[Patch 1.0.0.130: Volibear] General Discussion - Page 202

On December 13 2011 08:33 Two_DoWn wrote:

Note: I do not play a whole lot of TF. This is just my understanding of his situation:

Basically his issue has always been that his laning is actually pretty piss poor against a lot of ap characters. Anyone who wants to be slightly aggressive can generally out trade tf. The thing is that it used to be fine- you traded the pretty bad lane for the ability to fuck with everything on the map. Then they went ahead and got rid of the only thing that actually made you want to play him and put up with his shit laning.

The big thing is going to be the range buff. If its sizable enough to let him actually trade PAC with enemy spells, I think he will be in a great spot. If it cant, well, he is going to be in the same spot he is now.

And I have a feeling its really not going to be enough. They probably are gonna slap 25 range on him and call it a day, when he really needs to go from 510 to something like 575. It isnt enough for him to match other casters at 550- he needs to be longer because he has to rely on his auto to land his spells. (Although I will be honest- I do not know what the spell to ad range conversion is, and you definitely do not want tf outranging spells)

On December 12 2011 23:02 Haemonculus wrote:
Aegis is fantastic. There was some post on reddit a few months ago doing like all the math and it's one of the most cost efficient items in the game by itself, and I think becomes the *most* gold-efficient defense item once you give the aura to even a single teammate.

I also never really understood how good the active on Randuins was until I started playing Malphite and trying to time it between ground slam. Slow motion enemy team wololo.

On December 13 2011 09:53 Navi wrote:
wait what? when you say PAC do you mean his red card (in which case yes you can hit red card on a creep and hit the enemy champion, but this is very inefficient mana-damage wise early game)? because gold and blue does not have 800 effective range, because PAC is an autoattack modifier

On December 13 2011 10:01 Seuss wrote:


I'm working off the big brouhaha that occurred a month or so ago because Orianna's Q was purportedly overnerfed. It was supposed to go from 900 range to 800, but someone noticed that if Orianna was attacking a minion at her maximum auto-attack range it would simultaneously be outside of the range of her Q. Since her auto attack range was 525 at the time the person concluded that her Q range had been overnerfed to 500. In fact, the issue was simply that spell and auto-attack ranges are measured differently. It's all explained in the red posts I linked.

The point here is that Orianna's auto-attack range of 525 had a greater effective range than her spell with 800 range. Presumably if TF's model is similar his auto-attack, and thus his PAC, has a similar effective range.

I'm about to head home from work, I'll do some tests and take some screenshots to measure this exactly.

On December 13 2011 10:01 Seuss wrote:


I'm working off the big brouhaha that occurred a month or so ago because Orianna's Q was purportedly overnerfed. It was supposed to go from 900 range to 800, but someone noticed that if Orianna was attacking a minion at her maximum auto-attack range it would simultaneously be outside of the range of her Q. Since her auto attack range was 525 at the time the person concluded that her Q range had been overnerfed to 500. In fact, the issue was simply that spell and auto-attack ranges are measured differently. It's all explained in the red posts I linked.

The point here is that Orianna's auto-attack range of 525 had a greater effective range than her spell with 800 range. Presumably if TF's model is similar his auto-attack, and thus his PAC, has a similar effective range.

I'm about to head home from work, I'll do some tests and take some screenshots to measure this exactly.

On December 13 2011 10:25 freelander wrote:
it was an autoattack modifier long ago but they changed that already
it counts as a spell now i think

On December 13 2011 10:44 Two_DoWn wrote:
Navi and BP- Spells and auto attack ranges are calculated differently. Since its an auto modifier, PAC uses his default auto attack range. Now, someone at riot decided that spells are measured differently from auto ranges. Therefore spells are LISTED as longer range, when in fact you have to subtract about 300 range to get into the same scale as the auto range.

Therefore while you dont change range from pac to auto, the comparison between pac and other spells needs to be converted.

I dunno if you got that already and I explained unnecessarily or what, but thats how it works.

On December 13 2011 10:44 Two_DoWn wrote:
Navi and BP- Spells and auto attack ranges are calculated differently. Since its an auto modifier, PAC uses his default auto attack range. Now, someone at riot decided that spells are measured differently from auto ranges. Therefore spells are LISTED as longer range, when in fact you have to subtract about 300 range to get into the same scale as the auto range.

Therefore while you dont change range from pac to auto, the comparison between pac and other spells needs to be converted.

I dunno if you got that already and I explained unnecessarily or what, but thats how it works.

On December 13 2011 11:22 Haemonculus wrote:
Is there anything you can do as trynd laning against udyr, specifically tiger udyr? I just got my ass whooped so badly I doubt I'll be able to sit down for a week. He just right clicked on me and ogod the pain and I couldn't hurt him T_T

On December 13 2011 11:33 obesechicken13 wrote:
Huh. Can someone explain the TF stuff and message me it?

On December 13 2011 11:47 Takkara wrote:
Regi ratting on Chaox to Dan Dinh on his stream. Hilarious. Telling about how Chaox threw up twice in the restaurant challenging Chauster to a drinking contest with Whiskey. Apparently Chaox was going on and on about how Chauster was afraid. Hilarious. Sounds like it was a wild time.