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On April 11 2018 00:39 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2018 00:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2018 23:40 Gorsameth wrote:On April 10 2018 22:55 Plansix wrote:
It is really stupid because they could have charged them all with first degree burglary because they were breaking into homes while armed. That carries a 10-99 year sentence. Like in most states, home invasions are treated with the same severity as attempted murder in Alabama. But apparently the DA wanted to test the limits of felony murder. He'll spend 65 years in prison for felony murder, armed burglary, second-degree theft, and third-degree theft. So yes he was charged for it. I need to dig into that to see how the sentencing was issued. The felony murder charge might make up a small part of those 65 years, since first degree burglary is a serious charge. But kid was still 15 years old, so can’t justify them throwing book at him with these charges when there were other people involved. The article didn't mention the individual terms but I saw 30 for felony murder, 15 for armed burglary and 2x10 for 2 counts of theft mentioned on a different forum. Edit: Source
All right, there is no justifying any of that for any reason. The burglary charge would have been sufficient if they really wanted to go for him.
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How is it even possible to sentence a minor (that isn't a repeat offender psycho) for 65 years due to burglary?
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On April 11 2018 00:52 Velr wrote:
How is it even possible to sentence a minor (that isn't a repeat offender psycho) for 65 years due to burglary? He was tried as an adult. I haven't seen a justification for it anywhere (and I disagree with doing it without a damn good reason) but I imagine its because guns were involved or the severity of the charges.
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I get it if they do that with 17 year olds but 15? Come on... How this is not another outrage in itself seems just crazy... That you can jail anyone for 65 years seems crazy. Most countries got limits on that (20-25 years or something like that) unless your deemed untreatable.
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I’m not surprised by this at all. Given the instantaneous scrutiny that the raid would come under, it makes sense that the top members of the Justice Department would sign off personally. Removes any claim that the investigation went rogue or operated without authority. On a side note, it appears that Cohen had long term a hotel room and home in NYC. Because nothing says operating above board like a hotel room in the same city you live in.
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On April 11 2018 01:25 Velr wrote:
I get it if they do that with 17 year olds but 15? Come on... How this is not another outrage in itself seems just crazy... That you can jail anyone for 65 years seems crazy. Most countries got limits on that (20-25 years or something like that) unless your deemed untreatable.
it's not an outrage because it's normal here. people become normalized to all sorts of things after all, regardless of rightness or wrongness, people become used to it. if you want to seriously read up on it I could point to more detailed readings on that topic (not that i'm that familiar with them, i've only heard about them).
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On April 11 2018 01:25 Velr wrote:
I get it if they do that with 17 year olds but 15? Come on... How this is not another outrage in itself seems just crazy... That you can jail anyone for 65 years seems crazy. Most countries got limits on that (20-25 years or something like that) unless your deemed untreatable.
It is Alabama. Not really a state known for its fair treatment of black suspects historically. Or treatment of blacks in general.
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I just don'tget this diffreinciation between white and black subjects... Wtf is your code of law worth if it allos this?
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On April 11 2018 01:37 Velr wrote:
I just don'tget this diffreinciation between white and black subjects... Wtf is your code of law worth if it allos this?
Law is ultimately interpreted by humans. We have a wide range of humans on this planet. Some of them are Cletus. When Cletus interprets the law, it goes through a Cletus filter. Cletus tends to to err on the "let's do mean shit to blacks" side of things.
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On April 11 2018 01:37 Velr wrote:
I just don'tget this diffreinciation between white and black subjects... Wtf is your code of law worth if it allos this?
it's not so easy to fix things? any system must be implemented by people; and if there's a problem with the people, those can show up in the implementation.
and a law code can have serious problems, and still be far, far better than nothing.
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On April 11 2018 01:37 Velr wrote:
I just don'tget this diffreinciation between white and black subjects... Wtf is your code of law worth if it allos this?
The law doesn't make that distinction, the DA bringing the charges does. He was capable of convicting them off all of these crimes, so he brought all of the crimes against them. It is why you see the white Trump voter who voted twice getting no jail time, while a black woman that voted when she was ineligible gets 5 years. She threw herself on the mercy of the court, saying she truly thought she could vote while on probation, still got 5 years. Our is Justice system is rotten with racial bias, but not because of the laws, but because of the people involved.
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On April 11 2018 01:26 Plansix wrote:https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/983739174506426368I’m not surprised by this at all. Given the instantaneous scrutiny that the raid would come under, it makes sense that the top members of the Justice Department would sign off personally. Removes any claim that the investigation went rogue or operated without authority. On a side note, it appears that Cohen had long term a hotel room and home in NYC. Because nothing says operating above board like a hotel room in the same city you live in.
There was some controversy awhile back that Trump was interviewing people to appoint as Attorney for the Southern District of New York. Apparently the guy that Trump had appointed, Geoffrey Berman, has recused himself from the investigation into Michael Cohen. He donated money to Trump's campaign and had worked with Rudy Giuliani. He was in all likelihood there to act as a shield for Trump, and it backfired tremendously.
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On April 11 2018 01:31 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2018 01:25 Velr wrote:
I get it if they do that with 17 year olds but 15? Come on... How this is not another outrage in itself seems just crazy... That you can jail anyone for 65 years seems crazy. Most countries got limits on that (20-25 years or something like that) unless your deemed untreatable. It is Alabama. Not really a state known for its fair treatment of black suspects historically. Or treatment of blacks in general.
Yeah, but this is not even about black people. I mean, it is, but this shouldn't be legal in general. You should simply not legally be able to jail a 15 year old for 65 years. No matter the circumstances. The whole situation is insane.
And it is even more insane to jail him for the police shooting his friend.
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On April 11 2018 02:12 Tachion wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2018 01:26 Plansix wrote:https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/983739174506426368I’m not surprised by this at all. Given the instantaneous scrutiny that the raid would come under, it makes sense that the top members of the Justice Department would sign off personally. Removes any claim that the investigation went rogue or operated without authority. On a side note, it appears that Cohen had long term a hotel room and home in NYC. Because nothing says operating above board like a hotel room in the same city you live in. There was some controversy awhile back that Trump was interviewing people to appoint as Attorney for the Southern District of New York. Apparently the guy that Trump had appointed, Geoffrey Berman, has recused himself from the investigation into Michael Cohen. He donated money to Trump's campaign and had worked with Rudy Giuliani. He was in all likelihood there to act as a shield for Trump, and it backfired tremendously.
Trump's attempt to gain loyalty in that department seem to have backfired tremendously. It is almost fun to watch, but then I remember how much power he has and how useless the Speaker and Senate leader are.
On April 11 2018 02:16 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2018 01:31 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2018 01:25 Velr wrote:
I get it if they do that with 17 year olds but 15? Come on... How this is not another outrage in itself seems just crazy... That you can jail anyone for 65 years seems crazy. Most countries got limits on that (20-25 years or something like that) unless your deemed untreatable. It is Alabama. Not really a state known for its fair treatment of black suspects historically. Or treatment of blacks in general. Yeah, but this is not even about black people. I mean, it is, but this shouldn't be legal in general. You should simply not legally be able to jail a 15 year old for 65 years. No matter the circumstances. The whole situation is insane. And it is even more insane to jail him for the police shooting his friend.
I have no doubt that they would have been charged very differently if they were white men and a boy committing the same crimes. That kid would not have been tried as an adult.
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DJT's basic conflict is that the people that are loyal enough are almost certainly corrupted by the demands of his loyalty. Only someone who was close to Kislyak could be AG. Only someone who dealt with his mistresses could be his lawyer. Only someone he worked with could be the AG in NY. Only his son in law could talk to foreign powers on his behalf. He picks people who have demonstrated loyalty by participating in his corrupt/illegal behavior.
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So is it known why they raided Cohen's office? I don't really understand the link between the FBI and a pornstar payoff. NYT says they were looking for ''records of payment' to other women. But why is this the FBIs job?
Like he's a cheating lying scumbag but that is not exactly a crime. So is the money part why the FBI is there?
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money laundering/ campaign finance violations
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On April 11 2018 01:26 Plansix wrote:https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/983739174506426368I’m not surprised by this at all. Given the instantaneous scrutiny that the raid would come under, it makes sense that the top members of the Justice Department would sign off personally. Removes any claim that the investigation went rogue or operated without authority. On a side note, it appears that Cohen had long term a hotel room and home in NYC. Because nothing says operating above board like a hotel room in the same city you live in.
Or he has/d a mistress.
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On April 11 2018 03:03 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2018 01:26 Plansix wrote:https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/983739174506426368I’m not surprised by this at all. Given the instantaneous scrutiny that the raid would come under, it makes sense that the top members of the Justice Department would sign off personally. Removes any claim that the investigation went rogue or operated without authority. On a side note, it appears that Cohen had long term a hotel room and home in NYC. Because nothing says operating above board like a hotel room in the same city you live in. Or he has/d a mistress.
For any normal attorney, that would be my response. For this one, it could be anything.
On April 11 2018 02:42 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
So is it known why they raided Cohen's office? I don't really understand the link between the FBI and a pornstar payoff. NYT says they were looking for ''records of payment' to other women. But why is this the FBIs job?
Like he's a cheating lying scumbag but that is not exactly a crime. So is the money part why the FBI is there?
The payment could have violated a number of laws, since Trump claims he didn’t do it. It is a material assistance to a candidate that was not claimed as a contribution. But it also sounds like there are wire and bank fraud charges.
The deputy AG of the Justice department signed off on the raid. A judge signed off on it. Other members of the Justice department signed off on it. The FBI conducted the raid, as it is their jurisdiction. But there is no way Rosenstein approves a raid on the President’s personal attorney without overwhelming evidence. Like a basket of smoking guns.
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If your justice system is SOOOO open to discrimination, you better scrap it. Justicia is blind for a reason... But well, you still got lynch mobs (juries)...
Baseline is, in court justice should win, not the law or another strange concept.
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EPT
