On August 19 2011 04:17 Southlight wrote: My mind doesn't think fast enough so I click and miss anyways o/
and then just say
"I clicked on fatso sorry"
and most peoples' first thoughts isn't
"why didn't you use f-keys nub!"
but rather
"fuckin fatso"
so you can get away with it :3
haha i played a game a few weeks ago, i was trist with a cho on our team. around minute 25 i said CHO HIDE ME and he said OK
so he spent teamfights standing on top of me, and i'd walk where he walked, and then jump out of him and kill somebody. shit was pretty funny
with a tiny little champ like tristana there's so much flexibility underneath him, he can wander around and you can stay inside him np hahaha its funny as hell
On August 19 2011 05:50 Mogwai wrote: I've played with 2 Skarners recently. They both did a full clear in under 4:00. Doesn't seem that bad too me @_@.
I did a full clear in 3:47 WITHOUT any runes. I'm sure that with runes and more skill/better build I can get faster.
On August 19 2011 05:48 Southlight wrote: lol, my problem with Skarner atm is simply the same issue I'm weary about Talon and Wukong, it's really hard to slot him into a team where he doesn't get buttfucked somewhere. Like I feel like he's such a weak solo top champ, weak solo mid champ, and his jungle is terrislow. Otherwise he's a pretty decent hero :[
This is exactly what I've been thinking. Also, he doesn't slot well into a team with an AP carry that needs a blue buff, since all of his kit basically dictates spamming. Every Skarner I've played with smite steals blue after offering it to me as Ori or something.
On August 19 2011 05:14 zalz wrote: Just played some more Skarner.
I still don't understand why people call him UP. I even managed to kill a Xin 1v1 when we were both reasonably farmed. The king of 1v1 gets raped late game by bling bling scorpion. Just flat out 1v1 slamming into each others faces.
Grabbing targets and dragging them into your team or dragging away that enemy carry and going skarner on their ass.
You farm like a beast and you rape towers with more fury then a scorpion that's been stuck in a shoe for a week. It should go without mention that you go at the speed of a fucking racecar whilst your targets are moving like snails on a treadmill.
People gotta try this dog out, but don't be going into no shit jungle. Not only does he jungle slow as fuck and his ganks suck balls without ulti, he has to spend way too much money on items he doesn't really need other then to jungle.
He's a solid top dawg champion, beats the shit out of a lot of classic tops. Maybe he works on other lanes but i doubt it. He can't compete on bot with all that ranged harass every time he goes for a nibble and mid is so fucking long range these days that skarner might never even get a taste of that enemy champion.
Ooh yeah, and everyone thinks he sucks balls so you are probably looking at a buff and everyone thinks you are the man for owning it up with skarner.
His scaling is awful and his base abilities aren't anything special either. The typical top dawgs as you call them should poop on him because his sustain with e->hit isn't nearly as good as say, Turtle stance. Also he's only fast if the shield is up, and it takes 1 spell from a caster or 2 hits from any carry to break it if you maxed it, which means either your Q or E are awful.
He's not 'UP' but he's not some awesome champ that will totally change matchups top lane. He's just a middle tier champ, which should be perfectly fine if there weren't so many bruisers significantly better.
Scale is awefull? He has some of the highest stat growths in the game. The base on his damage covers him long enough to keep him more then viable until the sheen/triforce rolls around, at wich point his enormous base atack damage starts to pile up and you dish out the damage.
You gotta play him, stop thinking you know him and play him for yourself and play him proper. People in LoL take too much for granted. Same reason Eve went from que dodge to game changer with minor changes.
I think he meant ratios on his skills, they seem quite low but actually i think skarner's biggest strength is his lategame (just like with wukong)
Well the ration's on his skills aren't that bad considering you are spamming them all the time.
You also build a sheen/triforce wich is an item wich scales of your atack damage growth. I think Skarner might even have the highest base atack in the game. You have to work with the champion on a build, not scream that his ratio's are too low and ignore the massive base atack on him.
Building a deathcap or bloodthirster isn't gonna give you much, so you build a triforce wich works perfect for him.
This is exactly what I've been thinking. Also, he doesn't slot well into a team with an AP carry that needs a blue buff, since all of his kit basically dictates spamming. Every Skarner I've played with smite steals blue after offering it to me as Ori or something.
He actually isn't all that mana intensive. If you just randomly spam his skills around maybe, but if you just use them when it's the right time you won't be having many problems.
On August 19 2011 05:14 zalz wrote: Just played some more Skarner.
I still don't understand why people call him UP. I even managed to kill a Xin 1v1 when we were both reasonably farmed. The king of 1v1 gets raped late game by bling bling scorpion. Just flat out 1v1 slamming into each others faces.
Grabbing targets and dragging them into your team or dragging away that enemy carry and going skarner on their ass.
You farm like a beast and you rape towers with more fury then a scorpion that's been stuck in a shoe for a week. It should go without mention that you go at the speed of a fucking racecar whilst your targets are moving like snails on a treadmill.
People gotta try this dog out, but don't be going into no shit jungle. Not only does he jungle slow as fuck and his ganks suck balls without ulti, he has to spend way too much money on items he doesn't really need other then to jungle.
He's a solid top dawg champion, beats the shit out of a lot of classic tops. Maybe he works on other lanes but i doubt it. He can't compete on bot with all that ranged harass every time he goes for a nibble and mid is so fucking long range these days that skarner might never even get a taste of that enemy champion.
Ooh yeah, and everyone thinks he sucks balls so you are probably looking at a buff and everyone thinks you are the man for owning it up with skarner.
His scaling is awful and his base abilities aren't anything special either. The typical top dawgs as you call them should poop on him because his sustain with e->hit isn't nearly as good as say, Turtle stance. Also he's only fast if the shield is up, and it takes 1 spell from a caster or 2 hits from any carry to break it if you maxed it, which means either your Q or E are awful.
He's not 'UP' but he's not some awesome champ that will totally change matchups top lane. He's just a middle tier champ, which should be perfectly fine if there weren't so many bruisers significantly better.
Scale is awefull? He has some of the highest stat growths in the game. The base on his damage covers him long enough to keep him more then viable until the sheen/triforce rolls around, at wich point his enormous base atack damage starts to pile up and you dish out the damage.
You gotta play him, stop thinking you know him and play him for yourself and play him proper. People in LoL take too much for granted. Same reason Eve went from que dodge to game changer with minor changes.
I have played him, and lol @ the Eve changes being minor. That's like saying Kayle's first remake was minor.
His stat growth may be good but his ability scaling is completely meh. His Q takes a 2nd hit before it actually does anything(which isn't a guarantee, since the 2nd hit is also how you slow someone to stick on them) and said 2nd hit doesn't get anymore scaling from AD, only AP.
His shield is actually pretty good, but it runs into the problem that if you beef it up quick you do no damage, and if you don't build defensively it gets popped instantly, robbing you of bonuses his entire kit seems to be built around(aspd/mspd).
The E isn't bad either, but when you compare it to the sustain of similar champs it is completely outshined, in the name of damage that has no relevant scaling(healing has no scaling either, because you aren't building AP).
His early game is mediocre because the heal is weak and he can't win a trade at all, his mid game is alright because his base damage is decent and the shield will do alright vs not so farmed champs, but then he dies lategame(not counting SUPER DUPER LATEGAME, totally irrelevant to considering a champs place in game balance).
Edit: Forgot his ult, it's mediocre at best, REALLY FUCKING BAD at worst depending on matchups. It's damage and range are both horrible, only AP scaling, and it's caught in a never ending catch 22 of 'if it lasts a long time it's OP cause you can move people a long ass distance, but if it doesn't it sucks because you move them an inch.'
my setup is 0/14/16 flash ghost lane, 1/14/15 ghost smite jungle ms quints, dodge yellows, mr/lvl blues, aspd reds R>Q>W>E jungle (completely ignoring E in favor of W) R>E>Q>W lane unless I can get away with Q>E Did decently against a Jax top, got crushed by a Renekton, beat a Mordekaiser once I got sheen. Jungle is the standard blue-wolves-wraiths-gols-red route with a strong gank but not the most health at the end. Regrowth -> philo -> sheen -> trinforce top, cloth -> sheen -> hog -> trinforce jungle Wit's End and Randuin's Omen for tankiness, then whatever I feel like. Gunblade, GA, Shurelya's, Ghostblade all great items on him.
On August 19 2011 05:59 zalz wrote: Well the ration's on his skills aren't that bad considering you are spamming them all the time.
You also build a sheen/triforce wich is an item wich scales of your atack damage growth. I think Skarner might even have the highest base atack in the game. You have to work with the champion on a build, not scream that his ratio's are too low and ignore the massive base atack on him.
Building a deathcap or bloodthirster isn't gonna give you much, so you build a triforce wich works perfect for him.
Yeah, but when was the last time you saw a jungler get triforce fast enough for it to be useful? Good jungle champions can function well with the little farm they can secure, while Skarner needs the most expensive item in the game to operate well.
On August 19 2011 06:00 red_ wrote: Edit: Forgot his ult, it's mediocre at best, REALLY FUCKING BAD at worst depending on matchups. It's damage and range are both horrible, only AP scaling, and it's caught in a never ending catch 22 of 'if it lasts a long time it's OP cause you can move people a long ass distance, but if it doesn't it sucks because you move them an inch.'
On August 19 2011 05:59 zalz wrote: Well the ration's on his skills aren't that bad considering you are spamming them all the time.
You also build a sheen/triforce wich is an item wich scales of your atack damage growth. I think Skarner might even have the highest base atack in the game. You have to work with the champion on a build, not scream that his ratio's are too low and ignore the massive base atack on him.
Building a deathcap or bloodthirster isn't gonna give you much, so you build a triforce wich works perfect for him.
Yeah, but when was the last time you saw a jungler get triforce fast enough for it to be useful? Good jungle champions can function well with the little farm they can secure, while Skarner needs the most expensive item in the game to operate well.
Pretty much this. Skarners jungle is fast enough (I consistently get ~3:55) but he's extremely blue dependent, and even with blue you run oom pretty easy with Q spam in jungle. Ultimately though you're not real strong until you get your gunblade/tri-force and it takes him waaay too long to get there.
As a top lane he pretty much gets outshined by the most common solo tops and straight up gets face-rolled by alot of high sustain champs since he basically has to burn all his mana just to stave of harrass, meanwhile his harrass is inconsistent and easily ignored.
I think he's not far off from being good, but he's not quite there yet.
On August 19 2011 05:59 zalz wrote: Well the ration's on his skills aren't that bad considering you are spamming them all the time.
You also build a sheen/triforce wich is an item wich scales of your atack damage growth. I think Skarner might even have the highest base atack in the game. You have to work with the champion on a build, not scream that his ratio's are too low and ignore the massive base atack on him.
Building a deathcap or bloodthirster isn't gonna give you much, so you build a triforce wich works perfect for him.
Yeah, but when was the last time you saw a jungler get triforce fast enough for it to be useful? Good jungle champions can function well with the little farm they can secure, while Skarner needs the most expensive item in the game to operate well.
That's why imo Skarner is a top champ all the way.
On August 19 2011 05:59 zalz wrote: Well the ration's on his skills aren't that bad considering you are spamming them all the time.
You also build a sheen/triforce wich is an item wich scales of your atack damage growth. I think Skarner might even have the highest base atack in the game. You have to work with the champion on a build, not scream that his ratio's are too low and ignore the massive base atack on him.
Building a deathcap or bloodthirster isn't gonna give you much, so you build a triforce wich works perfect for him.
Yeah, but when was the last time you saw a jungler get triforce fast enough for it to be useful? Good jungle champions can function well with the little farm they can secure, while Skarner needs the most expensive item in the game to operate well.
That's why imo Skarner is a top champ all the way.
I still think Skarner's a better jungle champ because you can intuitively level his best skill (Q) first, and his second best (W) second. E exists only to be a point skill in jungle to get your first clear faster. It's pretty meh in teamfights and such. Not to mention his jungle ganks are actually quite good and Impale's pretty bad in lane unless you're getting tower dived.
The only thing that sucks is the decreased gold so Triforce is pushed out, but I still think that's better than 1) putting him in lane against champs who beat him there and 2) not pushing your good skills to 14-18 level and 3) not wasting ult.
On August 19 2011 06:16 Phrost wrote: Wait skarner's ult is bad? You mean worst case scenerio it's a 2 second stun that you can wail on them during?
Sadly it's 1.5 second ulti, but i feel that it's highly underated, just like Skarner himself.
It takes a few times but once you get a feel for the duration you can drag and turn around at the last moment and actually move them a pretty good deal.
Skarner, like every champ, turns around nearly instantly when you click the other way. The ulti always keeps targets infront of skarner, so turning around moves them further and it has you in the best possible position to chase.
On August 19 2011 06:16 Phrost wrote: Wait skarner's ult is bad? You mean worst case scenerio it's a 2 second stun that you can wail on them during?
1.5seconds, and you can't wail on them(unless by you, you mean your team) because it suppresses you as well. It's shorter than most basic qwe stuns, and the shortest of the suppression stuns(although WW's is only 1.7s, but his has much longer range, and does more damage, and heals him). It's upside is supposed to be the positioning effect it has, but it's just not that great when you consider him as a whole and what he has to go through to create it.
On August 19 2011 06:00 red_ wrote: Edit: Forgot his ult, it's mediocre at best, REALLY FUCKING BAD at worst depending on matchups. It's damage and range are both horrible, only AP scaling, and it's caught in a never ending catch 22 of 'if it lasts a long time it's OP cause you can move people a long ass distance, but if it doesn't it sucks because you move them an inch.'
shurelia ought to be a no-brainer on a champ like skarner. i dunno how people can say his ult's bad when they haven't actually explored how to make it useful lol
On August 19 2011 06:00 red_ wrote: Edit: Forgot his ult, it's mediocre at best, REALLY FUCKING BAD at worst depending on matchups. It's damage and range are both horrible, only AP scaling, and it's caught in a never ending catch 22 of 'if it lasts a long time it's OP cause you can move people a long ass distance, but if it doesn't it sucks because you move them an inch.'
You and I both know we could go find vids of every ability in the game being used in game changing fashion; that doesn't make it good. It's definitely not useless either, but any stun works just as well there with the team charging out behind him like it did. The absolute lack of any reaction from purple team makes it look like some devastating no reaction time allowing ability, when it's clearly not.
EPT
sorry"
