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[Patch 1.0.0.139: Spectator Mode] General Discussion - Pag…

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TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
May 08 2012 07:02 GMT
#1541
I'll be honest. I don't even care about the chaining part. A 1025 range point-and-click hard CC is going to be too strong.

Not even DotA has point-and-click CC with that kind of insane range.
Moderator
jadoth
Profile Joined December 2011
694 Posts
May 08 2012 07:03 GMT
#1542
On May 08 2012 15:41 beefhamburger wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 15:26 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 15:06 mr_tolkien wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:35 Amui wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:32 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 11:43 Frolossus wrote:

spotlight out, not sure if he should actually mid though


the way smart cast is on his q seems atrocious. that is one skill i will defiantly have to regular cast.


yeah I think the smart cast is retarded as well. If it feels ANYTHING like that smartcast range indicator option, that's absolutely terrible. Releasing key to have a function just feels unintuitive and wrong.

Ever heard of negative edge in fighting games ?
Realising buttons to perform actions is not counter-intuitive, there are even characters based around it (Eddie from Guilty Gear comes to mind). Once you get the hang of it it allows for much more type of inputs.

You know, moving a mouse in a 2D plane is not exactly the first thing that comes to mind when you think of targetting, and you know what ? You got used to it !


but what is the reason for having it trigger on release as apposed to just press to start press to end? the skill could be implemented just as easily and cleanly with existing methods so why implement a new method?

Because that's what smartcast is. You're telling them to make it so smartcast functions as....normal? That's already in the game. It's called default/non-smartcast.


no smart cast removes range indicators and mouse clicks. the way i think his q should work is this.
normal cast: press q it starts charging and a range circle indicator appears and starts growing around you. press q again a skill shot path indicators appears. mouse click it fires.
smart cast: press q it starts charging. press q again it fires.

On May 08 2012 15:29 Requizen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 15:26 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 15:06 mr_tolkien wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:35 Amui wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:32 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 11:43 Frolossus wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twiHstUjNkY&feature=youtu.be
spotlight out, not sure if he should actually mid though


the way smart cast is on his q seems atrocious. that is one skill i will defiantly have to regular cast.


yeah I think the smart cast is retarded as well. If it feels ANYTHING like that smartcast range indicator option, that's absolutely terrible. Releasing key to have a function just feels unintuitive and wrong.

Ever heard of negative edge in fighting games ?
Realising buttons to perform actions is not counter-intuitive, there are even characters based around it (Eddie from Guilty Gear comes to mind). Once you get the hang of it it allows for much more type of inputs.

You know, moving a mouse in a 2D plane is not exactly the first thing that comes to mind when you think of targetting, and you know what ? You got used to it !


but what is the reason for having it trigger on release as apposed to just press to start press to end? the skill could be implemented just as easily and cleanly with existing methods so why implement a new method?

It's also quicker that way. You're not going to fully charge it every time you fire it, sometimes you just want to shoot one off fast to break W stacks or to finish someone off before they escape. In that case, you want it to go off as soon as possible, and press->release is a lot faster than press->press. Among other things, of course.


that is a valid point but i don't think it justifies using a new method, especially if they have not improved the key release sensing because that felt clumsy and unresponsive when using smart cast range indicators. but maybe i am wrong and they have improved it and after a few games it will feel right and natural.


Juicyfruit
Profile Joined May 2008
Canada5484 Posts
May 08 2012 07:03 GMT
#1543
On May 08 2012 16:02 TheYango wrote:
I'll be honest. I don't even care about the chaining part. A 1025 range point-and-click hard CC is going to be too strong.

Not even DotA has point-and-click CC with that kind of insane range.


Wait it's not a skillshot?
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
May 08 2012 07:06 GMT
#1544
On May 08 2012 16:03 Juicyfruit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 16:02 TheYango wrote:
I'll be honest. I don't even care about the chaining part. A 1025 range point-and-click hard CC is going to be too strong.

Not even DotA has point-and-click CC with that kind of insane range.


Wait it's not a skillshot?

i was under the impression it was...
dae
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada1600 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 07:07:39
May 08 2012 07:06 GMT
#1545
On May 08 2012 15:23 I_Love_Bacon wrote:
This isn't really meant to sound hipsterish: but the amount of Blitzcrank being played makes me sad. I went from rarely ever seeing blitz supports outside of when i did it, and now they're everywhere. Was it more common at high elos and I just never saw it or has it picked up in flavor a lot recently and trickled down?


I get the feeling people realized how bad most people are at positioning, and how stupid some people can be with getting hooked and losing the game. Blitz is the support that can single handly win his team games with hooks, and the lower the elo you go the easier it is to hit those hooks >.<.

Also he recently got buffs to mana efficiency and people love playing heroes that just got buffed.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
May 08 2012 07:07 GMT
#1546
On May 08 2012 16:03 Juicyfruit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 16:02 TheYango wrote:
I'll be honest. I don't even care about the chaining part. A 1025 range point-and-click hard CC is going to be too strong.

Not even DotA has point-and-click CC with that kind of insane range.


Wait it's not a skillshot?

It is? Oh in that case it's more manageable.

Still strong but not stupid like I thought.
Moderator
Xevious
Profile Joined February 2011
United States2086 Posts
May 08 2012 07:11 GMT
#1547
On May 08 2012 13:57 Kouda wrote:
zzz. So I know this question has been asked hundreds of times, but when does it end? In ranked games, I'm currently 1180~ , with a variance of like 1100~ 1250. I generally go positive every game and win my lane, but it just seems hopeless at some points. My toplane Riven is 100-37-60~ with a 48% winrate, its like sometimes no matter how good you do, the team just crumbles.

Sigh, sorry for generic question and semi rant. just depressed.

sorry to bring this up again but i have to cite this

also just to throw in some general advice, when playing top try roaming a bit after winning your lane and killing your enemy's tower. shutting one enemy player out of the game only does so much. gank lanes that are failing, gank lanes with your jungler and/or mid, counterjungle, take dragons, push towers. by forcing the enemy top laner to stay top and freeze the lane to farm you effectively turn the game into a 5v4 until he's ready to start helping, you can abuse that time to get really far ahead.
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
May 08 2012 07:20 GMT
#1548
On May 08 2012 16:03 jadoth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 15:41 beefhamburger wrote:
On May 08 2012 15:26 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 15:06 mr_tolkien wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:35 Amui wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:32 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 11:43 Frolossus wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twiHstUjNkY&feature=youtu.be
spotlight out, not sure if he should actually mid though


the way smart cast is on his q seems atrocious. that is one skill i will defiantly have to regular cast.


yeah I think the smart cast is retarded as well. If it feels ANYTHING like that smartcast range indicator option, that's absolutely terrible. Releasing key to have a function just feels unintuitive and wrong.

Ever heard of negative edge in fighting games ?
Realising buttons to perform actions is not counter-intuitive, there are even characters based around it (Eddie from Guilty Gear comes to mind). Once you get the hang of it it allows for much more type of inputs.

You know, moving a mouse in a 2D plane is not exactly the first thing that comes to mind when you think of targetting, and you know what ? You got used to it !


but what is the reason for having it trigger on release as apposed to just press to start press to end? the skill could be implemented just as easily and cleanly with existing methods so why implement a new method?

Because that's what smartcast is. You're telling them to make it so smartcast functions as....normal? That's already in the game. It's called default/non-smartcast.


no smart cast removes range indicators and mouse clicks. the way i think his q should work is this.
normal cast: press q it starts charging and a range circle indicator appears and starts growing around you. press q again a skill shot path indicators appears. mouse click it fires.
smart cast: press q it starts charging. press q again it fires.

Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 15:29 Requizen wrote:
On May 08 2012 15:26 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 15:06 mr_tolkien wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:35 Amui wrote:
On May 08 2012 14:32 jadoth wrote:
On May 08 2012 11:43 Frolossus wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twiHstUjNkY&feature=youtu.be
spotlight out, not sure if he should actually mid though


the way smart cast is on his q seems atrocious. that is one skill i will defiantly have to regular cast.


yeah I think the smart cast is retarded as well. If it feels ANYTHING like that smartcast range indicator option, that's absolutely terrible. Releasing key to have a function just feels unintuitive and wrong.

Ever heard of negative edge in fighting games ?
Realising buttons to perform actions is not counter-intuitive, there are even characters based around it (Eddie from Guilty Gear comes to mind). Once you get the hang of it it allows for much more type of inputs.

You know, moving a mouse in a 2D plane is not exactly the first thing that comes to mind when you think of targetting, and you know what ? You got used to it !


but what is the reason for having it trigger on release as apposed to just press to start press to end? the skill could be implemented just as easily and cleanly with existing methods so why implement a new method?

It's also quicker that way. You're not going to fully charge it every time you fire it, sometimes you just want to shoot one off fast to break W stacks or to finish someone off before they escape. In that case, you want it to go off as soon as possible, and press->release is a lot faster than press->press. Among other things, of course.


that is a valid point but i don't think it justifies using a new method, especially if they have not improved the key release sensing because that felt clumsy and unresponsive when using smart cast range indicators. but maybe i am wrong and they have improved it and after a few games it will feel right and natural.



It sounds like you just want how it works for regular cast to be the smart cast. Just change the thing in settings and be done with it, they're not going to change it.
It's your boy Guzma!
deskscaress
Profile Joined May 2011
United States399 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 07:29:34
May 08 2012 07:27 GMT
#1549
All I have to say is Soviv is the best player on TL and listen to what he says, he is a super smart guy.

))))))
would you ever miss it?
De4ngus
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States6533 Posts
May 08 2012 07:44 GMT
#1550
On May 08 2012 16:27 deskscaress wrote:
All I have to say is Soviv is the best player on TL and listen to what he says, he is a super smart guy.

))))))

who is soviv
GANDHISAUCE
Parnage
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States7414 Posts
May 08 2012 08:12 GMT
#1551
Soniv pretty cool guy but I doubt he can play Lee Sin like shake(oh snap)


In all seriousness, as I say every time a new champion is released. You can't really judge him on what you read or even on what you see others do, you gotta play him often and numerous times to form a solid opinion. I have a feeling we'll have some interesting thoughts on him in a week or two but now? Too soon. Far too soon. Perhaps I am too reserved in that matter.
-orb- Fan. Live the Nal_rA dream. || Yordles are cool.
JackDino
Profile Joined July 2010
Gabon6219 Posts
May 08 2012 08:29 GMT
#1552
Does anyone jungle nunu these days? Isn't he pretty fucking shit in the new jungle?
This isnt Broodwar so I dont owe anyone respect for beating me. -arb
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
May 08 2012 08:30 GMT
#1553
On May 08 2012 17:29 JackDino wrote:
Does anyone jungle nunu these days? Isn't he pretty fucking shit in the new jungle?


He is pretty bad at jangle now.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
bobbob
Profile Joined December 2009
United States368 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 08:34:27
May 08 2012 08:34 GMT
#1554
Parnage
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States7414 Posts
May 08 2012 08:36 GMT
#1555
So here's a question, why don't we see more AP ezreal these days? I got this question from a friend and it's not my forte. If I had to guess it's something to do with other AP's scaling better and something to do with the difficulty of landing skillshots on players who are quite good.

-orb- Fan. Live the Nal_rA dream. || Yordles are cool.
De4ngus
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States6533 Posts
May 08 2012 08:43 GMT
#1556
On May 08 2012 17:30 NeoIllusions wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 17:29 JackDino wrote:
Does anyone jungle nunu these days? Isn't he pretty fucking shit in the new jungle?


He is pretty bad at jangle now.

idk im 100% winrate with it in soloq lul. i build wriggles and wits end and shit. then again im not a jungler but im always last pick and team makes me jungle D:
GANDHISAUCE
BlueBird.
Profile Joined August 2008
United States3890 Posts
May 08 2012 08:47 GMT
#1557
On May 08 2012 17:12 Parnage wrote:
Soniv pretty cool guy but I doubt he can play Lee Sin like shake(oh snap)


In all seriousness, as I say every time a new champion is released. You can't really judge him on what you read or even on what you see others do, you gotta play him often and numerous times to form a solid opinion. I have a feeling we'll have some interesting thoughts on him in a week or two but now? Too soon. Far too soon. Perhaps I am too reserved in that matter.


I can usually form an opinion based on what TL says in gd, the general reaction after they have played him, and just seeing him operate in my games, playing against him.

I have never played as lee sin, but I have a pretty good idea of how good lee sin is, very.
Currently Playing: Android Netrunner, Gwent, Gloomhaven, Board Games
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
May 08 2012 08:48 GMT
#1558
On May 08 2012 17:36 Parnage wrote:
So here's a question, why don't we see more AP ezreal these days? I got this question from a friend and it's not my forte. If I had to guess it's something to do with other AP's scaling better and something to do with the difficulty of landing skillshots on players who are quite good.


He can't farm at all and his damage output too low. The way his spells work, most of them are going to hit tanks no matter what, but you need more DPS than that to target tanks as a caster.
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
May 08 2012 08:49 GMT
#1559
On May 08 2012 17:36 Parnage wrote:
So here's a question, why don't we see more AP ezreal these days? I got this question from a friend and it's not my forte. If I had to guess it's something to do with other AP's scaling better and something to do with the difficulty of landing skillshots on players who are quite good.



AP Ezreal kicks into gear way too late. His primary ability, Q, has a mere 0.2 ratio. He only really becomes strong when he has at least Deathcap + Lich Bane, and even then he isn't really scary until he has another AP item or two.

Now AP Varus, that's scary.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
obesechicken13
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States10467 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 09:27:52
May 08 2012 09:26 GMT
#1560
Hecarim is fun in bot games. He seems like a good ganker and a good diver. His W probably lets him survive teamfighters longer than other melees. It's strange then that he seems so weak in the jungle but I suppose that's due to me favoring movement speed and slows over combat stats, lack of wriggles, and the negative penalties on Q and W vs creeps.
I think in our modern age technology has evolved to become more addictive. The things that don't give us pleasure aren't used as much. Work was never meant to be fun, but doing it makes us happier in the long run.
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