. I mean I guess most of this falls on the jungler's shoulders since they have the most impact in terms of game rhythm since most of the time (in silver at least ^^ its 1-1-2 lanes for both teams... But why haven't any new junglers entered the pool of viability. I'm just seeing all the same junglers from s3, just with less ganking because people are sad that the level three timing is gone and decide to just farm the jungle... Why not just pick a different jungler that can gank effectively at level two with a lot of CC, and doesn't need to afk farm jungle to be effective? Just because champs like ali/leona/thresh/blitz (to a lesser extent nami and lulu) were played as supports in s3 doesn't mean they have to be supports in s4. Super frustrating to see like zero innovation with the changes and just people shoehorning old champs into new metas and giving them all shields of infinite money -.-;; /rant
I believe that the biggest issue right now, is that it's rather difficult to close out the game during mid-game unless you're extremely far ahead (think something like 20-3 or similar). Most games I've played in ranked lately, playing when ahead and also when behind, still end up going into 35-40+ minutes, because everyone is stacking wave clear, and even if you don't double targon can help you as well. Games are now decided by factors like late-game positioning when baiting for baron or sieging towers rather than rewarding mid-game team play like in Season 3.
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Korea (South)11232 Posts
argh why does the update take so long to download 
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Anyone else has the feeling that ARAM champion selection is not random at all? From a pool of 16 champs I have to play always as Ashe, Ryze or the lamest champ from the free rotation.
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Just had a mid Riven and Annie support... But they couldn't trade for some reason so the Annie has AD runes and masteries and Riven has AP runes and masteries. The Riven player can only support so he goes support Riven with the Annie going mid.
The Riven goes 9-3-12, with 2 triple kills in teamfights and so on. Well, first time getting carried by AP rune support Riven. New meta? BTW, goes to show that teamcomp in plat is -very- important.
Oh, and I think I figured out how to handle Pantheon as Fiora. Just need to go on him hard and relentlessly. He cannot actually trade autos at all. After 6 it's an easy win if you aren't completely screwed(often might be). Getting a single gank from your jungler, even if it only takes like 250 hp off Pantheon and makes him miss a few minions, might already make the lane manageable / won.
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On November 27 2013 18:01 drkcid wrote:
Anyone else has the feeling that ARAM champion selection is not random at all? From a pool of 16 champs I have to play always as Ashe, Ryze or the lamest champ from the free rotation.
When i first played ARAM, i got Viktor 7 times in 8 games.  I have almost all the champs too.
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Cognitive bias.
On November 27 2013 14:59 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2013 14:54 thenexusp wrote:Fun fact about Ashe: She has the highest level 18 attack speed in the game. This isn't counting abilities or passives though, as she obviously loses out in the steroids department. But despite having no steroids her damage isn't as bad as it might seem on first blush. On November 27 2013 14:53 Gahlo wrote:On November 27 2013 14:47 canikizu wrote:On November 27 2013 14:44 nosliw wrote:
Any ashe players on TL?
learning to play her because she is only 450 IP. What are some tips/tricks? Good guides? They chase you run, they run you chase. Use spells wisely to assist your running and chasing. pretty much it. Your arrows are like blitz hooks, but people will rage harder if you miss. Her arrow is like 3x wider than a blitz hook or varus ult though, it's hard to miss if you use it at all thoughtfully She used to be considered a hypercarry at one point. + Show Spoiler +inb4, no such thing as hypercarry in LoL
GP used to be considered a late game powerhouse with excellent scaling, too. 
Jungling is frustrating. Well, the fact that there're bronze-level players amongst the stack doesn't help since I simply can't rely on them during my ganks (basically work if they can QWER to bring the damage, or are getting dived and I get the kill by myself), but even if I manage to somehow get a kill or two I don't really feel ahed of people, while had I just afk-farmed I'd at least have leveled a bit faster than pre-patch and been able to force drakes and/or dives better.
Then midgame rolls around and everything I did is rendered meaningless by drake and especially assist streaks, as after 2-3 teamfights pretty much everyone has the same gold regardless of who farmed, ganked, got ganked, etc.
It's a bit disheartening, and also frustrating because you can't leverage your power spikes as much. Better simply play an afk-farming jungler, play it as such till the teamfights start while skipping the jungle item, and then group and revel in free dough.
I've had the most success with Mundo when I end up rich as fuck anyway (and because his W makes it easier to get assists than Vi's or Jarvan's kits) and I've had to deal with splitpushing Shyvana/Nasus/etc. a whole lot, who don't even appear on the map before they're level 9 or so, skip the jungle item, and do nothing but try to backdoor/splitpush the whole game (because although our solo laners are often weak and don't require attention, we manage to overtake the teamfights since they receive so much free gold from them the lack of farm stop mattering), and the lack of vision doesn't help (I help to ward during the first 30 minutes but once I'm out of slots we only have the support, the others don't even use the trinket).
I know part of it comes from the players, but considering my faith in stuff such as players starting to actually ward, it just makes me annoyed than the most contribution I've seen junglers have from all these games is afk farm to reach their 40-minutes 6-items mark faster.
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On the LoL website page detailing the free champion rotation, Quinn as listed as "Ranged, Carry". Forever forgotten...
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United States47024 Posts
So, something just occurred to me.
Why is it that kill value is based on kill/death streak and not champion level? Riot has already had to implement not one, but TWO band-aid fixes to the system to handle abuses cases (assists partially resetting death streaks to avoid 0/x/y supports being worth no gold to kill, and farming partially resetting death streaks to avoid the feeding split-pusher abuse case), plus there's still the counter-intuitive case where someone who is on a death streak should avoid getting kills because he will reset his gold value (where the intuitive choice is for that player to get kills to have the gold to catch up).
Champion level is by far a better indicator than kill/death streak of who is ahead/behind anyway. Given how much they've already had to band-aid the system of kill/death streak to avoid the abuse cases--and how it STILL has counter-intuitive edge cases anyway--it just seems to make more sense to change it entirely.
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You see, Yango, The reason we can't implement that is because it would make too much sense.
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Government does this too where they make really unintuitive laws to deal with edge cases. I'm learning about all these weird laws and something I'm working with right now is the half year rule where you can only get depreciation tax up to half the amount for the first year.
When a system is overly complicated one way to control it to behave the way you want is to implement very specific and unintuitive changes. I personally don't like these design choices from a fundamental point of view because it ends up making the system more complex, but someone at Riot does.
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EPT
