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On July 31 2013 04:36 Clinic wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2013 04:34 Slusher wrote:
honestly if you get stuck with 5th pick, support Syndra isn't THAT troll, she has tools. 'going duo mid' playing nontraditional supports that need to be described as not THAT troll probably are better left out of ranked or played with the understanding that the resulting game is probably not going to be very useful for improving as a player
she has a vision check, a slow and a stun, as well as good lvl6 burst, back before people played her mid there was a camp that thought she could be viable as a support and I still tend to agree.
it's a positive alternative to duo mid, and if he plays Syndra that much I'm sure he's skilled enough to hit his slows and stuns.
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On July 31 2013 03:22 JimmiC wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2013 03:10 Taktik wrote:
I just lost my second series to plat 1-3 and only two of these game i played my main role, so mad right now >< I dont know how to play these I feel like i should just pick support and someday I will be carried trough series by my team, not doing much TT I feel confused because you seem to understand the game well enough to almost make it to plat. But then clearly don't because you think support doesn't do much. I think support is more often the bigger factor in bot lane then the adc.
Even if i play right as a support and my adc go even or ahead after laning phase, I feel like a ward machine afterwards. It would be totally different if i had played solo lane because it just feels u got more tools to outplay / make a difference.
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On July 31 2013 04:13 ReketSomething wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2013 03:58 Gahlo wrote:On July 31 2013 01:09 Mauzel wrote:
Maybe this is a dumb question but is top lane soloQ meta like
Tier 0: Kennen / Jayce
Tier 1: Elise (post nerf) / Riven / Renekton / Ryze / Wukong / Tryn
Tier 2: Singed / Malph / Vlad / Nasus / Yorick / Rumble / Jax / Cho / Shen
Edit: Where tier is some weird subjective combo of popularity / win rate Riven really that high? I mean, my favorite champ and all, but I never saw her being there. All I know is that if you are way better than your opponent, you can get early kills on Riven and snowball hard. For example, a challenger Riven will probably get FB against ̶a̶ ̶g̶o̶l̶d̶ ̶p̶l̶a̶y̶e̶r̶ hotshotgg at level 1 or 2 whereas someone like Jax wont get a kill for a while.
Well I also put Riven Tier 1 just cause of zionspartan's 5-0 Riven lol.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
Malphite runs pretty quickly out of mana, I usually start Flask+3 on Jax, don't need a ward because I am Jax and because Malphite will push (and really has no choice but to). He can't harass through the Flash+3, he runs out of mana, to harass you out he needs more mana efficient skills (lvl4-5) and save mana for that, but that's pretty close to Jax getting his ultimate.
After that it's standard, you can usually outdamage Malphite through his E and shield, but you have to keep going hard, so his shield doesn't rapp you. You might have to flash his close range ultimate, which is quite difficult, but doable.
Against Malph I go 9/21/0, take Magic resist quints and blues, armor yellow and I THINK I take attack speed reds against him, that is to keep up your ultimate and passive stacks after he Es you at higher levels, but I am not sure it's necessary. Maybe just take AD.
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On July 31 2013 04:49 Slusher wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2013 04:36 Clinic wrote:On July 31 2013 04:34 Slusher wrote:
honestly if you get stuck with 5th pick, support Syndra isn't THAT troll, she has tools. 'going duo mid' playing nontraditional supports that need to be described as not THAT troll probably are better left out of ranked or played with the understanding that the resulting game is probably not going to be very useful for improving as a player she has a vision check, a slow and a stun, as well as good lvl6 burst, back before people played her mid there was a camp that thought she could be viable as a support and I still tend to agree. it's a positive alternative to duo mid, and if he plays Syndra that much I'm sure he's skilled enough to hit his slows and stuns.
fair enough, i'll buy that (though mostly for the positive alternative bit). now to see if he does
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United States47024 Posts
I don't particularly like the fact that he referenced DotA when it came to "anything can work" because while that's true, people will still call you a troll and rage at you for going duo mid.
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I like duo mid conceptually because while it is difficult to gank, it is the most difficult lane to ward for. Also, support AP can ward for both top and bot. Finally, mid tower is probably the most important tower with regards to map control and with a 2v1 you can pretty safely put some damage on it I think.
That said I really have no clue because I've never played in a 2v1 lane.
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On July 31 2013 04:54 Scip wrote:
Malphite runs pretty quickly out of mana, I usually start Flask+3 on Jax, don't need a ward because I am Jax and because Malphite will push (and really has no choice but to). He can't harass through the Flash+3, he runs out of mana, to harass you out he needs more mana efficient skills (lvl4-5) and save mana for that, but that's pretty close to Jax getting his ultimate.
After that it's standard, you can usually outdamage Malphite through his E and shield, but you have to keep going hard, so his shield doesn't rapp you. You might have to flash his close range ultimate, which is quite difficult, but doable.
Against Malph I go 9/21/0, take Magic resist quints and blues, armor yellow and I THINK I take attack speed reds against him, that is to keep up your ultimate and passive stacks after he Es you at higher levels, but I am not sure it's necessary. Maybe just take AD.
Idk mang, I feel like malphite could just start faerie + 3 mana pots + 3 health pots + ward and push your shit in. If he's smart he won't be spamming Q until level 3 and then again at level 5, and then he'll just E everytime you try to trade. In my experience it is not a favorable matchup for jax unless he can hang in there in CS until ~level 9
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jax has zero issues farming under tower
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Duoing mid with someone who's on board is fine, stuffing yourself into "someone else's" lane and potentially abandoning a adc marksman who was expecting help is inconsiderate at best.
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On July 31 2013 05:01 Mauzel wrote:
I like duo mid conceptually because while it is difficult to gank, it is the most difficult lane to ward for. Also, support AP can ward for both top and bot. Finally, mid tower is probably the most important tower with regards to map control and with a 2v1 you can pretty safely put some damage on it I think.
That said I really have no clue because I've never played in a 2v1 lane.
there are situations where duo mid is a very good idea, in which case the ad and support are sent mid
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On July 31 2013 04:35 NeoIllusions wrote:
I'm not sold on Jax atm. If someone on NA wants to test this out tomorrow, PM me. I'll be the Malphite.
Not sure what this would prove tbh. A lot of Malphite's strength is in how well he assists ganks because he has a way to initiate them from a screen away (specially once Jax's flash is down). I generally run magic pen marks/armor seals+quints/scaling mr glyphs. If you want to simply dominate Jax, flat mr glyphs are probably better (but I don't have enough rune pages for two specialized Malph ones :>). If you don't play Malph much, early mana management will definitely be a problem.
On July 31 2013 04:32 Lord Tolkien wrote:I almost never lose to Jax as Irelia or Fiora, yet I will readily admit that it's due to in-depth champion/matchup knowledge, and a lack thereof from my opponent.
Or that theorycraft doesn't translate well. :p
Statements like this blow my mind whole. Irelia vs Jax I can understand because of how important the junglers are. Fiora vs Jax should never, ever be lost by the Jax. I've had games where I've fed 5-6 kills because their jungler camped the ever living crap out of me with their mid and STILL stomped a Fiora in lane because what the hell can she do to Jax after a point. You have to be so mind numbingly far behind to lose this as Jax if you have any idea how he works at all. Every time I get this matchup the enemy jungler ends up whining because they dedicated so many resources, helped their top get kills, and their top is still absolutely useless.
Also I think people's impression of the Jax vs Malphite matchup is pretty skewed by small sample sizes. I've played about 100 Jax games this season and Scip has too, but maybe 10 of those are against Malphite? How many Rock specialists are out there? My guess is there's far fewer of them than Jax specialists because Malph is pretty boring. I've played a decent number of games as Malph vs Jax, but it's still around 10, so I still don't have a very complete picture of the ideal way to play the matchup.
That being said, if someone pointed a gun at my head I'd still probably take Rockman.
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10 games is quite a lot for a specific matchup
id take malph too, but i like playing malphite more so that doesnt mean anythinhg
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On July 31 2013 05:13 Slayer91 wrote:
10 games is quite a lot for a specific matchup
It's really not though. Especially if half of those matchups had a huge skill disparity or some weird level 1 fight, which isn't uncommon.
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United States37500 Posts
z0r, what is with dis logic. :< gtfo
And I probably main Malph. sup?
Winning > boring. I blame Slayer for having a small but efficient champ pool.
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why would skill disparity be so common if you're playing vs top lane players at your elo?
boring is subjective, i have a lot of fun playing the most "boring" champs like udyr sona amumu and shit
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Ya saw some pro games where they would send like vayne + support mid and then karthus or something bot.
But I think it could work in SoloQ even w/ 2 AP mid and ADC bot as long as morale was okay. Dunno people in SoloQ can be surprisingly chill. Once someone on my team mispicked a support when we already had one at like 1000 ELO and then we were all like fuck it lets all go support.
But then enemy team dodged prolly cause they thought we were playing M5 protect the kog (except with no kog) or something which we basically were so I can understand where they are coming from because our team comp looked preeeetttyyy op.
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I pull off lane swaps because I can explain how it is strictly superior. I pick tryn, since I suck at everything top, and get counter picked with malph. I tell the bot lane I want to swap, because I will lose against malph, and they might win against bottom, but if they swap, I will lose to bot, but they will win vs malph, a strict upgrade.
But this is with players who understand the concept of the lane swap, how you're supposed to play it, and that I'm putting myself into the shitty lane and giving them the easy lane.
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For what it's worth http://www.lolking.net/charts?region=all&type=top-matchup&range=daily&map=sr&queue=1x1&league=diamond shows Malphite's team winning against Jax's team 67% of the time. (There were no data points in Challenger.)
But it also shows Malph only wins 47% of the time against a Tryndamere team. (If you include all ELO it shows Malph with a lower winrate vs Jax but actually gains a positive one against Tryndamere.)
So maybe the lesson is you should be skilled enough at the match up that your pick should contribute to what your team needs rather than who actually "wins the lane."
Or just 1v1 me nub gg ur jungler camps.
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Let me quote myself
On July 31 2013 05:21 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
I suck at everything top
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EPT
