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On August 22 2012 07:15 VirgilSC2 wrote:
This.
It doesn't matter how well you're farming in lane when a 7/0 LeBlanc/Morde/Fizz/EveryotherAPever walks up and kills you instantly in one burst because the rest of your team is incompetent.
it's the same in any other lane.
"it doesn't matter how well you're farming in mid when the 7/0 jungler walks up..."
"it doesn't matter how well you're farming in mid when the 7/0 bot lane takes tower and walks up..."
at my ELO (1300) teamfighting is a mess, but i also find that most ADCs are terrible at it and it's easy to outplay them if even if you're slightly down at the end of lane phase. if you get to that phase you will win hard.
as support, you can also take advantage of teamfighting since i find that most of them get tunneled into killing instead of peeling for their ADC.
i also find that in lane, support is usually the one who punishes the first misstep and initiates, and the ADC just mechanically finishes it off.
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AD carry is by far the most brainless role, there's literally only two things you need to do in fights, don't let the AP blow cooldowns on you, and kite the bruiser. I don't understand why you guys are bringing up the fact that an AP can burst down the AD. Aside from the fact that you shouldn't get bursted, past a certain period in the game, you can easily dodge skillshots and abuse the AP's cooldowns to beat him 1v1.
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the new popularity of regen quints top, are they running regen flat or regen/lvl? I have regen flat melee mid page for certain match ups but I don't have regen/lvl at all.
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On August 22 2012 07:48 kainzero wrote:
at my ELO (1300) teamfighting is a mess, but i also find that most ADCs are terrible at it and it's easy to outplay them if even if you're slightly down at the end of lane phase. if you get to that phase you will win hard.
as support, you can also take advantage of teamfighting since i find that most of them get tunneled into killing instead of peeling for their ADC.
i also find that in lane, support is usually the one who punishes the first misstep and initiates, and the ADC just mechanically finishes it off.
Very much so. The dps difference between a high Elo AD Carry with good positioning and a low Elo AD Carry with bad positioning but isn't getting focused is pretty similar if they had the same items and everything. One of the biggest differences is just how much "uptime" they can get on their dps. (Now learning how to get maximum uptime is a whole different thing...)
Supports are the best for making plays happen in the AD+Support pair. I mean, sure DLift makes great plays in solo queue. But when you watch things like Aphromoo's Leona, the other AD Carry suddenly looks like a genius despite just clicking on people. I think one of the stigmas that Supports have in solo queue is that you have to be able to feel the flow of the game and understand how to make plays much more than other roles because you offer utility rather than damage. With damage, it's easy to see how to make a play to kill someone. When you have to rely on someone else for damage it's harder to set it up. But still very possible.
On August 22 2012 07:55 Slusher wrote:
the new popularity of regen quints top, are they running regen flat or regen/lvl? I have regen/lvl melee mid page for certain match ups but I don't have regen/lvl at all.
Flat Quints I think. The scaling doesn't catch up until like lvl 10 at which point the lane is probably already decided. Having the flat earlier also effectively means a bigger %hp regen at lower hp levels. HP Regen Seals catch up at around lvl 4 btw.
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Every Rengar i observe maxes Q first. Why is that?
He seems to be more of a burst champion than sustained damage, so i don't feel like the AS buff increase when maxing Q is worth it compared to the a lot higher base damage of W and the increased survivability (+60 Armor/MRes on 5).
Q base damage 30 / 55 / 80 / 105 / 130
W base damage 75 / 120 / 165 / 210 / 255
Sure, a point early in Q is definitely worth it but the AS buff increases by 5%/level compared to +10 Armor/MRes per level of W.
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Because the Champion Spotlight said so probably.
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On August 22 2012 07:45 Shikyo wrote:
AP carry vs AD carry in midgame is no contest at all. Even someone like Sion with only 2 usable skills is able to 100 -> 0 an AD carry pretty simply in a deathcap vs ie scenario. the AD carry needs way too long to kill the AP carry. He needs to attack when the AP carry has his skills on cooldown, is preoccupied with something else, or is CC'd by your team
IE is a trap for low Elo. Build BT, negatron and/or chain vest, push your tower, then roam and destroy everything. If you're really better than your Elo you'll carry far harder that way than waiting for a late-game that may never come.
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After the AP Varus buff how viable is he as an AP carry bot lane? Perhaps this is an optional build if you have someone like Talon or Pantheon in the mid-lane?
Max W first
Berzerkers>Malady>Dcap>DFG
~350 AP total
With this build you should chunk down ~33% of their HP with 3 blight stacks with each Q or E. Plus you can proc it again with your ult dealing ~700 damage with all the extra ap. Add in the DFG and that gives you 4 bursts of ~33% of their total HP in fights. Your auto attacks will also gain another ~90 damage from all the AP.
Thoughts?
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I ran flat regen for a while, I liked it, I stopped using it and switched to gold/armor/mr quints. Mostly gold and I use it to buy potions.
Fun fact, if you just used the gold generated from gold quints exclusively for buying hp potions and chugged them constantly, you'd actually be getting significantly more hp/5 than regen quints give you, so that's basically how I view them, as sustain runes with bonuses. The gold quints obviously don't do anything until the first time you back but they:
- work when you are full hp in lane
- and when you are pilling and running back
- can be turned into other stats at a 1:1 ratio
- Have application to late game teamfights
- allow you to 'save up' your regen so you can do something like chug potions in a row
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On August 22 2012 08:00 Seuss wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2012 07:45 Shikyo wrote:
AP carry vs AD carry in midgame is no contest at all. Even someone like Sion with only 2 usable skills is able to 100 -> 0 an AD carry pretty simply in a deathcap vs ie scenario. the AD carry needs way too long to kill the AP carry. He needs to attack when the AP carry has his skills on cooldown, is preoccupied with something else, or is CC'd by your team IE is a trap for low Elo. Build BT, negatron and/or chain vest, push your tower, then roam and destroy everything. If you're really better than your Elo you'll carry far harder that way than waiting for a late-game that may never come.
You cannot destroy anything with just a BT, it's a pure lategame build, you deal 0 dmg --
On August 22 2012 08:08 UniversalSnip wrote:
I ran flat regen for a while, I liked it, I stopped using it and switched to gold/armor/mr quints. Mostly gold and I use it to buy potions.
Fun fact, if you just used the gold generated from gold quints exclusively for buying hp potions and chugged them constantly, you'd actually be getting significantly more hp/5 than regen quints give you, so that's basically how I view them, as sustain runes with bonuses. The gold quints obviously don't do anything until the first time you back but they:
- work when you are full hp in lane
- and when you are pilling and running back
- can be turned into other stats at a 1:1 ratio
- Have application to late game teamfights
- allow you to 'save up' your regen so you can do something like chug potions in a row Not to burst your bubble or anything but hp regen is by far the most important before your first back. Not to mention that usually you don't even need a billion potions, why not just spend 450g on a vamp scepter?
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On August 22 2012 08:10 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2012 08:00 Seuss wrote:On August 22 2012 07:45 Shikyo wrote:
AP carry vs AD carry in midgame is no contest at all. Even someone like Sion with only 2 usable skills is able to 100 -> 0 an AD carry pretty simply in a deathcap vs ie scenario. the AD carry needs way too long to kill the AP carry. He needs to attack when the AP carry has his skills on cooldown, is preoccupied with something else, or is CC'd by your team IE is a trap for low Elo. Build BT, negatron and/or chain vest, push your tower, then roam and destroy everything. If you're really better than your Elo you'll carry far harder that way than waiting for a late-game that may never come. You cannot destroy anything with just a BT, it's a pure lategame build, you deal 0 dmg -- Show nested quote +On August 22 2012 08:08 UniversalSnip wrote:
I ran flat regen for a while, I liked it, I stopped using it and switched to gold/armor/mr quints. Mostly gold and I use it to buy potions.
Fun fact, if you just used the gold generated from gold quints exclusively for buying hp potions and chugged them constantly, you'd actually be getting significantly more hp/5 than regen quints give you, so that's basically how I view them, as sustain runes with bonuses. The gold quints obviously don't do anything until the first time you back but they:
- work when you are full hp in lane
- and when you are pilling and running back
- can be turned into other stats at a 1:1 ratio
- Have application to late game teamfights
- allow you to 'save up' your regen so you can do something like chug potions in a row Not to burst your bubble or anything but hp regen is by far the most important before your first back. Not to mention that usually you don't even need a billion potions, why not just spend 450g on a vamp scepter?
Not particularly, you're always free to shove the lane and go buy a ward really early. In fact I almost always do unless I feel strongly that I'm ahead early. There's nothing forcing you to stay in lane until you have 1k.
As for the second question, because just buying a vamp sucks dick. In fact I don't even understand the question it seems so irrelevant.
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Hardest part about being aggressive support is not dying because your laner won't leave the minions.
Hardest part about being AD is your support not trying to be aggressive when you have a giant wave built up.
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On August 22 2012 08:18 Craton wrote:
Hardest part about being aggressive support is not dying because your laner won't leave the minions.
Hardest part about being AD is your support not trying to be aggressive when you have a giant wave built up.
lol so true. +++11111
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btw how are people playing zyra nowadays?
i tried her after the nerf and i am just doing terrible, though in general i am a terrible mid player.
i used to build doran x2 - sorc shoes - rabadons - rylais.
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On August 22 2012 08:22 kainzero wrote:
btw how are people playing zyra nowadays?
i tried her after the nerf and i am just doing terrible, though in general i am a terrible mid player.
i used to build doran x2 - sorc shoes - rabadons - rylais.
I still play her lots. You have to be smarter about your positioning since the hotfix. She gets caught way easier.
I go 2 dring, sorc, dcap, void (cuz fuck survivability when you can instagib the entire team)
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Soniv's master plan is basically get caught, die, but get enemy team low enough for jungle Nunu to clean up.
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just played a 59 minute jungle rengar game. he is a lot more fun then i thought he would be.
my build was boots x 3, dorans, hog, necklace, bruta, bt, fromal. this game kept going on and on (We had a dc that dragged it out another 15 min until he came back). i eventually ended the game with ghostblade, randuins, merc treads, bt, warmogs, frozen mallet. there came a point where i decided to sell the necklace for warmogs. the necklace is cost effective through the mid game, but i think if the game goes long you will want something else, in a 6 item build it isnt really a good use of a slot.
i just built for whatever i needed at the time, not really sure what is ideal on him yet. his burst is pretty good, mid game i could jump on their twitch or karthus and almost instantly nuke them down. i also liked that the cooldown on his ult drops dramatically at lvl 11 and then 16. i guess the base is 50 sec at 16, with some cdr can drop down to ~35 sec.
he didnt look that interesting to me from the previews, but i am pleasantly surprised. he is pretty fun.
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On August 22 2012 08:10 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2012 08:00 Seuss wrote:On August 22 2012 07:45 Shikyo wrote:
AP carry vs AD carry in midgame is no contest at all. Even someone like Sion with only 2 usable skills is able to 100 -> 0 an AD carry pretty simply in a deathcap vs ie scenario. the AD carry needs way too long to kill the AP carry. He needs to attack when the AP carry has his skills on cooldown, is preoccupied with something else, or is CC'd by your team IE is a trap for low Elo. Build BT, negatron and/or chain vest, push your tower, then roam and destroy everything. If you're really better than your Elo you'll carry far harder that way than waiting for a late-game that may never come. You cannot destroy anything with just a BT, it's a pure lategame build, you deal 0 dmg --
You can absolutely destroy everything with just a BT and zerker's. I have no idea why you think BT is restricted to the late-game. Rushing BT has historically been second only to BC in terms of "do this to crush your opponents early" item builds on AD carries.
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EPT
