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On September 05 2013 00:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:Show nested quote +On September 04 2013 23:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 19:45 CT Legacy wrote:On September 02 2013 09:07 BliptiX wrote:On September 02 2013 09:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 07:55 Daray wrote:
Going second is way too good in this game. Everyone knows and agrees. If it doesn't get addressed before release, I would be surprised. Something as simple as having the coin not count as a card, spell, etc and simply allow for +1 mana for the duration of a single turn without any other benefits should fix the issues. On top of that you shouldn't be able to mulligan your 4th card Why do you get to go second, get a free mana to use anytime you want AND get 4 cards to choose from at the start? I think if you gave first turn 4 cards and second player 3 cards plus coin it would work out. In most card games going second is the advantage since you can see already the plans of your opponent. Also going first you have 1 mana, not much can be done, usually a weak dude or nothing first turn anyways. The only major card game where going 2nd is an advantage is poker, and the only reason it is considered an advantage is because 90% of you hands aren't worth playing, and folding is free. This allows you to minimize your losses and potentially stay in the hand longer while paying a minimal amount. Any other game where you have to play the hand out regardless, going first is always an advantage. And in a game like hearthstone, where mana amounts are turn-based, going first is a HUGE advantage. This is why the 4th card is a non-issue, and the coin (outside of combos) is also completely OK. Because the person who goes second is both 1/2 a turn behind, AND 1/2 a mana crystal behind for the first 10 turns of the game. There are many draft and sealed deck formats where going second is an advantage in Magic: The Gathering (and there you don't get to see the extra card when you mull and have no coin). Rise of the Eldrazi being one of the more recent ones.
While I am not up-to-date on modern competitive formats, I can assume that you're exchanging going second during the game in order to go first during the draft.
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On September 05 2013 03:11 Jermstuddog wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2013 00:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 04 2013 23:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 19:45 CT Legacy wrote:On September 02 2013 09:07 BliptiX wrote:On September 02 2013 09:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 07:55 Daray wrote:
Going second is way too good in this game. Everyone knows and agrees. If it doesn't get addressed before release, I would be surprised. Something as simple as having the coin not count as a card, spell, etc and simply allow for +1 mana for the duration of a single turn without any other benefits should fix the issues. On top of that you shouldn't be able to mulligan your 4th card Why do you get to go second, get a free mana to use anytime you want AND get 4 cards to choose from at the start? I think if you gave first turn 4 cards and second player 3 cards plus coin it would work out. In most card games going second is the advantage since you can see already the plans of your opponent. Also going first you have 1 mana, not much can be done, usually a weak dude or nothing first turn anyways. The only major card game where going 2nd is an advantage is poker, and the only reason it is considered an advantage is because 90% of you hands aren't worth playing, and folding is free. This allows you to minimize your losses and potentially stay in the hand longer while paying a minimal amount. Any other game where you have to play the hand out regardless, going first is always an advantage. And in a game like hearthstone, where mana amounts are turn-based, going first is a HUGE advantage. This is why the 4th card is a non-issue, and the coin (outside of combos) is also completely OK. Because the person who goes second is both 1/2 a turn behind, AND 1/2 a mana crystal behind for the first 10 turns of the game. There are many draft and sealed deck formats where going second is an advantage in Magic: The Gathering (and there you don't get to see the extra card when you mull and have no coin). Rise of the Eldrazi being one of the more recent ones. While I am not up-to-date on modern competitive formats, I can assume that you're exchanging going second during the game in order to go first during the draft.
No...
You are exchanging going 2nd in the game for not skipping your draw step on your first turn. Period.
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On September 05 2013 03:13 Sn0_Man wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2013 03:11 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 05 2013 00:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 04 2013 23:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 19:45 CT Legacy wrote:On September 02 2013 09:07 BliptiX wrote:On September 02 2013 09:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 07:55 Daray wrote:
Going second is way too good in this game. Everyone knows and agrees. If it doesn't get addressed before release, I would be surprised. Something as simple as having the coin not count as a card, spell, etc and simply allow for +1 mana for the duration of a single turn without any other benefits should fix the issues. On top of that you shouldn't be able to mulligan your 4th card Why do you get to go second, get a free mana to use anytime you want AND get 4 cards to choose from at the start? I think if you gave first turn 4 cards and second player 3 cards plus coin it would work out. In most card games going second is the advantage since you can see already the plans of your opponent. Also going first you have 1 mana, not much can be done, usually a weak dude or nothing first turn anyways. The only major card game where going 2nd is an advantage is poker, and the only reason it is considered an advantage is because 90% of you hands aren't worth playing, and folding is free. This allows you to minimize your losses and potentially stay in the hand longer while paying a minimal amount. Any other game where you have to play the hand out regardless, going first is always an advantage. And in a game like hearthstone, where mana amounts are turn-based, going first is a HUGE advantage. This is why the 4th card is a non-issue, and the coin (outside of combos) is also completely OK. Because the person who goes second is both 1/2 a turn behind, AND 1/2 a mana crystal behind for the first 10 turns of the game. There are many draft and sealed deck formats where going second is an advantage in Magic: The Gathering (and there you don't get to see the extra card when you mull and have no coin). Rise of the Eldrazi being one of the more recent ones. While I am not up-to-date on modern competitive formats, I can assume that you're exchanging going second during the game in order to go first during the draft. No... You are exchanging going 2nd in the game for not skipping your draw step on your first turn. Period.
So... you're gaining card advantage then? Regardless, you're getting SOMETHING for going second that you wouldn't get for going first. It is not an advantage to have to wait for the other guy to go first, and that seems to be the argument Bliptix is making. The ability to move AFTER your opponent is just not advantageous in pretty much any strategy game unless you have the option of getting out of the hand (poker).
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Well im quite surprised how fast they came out with eu beta.Altho i didnt recieve beta key its still Great news!
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I certainly didn't... 
Anybody?
I get the impression that, ever since HotS, Blizzard has been turning its beta tests more into marketing campaigns. Give access to internet celebrities that then livestream and produce YouTube content and get the masses hyped up. The 'normal' folks seem to have an incredibly slim chance of getting a key via opt-in. It's a bit early to tell with Hearthstone, of course, but I personally really dislike this behavior.
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First wave is probably mostly for popular streamers from EU, although even if it isn't, it's doubtful anyone from TL will get one, haha. Chances are so low.
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Cool stuff! :D.
I have nothing on my e-mail but hopefully the invites take a couple of hours to get going  *wishfull thinking*
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Man this game looks like heaps of run.
I've never played any TCG (except the one my little brother and I made, with hand drawn cards self made laminates), so I'll probably get assraped the second I start playing, but even so...
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Northern Ireland22208 Posts
Let the wait for keys begin...
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Mhmm hitting normal play at the moment seems a bit slow to find opponents, should have guessed xD
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Well, like it looks all that has been done yet is: They replayced EU-press people temp. US-acc. with a permanent EU one...
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This game looks great. Can't wait.
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Now we have to split the chance of getting a beta key with Europeans
Why didn't Blizz delay EU beta further
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Unfortunatly no key.. *sob
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On September 05 2013 03:17 Jermstuddog wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2013 03:13 Sn0_Man wrote:On September 05 2013 03:11 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 05 2013 00:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 04 2013 23:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 19:45 CT Legacy wrote:On September 02 2013 09:07 BliptiX wrote:On September 02 2013 09:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 07:55 Daray wrote:
Going second is way too good in this game. Everyone knows and agrees. If it doesn't get addressed before release, I would be surprised. Something as simple as having the coin not count as a card, spell, etc and simply allow for +1 mana for the duration of a single turn without any other benefits should fix the issues. On top of that you shouldn't be able to mulligan your 4th card Why do you get to go second, get a free mana to use anytime you want AND get 4 cards to choose from at the start? I think if you gave first turn 4 cards and second player 3 cards plus coin it would work out. In most card games going second is the advantage since you can see already the plans of your opponent. Also going first you have 1 mana, not much can be done, usually a weak dude or nothing first turn anyways. The only major card game where going 2nd is an advantage is poker, and the only reason it is considered an advantage is because 90% of you hands aren't worth playing, and folding is free. This allows you to minimize your losses and potentially stay in the hand longer while paying a minimal amount. Any other game where you have to play the hand out regardless, going first is always an advantage. And in a game like hearthstone, where mana amounts are turn-based, going first is a HUGE advantage. This is why the 4th card is a non-issue, and the coin (outside of combos) is also completely OK. Because the person who goes second is both 1/2 a turn behind, AND 1/2 a mana crystal behind for the first 10 turns of the game. There are many draft and sealed deck formats where going second is an advantage in Magic: The Gathering (and there you don't get to see the extra card when you mull and have no coin). Rise of the Eldrazi being one of the more recent ones. While I am not up-to-date on modern competitive formats, I can assume that you're exchanging going second during the game in order to go first during the draft. No... You are exchanging going 2nd in the game for not skipping your draw step on your first turn. Period. So... you're gaining card advantage then? Regardless, you're getting SOMETHING for going second that you wouldn't get for going first. It is not an advantage to have to wait for the other guy to go first, and that seems to be the argument Bliptix is making. The ability to move AFTER your opponent is just not advantageous in pretty much any strategy game unless you have the option of getting out of the hand (poker).
Yes, you gain card advantage. In Hearthstone you gain super mega ultra card advantage (since you can mulligan the card you get to draw). Which is why the 4th card and coin are more than enough incentive to want to go second in Hearthstone the vast majority of the time along with the card puddle making it so that good one-drops are few and far between.
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Germany25657 Posts
Obviously I didn'T get a key. I never do fuck my life
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Well, didn't expect to get one to begin with ;(
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EPT
