EPT[Patch 1.0.0.130: Volibear] General Discussion - Page 49
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freelander
Hungary4707 Posts
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shinarit
Hungary900 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On December 01 2011 22:24 redtooth wrote: who would you guys say are the best scaling ap champions. meaning given equal farm over an extended period of time, which hero is strongest at the end? I feel the strongest late game when I play Karthus, Imo. The ult is just devastating. Brand always seems to fall off late game for me. Cass is super strong all game, and the amount of control she provides is amazing. Kennen is also awesome, and more durable than either Cass or Karth, although he does have to jump into the middle of everything. I don't play Grag or Veigar, so I can't comment on their power. | ||
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Hynda
Sweden2226 Posts
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phyvo
United States5635 Posts
Also, tank brand secret OP? 2 second stun on 3.6 second CD. Quick, invent new meta where every skillshot lands! | ||
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rredtooth
5464 Posts
On December 01 2011 22:55 spinesheath wrote: Not angry. Confused. Very confused. It's a question that only real newbs would ask (at least like this; if he added a scenario it could be a good question), and I thought that Redtooth isn't one of those. lol so mad. does it matter what the reason is? i have a few thoughts of my own but just wanted to get the input of the brain trust that is TL's amazing group of GD posters. also, i've only started playing again recently so i haven't had as much experience as or against orianna, brand, cass, new gragas, new kassadin (or the way people now play him), swain, etc etc. anyways, i laid out a pretty clear scenario imo. given equal amounts of farm, who scales better into the late game in relation to the rest of a theoretical team. some examples of people who aren''t are leblanc and ryze imo. other people seemed to have understood it and gave their input. back on topic, it's interesting people say brand because my notion of brand was strong early/mid game not necessarily late game. remember we're assuming you're on equal footing with their carries/bruisers/casters and not comparatively fed (which is the only way i think brand can pull significantly ahead). edit: i don't think it's necessarily just all about AP ratios. like a farmed karthus vs a farmed everybody else would be pretty strong but not so much a farmed annie IMO. also, what's people's take on xerath's lategame scaling? | ||
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Hynda
Sweden2226 Posts
On December 01 2011 23:23 redtooth wrote: I think people say brand because if you manage to single 2 people out (which almost never happens) He just destroys them. But usually those that are best late game are those with good cc. Anivias wall can win you a game outright if you get it off in the right place. But it is as Spine put it it's mostly down to team comp.lol so mad. does it matter what the reason is? i have a few thoughts of my own but just wanted to get the input of the brain trust that is TL's amazing group of GD posters. also, i've only started playing again recently so i haven't had as much experience as or against orianna, brand, cass, new gragas, new kassadin (or the way people now play him), swain, etc etc. anyways, i laid out a pretty clear scenario imo. given equal amounts of farm, who scales better into the late game in relation to the rest of a theoretical team. some examples of people who aren''t are leblanc and ryze imo. other people seemed to have understood it and gave their input. back on topic, it's interesting people say brand because my notion of brand was strong early/mid game not necessarily late game. remember we're assuming you're on equal footing with their carries/bruisers/casters and not comparatively fed (which is the only way i think brand can pull significantly ahead). Unless you are Xerath and can nuke their nexus from your base. | ||
NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On December 01 2011 23:23 redtooth wrote: lol so mad. does it matter what the reason is? i have a few thoughts of my own but just wanted to get the input of the brain trust that is TL's amazing group of GD posters. also, i've only started playing again recently so i haven't had as much experience as or against orianna, brand, cass, new gragas, new kassadin (or the way people now play him), swain, etc etc. anyways, i laid out a pretty clear scenario imo. given equal amounts of farm, who scales better into the late game in relation to the rest of a theoretical team. some examples of people who aren''t are leblanc and ryze imo. other people seemed to have understood it and gave their input. back on topic, it's interesting people say brand because my notion of brand was strong early/mid game not necessarily late game. remember we're assuming you're on equal footing with their carries/bruisers/casters and not comparatively fed (which is the only way i think brand can pull significantly ahead). edit: i don't think it's necessarily just all about AP ratios. like a farmed karthus vs a farmed everybody else would be pretty strong but not so much a farmed annie IMO. also, what's people's take on xerath's lategame scaling? Fed Xerath is akin to a fed Trist or Kog mog. Batshit range is fucking hard to deal with. Charge at me bro? I'll chunk you down 2/3 of your health before you get in range to CC or deal damage to me. np | ||
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starfries
Canada3508 Posts
for the traditional casters I'd say Karthus and Xerath. if Kennen wasn't an energy caster I'd put him in there for all the CC but his lategame damage suffers a bit because of energy. | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On December 01 2011 23:52 starfries wrote: not really your traditional AP mid, but AP poppy gets pretty retarded once she gets most of her items and is honestly more scary than Veigar unless it's been like a 2 hour game. for the traditional casters I'd say Karthus and Xerath. if Kennen wasn't an energy caster I'd put him in there for all the CC but his lategame damage suffers a bit because of energy. Gud Kennens get Energy/Level Seals. This includes Salce and Ego. | ||
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Therealdevil
Netherlands1021 Posts
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starfries
Canada3508 Posts
On December 02 2011 00:00 NeoIllusions wrote: Gud Kennens get Energy/Level Seals. This includes Salce and Ego. I'm poor, I only have 3 so far  | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On December 02 2011 00:05 Therealdevil wrote: Even with energy/level seals AND flat energy quints, I easily run out of energy with Kennen. Really? I don't run Quints and I feel fine with just the Seals. Granted I am not very spammy at all with his Q. I use Q in teams fights after Ulti and stun guarantees a Q hit. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
He provides a lot of control over map objectives, and sieging towers is really strong. Pushing down a turret defended by xerath is nigh impossible. | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
The Brands and such are ok but their ratios don't match their cooldowns IMO. Their damage looks great if they hit big AoE but if they can't then their damage output isn't that high. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On December 02 2011 00:19 Southlight wrote: Xerath and Malzahar are the best scaling AP I think. If you ignore CC then Cass is up there as well. I'd imagine if you don't suck at him Karthus is ridiculous scale too. The Brands and such are ok but their ratios don't match their cooldowns IMO. Their damage looks great if they hit big AoE but if they can't then their damage output isn't that high. Why would you count Cass if you're not looking at CC? She has one of the most powerful CC ults in the game, and with rylai's every one of her skills provides immense amount of control over your enemies. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On December 02 2011 00:05 Therealdevil wrote: Even with energy/level seals AND flat energy quints, I easily run out of energy with Kennen. Thats probably due to poor energy management. You want to make sure you go into fights with full energy, and you have the ability to use any spell as you need. That means generally its a bad idea to just spam q all fight long, even if its hitting people, and instead just focus on making sure you take out high priority targets like any other ap carry. | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On December 01 2011 23:14 shinarit wrote: I think Brand has the best scaling if you only look at the numbers, because he has 3 aoe and all 4 skills do damage. But numbers are not everything ofc. Brands AP ratios are pretty mediocre, though. His late game becomes more about keeping everyone on the enemy team (or as many useful targets as he can catch in his aoes) on fire for the % max life burn damage, and landing his low CD stuns repeatedly. Once he's got maxed CDR (happens early with blue buff) and an OK amount of AP (basically deathcap + whatever when he hits around 300 AP), he really has reached the peak, and by then enemies are going to be building MR faster than he can add new damage, and MR really hurts his output bigtime (even with void staff - though this is why void staff is more important on him than some other APs.) Also if his ulti fails to bounce in lategame teamfights brand is a sad panda. sad panda on fire. | ||
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Sandster
United States4054 Posts
In terms of raw damage Karthus is generally known has the hardest scaling late-game AP, and probably Xerath for burst. You have a lot of single-target bursty champions, but not many of those can sustain high damage output for the entire team fight due to long cds. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
And the truth comes out. Jungle was meant to be a nerf all along. I TOTALLY didnt see that one coming. | ||
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