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On September 05 2013 05:54 TheTenthDoc wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2013 03:17 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 05 2013 03:13 Sn0_Man wrote:On September 05 2013 03:11 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 05 2013 00:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 04 2013 23:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 19:45 CT Legacy wrote:On September 02 2013 09:07 BliptiX wrote:On September 02 2013 09:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 07:55 Daray wrote:
Going second is way too good in this game. Everyone knows and agrees. If it doesn't get addressed before release, I would be surprised. Something as simple as having the coin not count as a card, spell, etc and simply allow for +1 mana for the duration of a single turn without any other benefits should fix the issues. On top of that you shouldn't be able to mulligan your 4th card Why do you get to go second, get a free mana to use anytime you want AND get 4 cards to choose from at the start? I think if you gave first turn 4 cards and second player 3 cards plus coin it would work out. In most card games going second is the advantage since you can see already the plans of your opponent. Also going first you have 1 mana, not much can be done, usually a weak dude or nothing first turn anyways. The only major card game where going 2nd is an advantage is poker, and the only reason it is considered an advantage is because 90% of you hands aren't worth playing, and folding is free. This allows you to minimize your losses and potentially stay in the hand longer while paying a minimal amount. Any other game where you have to play the hand out regardless, going first is always an advantage. And in a game like hearthstone, where mana amounts are turn-based, going first is a HUGE advantage. This is why the 4th card is a non-issue, and the coin (outside of combos) is also completely OK. Because the person who goes second is both 1/2 a turn behind, AND 1/2 a mana crystal behind for the first 10 turns of the game. There are many draft and sealed deck formats where going second is an advantage in Magic: The Gathering (and there you don't get to see the extra card when you mull and have no coin). Rise of the Eldrazi being one of the more recent ones. While I am not up-to-date on modern competitive formats, I can assume that you're exchanging going second during the game in order to go first during the draft. No... You are exchanging going 2nd in the game for not skipping your draw step on your first turn. Period. So... you're gaining card advantage then? Regardless, you're getting SOMETHING for going second that you wouldn't get for going first. It is not an advantage to have to wait for the other guy to go first, and that seems to be the argument Bliptix is making. The ability to move AFTER your opponent is just not advantageous in pretty much any strategy game unless you have the option of getting out of the hand (poker). Yes, you gain card advantage. In Hearthstone you gain super mega ultra card advantage (since you can mulligan the card you get to draw). Which is why the 4th card and coin are more than enough incentive to want to go second in Hearthstone the vast majority of the time along with the card puddle making it so that good one-drops are few and far between.
The lack of good one-drops isn't important considering it affects both sides. I also don't think being able to mulligan the 4th card is an issue considering that the person who goes first gets to set the tempo from the get-go. The only issue I think needs addressing right now is the coin comboing and activating card effects when it should be nothing more than a free 1-time-use mana crystal.
I think you guys are undervaluing the effect of going first and having a mana advantage for the first 20 turns in the game. Being able to mulligan 1 extra card is pretty fair IMO.
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On September 05 2013 05:56 KadaverBB wrote:Obviously I didn'T get a key. I never do  fuck my life
I've only ever received a beta key from blizzard in the last "stress test" wave. I've been signed up for betas since Starcraft1. Feel your pain.
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On September 05 2013 03:22 NihiLStarcraft wrote:I certainly didn't... Anybody? I get the impression that, ever since HotS, Blizzard has been turning its beta tests more into marketing campaigns. Give access to internet celebrities that then livestream and produce YouTube content and get the masses hyped up. The 'normal' folks seem to have an incredibly slim chance of getting a key via opt-in. It's a bit early to tell with Hearthstone, of course, but I personally really dislike this behavior.
How would there ever be a high chance of getting one with maybe 1 million people or smth opting in? Ok I guess they could give out 500.000 keys, but why even make it closed beta then? The thing is, for any Blizzard game the chance for a closed beta key will always be VERY low. Think lower than 1%.
Which is why people should never get their hopes up in the first place, and just wait for open beta.
Best chance for keys are probably prize draws on gaming sites etc.
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On September 05 2013 03:22 NihiLStarcraft wrote:I certainly didn't... Anybody? I get the impression that, ever since HotS, Blizzard has been turning its beta tests more into marketing campaigns. Give access to internet celebrities that then livestream and produce YouTube content and get the masses hyped up. The 'normal' folks seem to have an incredibly slim chance of getting a key via opt-in. It's a bit early to tell with Hearthstone, of course, but I personally really dislike this behavior.
Hasn't hearthstone been the only beta since HotS?
Also what redox said. There are probably so many people opted in.
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It just occurred to us that tomorrow is going to be an awesome day for friends of BlizzardCS who are not already part of the Hearthstone Beta. If you know people who are interested, and are not already friends of the page, let them know so they can friend us to find out more!
Stay tuned for more info tomorrow!
BlizzardCS
Might (most likely) be some more promotional Blizzard BS, but heads up for anyone that wants to try anyway.
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On September 05 2013 06:25 Jermstuddog wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2013 05:54 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 05 2013 03:17 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 05 2013 03:13 Sn0_Man wrote:On September 05 2013 03:11 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 05 2013 00:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 04 2013 23:01 Jermstuddog wrote:On September 02 2013 19:45 CT Legacy wrote:On September 02 2013 09:07 BliptiX wrote:On September 02 2013 09:01 Jermstuddog wrote:
[quote]
Everyone knows and agrees. If it doesn't get addressed before release, I would be surprised.
Something as simple as having the coin not count as a card, spell, etc and simply allow for +1 mana for the duration of a single turn without any other benefits should fix the issues. On top of that you shouldn't be able to mulligan your 4th card Why do you get to go second, get a free mana to use anytime you want AND get 4 cards to choose from at the start? I think if you gave first turn 4 cards and second player 3 cards plus coin it would work out. In most card games going second is the advantage since you can see already the plans of your opponent. Also going first you have 1 mana, not much can be done, usually a weak dude or nothing first turn anyways. The only major card game where going 2nd is an advantage is poker, and the only reason it is considered an advantage is because 90% of you hands aren't worth playing, and folding is free. This allows you to minimize your losses and potentially stay in the hand longer while paying a minimal amount. Any other game where you have to play the hand out regardless, going first is always an advantage. And in a game like hearthstone, where mana amounts are turn-based, going first is a HUGE advantage. This is why the 4th card is a non-issue, and the coin (outside of combos) is also completely OK. Because the person who goes second is both 1/2 a turn behind, AND 1/2 a mana crystal behind for the first 10 turns of the game. There are many draft and sealed deck formats where going second is an advantage in Magic: The Gathering (and there you don't get to see the extra card when you mull and have no coin). Rise of the Eldrazi being one of the more recent ones. While I am not up-to-date on modern competitive formats, I can assume that you're exchanging going second during the game in order to go first during the draft. No... You are exchanging going 2nd in the game for not skipping your draw step on your first turn. Period. So... you're gaining card advantage then? Regardless, you're getting SOMETHING for going second that you wouldn't get for going first. It is not an advantage to have to wait for the other guy to go first, and that seems to be the argument Bliptix is making. The ability to move AFTER your opponent is just not advantageous in pretty much any strategy game unless you have the option of getting out of the hand (poker). Yes, you gain card advantage. In Hearthstone you gain super mega ultra card advantage (since you can mulligan the card you get to draw). Which is why the 4th card and coin are more than enough incentive to want to go second in Hearthstone the vast majority of the time along with the card puddle making it so that good one-drops are few and far between. The lack of good one-drops isn't important considering it affects both sides. I also don't think being able to mulligan the 4th card is an issue considering that the person who goes first gets to set the tempo from the get-go. The only issue I think needs addressing right now is the coin comboing and activating card effects when it should be nothing more than a free 1-time-use mana crystal. I think you guys are undervaluing the effect of going first and having a mana advantage for the first 20 turns in the game. Being able to mulligan 1 extra card is pretty fair IMO.
Lack of one drops when the second player doesn't ever need to play a one drop thanks to the coin is pretty important. Player 2 gets to play two 2-drops in the first two turns, player 1 gets to play one 2-drop and (maybe) one 1-drop.
I would also argue that pint sized summoner-> your opponent facing it with 2 mana, then 3 mana, poses a much tougher obstacle than pint sized summoner -> your opponent facing it with 3 mana then 3 mana or 2 mana then 4 mana. Knife juggler is even worse.
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I can't think of any 1 drop that can really snowball the game
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On September 05 2013 08:15 Redox wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2013 03:22 NihiLStarcraft wrote:I certainly didn't... Anybody? I get the impression that, ever since HotS, Blizzard has been turning its beta tests more into marketing campaigns. Give access to internet celebrities that then livestream and produce YouTube content and get the masses hyped up. The 'normal' folks seem to have an incredibly slim chance of getting a key via opt-in. It's a bit early to tell with Hearthstone, of course, but I personally really dislike this behavior. How would there ever be a high chance of getting one with maybe 1 million people or smth opting in? Ok I guess they could give out 500.000 keys, but why even make it closed beta then? The thing is, for any Blizzard game the chance for a closed beta key will always be VERY low. Think lower than 1%. Which is why people should never get their hopes up in the first place, and just wait for open beta. Best chance for keys are probably prize draws on gaming sites etc.
I'd like to see less 'giveaways' (ie. like this page on facebook, like that page, share this, follow this on twitter, retweet/favorite that etc.) and give all those keys to random people that are opted-in. Right now, and that's the best example, the Blizzard Customer Support just tweeted that they give keys away in the near future but you need to learn about their freaking Knowledge Base... Why torture players like that? Also, these giveaways clearly favor 12-16 year olds that don't have long school days and don't work. I realize nobody is entitled to beta access - I'd just have it be more random chance instead of these stupid marketing contests.
Of course, I'm just grumpy because I don't have a key... :p
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Still no key I had so much hope.
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BlizzardCSEU_EN twitter is giving out keys it seems. I dont even bother trying. 
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Haven't been paying attention for a few days... Does this mean EU beta is going or are they giving out keys for US?
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On September 05 2013 20:27 beef42 wrote:
Haven't been paying attention for a few days... Does this mean EU beta is going or are they giving out keys for US?
EU Is out, keys for EU.
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On September 05 2013 20:21 Grettin wrote:BlizzardCSEU_EN twitter is giving out keys it seems. I dont even bother trying.
Goooood, less competition :D
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Blizzard trolling me by sending out a promotion for Diablo 3 on console.
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On September 05 2013 19:42 NihiLStarcraft wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2013 08:15 Redox wrote:On September 05 2013 03:22 NihiLStarcraft wrote:I certainly didn't... Anybody? I get the impression that, ever since HotS, Blizzard has been turning its beta tests more into marketing campaigns. Give access to internet celebrities that then livestream and produce YouTube content and get the masses hyped up. The 'normal' folks seem to have an incredibly slim chance of getting a key via opt-in. It's a bit early to tell with Hearthstone, of course, but I personally really dislike this behavior. How would there ever be a high chance of getting one with maybe 1 million people or smth opting in? Ok I guess they could give out 500.000 keys, but why even make it closed beta then? The thing is, for any Blizzard game the chance for a closed beta key will always be VERY low. Think lower than 1%. Which is why people should never get their hopes up in the first place, and just wait for open beta. Best chance for keys are probably prize draws on gaming sites etc. I'd like to see less 'giveaways' (ie. like this page on facebook, like that page, share this, follow this on twitter, retweet/favorite that etc.) and give all those keys to random people that are opted-in. Right now, and that's the best example, the Blizzard Customer Support just tweeted that they give keys away in the near future but you need to learn about their freaking Knowledge Base... Why torture players like that? Also, these giveaways clearly favor 12-16 year olds that don't have long school days and don't work. I realize nobody is entitled to beta access - I'd just have it be more random chance instead of these stupid marketing contests. Of course, I'm just grumpy because I don't have a key... :p
Well you could argue that this way the people that are really interested have a higher chance of getting one than lets say the WoW players that randomly opt in because they just opt in for everything on their b.net account.
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On September 05 2013 20:46 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Blizzard trolling me by sending out a promotion for Diablo 3 on console.
Same, it was literally soon after the EU Beta announcement. -_-
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Dudes. I wrote it before and I will do it again. This beta is 100% a marketing thing. What is it they needed tested on EU, that they couldn't test on US? Nothing, that's bloody what. So basically the entire thing is the marketing department's bright as hell idea to generate interest and hype and etc.
Good luck to people jumping through the hoops and going for the keys. For my part I'll just patiently wait for it to go open. Well... I did opt in but what the hell does that do anyway?
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On September 05 2013 21:04 beef42 wrote:
Dudes. I wrote it before and I will do it again. This beta is 100% a marketing thing. What is it they needed tested on EU, that they couldn't test on US? Nothing, that's bloody what. So basically the entire thing is the marketing department's bright as hell idea to generate interest and hype and etc.
Good luck to people jumping through the hoops and going for the keys. For my part I'll just patiently wait for it to go open. Well... I did opt in but what the hell does that do anyway?
One thing they can test in EU they can't really test in US is localization.
edit: though I mostly agree with you.
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I didn't get an invite, and I'm almost disappointed. My current PC is pretty asymmetrical (overclocked 2700k with a HD5850) and it has given me a shit ton of beta invites in the past. But I guess there's not much to test hardware-wise at this point.
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The game will be out in a couple months and the card pool is laughably small right now anyway. Just find another game to play and forget about this for a while. It'll do you all some good, trust me.
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EPT
