EPT[Patch 1.0.0.145: Rengar] General Discussion - Page 91
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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mistax
United States415 Posts
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22476 Posts
On August 22 2012 08:45 mistax wrote: always thought Zerker + 1 Doran + IE + vamp scepter was better than rushing a BT. It give you some what of a better laning phase, but in team battle you do alot less damage. only time i could see it being okay, would be if you're ahead or on a hero where more AD scales with them better for their skill. Since I've seen so many AD lately rushing BT again and at mid game end up with BT + PD and either a defensive item or LW and still can't beat the other AD carry who is behind with IE PD / Vamp scepter The thing is you dont need to beat there ad carry as such. I often go BT myself because at lower elos your not going to get enough protection and peels so your first worry is surviving and beating bruisers. | ||
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HazMat
United States17077 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
I don't like BT on Ez and Corki because it gives you no damage I feel like. What's a bit of extra AD on already strong poke, when you can just improve your auto attack DPS which is what they are weak at compared to other ADs. Even BT on graves I don't like that much. When I play melees I'm always super happy when enemy AD goes BT because I know he's not a big threat until he gets IE PD and LW and he probably wants GA before all that so if I have a FH or Randuins and he has BT or BT PD he now needs IE for DPS, LW for armour pen, and QSS/GA to avoid being 1 combo'd by burst, and I feel like that's overloading the AD's gold. Some champs are exceptions here like I feel vayne can get away with it because of her absurd damage. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On August 22 2012 08:45 mistax wrote: always thought Zerker + 1 Doran + IE + vamp scepter was better than rushing a BT. It give you some what of a better laning phase, but in team battle you do alot less damage. only time i could see it being okay, would be if you're ahead or on a hero where more AD scales with them better for their skill. Since I've seen so many AD lately rushing BT again and at mid game end up with BT + PD and either a defensive item or LW and still can't beat the other AD carry who is behind with IE PD / Vamp scepter I'm not sure what you're trying to do with the zerkers. If you do the calculations out it provides very little dps increase when you're in a role that traditionally has long cooldowns so cdr isn't as useful, and you rely on autoattacks. I personally don't feel like melee champs can use attack speed all that well since they're always moving in between autoattacks. So that aura isn't doing as much for them as you think it is either. As far as unconventional AD builds that beat bruisers go, I think your best bet at beating a bruiser is to kite them. That means that unless you are ashe, you should get a phage. | ||
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I_Love_Bacon
United States5765 Posts
No need to start that debate here, dude. (Is this better?) | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
Oh uhm. Any chance you can edit this post to hide my mistake? | ||
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Jumbled
1543 Posts
On August 22 2012 08:01 Ghost-z wrote: After the AP Varus buff how viable is he as an AP carry bot lane? Perhaps this is an optional build if you have someone like Talon or Pantheon in the mid-lane? Max W first Berzerkers>Malady>Dcap>DFG ~350 AP total With this build you should chunk down ~33% of their HP with 3 blight stacks with each Q or E. Plus you can proc it again with your ult dealing ~700 damage with all the extra ap. Add in the DFG and that gives you 4 bursts of ~33% of their total HP in fights. Your auto attacks will also gain another ~90 damage from all the AP. Thoughts? I tried a couple of normal games running AP Varus mid recently, and it went quite well. Used a very different build though. Of course, in a real fight, it's very unlikely you'll ever be able to use the ideal rotation of 3 stacks, ability, 3 stacks, ability, 3 stacks, ability. | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On August 22 2012 08:34 Sufficiency wrote: I don't know why people say IE first is a low Elo trap. It's still a good option if you are behind. It's very simple, a dead player does no damage. BT helps keep you alive and fighting. More below. On August 22 2012 08:45 mistax wrote: always thought Zerker + 1 Doran + IE + vamp scepter was better than rushing a BT. It give you some what of a better laning phase, but in team battle you do alot less damage. only time i could see it being okay, would be if you're ahead or on a hero where more AD scales with them better for their skill. Since I've seen so many AD lately rushing BT again and at mid game end up with BT + PD and either a defensive item or LW and still can't beat the other AD carry who is behind with IE PD / Vamp scepter Two things. If you have IE + Zerker's + 1 Doran + Scepter, the enemy has BT + Zerker's + 1 Doran + Zeal. Assuming you have a base AD of 75 the IE build will actually do less damage (216.6 DPS vs 225.8 DPS). IE will eventually outdamage BT, but the point is to abuse BT's early completion, better mid-game damage, and significantly better healing to dominate. Also, if you have IE the laning phase should be over. If it isn't, end it and start carrying because it should be. I'm ultimately dissing IE not because you can't carry with it, but because a lot of players build it as if there's going to be a late-game, and then complain bitterly about allies feeding when it was within their power to build a strong mid-game item, stop farming, and bail out their team. | ||
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101toss
3232 Posts
Usually only because you don't get to utilize your full AS anyways unless you get great peel | ||
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CeriseCherries
6170 Posts
On August 22 2012 08:57 obesechicken13 wrote: I'm not sure what you're trying to do with the zerkers. If you do the calculations out it provides very little dps increase when you're in a role that traditionally has long cooldowns so cdr isn't as useful, and you rely on autoattacks. I personally don't feel like melee champs can use attack speed all that well since they're always moving in between autoattacks. So that aura isn't doing as much for them as you think it is either. Bezerker greaves, not zeke's herald | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
Shutup I never said that! | ||
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Vaporized
United States1471 Posts
On August 22 2012 08:59 Jumbled wrote: I tried a couple of normal games running AP Varus mid recently, and it went quite well. Used a very different build though. Of course, in a real fight, it's very unlikely you'll ever be able to use the ideal rotation of 3 stacks, ability, 3 stacks, ability, 3 stacks, ability. when varus came out i played a few games mid with malady, nashors tooth, madreds bloodrazer. many lol's to be had with that build. havent tried it sense he got buffed recently tho. | ||
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
All they had to do was stand between me and the towers while I siege them and we win, but they couldn't even do that. I couldn't stop laughing at how absurd the situation was. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
She was a blast in teamfights tho. Especially with Zhonya "I'll kill y- shit you just QR'd to somebody on the other side of the screen, wait here I c- FUCK YOUR ZHONYA. Well, now I'm gonna finish you o- HOW COME YOUR SHIELD IS OFF CD AGAIN?! Well it's time, I- ... I got QRR'd to death. Well shit." | ||
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beefhamburger
United States3962 Posts
"If you're going to send one them mid, it would probably be Ez because Kog just isn't that viable mid anymore after all his nerfs." | ||
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red_
United States8474 Posts
On August 22 2012 09:33 beefhamburger wrote: Oh man these NESL casters.... after CLG B pick an Ezreal and Kog "If you're going to send one them mid, it would probably be Ez because Kog just isn't that viable mid anymore after all his nerfs." Completely unrelated but I miss Ez mid. Bring back 2010... | ||
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