|
On July 13 2011 23:14 calgar wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2011 22:43 BluzMan wrote:
Generally, "Don't focus the tank" is the best indicator of a player who still has no idea but thinks much of his own ability. Tank their ELO or just plain ragequit, they are the worst kind of all. Can you explain this? It's the average excuse your standard loltard uses to flame you when your team loses a fight?
He most likely means, that most carries can't afford to focus someone if that puts them within the range of melee dps and tanks.
In case you fight in a straight line it looks like this:
Carries -> Tanks/Melee dps --> <-- enemy Tanks/Melee dps <- enemy Carries.
If you now (as a carry) try to focus the enemy carries you're in the middle of crap (not to mention within AP burst range) and would just explode, that's why you opt for the correct way of shooting the enemy melees till they're forced out of the fight.
The priority list for any ranged AD (and to a similar extent to sustained AP casters like Malz or Vlad, not so much to real bursters like Annie) are:
#1 Stay alive. Under no circumstance should you expose yourself to CC or melee based champs that will shit in your face.
#2 Deal damage. It doesn't matter to who, but just deal damage to someone.
#3 Focus high priority targets while still applying #1 and #2. If their ashe runs in the middle of things, rape that bitch, but don't fucking chase her if there's scary stuff in the way.
The whole "Don't focus the tank omg newb" comes from people who expect carries to act like assassins. Irelia, Akali, Yi etc. have to dive enemy carries. Not you as the carry.
PS: At the same elo you meet AD carries with stats like 14-10-15 who think they're doing their job correctly and flame the team for failing. =P
|
Because they dont understand how playing a carry actually works. If I'm playing a carry, Im hitting whoever is closest to me and makes me the safest positionally. If its only the tank, then you can bet your ass Im hitting the tank.
Best was yesterday when the other team had a fed udyr who did stupid amounts of damage, and was only going to die if we all killed him together. However, the "dont focus the tank" morons instead on hitting the brand who did no damage because he was a "carry"
|
Ahh ok, that was enlightening. There's so much metagame that I'm completely unaware of right now it's kind of funny. So what's different about a burster like Annie? Does she try and stay alive and burst whats in range or dive for the squishies? Who else is a burster?
|
Focusing the tank is not usually optimal but low eloers don't understand the concept of peeling and to at least stop them from raping your carry which means focus them (cause a lot of tanks nowadays are tanky dps like irelia, lee sin, jarvan, etc) that need to die because of their damage output being same as a carry but they themselves being tanky. Ranged carries or AP's are usually behind them so it's hard to actually get to them if your positioning isn't correct, and low elo players have no clue about positioning. Carries generally are supposed to hit whichever is safest for them to hit. They don't run up to an annie and die instantly to tibber stun combo. 
|
An aoe burster will just try to hit as many people as possible with their full combo before they die. For annie this means hitting 3+ people with tibbers, w, and then the weakest with q. Of course, this means going and getting into the enemy team's face, which is quite dangerous and often results in death immediately following.
|
On July 13 2011 23:31 calgar wrote:
Ahh ok, that was enlightening. There's so much metagame that I'm completely unaware of right now it's kind of funny. So what's different about a burster like Annie? Does she try and stay alive and burst whats in range or dive for the squishies? Who else is a burster?
annies job is to drop her ultimate on as many people as possible and then nuke them some more and if possible stay alive for the 2nd ae stun, if she does the fight is won.
|
United States47024 Posts
On July 13 2011 22:43 BluzMan wrote:
Generally, "Don't focus the tank" is the best indicator of a player who still has no idea but thinks much of his own ability. Tank their ELO or just plain ragequit, they are the worst kind of all.
There is of course the flip side to this, where you're playing, say, MF, and their Malzahar just sort of walks up to you and starts unloading spells on you, while your team all choose to run STRAIGHT PAST him to chase their Warwick off into the jungle.
|
Uhhh, this is more of a personal opinion but
Tanks in this game usually aren't really tanks. They're beefy heroes that do a metric fuckton of damage. And 90% of heroes in the game can't actually deal with tanks. So what ends up happening is a killer vs target hierarchy similar to
Ranged AD > Tanks
Tanks > Everything
Everything > Ranged AD
A rather interesting phenomenon you end up seeing is that most games are decided by an arms race between the tank and the ranged AD, and AP heroes serve to keep tanks honest (make MR!), to suppress tanks early game, and to apply CC/gun down the rest of their team. That sort of thing.
So when people say RANGED AD Y U NO HIT SQUISHY that's because they don't understand that tanks are absolute bitch in this game.
|
I'm in mood for a solo queue game after a nice shower, so I queue.
Last pick says 'vlad mid' so first pick bans him first. I ask if I can solo with kass and he picks kass.
Picks and bans seems all right until 5th pick, who picks trundle with smite/ghost after someone nocturned. Everyone proceeds to bash him. So noc gets flash exhaust.
Game starts, pretty normal except for aforementioned first pick yelling at me (Janna) for cv when it's on cd in addition to bashing me for letting our 5th pick ad carry.
Udyr vs Irelia top gives fb, Kass does some weird ass ring->philo->cata build while dying twi times to annie, and this noc doesn't know how to last hit nor harass nor lane at all (proper aggression, etc) while dying to ashe/taric.
Why is this not in qq thread? Because we won lol. Trundle countergank top turned into 4 kills and two towers over a minute and irelia ragequit lol.
My apologies to anyone on the other team.
|
On July 13 2011 23:47 Southlight wrote:
Uhhh, this is more of a personal opinion but
Tanks in this game usually aren't really tanks. They're beefy heroes that do a metric fuckton of damage. And 90% of heroes in the game can't actually deal with tanks. So what ends up happening is a killer vs target hierarchy similar to
Ranged AD > Tanks
Tanks > Everything
Everything > Ranged AD
A rather interesting phenomenon you end up seeing is that most games are decided by an arms race between the tank and the ranged AD, and AP heroes serve to keep tanks honest (make MR!), to suppress tanks early game, and to apply CC/gun down the rest of their team. That sort of thing.
So when people say RANGED AD Y U NO HIT SQUISHY that's because they don't understand that tanks are absolute bitch in this game.
I'm just posting to point out that you used the phrase metric fuckton here. This proves that you've talked with me too much. Carry on.
|
Dude you and Turkey are getting to me :/
|
is awesome32274 Posts
On July 13 2011 22:31 Woony wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2011 22:12 IntoTheWow wrote:
Also, never focus Mordekaiser in a teamfight.
God I hate this mentality, its like there is a full AP Mordekaiser with zero defense in the middle of your team all by himself and still everyone ignores him and lets him do whatever he wants -_-
Haha, it was meant as a joke, since in low lvl games people rush tank items on mordekaiser and end up 1v5ing an entire team. :p
|
On July 13 2011 23:56 Southlight wrote:
Dude you and Turkey are getting to me :/
obligatory huehuehue
|
On July 13 2011 20:41 Shiv. wrote:
As a former rather successful DotA player, how hard will the transition to LoL be? I haven't played DotA for about 2 years now, but I used to be pretty good.
I still have the mechanics and game sense I guess, but how hard was it for you guys to get used to the new heroes, the items and stuff?
i was a decent dota player but i'm much much better at LoL
you get out of the game what you put in, like any other game
i remember my first few games of LoL i went like 25-1 every game with blitzcrank (who is somewhat akin to pudge) and i thought i was god of this game. but then every time i played against someone using a champ i'd never seen before, it was a new roadblock
some memories i have from the learning process that is lol:
>my first time playing against a tryndamere, where he tower dove both myself and my lanemate at level 6, got a double, didn't die (thanks to his ult), and caused previously untold amounts of rage
>my first few games against TF, where i thought the easiest way to play this game was just buy TF and backdoor towers
>twitch, LOL
>finally getting good enough mechanically to remember to use my item actives (randuins mostly)
etc etc etc
so basically what i'm saying here is, knowing your last hitting and creep control and when to push an advantage are really handy skills to take from dota to lol, but don't feel bad if you lose a lot. it will take a long time til you learn all the champs and skills (shit, it took me 20+ summoner levels, and i joined before xin was released... what was that, 23 champions ago?), and even the you'll only be a proficient player. what you put in is what you get out
|
My first games (with no significant DotA experience beyond a few games vs AI) consisted of me going 0-lots as Mundo. My first 300 games, in fact, with about 50 Zilean games and 10 Karthus games in between. Karthus was the only one on which I had a positive K/D and then only barely.
Oh my biggest WTF moment was the first time I saw a Sion. He was the only one on their team doing well... but he was something like 26-0. He built AP and was nearly one-shotting everyone with his stun. Then once everyone had like 200 MR he switched to DPS. And was even more unkillable.
|
Russian Federation4235 Posts
On July 13 2011 23:14 calgar wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2011 22:43 BluzMan wrote:
Generally, "Don't focus the tank" is the best indicator of a player who still has no idea but thinks much of his own ability. Tank their ELO or just plain ragequit, they are the worst kind of all. Can you explain this? It's the average excuse your standard loltard uses to flame you when your team loses a fight?
Pretty much explained above, but what I have to add is that the preffered target of focus is always the one that is out of position. I've seen plenty of times where people start running from an enemy tank who can do like nothing to them and is essentially asking for free damage (his allies can't do damage in return for a second or two).
Furthermore, no champion in this game save for maybe Alistar can take 5-man focus for a long while. Even the tankiest tank, unless he somehow has 10k gold more than anyone else, will drop pretty fast if 5 people are dropping their shit on him. In many situation it's VERY GOOD to focus the tank if you find him out of position. Even if you blow your ult/summoners to drop him, it's worth it to 5v4 a team that lost their main source of initiation/CC. Being out of position does not mean half the map, generally a support tank (not the rich solo top tank variety of the old EU style, but the tank who jungled or played on bot) will drop in 1-2 seconds to a dedicated 5v1 focus, so a screen or even less in some circumstances is enough. Shit happens when people almost kill a stupid Singed this way and go berserk chasing him through the rest of his team, completely redeeming his stupidity, but that has nothing to do with 'focusing down the tank', it's just about greed and being stupid.
|
Stealth Assassin in LoL YES PLEASE!!!!!!!! Perma stealth funtimes
Although since LoL doesn't use agility you can't get double bonus of attackspeed + damage + backstab bonus 
|
You can say what you want about riots downtimes, but their compensations when you ask nicely are quite immense. Their support in general is quite cool.
To sum up what I got via asking nicely in the last 3 months:
-Refund on Red Baron Corki which I bought right before Urfrider appeared.
-Leaves reset and free 10 Win IP boost to compensate me for server issues
-Just got 12 Win IP boost cause my last 3d IP boost (which I got from the random RP giveaways) was active while servers had massive downtimes.
<3 riot support.
|
On July 14 2011 01:59 r.Evo wrote:
You can say what you want about riots downtimes, but their compensations when you ask nicely are quite immense. Their support in general is quite cool.
To sum up what I got via asking nicely in the last 3 months:
-Refund on Red Baron Corki which I bought right before Urfrider appeared.
-Leaves reset and free 10 Win IP boost to compensate me for server issues
-Just got 12 Win IP boost cause my last 3d IP boost (which I got from the random RP giveaways) was active while servers had massive downtimes.
<3 riot support.
Hi!
Riot can be nice, but your examples feel weak.
Your "refund" was more of an "exchange." Riot still got your money and it is in their best interest to perform this task so you spend more in the future.
Your 12 Win IP boost was essentially they fulfilling an obligation. (Read the Server "Busy" or "Offline" descriptions)
I don't understand what you mean for leaves reset, but it is appeasement! DON'T BE TRICKED!
Riot Support still makes me laugh with the pictures they make people draw for X amount of RP (in a good way)
|
Has anybody tried to get Tristana via Facebook? How long does it take them to ''send'' her to your account?
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
