EPT[Patch 1.0.0.154: Preseason Balance Update 2] GD - Page 43
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TheLink
Australia2725 Posts
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
On January 18 2013 20:08 Promises wrote: Quick question, a few mates of mine and me were discussing what the right botlane counter to a Graves-Taric lane would be and we couldnt quite come to an agreement... Some argued Cait-Lulu'ish lanes b/c of poke, while others argued that that meant way too few damage in trades considering their tankyness, others suggested Vayne for the true damage but the counterargument to that would be vayne's short range as a liability with regards to stun etc... What do you guys think? anything with lulu/zyra and probably nami if you dont get into stun range, cait/nunu should destroy graves/taric, ez/sona should also be fine. | ||
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
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AsnSensation
Germany24009 Posts
Cait and Ezreal are decent for that and Sivir can just straight up tell taric to go fuck himself with his dazzle  . For supports Lulu or Nunu are nice. Lulu early dmg is op and since she's dealing Magic dmg she pretty much ignores the tankiness and nunu to outscale them even harder. Ah yeah Alistar is good, too for disengage in case your ad got into dazzle range accidently. ( with the patch I think Ali is king Melee supp again) ah yeah Zyra is fine too, my experience with Ezreal Sona is that Sona just gets killed over and over whilöe ezreal desperately shoots mystic shots at graves tickling him. edit>below me yeah I was thinking of Corki too but I haven't had a corki in my games for like 6 weeks now nobody plays him anymore =( fotm ez,cait,twitch,vayne too strong. | ||
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kongoline
6318 Posts
i read somewhere corki/leona is a counter to them because they do so much magic dmg | ||
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eagle
United States693 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On January 18 2013 20:08 Promises wrote: Quick question, a few mates of mine and me were discussing what the right botlane counter to a Graves-Taric lane would be and we couldnt quite come to an agreement... Some argued Cait-Lulu'ish lanes b/c of poke, while others argued that that meant way too few damage in trades considering their tankyness, others suggested Vayne for the true damage but the counterargument to that would be vayne's short range as a liability with regards to stun etc... What do you guys think? Any good late-game carry + Janna >>> Graves Taric. Mostly because Janna counters Taric pretty hard, so you just need to pick an ADC that doesn't mind splitting farm with Graves. Lulu is also pretty good. I really hate playing Leona against Taric though. It's almost impossible. | ||
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deathray797
196 Posts
On January 18 2013 20:06 GregMandel wrote: Hey guys, I'm going to hit 30 soon(ish) and I was wondering : what is, In your opinion, the most pub-stomping champ. I really like to play Zed mid, but his carry potential is limited because you usually dive straight up into the carries and get focused, I also bought Eve but I find her " weird " and do not enjoy playing her too much. I play any role but jungle, I love supporting, but in solo q it's annoying because you're AD will always do dumb shit and make terrible calls and I just sit here and have 0 carry potential  I really like high mobility champs and champs with high skillcap ( Lee Sin, Zed, Ahri are my favorites so far but I only own Zed :/ ), so what would you reccomend ? Talon. Is probably not the best or easiest pubstomp character, but I love him nonetheless. His skillset just feels like a true assassin to me: get in, oneshot a high value target, and get out. Hes pretty similar to zed in that regard, but has an easier time escaping due to his ult. There are plenty of champs that can burst like him, but I just like his skillset a lot. imo once u've farmed to BT, BC, and LW, u can pretty much 1shot anyone who isnt a tank/offtank provided they dont have heals and shields. The main problem with him is that his lvl 1-5 was already pretty weak vs some mids, and its even worse with the nerfs to his earlygame. His base dmg for his w, his main poke skill, is fairly low, so you only really start doing decent dmg with it once its ranked 4 or 5 and you have some ad items ie brutalizer, bf sword (or if they just didnt get armor runes, but in that case u should by winning by lvl 1). | ||
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Doctorbeat
Netherlands13241 Posts
On January 18 2013 20:47 AsnSensation wrote: I don't think there is a straight up hardcounter lane to graves#taric because of the nature of ad+supp botlane so the ad won't deal any dmg to either of them because of grave's passive and taric's w early game. That's why that combo is considered such a lanebully and snowballs really hard if they get ahead. Whenever I have to lane against graves#taric my gameplan is just to keep up with cs and survive the laningphase because they fall of so hard. Cait and Ezreal are decent for that and Sivir can just straight up tell taric to go fuck himself with his dazzle . For supports Lulu or Nunu are nice. Lulu early dmg is op and since she's dealing Magic dmg she pretty much ignores the tankiness and nunu to outscale them even harder. Ah yeah Alistar is good, too for disengage in case your ad got into dazzle range accidently. ( with the patch I think Ali is king Melee supp again) ah yeah Zyra is fine too, my experience with Ezreal Sona is that Sona just gets killed over and over whilöe ezreal desperately shoots mystic shots at graves tickling him. edit>below me yeah I was thinking of Corki too but I haven't had a corki in my games for like 6 weeks now nobody plays him anymore =( fotm ez,cait,twitch,vayne too strong. Pretty much any of the hard carries + Nunu will work great against Graves Taric. Twitch/Vayne/Cait/Kog can all do well. Cait + Nunu can be really strong vs graves Taric, because Cait's auto range is higher than Dazzle range is, and Snowballs are still strong, even vs a guy with a lot of dmg in spells. Vayne has it the hardest out of those. No way of csing at high distances, out of range of Dazzle. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
On January 18 2013 16:56 Seuss wrote: Just played a bunch of Jungle Vi games. I've settled on Machete -> Tabi -> Stinger -> Phage -> Mallet -> Whatever. With Q maxed first only champions like Kassadin and Katarina have a prayer of escaping the slows, and doing 6-10%+ maximum health in physical damage to a target whose armor you automatically shred is nuts. You can easily go to golems instead of back to wolves before Red with or without a leash. She feels really good after all those bug fixes and quality of life changes. Highly recommend trying her out. No MR? I tend to go machete->boots+phage->wit's + mercs (double NMM if they have magic damage), then generally belt into randuin's or mallet. I dislike BC on her (too much gold dumped into damage) and hexdrinker (too slot-inefficient later on, especially for somebody who won't upgrade machete) so I tend to try and complete wit's before mercs. I end up a bit slow at some window but I don't know how much my inability to hit a Q plays into that. Locket's combination of HP+CDR+the active is definitely nice on her but if I go something like locket+phage I'll be pretty low on armor and randuin's kinda awkward build path (need 1100 or you sit on a cloth armor) makes me dislike my early midgame with that. Maybe just build locket+phage+tabis and then work on MR. On January 18 2013 20:06 GregMandel wrote: Hey guys, I'm going to hit 30 soon(ish) and I was wondering : what is, In your opinion, the most pub-stomping champ. I really like to play Zed mid, but his carry potential is limited because you usually dive straight up into the carries and get focused, I also bought Eve but I find her " weird " and do not enjoy playing her too much. Carry build Zed: BT+LW -> warmogs+GA. Maxing W after E makes him not care about damage past that point, he'll always have enough considering his huge dps. | ||
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HeavOnEarth
United States7087 Posts
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
On January 18 2013 20:08 Promises wrote: Quick question, a few mates of mine and me were discussing what the right botlane counter to a Graves-Taric lane would be and we couldnt quite come to an agreement... Some argued Cait-Lulu'ish lanes b/c of poke, while others argued that that meant way too few damage in trades considering their tankyness, others suggested Vayne for the true damage but the counterargument to that would be vayne's short range as a liability with regards to stun etc... What do you guys think? Taric can be countered in a few ways. You either need poke+strong disengage, or the ability to punish him for engaging. In terms of poke, Lulu is a great support. You harass with q, and if they all in, turn enemy adc into a cupcake and disengage. Her ult is also great against their damage output. If you want to counter how aggressive he can be, pick Leona or cow. They can both lock down an adc just as well as he can, though at that point, it comes down to who gets their damage off first. Generally though, neither support should engage on enemy adc, as the other support will have the advantage of locking theirs down, allowing retaliation. Also, Ezreal. That fuck doesn't lose lane. At all. | ||
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Bladeorade
United States1898 Posts
Cleaver BT GA LW Nerfs Mogs | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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GregMandel
France822 Posts
On January 18 2013 21:00 deathray797 wrote: Talon. Is probably not the best or easiest pubstomp character, but I love him nonetheless. His skillset just feels like a true assassin to me: get in, oneshot a high value target, and get out. Hes pretty similar to zed in that regard, but has an easier time escaping due to his ult. There are plenty of champs that can burst like him, but I just like his skillset a lot. imo once u've farmed to BT, BC, and LW, u can pretty much 1shot anyone who isnt a tank/offtank provided they dont have heals and shields. The main problem with him is that his lvl 1-5 was already pretty weak vs some mids, and its even worse with the nerfs to his earlygame. His base dmg for his w, his main poke skill, is fairly low, so you only really start doing decent dmg with it once its ranked 4 or 5 and you have some ad items ie brutalizer, bf sword (or if they just didnt get armor runes, but in that case u should by winning by lvl 1). Damn I actually felt like Talon was the next assasin I'd buy :D Carry build Zed: BT+LW -> warmogs+GA. Maxing W after E makes him not care about damage past that point, he'll always have enough considering his huge dps. Will definitely try out thank you :D I usually rush BT LW anyways, but then I'll pick a Malmortius Maw or a BC, will try deviating  | ||
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57 Corvette
Canada5941 Posts
How would you counter such a strategy? | ||
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NEOtheONE
United States2233 Posts
On January 19 2013 02:06 57 Corvette wrote: I watched a game last night where one team picked a 5-man dive comp (Shen Olaf Karthus Ezreal Taric), and every time Karthus's ult was off cooldown, everyone dived the opponent Ashe/sona and snowballed hard. How would you counter such a strategy? With Ashe plus Sona the best thing to do would be save both of your ults for when they try and then chain stun them underneath your turret. Also, ask your jungler if they could keep a closer eye on your lane because you know it's coming. On January 18 2013 20:06 GregMandel wrote: Hey guys, I'm going to hit 30 soon(ish) and I was wondering : what is, In your opinion, the most pub-stomping champ. I really like to play Zed mid, but his carry potential is limited because you usually dive straight up into the carries and get focused, I also bought Eve but I find her " weird " and do not enjoy playing her too much. I play any role but jungle, I love supporting, but in solo q it's annoying because you're AD will always do dumb shit and make terrible calls and I just sit here and have 0 carry potential I really like high mobility champs and champs with high skillcap ( Lee Sin, Zed, Ahri are my favorites so far but I only own Zed :/ ), so what would you reccomend ? Akali and Katarina are pretty good pubstomp champions. Diana is another good choice. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On January 19 2013 02:06 57 Corvette wrote: I watched a game last night where one team picked a 5-man dive comp (Shen Olaf Karthus Ezreal Taric), and every time Karthus's ult was off cooldown, everyone dived the opponent Ashe/sona and snowballed hard. How would you counter such a strategy? I'd imagine hard turtle. Ashe and Sona should have been decent picks, just save ults for the dive and then run. Varus (ult/slow), Nami (ult and sprints), Jayce (gate), Anivia (wall), Jarvan (ult to take someone with you and save teammates), Ez/Graves/Corki (slip from dives). Or you bring hard initates/counterinitiates of your own (Amumu, Hec, Malph, Lulu, Syndra, Janna) and try to have a stronger teamfight. Aside from that, you just sacrifice the bot lane, get top/mid/jungle farmed and try to keep pressure elsewhere on the map while bot just tries to keep their towers from pushing too hard. Bringing strong split pushers like Nid, Teemo, TF, etc. Oh, and 1000000000 wards, then waste their time while they wait to dive. | ||
AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On January 19 2013 02:06 57 Corvette wrote: I watched a game last night where one team picked a 5-man dive comp (Shen Olaf Karthus Ezreal Taric), and every time Karthus's ult was off cooldown, everyone dived the opponent Ashe/sona and snowballed hard. How would you counter such a strategy? Sounds like the best way would be better picks including more escape and a REALLY hard counter-initiate. Corki might have been a better AD choice, then something like Zyra/Lulu (Sona was also good tho) and maybe Hecarim in the jungle. Another helpful thing might have been some safe split-pushers, so you can just avoid those gross fights. Dunno, seems tough. | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On January 19 2013 01:42 Requizen wrote: I have not found a single lane opponent that I've lost to as Elise. Shit's broken yo. I even won lane against Teemo, my bane. Uh Teemo has many counters... | ||
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