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On July 06 2012 11:35 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2012 11:00 TheYango wrote:On July 06 2012 10:29 Ryuu314 wrote:
The problem with maxing W is that it’s a channeling spell, which means that whenever you try to use it, any good AP mid will be able to do tons of damage to you and also possibly interrupt your channel. Not only that, but W’s cooldown is pretty high until you get several levels in it and/or have blue. I don’t think it’s very mana efficient either iirc. Drain only needs to channel 2 ticks to be comparably powerful compared to non-channeling point-and-click nukes in terms of damage efficiency. This isn't even considering the fact that it heals as well. Show nested quote +On July 06 2012 10:30 HazMat wrote:On July 06 2012 10:29 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 06 2012 10:12 Qualm wrote:On July 06 2012 10:09 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 06 2012 09:52 Shikyo wrote:
Hmm I'm thinking a little.
Would a comp such as Fiddle in the Middle, Amumu jungle, Rumble top, Ezreal/Janna bot be viable?
Interesting that no one has really tried to run stuff like that in a competitive game, in theory it would be amazing. I guess people ward too well against Fiddle, but in that case, something like Karthus should still work... Someone (I think Shake?) was talking about a 2k elo duo q running Fiddle mid and Amumu jungle with great success several pages back. Honestly I think it might work if your Fiddle mid isn't too heavily counterpicked. I'm not sure how you'd skill him tho, cause his laning seems pretty weak against other APs to me. My guess is a combination of Q and E skilling , while more or less ignore W. Fiddle has sick gank assist with Q and E, but without W he doesn't really do damage so iunno. You can just max W and sustain pretty much everything. The problem with maxing W is that it’s a channeling spell, which means that whenever you try to use it, any good AP mid will be able to do tons of damage to you and also possibly interrupt your channel. Not only that, but W’s cooldown is pretty high until you get several levels in it and/or have blue. I don’t think it’s very mana efficient either iirc. You can't out dmg drain unless you have a cc. Most ap mid's don't have an on call CC that they can also save up for drain (ie they wouldn't be able to use it to CS or harass) If they have a cc, then Fiddle's kinda screwed early on when drain cd is still quite long. Not to mention that Drain is costs quite a ton of mana and if Fiddle wants to fear+drain combo his opponent, he's going to go oom in like 3 combos. Fiddle also doesn't exactly have the best base mana pool/regen iirc. Also, AP mids that don't have cc tend to have very strong pushing power, which Fiddle simply can't deal with at all. His pushing power is awful, which means it's very easy for the opposing AP mid to just shove lane and then steal your jungler's camps or go gank with little fear of retaliation from Fiddle. I'm not saying that Fiddle can't do well. Just that in an isolated 1v1 lane situation I can't see Fiddle being able to dominate many lanes. Of course, with sufficient jungle support, Fiddle should be able to rock lanes pretty hard due to having like 5+ seconds of cc easily.
He could always fear you and drain back to full hp in a good 2 seconds. Or god forbid he goes to wraiths like other AP's and gets full hp via drain. Idk I think you're underestimating his mid power.
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Shake vs. Smash going down now. Lee Sin real chump, bout to get bodied.
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On July 06 2012 11:37 HazMat wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2012 11:35 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 06 2012 11:00 TheYango wrote:On July 06 2012 10:29 Ryuu314 wrote:
The problem with maxing W is that it’s a channeling spell, which means that whenever you try to use it, any good AP mid will be able to do tons of damage to you and also possibly interrupt your channel. Not only that, but W’s cooldown is pretty high until you get several levels in it and/or have blue. I don’t think it’s very mana efficient either iirc. Drain only needs to channel 2 ticks to be comparably powerful compared to non-channeling point-and-click nukes in terms of damage efficiency. This isn't even considering the fact that it heals as well. On July 06 2012 10:30 HazMat wrote:On July 06 2012 10:29 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 06 2012 10:12 Qualm wrote:On July 06 2012 10:09 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 06 2012 09:52 Shikyo wrote:
Hmm I'm thinking a little.
Would a comp such as Fiddle in the Middle, Amumu jungle, Rumble top, Ezreal/Janna bot be viable?
Interesting that no one has really tried to run stuff like that in a competitive game, in theory it would be amazing. I guess people ward too well against Fiddle, but in that case, something like Karthus should still work... Someone (I think Shake?) was talking about a 2k elo duo q running Fiddle mid and Amumu jungle with great success several pages back. Honestly I think it might work if your Fiddle mid isn't too heavily counterpicked. I'm not sure how you'd skill him tho, cause his laning seems pretty weak against other APs to me. My guess is a combination of Q and E skilling , while more or less ignore W. Fiddle has sick gank assist with Q and E, but without W he doesn't really do damage so iunno. You can just max W and sustain pretty much everything. The problem with maxing W is that it’s a channeling spell, which means that whenever you try to use it, any good AP mid will be able to do tons of damage to you and also possibly interrupt your channel. Not only that, but W’s cooldown is pretty high until you get several levels in it and/or have blue. I don’t think it’s very mana efficient either iirc. You can't out dmg drain unless you have a cc. Most ap mid's don't have an on call CC that they can also save up for drain (ie they wouldn't be able to use it to CS or harass) If they have a cc, then Fiddle's kinda screwed early on when drain cd is still quite long. Not to mention that Drain is costs quite a ton of mana and if Fiddle wants to fear+drain combo his opponent, he's going to go oom in like 3 combos. Fiddle also doesn't exactly have the best base mana pool/regen iirc. Also, AP mids that don't have cc tend to have very strong pushing power, which Fiddle simply can't deal with at all. His pushing power is awful, which means it's very easy for the opposing AP mid to just shove lane and then steal your jungler's camps or go gank with little fear of retaliation from Fiddle. I'm not saying that Fiddle can't do well. Just that in an isolated 1v1 lane situation I can't see Fiddle being able to dominate many lanes. Of course, with sufficient jungle support, Fiddle should be able to rock lanes pretty hard due to having like 5+ seconds of cc easily. He could always fear you and drain back to full hp in a good 2 seconds. Or god forbid he goes to wraiths like other AP's and gets full hp via drain. Idk I think you're underestimating his mid power.
I'm probably underestimating his drain power, but I'm pretty sure I'm not underestimating his horrible pushing/anti-pushing capabilities.
I can't see Fiddle being able to keep his tower against or stop the map presence of say a Morgana or Cassiopeia since Fiddle's ability to clear creep is abysmal. Even if Fiddle can out-trade and out-sustain other AP mids, it wouldn't really matter if he can't clear creep since most APs can just shove the lane and stay out of range of Fiddle's fear/drain, both of which are pretty short range (575 and 475 respectively).
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On July 06 2012 11:44 Mogwai wrote:
Shake vs. Smash going down now. Lee Sin real chump, bout to get bodied.
Creepin' on you guys as we speak!
I can see neither of you are streaming....should I do it so the TL masses can see?
Edit: FUck it....XSplit is being an asshole...I can LR it though... 
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ok, so that took literally 2:30 for me to die, fuck.
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On July 06 2012 11:50 Mogwai wrote:
ok, so that took literally 2:30 for me to die, fuck.
Spoiler goddamn it! It;s till 2:00 here
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I tried right clicking on him, but then I ran out of oom from E and didn't do any damage to him and also i had no pots or movespeed or flash to get away. I dunno, in retrospect I guess shake just got lucky.
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Too bad you ran oom after 2 E's.
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Well my question is (at the risk of extending this retarded argument any further) how are you SUPPOSED to play the lane in his eyes?
Like.....after you E 2-3 times you can't do shit....
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Hey, I totally got 3 off.
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On July 06 2012 11:54 WaveofShadow wrote:
Well my question is (at the risk of extending this retarded argument any further) how are you SUPPOSED to play the lane in his eyes?
Like.....after you E 2-3 times you can't do shit....
Well the opponent can't start boots + 4 pots. That ruins the strat.
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Did you guys actually waste like 3 minutes of your life testing out an Eve vs Lee Sin lane...
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Scientific research is NOT a waste of time. Ask the god particle guys. Me and smash are just like that except we work on more pressing matters.
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THANKS GUYS just saved me 1350ip :D, sure am glad I waited for the test to be sure.
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Well.
Lee Sin was pretty obviously going to beat Evelynn, however she can be possible as a last pick counterpick to something specific(I need to figure out what that might be first)
By the way, has no one thought about the art of botlane counterpicking? For example, they pick Soraka -> pick MF Taric, or things like that?
It seems like many people think that botlane is a safe first pick and can't really be counterpicked and is all about the support + ad carry synergy, I jsut cannot agree with that.
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So...watching something interesting right now, want to know what TL's take on this is.
Phantomlord (who I normally don't watch too often...not a fan of his attitude) apparently is makin' bank off of people who are paying him for lessons/duo queue and such.
He's currently giving mid lane lessons to some guy and is doing something he calls 'The Caitlyn Challenge.'
I guess the opponent can pick any champ he wants to go v. Phantomlord on Caitlyn (except for easy clearing champs like Morde or Heimer or something) and the rules are:
1. 85 cs by 10 min
2. Can only step on 1 trap or he fails.
3. Cannot kill cait, can only harass
4. Cait can kill opponent unless Cait is below 50% hp in which case she may not harass.
Supposedly this is supposed to make someone 'think outside the box.' I'm not sure how useful this actually is, and I'm not sure how the rest of Phantomlord's lessons are supposed to go or teach someone. Just wondering what you guys think of these lessons as a teaching tool or whather it's just so much bullshit.
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On July 06 2012 12:19 Shikyo wrote:
Well.
Lee Sin was pretty obviously going to beat Evelynn, however she can be possible as a last pick counterpick to something specific(I need to figure out what that might be first)
By the way, has no one thought about the art of botlane counterpicking? For example, they pick Soraka -> pick MF Taric, or things like that?
It seems like many people think that botlane is a safe first pick and can't really be counterpicked and is all about the support + ad carry synergy, I jsut cannot agree with that.
Shikyo, you talk lots of weird stuff, you have many weird ideas, you cry a lot and we still love you. In some weird kind of way. But trying to even remotely side with the eve side of this debate really makes you look stupid. =P
Besides that:
On July 06 2012 00:44 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2012 00:37 Mogwai wrote:On July 05 2012 09:56 PrinceXizor wrote:
Eh i only 1v1'd him because he caught me inbetween dota 2 matches(watching not playing) while i was sitting in LoL. I still don't think it proves a damn thing, except that he definitely underestimated the trading mid wave issue and that i shouldn't have tried the trade to wukong outside of the creep waves like i did twice. and that he was BM in game.
EDIT: I'd like to see two top laners try it instead of a support player playing vs a jungler. fine, I'll use your spec and play vs. Shake. I'm a better top laner than he is anyway. Tell me your spec and we'll see what happens with Eve vs. Lee Sin. "You didn't do it right" incoming. I promise
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On July 06 2012 12:24 WaveofShadow wrote:
So...watching something interesting right now, want to know what TL's take on this is.
Phantomlord (who I normally don't watch too often...not a fan of his attitude) apparently is makin' bank off of people who are paying him for lessons/duo queue and such.
He's currently giving mid lane lessons to some guy and is doing something he calls 'The Caitlyn Challenge.'
I guess the opponent can pick any champ he wants to go v. Phantomlord on Caitlyn (except for easy clearing champs like Morde or Heimer or something) and the rules are:
1. 85 cs by 10 min
2. Can only step on 1 trap or he fails.
3. Cannot kill cait, can only harass
4. Cait can kill opponent unless Cait is below 50% hp in which case she may not harass.
Supposedly this is supposed to make someone 'think outside the box.' I'm not sure how useful this actually is, and I'm not sure how the rest of Phantomlord's lessons are supposed to go or teach someone. Just wondering what you guys think of these lessons as a teaching tool or whather it's just so much bullshit.
It's basically saying "learn to cs under high pressure". If that's something his student is bad at, I can see it working. However, this exercise will not help someone as much as others if he is bad at plain and simple CSing.
In case someone has problems with pressure/harass AND csing I can see this work for each of those isolated it's pretty bad.
(Another version with the trainee learning how to apply pressure would trainee on cait with rules like "If you don't hit me at least each x seconds you fail - this version however sucks to do with a coach because you can do it just the same in solo q.)
Edit: If he claims that this should teach someone to "think outside the box" he's either lying or stupid in this case, that has nothing to do with this exercise.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
Oh god guys Im going to Norway for like maybe a week and I won't have any internet connection there.
I'm gonna mis you guys soooo much, Il have fun in there but still, no internets. With my absence being imminent, Im just going to thoughtdump.
I like Rammus, he's ok. I am having trouble finding a good build for him, can't hel but feel the wriggles PD build isn't exactly cutting it.
If the leaked patch notes are true, nautilus is going to be not very good at all, I feel like he's on the very very edge where he is barely OP from where he can kinda snowball if that makes sense, and I think the nerf would push him over the edge and make him mig-high tier jungler.
I want to see more Karma, the shield is just soooo strong and the speed up too just a godsent for a bruiser. But the same goes for Zilean who is arguably better, so I don't know. Support Karma unlikely to work. sigh sadface
Teut aka Slayer91 was avoiding to me, played ranked 5s with other guys and when I came online he just continued to play with them. I don't know what to do, I'd write a [girl] blog tommorow but I won't have the time. Any relationship advice? Does he want more freedom and think I'm too possesive? I don't think he would be unfaithful to me, he's way too awesome for that, but I'm worried about us. I'm starting to think I'm not good enough for him. Help please
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EPT
