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On December 15 2012 02:57 willoc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 00:58 jcarlsoniv wrote:On December 15 2012 00:33 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 23:28 thenexusp wrote:On December 14 2012 23:09 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 22:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Um...you know you can shorten Diana's Q to match that of the new ult range.
Yes, but now you can't actually use your ult to follow up your q(atleast in lane where you're usually hitting your q from long ranges) which is literally the core design of the champion. If they also nerfed the range of her Q to match her ult, would that make her better? It would make her worse, but it'd make her kit more consistent. A spell that is literally designed to set up your ult being too far for your ult is dumb. I'm not whining, I don't care, I don't play Diana much because I prefer other champions, but it's clear they made it a specific design choice to have her q and r have the exact same range so she can follow up on landed Qs. On December 14 2012 23:25 jcarlsoniv wrote:On December 14 2012 23:09 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 22:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Um...you know you can shorten Diana's Q to match that of the new ult range.
Yes, but now you can't actually use your ult to follow up your q(atleast in lane where you're usually hitting your q from long ranges) which is literally the core design of the champion. On December 14 2012 22:59 Tobberoth wrote:
Hopefully the diana nerfs are strong enough that we don't have to ban her every single draft pick. It's fine to get sad when a hero you've been owning it up with for a while gets nerfed, but please realize it's good for the game when bonker-OP heroes are nerfed. If she has been nerfed so hard that no one will be playing her, she will be buffed again, so there's nothing to whine about. I don't' play but, I think she's one of the more interesting champions that gets played mid in tournaments, and is one of the only champs who plays well against op as heck Orianna. For how tanky she was, she had way too much damage and utility. Was it too much? Possibly, but everyone stop whining until you can actually play her and find out. More likely, she'll still be plenty usable and less faceroll. Zyra got a decent nerf. I currently have an 80% win rate with Zyra mid. Do you see me complaining? No, she needed the nerf. Will I stop playing her? Absolutely not, she is still going to be strong due to the nature of the kit. tl;dr Stop complaining, learn to adapt. I wasn't whining. I was pointing out clunky design. You are rude and follow it up with a strawman argument that has nothing to do with what I'm saying because I don't play Diana, so why should I care if a champ you played got nerfed? I don't think Zyra's E missile speed will affect the way her combos execute (since her seeds are instant place), moreso than just make it more difficult to hit -- similar to the gragas e speed nerf. tl;dr Your post is dumb and rude for no reason. My tl;dr was not pointed at you, it was a general statement. My mistake for not clarifying that. This thread has been rife with complaining the last few days, I just want it to stop. This thread was up for not even a day when you made this post. I believe you are letting external complain sources influence you.
I'm sure he meant TL-LoL GDs in general...
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On December 15 2012 02:58 Requizen wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 02:57 willoc wrote:On December 15 2012 00:58 jcarlsoniv wrote:On December 15 2012 00:33 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 23:28 thenexusp wrote:On December 14 2012 23:09 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 22:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Um...you know you can shorten Diana's Q to match that of the new ult range.
Yes, but now you can't actually use your ult to follow up your q(atleast in lane where you're usually hitting your q from long ranges) which is literally the core design of the champion. If they also nerfed the range of her Q to match her ult, would that make her better? It would make her worse, but it'd make her kit more consistent. A spell that is literally designed to set up your ult being too far for your ult is dumb. I'm not whining, I don't care, I don't play Diana much because I prefer other champions, but it's clear they made it a specific design choice to have her q and r have the exact same range so she can follow up on landed Qs. On December 14 2012 23:25 jcarlsoniv wrote:On December 14 2012 23:09 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 22:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Um...you know you can shorten Diana's Q to match that of the new ult range.
Yes, but now you can't actually use your ult to follow up your q(atleast in lane where you're usually hitting your q from long ranges) which is literally the core design of the champion. On December 14 2012 22:59 Tobberoth wrote:
Hopefully the diana nerfs are strong enough that we don't have to ban her every single draft pick. It's fine to get sad when a hero you've been owning it up with for a while gets nerfed, but please realize it's good for the game when bonker-OP heroes are nerfed. If she has been nerfed so hard that no one will be playing her, she will be buffed again, so there's nothing to whine about. I don't' play but, I think she's one of the more interesting champions that gets played mid in tournaments, and is one of the only champs who plays well against op as heck Orianna. For how tanky she was, she had way too much damage and utility. Was it too much? Possibly, but everyone stop whining until you can actually play her and find out. More likely, she'll still be plenty usable and less faceroll. Zyra got a decent nerf. I currently have an 80% win rate with Zyra mid. Do you see me complaining? No, she needed the nerf. Will I stop playing her? Absolutely not, she is still going to be strong due to the nature of the kit. tl;dr Stop complaining, learn to adapt. I wasn't whining. I was pointing out clunky design. You are rude and follow it up with a strawman argument that has nothing to do with what I'm saying because I don't play Diana, so why should I care if a champ you played got nerfed? I don't think Zyra's E missile speed will affect the way her combos execute (since her seeds are instant place), moreso than just make it more difficult to hit -- similar to the gragas e speed nerf. tl;dr Your post is dumb and rude for no reason. My tl;dr was not pointed at you, it was a general statement. My mistake for not clarifying that. This thread has been rife with complaining the last few days, I just want it to stop. This thread was up for not even a day when you made this post. I believe you are letting external complain sources influence you. I'm sure he meant TL-LoL GDs in general...
Articulation goes a long way! 
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Anyone really hate the new blue/red buff display on a champion? I feel like it is really hard to tell if someone has a buff if you just glance at them. It is so low to the ground and partly obscured by a lot of character models, not to mention the color difference itself is harder to see.
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On December 15 2012 03:09 zer0das wrote:
Anyone really hate the new blue/red buff display on a champion? I feel like it is really hard to tell if someone has a buff if you just glance at them. It is so low to the ground and partly obscured by a lot of character models, not to mention the color difference itself is harder to see.
It looks cleaner compared to 500 books surrounding a person though
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People are disregarding the fact that at 900 range, you don't even need to land the q to use the ult, as the ult + e is a great engage (almost like a little malphite's ult) and that you cannot miss it. At some point you need to see when something is imba.
I don't necesseraly agree with the other nerf (her q, w and e) but the r clearly needed some tweak. As for the synergy, the opposite would be dumb : a q with a smaller range than the r, but since it is not that way, the synergy is still plenty good.
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United States47024 Posts
A middle ground solution I don't think has been considered is allowing you target Q-ed enemies at 900 range, but can only target enemies without the Q debuff at 750 range.
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On December 15 2012 03:01 willoc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 02:58 Requizen wrote:On December 15 2012 02:57 willoc wrote:On December 15 2012 00:58 jcarlsoniv wrote:On December 15 2012 00:33 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 23:28 thenexusp wrote:On December 14 2012 23:09 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 22:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Um...you know you can shorten Diana's Q to match that of the new ult range.
Yes, but now you can't actually use your ult to follow up your q(atleast in lane where you're usually hitting your q from long ranges) which is literally the core design of the champion. If they also nerfed the range of her Q to match her ult, would that make her better? It would make her worse, but it'd make her kit more consistent. A spell that is literally designed to set up your ult being too far for your ult is dumb. I'm not whining, I don't care, I don't play Diana much because I prefer other champions, but it's clear they made it a specific design choice to have her q and r have the exact same range so she can follow up on landed Qs. On December 14 2012 23:25 jcarlsoniv wrote:On December 14 2012 23:09 TwoToneTerran wrote:On December 14 2012 22:48 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Um...you know you can shorten Diana's Q to match that of the new ult range.
Yes, but now you can't actually use your ult to follow up your q(atleast in lane where you're usually hitting your q from long ranges) which is literally the core design of the champion. On December 14 2012 22:59 Tobberoth wrote:
Hopefully the diana nerfs are strong enough that we don't have to ban her every single draft pick. It's fine to get sad when a hero you've been owning it up with for a while gets nerfed, but please realize it's good for the game when bonker-OP heroes are nerfed. If she has been nerfed so hard that no one will be playing her, she will be buffed again, so there's nothing to whine about. I don't' play but, I think she's one of the more interesting champions that gets played mid in tournaments, and is one of the only champs who plays well against op as heck Orianna. For how tanky she was, she had way too much damage and utility. Was it too much? Possibly, but everyone stop whining until you can actually play her and find out. More likely, she'll still be plenty usable and less faceroll. Zyra got a decent nerf. I currently have an 80% win rate with Zyra mid. Do you see me complaining? No, she needed the nerf. Will I stop playing her? Absolutely not, she is still going to be strong due to the nature of the kit. tl;dr Stop complaining, learn to adapt. I wasn't whining. I was pointing out clunky design. You are rude and follow it up with a strawman argument that has nothing to do with what I'm saying because I don't play Diana, so why should I care if a champ you played got nerfed? I don't think Zyra's E missile speed will affect the way her combos execute (since her seeds are instant place), moreso than just make it more difficult to hit -- similar to the gragas e speed nerf. tl;dr Your post is dumb and rude for no reason. My tl;dr was not pointed at you, it was a general statement. My mistake for not clarifying that. This thread has been rife with complaining the last few days, I just want it to stop. This thread was up for not even a day when you made this post. I believe you are letting external complain sources influence you. I'm sure he meant TL-LoL GDs in general... Articulation goes a long way!
A long way toward what? The Thames? West Newton? The Valley Forge? The future? Is it even going toward something? Are we going a long way away from discombobulation? From uncertainty in communication? From improper grammar and spelling?
Help me I can't figure this out from context!
I jest. But you reminded me of http://xkcd.com/169/
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On December 15 2012 03:26 TheYango wrote:
A middle ground solution I don't think has been considered is allowing you target Q-ed enemies at 900 range, but can only target enemies without the Q debuff at 750 range.
I'm not sure what her current range is, but that's very much like what I posted a few pages back. Just to be clear, you mean that ult range should be longer if a target is hit by Q?
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United States47024 Posts
On December 15 2012 03:29 zodde wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 03:26 TheYango wrote:
A middle ground solution I don't think has been considered is allowing you target Q-ed enemies at 900 range, but can only target enemies without the Q debuff at 750 range. I'm not sure what her current range is, but that's very much like what I posted a few pages back. Just to be clear, you mean that ult range should be longer if a target is hit by Q?
Yes.
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i thought the only problem with diana was that the E effect was like a 1s stun because it was so slow. would've been more balanced if it were faster, like say, oriannas.
i thought she was strong in lane and was a strong ganker but in teamfights she has to dive and i don't feel comfortable diving as AP carry.
i didn't play S3 diana though. were the new items really good on her?
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Can you dodge Hemoplague activation they way you can dodge Requiem using Shaco ult or Yi Q? I just tried a whole bunch and either I'm bad or you can't 
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On December 15 2012 03:49 xes wrote:Can you dodge Hemoplague activation they way you can dodge Requiem using Shaco ult or Yi Q? I just tried a whole bunch and either I'm bad or you can't
Shaco Ult/Yi Q/Fizz W and similar effects aren't like Zhonya's, they make you untargetable but do not prevent damage from status affects. You can be killed by any DoTs like Ignite or Hemoplague while you're untargetable.
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United States47024 Posts
On December 15 2012 03:35 kainzero wrote:
i thought she was strong in lane and was a strong ganker but in teamfights she has to dive and i don't feel comfortable diving as AP carry.
That's an issue in solo queue, but due to how easily Moonfall sets up follow-up CC, that's basically not a problem in arranged play if you choose your initiates well and your team follows up. Diana E->3/4 man Cho Q+Silence is basically zero risk for Diana because the enemy simply doesn't have time to focus her before they're locked out of doing anything.
On December 15 2012 03:55 Seuss wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 03:49 xes wrote:Can you dodge Hemoplague activation they way you can dodge Requiem using Shaco ult or Yi Q? I just tried a whole bunch and either I'm bad or you can't Shaco Ult/Yi Q/Fizz W and similar effects aren't like Zhonya's, they make you untargetable but do not prevent damage from status affects. You can be killed by any DoTs like Ignite or Hemoplague while you're untargetable.
Unless it's changed, you can use Alpha Strike to dodge Zilean bombs.
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United States47024 Posts
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On December 15 2012 03:58 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 03:55 Seuss wrote:On December 15 2012 03:49 xes wrote:Can you dodge Hemoplague activation they way you can dodge Requiem using Shaco ult or Yi Q? I just tried a whole bunch and either I'm bad or you can't Shaco Ult/Yi Q/Fizz W and similar effects aren't like Zhonya's, they make you untargetable but do not prevent damage from status affects. You can be killed by any DoTs like Ignite or Hemoplague while you're untargetable. Unless it's changed, you can use Alpha Strike to dodge Zilean bombs.
Hmm... this might be because Zilean bombs are an AoE, while hemoplague just affects whatever is debuffed by it. So when Hemoplague goes off it does damage to the person affected by it, but the Zilean bomb hits everything in the area, and that ignores Yi/Fizz/Shaco just like any other AoE nuke
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Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 02:22 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
Nah bro, Lux is about ulting every 24 seconds for 1000 dmg with Mejais. huehuehueheuehuehueh. I thought she was all about spamming laugh. Oh, yeah, laugh key remapped for max spammage QERGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
I bind it to T, on the same row as all your skills. Or better yet, macro it to your right click so you don't even have to press an extraneous button. Secret Lux tech OPOP riot plz nerf plz.
Only if you keep doing it when people ask you to stop..
That just means its working.
I want to do an annoying laugh team sometime. Singed, Teemo, Lulu, Lux, and I guess Master Yi with his taunt.
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United States23745 Posts
On December 15 2012 02:28 Keniji wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 02:20 clickrush wrote:On December 15 2012 02:04 LaNague wrote:On December 15 2012 00:55 Complete wrote:
I have a question:
As a low ELO player (~1300 or something) I often end up playing support and getting an abnormal amount of gold. Lately I've been playing a lot of Sona. If say bottom lane dominates and I'm getting a bunch of kills/assists (yes I know don't ks from adc, but it happens), and I'm getting in to the mid game with as much gold as my opponents laners, how should I be switching up my build (if at all)? Say for Sona (or taric, or any other support I guess) should I still continue building my regular stuff (locket/aegis/shruileyas/etc)? Or should I be building AP? Or what? you should try zyra or lux support if that happens too often. i have seen numerous zyra supports in asian teams that ended up being a 2nd ap carry. sona is pretty fine with some extra gold. And yes build regular support stuff. there are so many really strong support items now. if you get alot of gold you should start to care less about not getting behind in levels and start roaming and warding more often. you will naturally get behind in your gold advantage while you give super extra map control and enhance the farm roles better. with sona it is also common to get some kills now and then during laneing phase in very close fights/ganks. don't try to be something your not. instead of being a shitty 2nd ap start to be a very strong super support who baits, pokes, wards more often. you can for example just go all-in on their carry at the right moment. you and him will have low health after this so you can bluepill, give your carry free farm and tons of exp, while you get more wards and roam the jungle. do stuff like that instead of trying to somehow get to a deathcap. the closest to a ap-carry support i saw in a serious game was a tripple gold morgana getting a zonyas at 45min or so. this was planned and executed by the whole team and only works because of this. as a soloq support you have to keep your head down and do what your teammates base their plays on. this is probably one of the most important things in soloq. How does roaming sets you behind in gold as a support? If anything you get more gold by roaming because you get more assists/kills.
But you will fall behind in experience. If the gank fails coming back to lane where the enemy ADC and Support probalby both have a level advantage on you is asking for trouble.
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Usually the adc will either or lose the whole farm because he gets zoned or die due 2vs1 on the bot lane...
I dont think roaming as a support is a good idea unless your adc knows what he is doing
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United States8298 Posts
On December 15 2012 04:27 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 02:28 Keniji wrote:On December 15 2012 02:20 clickrush wrote:On December 15 2012 02:04 LaNague wrote:On December 15 2012 00:55 Complete wrote:
I have a question:
As a low ELO player (~1300 or something) I often end up playing support and getting an abnormal amount of gold. Lately I've been playing a lot of Sona. If say bottom lane dominates and I'm getting a bunch of kills/assists (yes I know don't ks from adc, but it happens), and I'm getting in to the mid game with as much gold as my opponents laners, how should I be switching up my build (if at all)? Say for Sona (or taric, or any other support I guess) should I still continue building my regular stuff (locket/aegis/shruileyas/etc)? Or should I be building AP? Or what? you should try zyra or lux support if that happens too often. i have seen numerous zyra supports in asian teams that ended up being a 2nd ap carry. sona is pretty fine with some extra gold. And yes build regular support stuff. there are so many really strong support items now. if you get alot of gold you should start to care less about not getting behind in levels and start roaming and warding more often. you will naturally get behind in your gold advantage while you give super extra map control and enhance the farm roles better. with sona it is also common to get some kills now and then during laneing phase in very close fights/ganks. don't try to be something your not. instead of being a shitty 2nd ap start to be a very strong super support who baits, pokes, wards more often. you can for example just go all-in on their carry at the right moment. you and him will have low health after this so you can bluepill, give your carry free farm and tons of exp, while you get more wards and roam the jungle. do stuff like that instead of trying to somehow get to a deathcap. the closest to a ap-carry support i saw in a serious game was a tripple gold morgana getting a zonyas at 45min or so. this was planned and executed by the whole team and only works because of this. as a soloq support you have to keep your head down and do what your teammates base their plays on. this is probably one of the most important things in soloq. How does roaming sets you behind in gold as a support? If anything you get more gold by roaming because you get more assists/kills. But you will fall behind in experience. If the gank fails coming back to lane where the enemy ADC and Support probalby both have a level advantage on you is asking for trouble.
Nrated and other pro Zyra players would beg to differ, in S2 going 2 GP10s -> getting Zhonyas at around 25 mins. But Zhonya isn't deathcap, the activate makes it special and allows you to make plays (especially as a notoriously squishy support) you can't make without it. Deathcap just adds damage.
Roaming on support is more likely to leave your duo laner behind in gold from getting zoned harassed away from CS. Their support can just get in his face and make him completely back off.
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United States47024 Posts
On December 15 2012 04:36 BlACKTrA wrote:
Usually the adc will either or lose the whole farm because he gets zoned or die due 2vs1 on the bot lane...
I dont think roaming as a support is a good idea unless your adc knows what he is doing
If you have a roaming support, you don't put your AD in a 1v2. That should be obvious. You run your AD in a solo lane matchup and put a strong 1v2 top laner against their duo lane.
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EPT
