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On July 06 2013 22:41 Shikyo wrote:
I really wish Riot would hurry up with the next patch. Nunu ridiculous, Draven really stupid and both instaloss whenever someone doesn't ban them -.- Still numerous champions that aren't viable either in competitive or casual... Oh and Jayce
Champions that are not viable ? Could you bother expanding those thoughts my dear Shikyo ?
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On July 06 2013 23:34 forscher wrote:
Hi folks - been lurking around for a couple of months, I really enjoy reading the league related discussions on TL. You have a nice community here. If any of you are playing sub-30 normals (I'm guessing that's not likely) I'm always looking for more reasonable people to play with.
I also can't wait for Nunu to get nerfed somehow. Ever since that trick guy made his video about stealing buffs at level 1 I've been seeing people trying it even at my level. Super annoying to jungle against.
you should be aware though for the record though, nunu is up there with warwick for champs that aren't as rune/masteries dependant to jungle, so they're good at low levels, even before the current nunu flavour of the month
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I'm probably in the minority here but I honestly don't think Nunu's that strong. At least not as strong as people are making him out to be. I'm bouncing between plat 1~2 atm so I'm no pro but I wouldn't say I'm playing against complete trash players. Honestly, I see a lot of Nunu jungles do pretty well early counterjungling but the lack of real scaling kinda hurts. You basically end up with 2 supports on your team if it drags out. While the opposing jungle will be very poor for a while they can still catch up by leeching gold/exp for laners when they recall or through global objectives. On top of that, if by some miracle the opposing solo q team is responsive/good ward coverage, your counter jungling can actually set you back more than the opponent if you're not careful. On top of that, his ganking is very strong if the enemy doesn't ward, but once they have good coverage your ganking is mediocre. Snowball doesn't slow all that much until you get a couple levels in it. It also has a very short range and you don't have a strong gap closer outside of bloodboil, which will probably stay at level 1~2 for a while. On top of that, you really don't bring much damage to ganks early on with minimal items.
I've yet to see a Nunu jungle that's been able to win the game the way say TF or Draven can win games. I've tried Nunu jungle myself several times and the early game counter jungling is pretty terror for the enemy, but unless I completely snowball my lanes, which can be somewhat hard if they have good ward coverage I always feel really useless later.
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On July 06 2013 23:34 forscher wrote:
Hi folks - been lurking around for a couple of months, I really enjoy reading the league related discussions on TL. You have a nice community here. If any of you are playing sub-30 normals (I'm guessing that's not likely) I'm always looking for more reasonable people to play with.
I also can't wait for Nunu to get nerfed somehow. Ever since that trick guy made his video about stealing buffs at level 1 I've been seeing people trying it even at my level. Super annoying to jungle against.
What's your ign? Also, try joining the chat room "liquidpractice". It's where we organise most of our games.
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On July 06 2013 23:45 mr_tolkien wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2013 22:41 Shikyo wrote:
I really wish Riot would hurry up with the next patch. Nunu ridiculous, Draven really stupid and both instaloss whenever someone doesn't ban them -.- Still numerous champions that aren't viable either in competitive or casual... Oh and Jayce Champions that are not viable ? Could you bother expanding those thoughts my dear Shikyo ?
What's your definition of viable?
Poppy urgot corki olaf etc
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dude its 12am and that starswar 8 is still going on....
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Yeah I agree that Nunu doesn't seem like the best jungler since he doesn't do much late game and his ganks aren't great. It's mainly just annoying that there's a champ who can steal my buffs and fuck up my early game without any real possibility of me winning a smite fight. I'd rather have a Nunu as my enemy jungler than something like Hec/Udyr/J4, but he's still a real pain.
On July 07 2013 00:04 swim224 wrote:What's your ign? Also, try joining the chat room "liquidpractice". It's where we organise most of our games.
My ign is das forscher.
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On July 07 2013 00:09 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2013 23:45 mr_tolkien wrote:On July 06 2013 22:41 Shikyo wrote:
I really wish Riot would hurry up with the next patch. Nunu ridiculous, Draven really stupid and both instaloss whenever someone doesn't ban them -.- Still numerous champions that aren't viable either in competitive or casual... Oh and Jayce Champions that are not viable ? Could you bother expanding those thoughts my dear Shikyo ? What's your definition of viable? Poppy urgot corki olaf etc
Corki is definitely viable. Urgot was just run last week in LCS.
I don't play Olaf. Poppy probably not very viable in the current meta.
If you're stretching the term viable out to mean niche or slightly weaker then there are tons of champions you could call "not viable." But if your definition of viable is the actual definition of viable + Show Spoiler +Capable of working successfully; feasible
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Corki has like a 35% winrate on NA, so I'd say he's pretty terrible.
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Terrible does not mean not viable. He may fit into particular comps. I agree Corki seems underwhelming in his current form though.
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Please buff Corki. I will go mid Corki and murder everything all day long.
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United States47024 Posts
"Viable" as a term is just stupid as hell because it implies that there's some arbitrary vacuum champ selection where a champ is "viable" or "not viable" without the context of a draft involving 6 bans and 9 other picks (or, as it may be, 4 other allied picks and 5 blind enemy picks).
It's really not that hard to envision a teamcomp where Corki is a sensible AD pick.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
On July 06 2013 23:52 Ryuu314 wrote:
I'm probably in the minority here but I honestly don't think Nunu's that strong. At least not as strong as people are making him out to be. I'm bouncing between plat 1~2 atm so I'm no pro but I wouldn't say I'm playing against complete trash players. Honestly, I see a lot of Nunu jungles do pretty well early counterjungling but the lack of real scaling kinda hurts. You basically end up with 2 supports on your team if it drags out. While the opposing jungle will be very poor for a while they can still catch up by leeching gold/exp for laners when they recall or through global objectives. On top of that, if by some miracle the opposing solo q team is responsive/good ward coverage, your counter jungling can actually set you back more than the opponent if you're not careful. On top of that, his ganking is very strong if the enemy doesn't ward, but once they have good coverage your ganking is mediocre. Snowball doesn't slow all that much until you get a couple levels in it. It also has a very short range and you don't have a strong gap closer outside of bloodboil, which will probably stay at level 1~2 for a while. On top of that, you really don't bring much damage to ganks early on with minimal items.
I've yet to see a Nunu jungle that's been able to win the game the way say TF or Draven can win games. I've tried Nunu jungle myself several times and the early game counter jungling is pretty terror for the enemy, but unless I completely snowball my lanes, which can be somewhat hard if they have good ward coverage I always feel really useless later.
Hes way more ridiculous in premade play than in soloQ. In soloQ you have to deal with your teammates not responding, in premades you have to deal with Nunu's teammates having a unique long term plan.
That's not to say he isn't broken as hell in soloQ though, because he is.
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On July 07 2013 00:48 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2013 00:09 Shikyo wrote:On July 06 2013 23:45 mr_tolkien wrote:On July 06 2013 22:41 Shikyo wrote:
I really wish Riot would hurry up with the next patch. Nunu ridiculous, Draven really stupid and both instaloss whenever someone doesn't ban them -.- Still numerous champions that aren't viable either in competitive or casual... Oh and Jayce Champions that are not viable ? Could you bother expanding those thoughts my dear Shikyo ? What's your definition of viable? Poppy urgot corki olaf etc Corki is definitely viable. Urgot was just run last week in LCS. I don't play Olaf. Poppy probably not very viable in the current meta. If you're stretching the term viable out to mean niche or slightly weaker then there are tons of champions you could call "not viable." But if your definition of viable is the actual definition of viable + Show Spoiler +Capable of working successfully; feasible there isn't a single champion that fits that description as literally anything can work in solo queue.
Urgots really strong imo, muramana pretty obnoxious on him truthfully.
I think corki not having a steroid is kinda what really hurts him, aside from his passive which is kinda.. underwhelming.
Olaf is getting buffs tho so he might be good might not.
poppy i probably agree on
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Corki is one of those ads, who like caitlyn, becomes exponentially better with skilled auto attacking and kiting, with his passive and fantastic escape. the difference is that people who lack those mechanics play him like a worse ez, using his ulti to poke, which does less damage and has no procs. It doesn't surprise me that he has a low winrate, if the mechanically good players have abandoned him.
Weixiao on corki was really the heyday of adcs, before all the s3 nerfs.
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I'm a little confused why Corki has such a low winrate honestly. I used to think that it was because his range was low, but its actually the same as most ranged characters. His steroids aren't the greatest, gatling is a little bit awkward, but yeah.
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United States47024 Posts
The thing with Corki is that you can't run him as a 1st position hero because of how his lategame damage flattens out. This is fine because his baseline skill damage is really high, but it means you have to run a mid or top laner as your first position hero in a long game, and right now lane swaps make many of the suitable top laners for this hard to lane.
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On July 07 2013 01:17 TheYango wrote:
"Viable" as a term is just stupid as hell because it implies that there's some arbitrary vacuum champ selection where a champ is "viable" or "not viable" without the context of a draft involving 6 bans and 9 other picks (or, as it may be, 4 other allied picks and 5 blind enemy picks).
It's really not that hard to envision a teamcomp where Corki is a sensible AD pick.
Dude please let Shikyo talk. GD is being too calm atm :o
On another note, I whole-heartly agree with you, and everybody is friggin viable atm... It doesn't mean you can pick them in any matchup, but that they can make sense in some team compositions.
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United States47024 Posts
I mean there are some champs that are just awkward because of the way the game is played right now (lane swaps, etc.). It's not because they're bad, it's because the game doesn't suit them, and, well, this is fine.
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On July 07 2013 01:22 TheYango wrote:
The thing with Corki is that you can't run him as a 1st position hero because of how his lategame damage flattens out. This is fine because his baseline skill damage is really high, but it means you have to run a mid or top laner as your first position hero in a long game, and right now lane swaps make many of the suitable top laners for this hard to lane.
Is there some kind of data about farming rates in the LCS? It would be fun to look at who actually gets the most farm on a given team and if it varies significantly based on which champion their ADC is (or other fun things I can't think of).
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EPT
