• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 08:25
CET 14:25
KST 22:25
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-1815Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises2Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies3ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !11Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4
StarCraft 2
General
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Starcraft 2 Zerg Coach ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !
Tourneys
OSC Season 13 World Championship WardiTV Mondays $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship $100 Prize Pool - Winter Warp Gate Masters Showdow Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 506 Warp Zone Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play
Brood War
General
I would like to say something about StarCraft BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ (UMS) SWITCHEROO *New* /Destination Edit/ What monitor do you use for playing Remastered? BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[BSL21] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CET SLON Grand Finals – Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] LB SemiFinals - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Awesome Games Done Quick 2026! Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Mechabellum
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI 12 Days of Starcraft
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
National Diversity: A Challe…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1123 users

[Patch 1.0.0.143: MidJuly-Zyra] General Discussion - Page…

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 129 130 131 132 133 137 Next
Deleted User 101379
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
4849 Posts
July 31 2012 18:37 GMT
#2601
On August 01 2012 03:24 QuakerOats wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 03:16 TheYango wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:10 wei2coolman wrote:
Also, the whole ELO system is there so you will play with opponents that are around your skill level.

You really think that Jiji playing random solo queue opponents would be remotely comparable to him 1v1ing Froggen over and over again?


1v1s oversimplify laning though. I remember a while back Hotshot and Chauster got in an argument cuz they were doing a 1v1, and when Chauster went back to base early on (lvl 3 or so) Hotshot started farming past the turret. Chauster told him he would never be able to do that in a real game because the jungler/mid would come up and kill him; Hotshot disagreed, and from what I remember they never came to a consensus. You can get away with a lot more stuff when you know there is no jungler or other lanes to worry about, so I think solo queue is actually probably better practice (although you can definitely learn stuff from 1v1s).


The junglers should practice at the same time... but then you could say "but the jungler would be ganking top now instead".
If you follow some rules, 1v1 can be good early game practice but it never really can replace 5v5 practice.

wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
July 31 2012 18:37 GMT
#2602
On August 01 2012 03:24 Requizen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 03:19 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:14 Requizen wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:11 Bladeorade wrote:
Yeah because the brood war Meta was never stale for long periods of time.

/shrug

At least you saw some variance in builds. It gets a bit grating seeing bruiser top, caster mid, AD bot with 0 farm support, and tanky/CC jungler every game. The only variation is like, occasionally you see an assassin mid or a high-damage jungler, and sometimes bot and top switch lanes to counter something. Not to mention the builds being nearly exactly the same for every single person for a given role every time.

I'll admit that it got stale for stretches, but at least the play was always exciting. For every cool composition we see in LoL, there are 10 more games playing "farm until late game and then protect the Kog/Vayne" for the umpteenth time.

I disagree, There seems to be shift in meta right now, in high tourney play. 1v2 seems to be a popular lane choice now, sending someone like gangplank bot, to 1v2, while 2v1ing top, and trying to abuse that as hard as possible. I think by season 3 we'll see a huge evolution in the meta, and more well thought out team comps.



It's not really a difference, though. I see the same thing a lot with Shen, Kayle, or Yorick switching lanes, but it's the exact same team comp, just abusing the fact that some solo laners can 1v2 safely and others can't. Actually, I'm sure that if WotA Nunu picks up steam, we'll see him do the lane switch as well.

The only awkward thing this does to the meta is that it moves a player away from dragon, but as long as your support/AD top wins lane (which they should against most non-godly tops), the support at least is free to roam for control.

Now a big meta shift would be like, bringing back actual roam supports as an actual thing, and not "oh my lane is winning, may as well roam". The days of picking Taric to just more or less never be in lane and constantly roam and stun was hilariously fun.

How is going back to old meta, a big change to the meta? :O

Imo I want to see supports that have strong damaging spells, that have high base damage, but poor scaling, similar to some of the "supports" in dota.
liftlift > tsm
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
July 31 2012 18:38 GMT
#2603
On August 01 2012 03:37 Morfildur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 03:24 QuakerOats wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:16 TheYango wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:10 wei2coolman wrote:
Also, the whole ELO system is there so you will play with opponents that are around your skill level.

You really think that Jiji playing random solo queue opponents would be remotely comparable to him 1v1ing Froggen over and over again?


1v1s oversimplify laning though. I remember a while back Hotshot and Chauster got in an argument cuz they were doing a 1v1, and when Chauster went back to base early on (lvl 3 or so) Hotshot started farming past the turret. Chauster told him he would never be able to do that in a real game because the jungler/mid would come up and kill him; Hotshot disagreed, and from what I remember they never came to a consensus. You can get away with a lot more stuff when you know there is no jungler or other lanes to worry about, so I think solo queue is actually probably better practice (although you can definitely learn stuff from 1v1s).


The junglers should practice at the same time... but then you could say "but the jungler would be ganking top now instead".
If you follow some rules, 1v1 can be good early game practice but it never really can replace 5v5 practice.



I've done 1v1's for practice in top lane. The #1 thing 1v1 toplanes can teach you, is how to play certain matchups when it comes to learning how to exchange in early game, and when to harass/get cs. etc etc.
liftlift > tsm
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
July 31 2012 18:39 GMT
#2604
On August 01 2012 03:37 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 03:24 Requizen wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:19 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:14 Requizen wrote:
On August 01 2012 03:11 Bladeorade wrote:
Yeah because the brood war Meta was never stale for long periods of time.

/shrug

At least you saw some variance in builds. It gets a bit grating seeing bruiser top, caster mid, AD bot with 0 farm support, and tanky/CC jungler every game. The only variation is like, occasionally you see an assassin mid or a high-damage jungler, and sometimes bot and top switch lanes to counter something. Not to mention the builds being nearly exactly the same for every single person for a given role every time.

I'll admit that it got stale for stretches, but at least the play was always exciting. For every cool composition we see in LoL, there are 10 more games playing "farm until late game and then protect the Kog/Vayne" for the umpteenth time.

I disagree, There seems to be shift in meta right now, in high tourney play. 1v2 seems to be a popular lane choice now, sending someone like gangplank bot, to 1v2, while 2v1ing top, and trying to abuse that as hard as possible. I think by season 3 we'll see a huge evolution in the meta, and more well thought out team comps.



It's not really a difference, though. I see the same thing a lot with Shen, Kayle, or Yorick switching lanes, but it's the exact same team comp, just abusing the fact that some solo laners can 1v2 safely and others can't. Actually, I'm sure that if WotA Nunu picks up steam, we'll see him do the lane switch as well.

The only awkward thing this does to the meta is that it moves a player away from dragon, but as long as your support/AD top wins lane (which they should against most non-godly tops), the support at least is free to roam for control.

Now a big meta shift would be like, bringing back actual roam supports as an actual thing, and not "oh my lane is winning, may as well roam". The days of picking Taric to just more or less never be in lane and constantly roam and stun was hilariously fun.

How is going back to old meta, a big change to the meta? :O

Imo I want to see supports that have strong damaging spells, that have high base damage, but poor scaling, similar to some of the "supports" in dota.

Well, not a shift, but at least variety. It would be interesting to see some games with 0 CS babysitting supports and some games with roaming gank supports, but instead we have all from column A and none from column B.

My wording needs work.
It's your boy Guzma!
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
July 31 2012 19:05 GMT
#2605
hatperson and red baron so knowledgeable I feel like watching IPL stream is unlocking the secrets of lol for me.
Carrilord has arrived.
TheKefka
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Croatia11752 Posts
July 31 2012 19:31 GMT
#2606
I just had a guy that banned nunu rofl,smash broke solo que already.
Cackle™
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
July 31 2012 19:36 GMT
#2607
On August 01 2012 04:31 TheKefka wrote:
I just had a guy that banned nunu rofl,smash broke solo que already.

The second the rumble nerf hits, nunu is going to be the next major target~.

Freaking smash...

Has any notable top pro player adapted the nunu top lane w/ smash's build?
liftlift > tsm
Perplex
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1693 Posts
July 31 2012 19:39 GMT
#2608
On August 01 2012 04:36 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 04:31 TheKefka wrote:
I just had a guy that banned nunu rofl,smash broke solo que already.

The second the rumble nerf hits, nunu is going to be the next major target~.

Freaking smash...

Has any notable top pro player adapted the nunu top lane w/ smash's build?


Voyboy ran it on stream yesterday
http://www.lolking.net/summoner/na/24238059
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-31 19:57:54
July 31 2012 19:49 GMT
#2609
On August 01 2012 04:39 Perplex wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 04:36 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 01 2012 04:31 TheKefka wrote:
I just had a guy that banned nunu rofl,smash broke solo que already.

The second the rumble nerf hits, nunu is going to be the next major target~.

Freaking smash...

Has any notable top pro player adapted the nunu top lane w/ smash's build?


Voyboy ran it on stream yesterday

What did he have to say about it?

Also, does anyone have link to vod of shake's nunu game w/ SV?
liftlift > tsm
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
July 31 2012 20:22 GMT
#2610
im getting the feeling irelia crushes everyone top and there's no champion in the game that can guarantee lane advantage. Everyone gets wrecked if they fall behind.
Perplex
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1693 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-31 20:27:40
July 31 2012 20:27 GMT
#2611
On August 01 2012 04:49 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 04:39 Perplex wrote:
On August 01 2012 04:36 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 01 2012 04:31 TheKefka wrote:
I just had a guy that banned nunu rofl,smash broke solo que already.

The second the rumble nerf hits, nunu is going to be the next major target~.

Freaking smash...

Has any notable top pro player adapted the nunu top lane w/ smash's build?


Voyboy ran it on stream yesterday

What did he have to say about it?

Also, does anyone have link to vod of shake's nunu game w/ SV?


He didn't talk about it much because the caitlyn on the enemy team started intentionally feeding and his team just 5 man pushed mid and won in ~25 minutes. He got 5 kills though and started buying the correct items (chalice, part of glacial, mercs). All I know is that he (and clg) are aware of the build.

Zulu you don't even think tiger udyr?
http://www.lolking.net/summoner/na/24238059
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
July 31 2012 20:30 GMT
#2612
for the first 3 levels maybe, too easy to make up disadvantage with rune/masteries, when W is level'd up a few levels no top in the game wins trades vs her if she's slightly ahead. Because so, I don't even think you need to ever run defensive quints vs her and can probably skimp on defensive seals/glyphs in favor of AS in respect to the matchup.
Scip
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Czech Republic11293 Posts
July 31 2012 20:33 GMT
#2613
On August 01 2012 05:22 zulu_nation8 wrote:
im getting the feeling irelia crushes everyone top and there's no champion in the game that can guarantee lane advantage. Everyone gets wrecked if they fall behind.

Irelia is one of the maybe 3 easiest top lanes to gank in the lane. First of all, her only escape is Q to a creep or her E, which is 1 second stun (shouldn't be a big deal as long as both top lane and jungler has any form of CC). Second, her damage (apart from ultimate, unimportant) is melee only, which makes her very vulnarable very often, if she wants to push any advantage she might have.

I obviously have no idea about how laning goes against her, but she is almost as easy to gank as Darius is. I dunno if it actually does anything, but try to ask your jungler to gank early (in champ select or before 1:20, preferably)
"It may be pleasurable for some of us to imagine being ravished" - Christopher Hitchens in a debate with feminists RIP 2011 Psalm 2:9 You shall break them with a rod of iron
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-31 20:36:11
July 31 2012 20:35 GMT
#2614
On August 01 2012 05:33 Scip wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 05:22 zulu_nation8 wrote:
im getting the feeling irelia crushes everyone top and there's no champion in the game that can guarantee lane advantage. Everyone gets wrecked if they fall behind.

Irelia is one of the maybe 3 easiest top lanes to gank in the lane


LOL
She has 2 abilities which help her escape.
Any from behind ganks can be Q-->E'd run away, and any straight up ganks she can still juke around. She's no ungankable but "top 3 easiest to gank" is hilariously stupid.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
July 31 2012 20:37 GMT
#2615
On August 01 2012 05:35 Slayer91 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 05:33 Scip wrote:
On August 01 2012 05:22 zulu_nation8 wrote:
im getting the feeling irelia crushes everyone top and there's no champion in the game that can guarantee lane advantage. Everyone gets wrecked if they fall behind.

Irelia is one of the maybe 3 easiest top lanes to gank in the lane


LOL
She has 2 abilities which help her escape.
Any from behind ganks can be Q-->E'd run away, and any straight up ganks she can still juke around. She's no ungankable but "top 3 easiest to gank" is hilariously stupid.

E is probably the only real escape. Q is only viable if you're being beyond aggressive, and get caught doing so.
liftlift > tsm
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-31 20:38:44
July 31 2012 20:38 GMT
#2616
Ganks from behind? Jukes from bush to creep wave? Escapes down river?
Scip
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Czech Republic11293 Posts
July 31 2012 20:39 GMT
#2617
On August 01 2012 05:35 Slayer91 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2012 05:33 Scip wrote:
On August 01 2012 05:22 zulu_nation8 wrote:
im getting the feeling irelia crushes everyone top and there's no champion in the game that can guarantee lane advantage. Everyone gets wrecked if they fall behind.

Irelia is one of the maybe 3 easiest top lanes to gank in the lane


LOL
She has 2 abilities which help her escape.
Any from behind ganks can be Q-->E'd run away, and any straight up ganks she can still juke around. She's no ungankable but "top 3 easiest to gank" is hilariously stupid.

Please, make me a gift of a list of champions that are easier to gank than irelia, your Brilliance.
"It may be pleasurable for some of us to imagine being ravished" - Christopher Hitchens in a debate with feminists RIP 2011 Psalm 2:9 You shall break them with a rod of iron
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-31 20:41:01
July 31 2012 20:40 GMT
#2618
Isn't the whole 'limits of solo queue' the whole reason CLG picked up a second NA team? They wanted somebody they could consistently practice with cooperatively. then they moved to korea
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-31 20:42:32
July 31 2012 20:40 GMT
#2619
i feel like irelia is top 3 hardest lane to gank...

if lv2 ganked from behind when you're lv1, hide in brush, Q to ganker, flash to tower if you have to. Otherwise if you max E it's like a 2 sec stun, it's impossible to die with flash up, without flash it's still hard. I don't think any other top laner has a dash and a stun to escape from ganks.
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-31 20:40:53
July 31 2012 20:40 GMT
#2620
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
Prev 1 129 130 131 132 133 137 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Platinum Heroes Events
12:00
PSC2L Finals - Playoffs
Krystianer vs PercivalLIVE!
Gerald vs Jumy
Nicoract vs Creator
RotterdaM975
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 975
SortOf 201
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 43698
Shuttle 2093
GuemChi 1738
Sea 1518
Horang2 1153
EffOrt 1063
Stork 764
Jaedong 716
Soma 603
ggaemo 392
[ Show more ]
actioN 370
Snow 322
hero 234
Mini 224
Last 202
Sharp 178
Zeus 149
Barracks 129
Leta 77
sorry 72
ToSsGirL 67
PianO 45
Sea.KH 33
Mind 29
JYJ 23
Rock 16
Shine 16
yabsab 15
scan(afreeca) 11
Sacsri 11
ajuk12(nOOB) 11
GoRush 10
HiyA 10
Noble 10
Sexy 4
Dota 2
singsing3523
XcaliburYe710
Fuzer 344
syndereN275
League of Legends
C9.Mang0397
Other Games
Gorgc3458
Pyrionflax536
Hui .115
hiko75
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 21
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• WagamamaTV130
Upcoming Events
OSC
23h 35m
Korean StarCraft League
1d 13h
OSC
1d 22h
IPSL
2 days
Dewalt vs Bonyth
OSC
2 days
OSC
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Patches Events
4 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

C-Race Season 1
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9

Ongoing

IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W2
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
Escore Tournament S1: W3
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Thunderfire SC2 All-star 2025
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
Nations Cup 2026
Underdog Cup #3
NA Kuram Kup
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.