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.docX is dead! Yay! - Page 2

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Grimatoma2
Profile Joined June 2009
United States68 Posts
August 12 2009 18:40 GMT
#21
why are you guys complaining about the size of a document? we have drives with 1 terabyte, and u guys r talking about the different of a few killabytes???

imo microsoft should do make msoffice open source and give it free with windows and just lol like what they did with internet explorer
:o hi mom
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
August 12 2009 18:41 GMT
#22
The irony is that MS went to OOXML to increase compatibility with third party software instead of the old binary format, but general computer users have been too stupid to understand what to do (even though their files have gotten 10x smaller.) Google it, people.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
Last Romantic
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States20667 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-12 18:44:48
August 12 2009 18:41 GMT
#23
Agreed with Jibba, Insane, and azndsh.

Insofar as ubiquity goes, sure, .doc is more common, but .docx is.... better. This is even more ridiculous than Cisco's suit against Apple due to its ownership of the name "iPhone". Delay of technological advance due to some petty detail is... well. A bit silly.

@grimatoma, have you worked in a large tech firm? Those few 'killabytes' total up to a few million... what would you call them.... 'giggabytes'. And then you have to buy more storage, and service that storage, and all sorts of useless spending that can easily be prevented.

Microsoft is a profit-making venture. Asking them to give away their hard work for free is despicable. As a Microsoft shareholder I encourage them to make money in as many ways as possible.
ㅋㄲㅈㅁ
Husky
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3362 Posts
August 12 2009 18:42 GMT
#24
Yeah this is definitely going to get overturned. This is like saying Ford can no longer make trucks.
Commentaries: youtube.com/HuskyStarcraft
PianoMan
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
Pakistan54 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-12 18:43:43
August 12 2009 18:43 GMT
#25
On August 13 2009 03:40 Grimatoma2 wrote:
why are you guys complaining about the size of a document? we have drives with 1 terabyte, and u guys r talking about the different of a few killabytes???

imo microsoft should do make msoffice open source and give it free with windows and just lol like what they did with internet explorer

Yeah man, rage against the man, man. Microsoft should just give away everything for free and pull money out of their hats.

P i a n o M a n
Az the Donkey
ParasitJonte
Profile Joined September 2004
Sweden1768 Posts
August 12 2009 18:44 GMT
#26
On August 13 2009 03:32 Jibba wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2009 03:02 cgrinker wrote:
Source

A Judge on Tuesday ordered Microsoft (NSDQ: MSFT) to stop selling its popular Word document creation application in the United States after finding that the software contains technology that violates a patent held by a third party.

Microsoft Office, which includes Word, accounted for more than $3 billion in worldwide sales in Microsoft's most recent fiscal year and is used by literally millions of businesses and consumers for everyday tasks like word processing and making spreadsheets and presentations.

The judge said the ruling, which applies to Word 2003 and Word 2007, takes effect in 60 days.

Investors shrugged off the news—perhaps in anticipation of a higher court overturning the ruling, which arose from the plaintiff-friendly Eastern Texas federal jurisdiction. Microsoft shares were up 1.6% to $23.50 in early trading Wednesday.

Judge Leonard Davis, of U.S. District Court for Eastern Texas, said Microsoft "unlawfully infringed" on a patent that describes how programs go about "manipulating a document's content and architecture separately." The patent, No. 5,787,449, is held by Toronto-based i4i, Inc. i4i develops "collaborative content solutions," according to its Web site.

i4i originally sued Microsoft for patent infringement in 2007. Microsoft officials said the company plans to appeal, adding that the software maker is "disappointed by the court's ruling." The company said it believes i4i's patent is "invalid."

Davis on Tuesday ordered Microsoft to pay $240 million in damages to i4i, plus court costs and interest. More significantly, he enjoined Microsoft from continuing to sell Microsoft Word, in its current form, in the U.S.

Specifically, Davis said Microsoft can't sell versions of Word that can open documents saved in the .XML, .DOCX, or .DOCM formats that contain custom XML. Those formats were at the heart of the patent dispute. .DOCX is the default format for the most current version of Word, which is included in Microsoft Office 2007. Custom XML is used by businesses to link their corporate data to Word documents.

"Microsoft Corporation is hereby permanently enjoined" from selling Word 2003 and Word 2007 in the U.S. Davis, wrote in his order.

Davis also prohibited Microsoft from providing technical support for infringing products sold after the injunction takes effect, or from "testing, demonstrating, or marketing the ability of the infringing and future Word products to open an XML file containing custom XML."

Davis said the injunction does not apply to versions of Word that open an XML file as plain text or which apply a transform that removes all custom XML elements—possibly paving the way for Microsoft to issue a patch that rectifies the problem.


Have you ever been at school and someone would be like "I can't open this Word Document because I run Windows Vista," and you thought to yourself "You are a fucking idiot." Well now those days are over since a Texas court ruled that Microsoft infringed upon a patent with their custom XML stuff for the .docX format. Which is good because it make the documents twice the size and doesn't do anything.

What? The XML files are superior in every way (especially size.) There's a compatability pack for older versions of Office so they read .docx without having to convert anything. You guys are dum.


Thank you.

And no there's no reason to be happy about this. Some stupid company (i4i -> lol?) taking advantage of stupid rules and possibly forcing Microsoft to change the format in which word documents are saved. For portability issues I always use this http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/thankyou.aspx?familyId=f1fc413c-6d89-4f15-991b-63b07ba5f2e5&displayLang=en and export my .docx files to pdf.
Hello=)
StorrZerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States13922 Posts
August 12 2009 18:47 GMT
#27
On August 13 2009 03:42 HuskyTheHusky wrote:
Yeah this is definitely going to get overturned. This is like saying Ford can no longer make trucks.


yeah sums it up pretty well.

just give the guy his millions and let Microsoft be Microsoft.
Hwaseung Oz fan for life. Swing out, always swing out.
Aerox
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
Malaysia1213 Posts
August 12 2009 18:50 GMT
#28
YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU!
"Eyes in the sky."
-fj.
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Samoa462 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-12 18:53:58
August 12 2009 18:50 GMT
#29
Patent law -_-

Esp. When it is applied to computers, it mostly just prevents people from doing the best work they can... Its like a limit on what you can make, for example people have to use worse / less efficient methods of rendering shadows in 3D games because the best ways are patented.

Capitalism does this all the time.. Makes things shitty for everyone just so 1 person can make money. Planned obsolescence, anyone?
Ganfei
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Taiwan1439 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-12 18:52:30
August 12 2009 18:51 GMT
#30
On August 13 2009 03:41 Last Romantic wrote:
Agreed with Jibba, Insane, and azndsh.

Insofar as ubiquity goes, sure, .doc is more common, but .docx is.... better. This is even more ridiculous than Cisco's suit against Apple due to its ownership of the name "iPhone". Delay of technological advance due to some petty detail is... well. A bit silly.

@grimatoma, have you worked in a large tech firm? Those few 'killabytes' total up to a few million... what would you call them.... 'giggabytes'. And then you have to buy more storage, and service that storage, and all sorts of useless spending that can easily be prevented.

Microsoft is a profit-making venture. Asking them to give away their hard work for free is despicable. As a Microsoft shareholder I encourage them to make money in as many ways as possible.


uh where exactly is this "free" part that you are gleaning from the article? And quite regardless of whether or not it's good, worked, or doesn't work, if Microsoft did in fact steal another company's idea or programming or whatever the fuck it is, then Microsoft needs to pay that company. I don't know if they did or not...but if they did, then they should.
You are crushing me like a cheese sandwich
fusionsdf
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada15390 Posts
August 12 2009 18:51 GMT
#31
as much as I dislike microsoft, this is retarded

just another patent troll
SKT_Best: "I actually chose Protoss because it was so hard for me to defeat Protoss as a Terran. When I first started Brood War, my main race was Terran."
fusionsdf
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada15390 Posts
August 12 2009 18:54 GMT
#32
On August 13 2009 03:25 Nytefish wrote:
I always wonder about these kind of rulings. How much does the judge understand the technology? Was the patent stupidly vague in the first place? Should I be happy that Microsoft is on the losing end?


not at all
yes
no
SKT_Best: "I actually chose Protoss because it was so hard for me to defeat Protoss as a Terran. When I first started Brood War, my main race was Terran."
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
August 12 2009 18:55 GMT
#33
On August 13 2009 03:50 -fj. wrote:
Patent law -_-

Esp. When it is applied to computers, it mostly just prevents people from doing the best work they can... Its like a limit on what you can make. People have to use worse / less efficient methods of rendering shadows in 3D games because the best ways are patented.

Capitalism does this all the time.. Makes things shitty for everyone just so 1 person can make money. Planned obsolescence, anyone?

Uh... if you create something you deserve to profit off of it. If patent holders couldn't make money off their inventions, those rendering methods wouldn't have been created in the first place.

The problem is when the law is stretched to an unreasonable extent, and this is one of them.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
August 12 2009 19:04 GMT
#34
On August 13 2009 03:51 NoobsOfWrath wrote:
if Microsoft did in fact steal another company's idea or programming or whatever the fuck it is, then Microsoft needs to pay that company. I don't know if they did or not...but if they did, then they should.

Patent

Method and system for manipulating the architecture and the content of a document separately from each other


Abstract
A system and method for the separate manipulation of the architecture and content of a document, particularly for data representation and transformations. The system, for use by computer software developers, removes dependency on document encoding technology. A map of metacodes found in the document is produced and provided and stored separately from the document. The map indicates the location and addresses of metacodes in the document. The system allows of multiple views of the same content, the ability to work solely on structure and solely on content, storage efficiency of multiple versions and efficiency of operation.
Basically a file with metacodes.

The fun thing is that MS is just being singled out for $$$. Apple, IBM, Sun, etc. are all using the same format.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
fusionsdf
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada15390 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-12 19:07:00
August 12 2009 19:04 GMT
#35
On August 13 2009 03:55 Jibba wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2009 03:50 -fj. wrote:
Patent law -_-

Esp. When it is applied to computers, it mostly just prevents people from doing the best work they can... Its like a limit on what you can make. People have to use worse / less efficient methods of rendering shadows in 3D games because the best ways are patented.

Capitalism does this all the time.. Makes things shitty for everyone just so 1 person can make money. Planned obsolescence, anyone?

Uh... if you create something you deserve to profit off of it. If patent holders couldn't make money off their inventions, those rendering methods wouldn't have been created in the first place.

The problem is when the law is stretched to an unreasonable extent, and this is one of them.


computer patents have a whole host of other problems since a) the turn over is a lot faster than in other fields. Having a company able to sit on a patent for 17 years is pretty ridiculous. b)when you do a patent, you are patenting an algorithm, which is just a generic way to accomplish a task. The vast majority of tech patents are ridiculous for this reason.
The company can make money off the program itself.


If patent holders couldn't make money off their inventions, those rendering methods wouldn't have been created in the first place.


its more than a bit flimsy to say that by itself without justification. Of course those rendering methods would still be used. You use those algorithms to produce a superior product which you then sell. Someone using the same/similar algorithms doesnt mean they will have the same product.
SKT_Best: "I actually chose Protoss because it was so hard for me to defeat Protoss as a Terran. When I first started Brood War, my main race was Terran."
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
August 12 2009 19:17 GMT
#36
The problem is they give out patents too generally. If you're John Carmac and you build a whole freaking engine, then yes you get control of it. If you're talking about a singular algorithm or method, then I think it's a bit silly.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
andiCR
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Costa Rica2273 Posts
August 12 2009 19:33 GMT
#37
This appeal is retarded. Its a custom usage of a doc format. Every damn software vendor can make their own format and even compress it and distribute it with their application. Common sense.
Now its as if they try to sue Microsoft into bankrupcy just for the sake of.. what??? This makes no sense to me. I find it malicious. I dont care if docx is not "portable" enough, it's their fucken software..
Nightmare1795 wrote: I played a guy in bronze who said he was Japanese. That was the only game I ever dropped a nuke, which was purely coincidental.
BBS
Profile Joined September 2008
Germany204 Posts
August 12 2009 19:44 GMT
#38
FUCK YES, THAT IS SO AWESOME! sorry for caps, but am really celebrating this :D
azndsh
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States4447 Posts
August 12 2009 19:50 GMT
#39
LR, aren't you a mod? where are your ban powers T_T
Last Romantic
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States20667 Posts
August 12 2009 19:52 GMT
#40
On August 13 2009 03:51 NoobsOfWrath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2009 03:41 Last Romantic wrote:
Agreed with Jibba, Insane, and azndsh.

Insofar as ubiquity goes, sure, .doc is more common, but .docx is.... better. This is even more ridiculous than Cisco's suit against Apple due to its ownership of the name "iPhone". Delay of technological advance due to some petty detail is... well. A bit silly.

@grimatoma, have you worked in a large tech firm? Those few 'killabytes' total up to a few million... what would you call them.... 'giggabytes'. And then you have to buy more storage, and service that storage, and all sorts of useless spending that can easily be prevented.

Microsoft is a profit-making venture. Asking them to give away their hard work for free is despicable. As a Microsoft shareholder I encourage them to make money in as many ways as possible.


uh where exactly is this "free" part that you are gleaning from the article? And quite regardless of whether or not it's good, worked, or doesn't work, if Microsoft did in fact steal another company's idea or programming or whatever the fuck it is, then Microsoft needs to pay that company. I don't know if they did or not...but if they did, then they should.


Not from the article, from the previous poster who said that Office should be open source/free to download like internet explorer is.
ㅋㄲㅈㅁ
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