EPTEdit: Although discussing how to deal with Diana was a totally valid discussion to have in the first place.
[Patch 3.05: Balance Update] General Discussion - Page 61
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onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
Edit: Although discussing how to deal with Diana was a totally valid discussion to have in the first place. | ||
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:44 onlywonderboy wrote: To sum it up, abusing counters will probably win you games and will promote you through divisions, but not make you a better player. Edit: Although discussing how to deal with Diana was a totally valid discussion to have in the first place. and the conclusion we have reached is that there is no way to counter diana, right? OP OP OP OP | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:43 Sufficiency wrote: So basically if someone who is not in the <elo range wei2coolman perceives to be low>, he would have gotten a non-generic answer that actually describe what he wants to know about possible Diana matchups. If he is in the <elo range wei2coolman perceives to be low>, he would have gotten a generic answer of "GET ON MY LEVEL", which is not relevant to what he initially asked at all. The problem was he asked the wrong question. He asked for a counter for diana, when the real questions should've been, " what are somethings I can do to curb diana's strength as X champ?" | ||
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WhiteDog
France8650 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:44 onlywonderboy wrote: To sum it up, abusing counters will probably win you games and will promote you through divisions, but not make you a better player. Edit: Although discussing how to deal with Diana was a totally valid discussion to have in the first place. I don't think so at all. It's better to play something you are confident with. Most people who have gone up the ladder in my friend list did it by playing a few selected champions. | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:44 onlywonderboy wrote: To sum it up, abusing counters will probably win you games and will promote you through divisions, but not make you a better player. Edit: Although discussing how to deal with Diana was a totally valid discussion to have in the first place. The only champ that just straight up wins 1v1 against diana is + Show Spoiler + ban Other than morde I don't think anyone can just straight up 1v1 and outpush her. | ||
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courtpanda
866 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:48 nafta wrote: The only champ that just straight up wins 1v1 against diana is + Show Spoiler + ban Other than morde I don't think anyone can just straight up 1v1 and outpush her. its not just "abusing counters", its knowing how to play counters. i.e. leblanc "counters" karthus, but she has to win early, because karthus way outscales her | ||
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onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:47 WhiteDog wrote: I don't think so at all. It's better to play something you are confident with. Most people who have gone up the ladder in my friend list did it by playing a few selected champions. I didn't mean it would carry you indefinitely, but probably raise you to a higher MMR/Division than your actual skill would normally allow (at which point you would plateau). | ||
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Capricious_LoL
United States222 Posts
On April 15 2013 13:08 xes wrote: That post goes against pretty much what every professional player or competitive TLer has said. WildTurtle was a soloq god if you paid attention to streamed soloq but he's said in interviews that in arranged play he mostly has 0 clue what he needs to do. Ranked 5s is infinitely superior to ranked soloq in terms of developing an amateur competitive scene. Beyond basic mechanics, the skills involved in winning games are pretty different. WildTurtle is a really good player. When he says that he has zero clue in arranged play he is over-exaggerating. Already, replacing Chaox with the Turtle has partly helped TSM's resurgence in the LCS. This comes as no surprise if you play with these players and see how they perform even if it is just solo queue. In time, I see no reason why WildTurtle can't become one of the best competitive players... because he got the tools he needed from solo queue. After all, how did the old CLG get formed back when they were THE team to beat, they were players at the top of the ladder who regularly played against each other in solo queue. Ranked 5s are invaluable for amateur players, yes. But my point is more that if you play Ranked 5s with players who are below Diamond (even this might be generous), you are wasting your time. Invariably, players who are below Diamond I have individual flaws to their play that cannot be fixed just by playing in an arranged environment. If, for example, low ranked players made a ranked 5s team and got to high elo as a ranked team, then no doubt they would individually achieve high elo in solo queue provided that they take solo queue seriously and play their best roles/champs. The skills involved in winning games are different, but not to the embellished degree that people seem to think; after all, it is the same game. It doesn't matter how good your team play is if you get stomped in lane because your individual mechanics don't compare to a pro's. If you were to watch a high elo solo queue game where everyone is in a mood to tryhard, and is playing their best roles/champs, it can be as educational as watching an LCS game. | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:48 nafta wrote: The only champ that just straight up wins 1v1 against diana is + Show Spoiler + ban Other than morde I don't think anyone can just straight up 1v1 and outpush her. Morde will lose to Diana 1v1 post-6. Pre-6 she won't even bother to fight Mordekaiser. | ||
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Mensol
14536 Posts
http://eune.lolesports.com/allstar sOAz 32.74% Wickd 32.72% 1 HOURS LEFT!!!!!!! VOTE FOR SOAZ!!!!! | ||
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cascades
Singapore6122 Posts
AD mids are good, but not what I am looking for. I am well aware you can just redpot cheese and win all lane, but that's besides the point. | ||
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onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:58 Mensol wrote: http://euw.lolesports.com/allstar http://eune.lolesports.com/allstar sOAz 32.74% Wickd 32.72% 1 HOURS LEFT!!!!!!! VOTE FOR SOAZ!!!!! Apparently they are going to be a 1v1 BO5 for fun due to the epic closeness of the vote. | ||
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Mensol
14536 Posts
On April 16 2013 05:01 onlywonderboy wrote: Apparently they are going to be a 1v1 BO5 for fun due to the epic closeness of the vote. sOAz will crush him ^_^ | ||
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Louuster
Canada2869 Posts
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Dusty
United States3359 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:55 Sufficiency wrote: Morde will lose to Diana 1v1 post-6. Pre-6 she won't even bother to fight Mordekaiser. Diana has no way of forcing a fight against morde pre-6 so that's pretty much irrelevant unless you are planning to autoattack trade with her for some reason o_o on the topic of counters; A counter will only ever matter if you know how to play it. Irelia won't beat Vlad if she plays like a bitch and eats every Q and auto without retaliation; a Ryze will only lose to a Cassiopeia if he counter-attacks when she misses her Q etc. | ||
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cascades
Singapore6122 Posts
AD mids are good, but not what I am looking for. I am well aware you can just redpot cheese and win all lane, but that's besides the point. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:18 sylverfyre wrote: I dunno, picking renekton into every top lane works pretty well for me!  Croc > all.this is the opposite of what my post says, which is playing more champs = bad for improving On April 16 2013 04:44 onlywonderboy wrote: To sum it up, abusing counters will probably win you games and will promote you through divisions, but not make you a better player. Edit: Although discussing how to deal with Diana was a totally valid discussion to have in the first place. it's not abusing, but it won't get you through divisions. Being a better player gets you through divisions, you can never guarantee counter picking because you could get ganked and have no idea of how to come from behind for example, and then not know how to play the champ later. You can play your favourite champ being used to getting countered and still win cs, maybe get ganks and win or if not, know how to preform better than him in fights and still win. | ||
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Capricious_LoL
United States222 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:21 Sufficiency wrote: That is so wrong it's not even funny. What you are saying is that you can always outplay your opponent regardless of the match up - which is true - but whoever asked the question isn't going to become challenger tier in 1 day. I used to tutor calculus. One question people often ask is "how do I get better at calculus?". Since I have a master degree in mathematics, I tell him "FUCK CALCULUS JUST GET ON MY LEVEL YOU NUB AND DO THESE GRADUATE MATH COURSES INSTEAD". Am I being helpful here? Seriously though, discussing counters is totally valid regardless of your skill level. It's possible to outplay a vastly superior lane opponent with a good match up - such as going Kassadin/LeBlanc against the old Katarina. I think you are misunderstanding his point. Obviously, counters do matter, but at low elo (below Diamond), not worrying about counters at all is the better way to improve. A high elo player can easily beat a low elo player playing a champion they have never played before into an unfavorable matchup. I think the most important thing to worry about is general game sense; concepts of timing and knowing where exactly to be on the map at all points in time. | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On April 16 2013 04:55 Sufficiency wrote: Morde will lose to Diana 1v1 post-6. Pre-6 she won't even bother to fight Mordekaiser. I've had the exact opposite experience. I wonder how soaz/wickd will play.If they go blind pick it would be pretty interesting.Not sure what would be soaz' go to 1v1 champ.Maybe lee....Lee vs Irelia would be pretty nice . | ||
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