• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:41
CEST 00:41
KST 07:41
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists14[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy21
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers11Maestros of the Game 2 announced32026 GSL Tour plans announced11Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid20
StarCraft 2
General
2026 GSL Tour plans announced Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail MaNa leaves Team Liquid Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued
Tourneys
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly) $5,000 WardiTV TLMC tournament - Presented by Monster Energy
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power
Brood War
General
Data needed ASL21 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Pros React To: Tulbo in Ro.16 Group A RepMastered™: replay sharing and analyzer site
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [ASL21] Ro16 Group A [ASL21] Ro16 Group B [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
McBoner: A hockey love story 2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Reappraising The Situation T…
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2691 users

[Patch 1.0.0.130: Volibear] General Discussion - Page 175

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 173 174 175 176 177 205 Next
Want to rage about your latest loss?
Use the QQ thread.
If you whine in GD, you'll get warned.
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
December 10 2011 05:07 GMT
#3481
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
December 10 2011 05:11 GMT
#3482
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
December 10 2011 05:13 GMT
#3483
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

Well, if you die, BT loses a bunch of power. So its a lot less forgiving.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Haemonculus
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
United States6980 Posts
December 10 2011 05:13 GMT
#3484
Woah woah woah anyone seen the new patch preview?

Spellvamp/lifesteall runes?
%hp runes?
dual armor/mr-pen runes?

Wattttt crazyness
I admire your commitment to being *very* oily
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
December 10 2011 05:14 GMT
#3485
I'm all for new runes. They need moar items too.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
December 10 2011 05:17 GMT
#3486
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
December 10 2011 05:20 GMT
#3487
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-10 05:23:35
December 10 2011 05:22 GMT
#3488
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

He is agreeing with me. IE is safer in terms of less punishment if you die, but a BT is probably the heavier carry item, especially on characters like vayne and graves.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
December 10 2011 05:24 GMT
#3489
If he's agreeing with you, both of you clearly don't play AD carries much.

Dodge runes refund next patch: http://na.leagueoflegends.com/news/dodge-rune-refunded-next-patch
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-10 05:31:05
December 10 2011 05:25 GMT
#3490
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.

Personally, the only AD carry I play well is Corki and I pretty much always go Triforce->BT since for him raw damage to maximize burst is best, but he's (and Ez) not exactly standard AD carry in that they play differently.
SnK-Arcbound
Profile Joined March 2005
United States4423 Posts
December 10 2011 05:26 GMT
#3491
Life steal and spell vamp runes. Who said they wouldn't come out with those?
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
December 10 2011 05:28 GMT
#3492
On December 10 2011 14:26 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Life steal and spell vamp runes. Who said they wouldn't come out with those?

Me, although originally it was because they would have allowed too many problematic junglers to exist.


Then they crushed eve and twitch, then they did the new masteries that let anyone jungle, then they blew the jungle up. So you really cant blame me.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
57 Corvette
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada5941 Posts
December 10 2011 05:31 GMT
#3493
Smash, I tried your Shen guide, and it was hilarious early, getting 2 kills top against singed before dying once (Towers too strong)

Ofc this was the result though, normal queue too heavy
[image loading]
Survival is winning, everything else is bullshit.
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-10 05:40:20
December 10 2011 05:37 GMT
#3494
On December 10 2011 14:25 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.


I guess the source of our disagreement here is that you and TwoDown are making item choices based on playing scared. In my original post on the previous page I outlined the criteria for picking the ideal BF Sword item for your hero. If I'm on Graves or Vayne, I pick up BT for the reasons I mentioned (need sustain since low auto range, abilities scale well with AD). If I choose IE first, it's because I'm very far ahead and confident in my ability to completely stomp the other team, not because I'm afraid that I'll die a lot. y not just build tank items on every char if u r so scared?

edit: inb4 y dont build mejai/soto/levi on every char eyedrinker u pussycat
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
December 10 2011 05:40 GMT
#3495
On December 10 2011 14:37 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:25 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.


I guess the source of our disagreement here is that you and TwoDown are making item choices based on playing scared. In my original post on the previous page I outlined the criteria for picking the ideal BF Sword item for your hero. If I'm on Graves or Vayne, I pick up BT for the reasons I mentioned (need sustain since low auto range, abilities scale well with AD). If I choose IE first, it's because I'm very far ahead and confident in my ability to completely stomp the other team, not because I'm afraid that I'll die a lot. y not just build tank items on every char if u r so scared?

It's not the question of dying a lot. It's more that IE scales better into the lategame as you get more and more items. Whereas BT gives you more power more or less instantaneously due to it giving potentially the largest single source of AD in the game. From that perspective, getting IE lets you itemize towards later in the game, hence "safer" while BT itemizes for the more immediate future.

If you ever have to build tank items on a carry not as a fifth or final item either you suck or the other team's carry(s) are stomping.
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
December 10 2011 05:42 GMT
#3496
On December 10 2011 14:37 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:25 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.


I guess the source of our disagreement here is that you and TwoDown are making item choices based on playing scared. In my original post on the previous page I outlined the criteria for picking the ideal BF Sword item for your hero. If I'm on Graves or Vayne, I pick up BT for the reasons I mentioned (need sustain since low auto range, abilities scale well with AD). If I choose IE first, it's because I'm very far ahead and confident in my ability to completely stomp the other team, not because I'm afraid that I'll die a lot. y not just build tank items on every char if u r so scared?

There is a difference between playing scared and building according to the enemy team. I dun give a shit who you are. If the enemy team has nocturne, kassadin, skarner, and tristana you WILL DIE. Not to mention acknowledging that other lanes might be fed, ect.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
December 10 2011 05:44 GMT
#3497
On December 10 2011 14:40 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:37 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:25 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.


I guess the source of our disagreement here is that you and TwoDown are making item choices based on playing scared. In my original post on the previous page I outlined the criteria for picking the ideal BF Sword item for your hero. If I'm on Graves or Vayne, I pick up BT for the reasons I mentioned (need sustain since low auto range, abilities scale well with AD). If I choose IE first, it's because I'm very far ahead and confident in my ability to completely stomp the other team, not because I'm afraid that I'll die a lot. y not just build tank items on every char if u r so scared?

It's not the question of dying a lot. It's more that IE scales better into the lategame as you get more and more items. Whereas BT gives you more power more or less instantaneously due to it giving potentially the largest single source of AD in the game. From that perspective, getting IE lets you itemize towards later in the game, hence "safer" while BT itemizes for the more immediate future.

If you ever have to build tank items on a carry not as a fifth or final item either you suck or the other team's carry(s) are stomping.


In other words, you are making that initial big item choice based on the assumption that you will not be able to farm enough for another before the game ends. I dunno, guess it's mostly just a mindset difference but you are also wrong in thinking that BT gives more immediate power.
TieN.nS)
Profile Joined August 2003
United States2131 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-10 05:48:40
December 10 2011 05:48 GMT
#3498
On December 10 2011 14:42 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:37 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:25 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.


I guess the source of our disagreement here is that you and TwoDown are making item choices based on playing scared. In my original post on the previous page I outlined the criteria for picking the ideal BF Sword item for your hero. If I'm on Graves or Vayne, I pick up BT for the reasons I mentioned (need sustain since low auto range, abilities scale well with AD). If I choose IE first, it's because I'm very far ahead and confident in my ability to completely stomp the other team, not because I'm afraid that I'll die a lot. y not just build tank items on every char if u r so scared?

There is a difference between playing scared and building according to the enemy team. I dun give a shit who you are. If the enemy team has nocturne, kassadin, skarner, and tristana you WILL DIE. Not to mention acknowledging that other lanes might be fed, ect.


Cool, if you resign yourself to dying instantly I guess you just accept the fact that your team is always going to 4v5 without an AD carry. I suppose if the enemy team has Nocturne, Kassadin, Skarner, and Tristana you automatically lose the game.
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17281 Posts
December 10 2011 05:50 GMT
#3499
On December 10 2011 14:42 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:37 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:25 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.


I guess the source of our disagreement here is that you and TwoDown are making item choices based on playing scared. In my original post on the previous page I outlined the criteria for picking the ideal BF Sword item for your hero. If I'm on Graves or Vayne, I pick up BT for the reasons I mentioned (need sustain since low auto range, abilities scale well with AD). If I choose IE first, it's because I'm very far ahead and confident in my ability to completely stomp the other team, not because I'm afraid that I'll die a lot. y not just build tank items on every char if u r so scared?

There is a difference between playing scared and building according to the enemy team. I dun give a shit who you are. If the enemy team has nocturne, kassadin, skarner, and tristana you WILL DIE. Not to mention acknowledging that other lanes might be fed, ect.

Or you could just get a GA and/or play better.
twitch.tv/cratonz
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-10 05:54:15
December 10 2011 05:52 GMT
#3500
On December 10 2011 14:44 TieN.nS) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2011 14:40 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:37 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:25 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:20 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:17 Ryuu314 wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:11 TieN.nS) wrote:
On December 10 2011 14:07 Two_DoWn wrote:
On December 10 2011 13:52 Hakker wrote:
So im still kind of new to AD carries. How do you determine which BF item you should get first? Usually it just depends on which champion im playing, like i'll almost always get bc on vayne, ie on tristana etc. but I see pro players mix it up all the time and I'm wondering what thought process goes in to the items they choose to get.

It varies depending on matchup, farm, and need.

I generally only ever go BC if I am superduper farmed by the 15 minute mark and want to end the game before anyone on the other team can possibly catch up.

As for IE vs BT- its highly variable. I generally base it on a few factors- how soon I need to be full power, how often I will get gibed, and how much sustain I will need. If you can farm an IE you hit an immediate power burst, while a bt is much more gradual. BT sucks if you are going to be getting gibbed a lot (ie they have some way to get to you scott free like noct ult or your team just blows at peeling) but is very strong if you can keep max stacks. And of course, BT is great for the sustain. Generally IE is the safer all around choice, while a properly executed BT buy can decimate an enemy team.


lol? Other way around...

not really...BT snowballs harder but IE scales better into late game 'cause it's power increases as you get more aspd and crit %

not only that but if you're losing/dying a lot BT kinda sucks


So you're agreeing with me? Like I said in my post, IE is the highest DPS item and what you WANT as an AD carry, though not always the best choice.

Regarding BT stacks, if you're losing/dying a lot YOU suck. lol

agreeing with TD

well if your team's behind you're probably not going to getting stacks on your BT very easily and come teamfights you do run the risk of dying if your team's behind. Obviously if you're just getting ganked/caught and dying a shitton it's your own fault.

imo, gearing for the lategame is "safer" since as an AD carry your power gets stronger the later the game goes. BT gives you sustain and shit so it's nice in that respect, but it's much more snowbally. If you need sustain you can just grab a vamp scepter w/out building it into anything. Not only that but if you're behind you can consider buying a wriggles. I honestly don't see how BT is safer option than IE.


I guess the source of our disagreement here is that you and TwoDown are making item choices based on playing scared. In my original post on the previous page I outlined the criteria for picking the ideal BF Sword item for your hero. If I'm on Graves or Vayne, I pick up BT for the reasons I mentioned (need sustain since low auto range, abilities scale well with AD). If I choose IE first, it's because I'm very far ahead and confident in my ability to completely stomp the other team, not because I'm afraid that I'll die a lot. y not just build tank items on every char if u r so scared?

It's not the question of dying a lot. It's more that IE scales better into the lategame as you get more and more items. Whereas BT gives you more power more or less instantaneously due to it giving potentially the largest single source of AD in the game. From that perspective, getting IE lets you itemize towards later in the game, hence "safer" while BT itemizes for the more immediate future.

If you ever have to build tank items on a carry not as a fifth or final item either you suck or the other team's carry(s) are stomping.


In other words, you are making that initial big item choice based on the assumption that you will not be able to farm enough for another before the game ends. I dunno, guess it's mostly just a mindset difference but you are also wrong in thinking that BT gives more immediate power.

Well w/e. Again, I really only play Corki and for him BT>IE 90% of the time. When I do play AD carries other than Corki I build mostly based on whether their immediate damage source is autoattacks or spells that scale. IE for the former, BT for the latter. But in my eyes, I jsut feel like IE is the safer choice if you have to choose cause any item whose potency is dependent on your ability to stay alive is going to be somewhat snowbally. I think it's unreasonable to assume you're never ever going to die if your team's behind.
Prev 1 173 174 175 176 177 205 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
The PiG Daily
22:15
Best Games of SC
Rogue vs MaxPax
Maru vs Zoun
SHIN vs Cure
ByuN vs TBD
PiGStarcraft216
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft216
UpATreeSC 175
StarCraft: Brood War
Aegong 131
firebathero 95
LancerX 14
NaDa 8
Dota 2
monkeys_forever58
febbydoto7
Super Smash Bros
Liquid`Ken10
Other Games
gofns15619
tarik_tv9308
summit1g7418
Grubby3007
FrodaN1009
C9.Mang0388
shahzam335
RotterdaM166
mouzStarbuck144
Trikslyr139
Mew2King35
PPMD32
Livibee28
ViBE23
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV238
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta40
• mYiSmile123
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 53
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift2798
Other Games
• imaqtpie1084
• Scarra759
Upcoming Events
Korean StarCraft League
4h 19m
CranKy Ducklings
11h 19m
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
12h 19m
SC Evo League
14h 49m
IPSL
17h 19m
WolFix vs nOmaD
dxtr13 vs Razz
BSL
20h 19m
UltrA vs KwarK
Gosudark vs cavapoo
dxtr13 vs HBO
Doodle vs Razz
Patches Events
23h 19m
CranKy Ducklings
1d 1h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 11h
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
1d 12h
[ Show More ]
Ladder Legends
1d 16h
BSL
1d 20h
StRyKeR vs rasowy
Artosis vs Aether
JDConan vs OyAji
Hawk vs izu
IPSL
1d 20h
JDConan vs TBD
Aegong vs rasowy
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Barracks vs Leta
Royal vs Light
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
KCM Race Survival
5 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Escore
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-04-16
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Escore Tournament S2: W3
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.