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On December 14 2012 03:57 Seuss wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 03:51 onlywonderboy wrote:Trundle is getting the next visual update. Seems like an odd choice since no one really plays him. Popularity doesn't seem a particularly convincing argument against a visual rework. The real reason this is an odd choice is because Sivir has had the worst model in the game since forever. The Janna, Soraka, and Katarina models pre-rework were at least close to as bad, but there's seriously nothing else that's close. You can at least argue that maybe they want to make Karma more visually appealing (inc boob job), but I don't really understand what about Trundle's current model or look needs an update. Also, when they inevitably remake Nunu I'm totally gunning for Willump to just eat the kid and move on. Like, I totally don't even register he's there, the Yeti is the important part.
Well, Trundles boobs aren't really large, either. Maybe that is a determining factor regarding who gets reworks?
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United States47024 Posts
Trundle's still fine out of the jungle for the purposes he serves. The biggest issue is that every iteration of the jungle seems to be shittier for him than the last. S1 jungle was great, S2 jungle sucked but was situationally playable, and S3 somehow manages to be even worse than S2.
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clearing harder reward for clearing not really bigger, wriggles nerfed, tanks and bruiser nerfed in general
sad trundle
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On December 14 2012 03:29 PrinceXizor wrote:
I would definitely think that 20-30% of bans from the tribunal are people who should not be banned. which is an unacceptable margin, hell anything above 2% should be unacceptable, one in fifty cases is already ridiculously bad, and it's definitely above that.
That's only by your standards though. You might think it's ok to call people idiots once in a while, but the tribunal voters might not, and it's their ideas that matter in the end. Don't like it? Go participate in tribunal yourself.
And there is no such thing as punish-spamming in tribunal. Just look at how many people deserve bans but get pardoned all the time.
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On December 14 2012 03:33 wei2coolman wrote:
It still baffles me how people actually get banned >.>
if you are 0-1400 ELO you'll get reported roughly every other game for SOMETHING. eventually enough ban spammers get your case you get banned. regardless of if you are deserving. just played a game on a low level account i got reported by a xin for something i don't even know, he got mad that i took mini golems while he was ganking top (on blue) so he raged at me all game and said he'd report me then said "enjoy your ban" before leaving post game he also intentionally just split push and ignored anything the entire game and never retreated just died to go back home.
people love to report for anything that isn't dick riding them.
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United States47024 Posts
Unrelated--but does Spirit Stone's design really bother anyone else? I absolutely abhor buying an item like Spirit Stone that has no combat stats, but the huge % increase to damage vs. Jungle monsters makes it seem hard to skip on. It just feels like a situation where junglers are screwed either way--getting a Spirit Stone fucks over your midgame fighting ability because it's an 800 gold zero-combat-stat item, but NOT getting one fucks you over in the long run because of the difference in jungling speed with or without one.
Designing jungle around the assumption/requirement that you're getting Machete/Machete-based items really bothers me and feels like a cop-out solution to the issues of the S2 jungle.
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I dunno I feel like S3 jungle is a relative improvement for Trundle vs. top speed aoe clear junglers. The biggest issue that I see is, he competes with Mundo for the jungler position of "we want a poke/siege comp".
On December 14 2012 04:14 TheYango wrote:
Unrelated--but does Spirit Stone's design really bother anyone else? I absolutely abhor buying an item like Spirit Stone that has no combat stats, but the huge % increase to damage vs. Jungle monsters makes it seem hard to skip on. It just feels like a situation where junglers are screwed either way--getting a Spirit Stone fucks over your midgame fighting ability because it's an 800 gold zero-combat-stat item, but NOT getting one fucks you over in the long run because of the difference in jungling speed with or without one.
Designing jungle around the assumption/requirement that you're getting Machete/Machete-based items really bothers me and feels like a cop-out solution to the issues of the S2 jungle.
Ugh, I agree. Any improved gold junglers are getting in the new jungle AND MORE is just getting sunk into the shitty jungle-mandatory items. I don't feel good about spirit stone until it's spirit of the Ancient Golem. And even then, i'm not particularly fond of SoAG. Even wriggles feels awful now.
700 gold for an item which is regen like philo, but instead of gp10, I am 'ALLOWED' to kill monsters in the jungle at a reasonable speed instead of stupidly slow :/
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nerfing junglers as an attempt to stop mids stealing farm by making it too hard? shame it doesnt work
Also dunno if you actually played trundle in the new jungle but his clearing got SLOWER meanwhile tanks with spirit stone got FASTER because their spells burst down the camps faster lol.
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On December 14 2012 04:14 TheYango wrote:
Unrelated--but does Spirit Stone's design really bother anyone else? I absolutely abhor buying an item like Spirit Stone that has no combat stats, but the huge % increase to damage vs. Jungle monsters makes it seem hard to skip on. It just feels like a situation where junglers are screwed either way--getting a Spirit Stone fucks over your midgame fighting ability because it's an 800 gold zero-combat-stat item, but NOT getting one fucks you over in the long run because of the difference in jungling speed with or without one.
Designing jungle around the assumption/requirement that you're getting Machete/Machete-based items really bothers me and feels like a cop-out solution to the issues of the S2 jungle.
Yeah it's dumb. i've taken to buying it on supports. and just taking wolves/mini golems whenever i know the jungler will get back by the time it respawns. acts like a philo stone in that way, except it's way stronger for laning, and helps vs dragon/baron as well. also it has some nifty situational upgrades. soraka with lizard stone is hilarious , true damage bonus burn on starfall is funny.
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On December 14 2012 04:14 TheYango wrote:
Unrelated--but does Spirit Stone's design really bother anyone else? I absolutely abhor buying an item like Spirit Stone that has no combat stats, but the huge % increase to damage vs. Jungle monsters makes it seem hard to skip on. It just feels like a situation where junglers are screwed either way--getting a Spirit Stone fucks over your midgame fighting ability because it's an 800 gold zero-combat-stat item, but NOT getting one fucks you over in the long run because of the difference in jungling speed with or without one.
Designing jungle around the assumption/requirement that you're getting Machete/Machete-based items really bothers me and feels like a cop-out solution to the issues of the S2 jungle.
I feel the same way but felt I was in the minority since many junglers in S2 built philo stone early on.
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United States47024 Posts
Riot pls just give us S1 jungle back.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
I would argue against Trundle being situationally pickable in S2, not like it matters much now, but if you look at any pro games of the last 4(?) months or so you'll see that poke comps were going with Maokai, not Trundle, if Maokai was picked/banned they'd go with some random stuff depending on what the jungler played (Skarner, Cho, Mundo). Basically, for poke comp the jungler generally wants to get Shurelyas very fast for disengage (edit - or some early game benefits, like the junglers above. Pillar is a bit overrated as far as disengage goes though, until it reaches higher levels), which is something that Trundle can't do, because he kinda needs Wriggles to not clear camps horrendously slowly. And the bad ganks and very overrated and weak counterjungling abilities were nowhere near enough to compensate for that. If you look at the way junglers played towards end of S2, you'll notice that Trundle would have trouble maxing his E before teamfights begun, or he created massive problems for himself and became effectively a squishy due to lack of experience.
That's all S2 though. From theorycraft (because I haven't seen him played nor have I played him myself yet) he looks worse.
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On December 14 2012 04:15 Slayer91 wrote:
nerfing junglers as an attempt to stop mids stealing farm by making it too hard? shame it doesnt work
Also dunno if you actually played trundle in the new jungle but his clearing got SLOWER meanwhile tanks with spirit stone got FASTER because their spells burst down the camps faster lol.
I have, went wriggles and my clear speed didn't feel too bad. But I feel like any jungler I play these days is sinking too much gold into "I am allowed to clear the jungle" instead of combat effectiveness.
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Cept it was faster in S2 
I played warwick and trundle a bit in normals or ranked 5;s to try them in s2 and usually did ok but they just feel depressing now.
and wriggles gave 7 AD more
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On December 14 2012 04:21 Slayer91 wrote:Cept it was faster in S2 I played warwick and trundle a bit in normals or ranked 5;s to try them in s2 and usually did ok but they just feel depressing now.
just get a tiamat on trundle. clears faster than pretty much anyone then.
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On a sidenote, chogath with one of the spirits clears obscenely fast, it effects his E and QW clears camps instantly.
also I hate playing chogath
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On December 14 2012 04:22 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 04:21 Slayer91 wrote:Cept it was faster in S2 I played warwick and trundle a bit in normals or ranked 5;s to try them in s2 and usually did ok but they just feel depressing now. just get a tiamat on trundle. clears faster than pretty much anyone then.
its sad but this is probably viable since wriggles is so bad and expensive now
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On December 14 2012 04:23 Slayer91 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 04:22 PrinceXizor wrote:On December 14 2012 04:21 Slayer91 wrote:Cept it was faster in S2 I played warwick and trundle a bit in normals or ranked 5;s to try them in s2 and usually did ok but they just feel depressing now. just get a tiamat on trundle. clears faster than pretty much anyone then. its sad but this is probably viable since wriggles is so bad and expensive now
I thought of this, and had discarded the idea as too trollish. But clearly I wasn't in the right mindset for Trundle 
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Ok this may be old, but TF's dance is now the Horse dance from Gangnam style. Just ignore me if you guys already knew this
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On December 14 2012 04:23 Slayer91 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 04:22 PrinceXizor wrote:On December 14 2012 04:21 Slayer91 wrote:Cept it was faster in S2 I played warwick and trundle a bit in normals or ranked 5;s to try them in s2 and usually did ok but they just feel depressing now. just get a tiamat on trundle. clears faster than pretty much anyone then. its sad but this is probably viable since wriggles is so bad and expensive now
it's stupidly fast. can clear wraith/wolves in 12 seconds, stopping only a second at each camp. trundle is also healthy enough to start long sword + 2 in the jungle anyway (alternate start, bottle + rejuv + 70 gold)
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EPT
