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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread |
On January 27 2026 23:38 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2026 23:27 Jankisa wrote:=
Ayn Rand is the most important novelist of the 20th century in the same way that Mein Kampf is one of the most important books, but I do understand that to someone of the intellectual depth of Jimmy here her drivel might be the most important things he ever read, assuming he read a book in his life, which, given his overall personality is very unlikely. I have Aldous Huxley at #2. Given the myopia epidemic sweeping NA people would do well to read his book "The Art of Seeing". I love it when people wearing a -4 prescription tell me this book is useless.  So , ya, sorry dawg... i've read a few books. you are incorrect. Show nested quote +On January 27 2026 23:31 Billyboy wrote:
Lots, and you make no sense, so there is no point responding to you.
your generalizations about how libertarians view trump and his policies are incorrect. i explained how and why. you are correct though in that there is no need to respond. you don't know much, if anything at all, about what libertarians think.
How they should view Trump based on their supposed beliefs. The self declared libertarians who don’t understand it but think it sounds cool are pro Trump.
And you have not explained anything to anyone. Do you not read peoples response to you? Your posts read as nonsense, with strange rarely related culture references.
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the NPR article is there. check it out. your generalization is incorrect.
On January 27 2026 23:48 Billyboy wrote:The self declared libertarians who don’t understand it but think it sounds cool are pro Trump.
you're the final arbiter on who is and is not a libertarian? ok dawg. in order to count one must define zero/0 and one must define 1. you can't do either. so if you can't count, even to 1, you can't generate any stats on "fake libertarians".
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Jimmy getting spicy when you're closing in on his Randian politics, I like it.
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On January 27 2026 21:28 hexhaven wrote:Speaking of Olympic levels!Show nested quote +The sources who confirmed ICE participation on Tuesday said that federal ICE agents would support diplomatic security details and would not run any immigration enforcement operations. The article does mention that several agencies, including departments of ICE, have supported diplomatic security details in the past, so this is not unprecedented. Just the timing is such that I'd probably adjust things around.
Just like Jews and Christians go to Jerusalem to tour the holy sites, ICE is going to Italy for a tour of the birthplace of their ideology.
Also, I'll say Ayn Rand being an important novelist is true. The fact that she spent her entire life calling welfare recipients parasites and then went on to receive social security benefits despite being an immigrant is an important testimony to the fact that libertarians are hypocritical idiots. She used Medicare to pay for lung surgery she needed because she was a smoker, shortly after campaigning for Barry Goldwater who spoke about abolishing Medicare because it was immoral.
Libertarians are like house cats, fiercely convinced of their own independence despite relying on a system they neither appreciate nor understand.
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You say libertarian, I say gaslighting opportunism. Potato tomaco.
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Jimmy is just doing the same shit he always does where he has a narrative or predetermined conclusion and tries to find random videos or articles to use as an appeal to authority because he knows no one will read an inaccessible journal article or watch a 30 minute video.
Like that NPR article he linked? It is literally just an interview transcript. There’s no rigorous proof of anything, just people spouting opinion and mulling over why third parties got less support this time round.
Which was directly discussed in like the next paragraph below the quote he referenced, Fowler said this in response to the decline in third party votes:
FOWLER: Well, none of this is actually surprising when you look under the hood at how Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and the Libertarian Party apparatus both shifted to support Trump and oppose Democrats the closer we got to the election. At the Libertarian Party convention this summer, both RFK and Trump spoke. They tried to court the party's endorsement and favor. The party instead nominated Chase Oliver, a gay anti-war activist more on the progressive end of the libertarian spectrum. When I talked to Oliver earlier this month, he said Kennedy's decision to leave the race also took a lot of interest in third-party candidates along with him. Plus, he had to deal with his own party's politics that took a hard right turn towards Trump
Basically the more nuanced argument actually being made is that Trump and Kennedy courted the Libertarian Party base, Kennedy dragged the base with him when he dropped out, and said base took a hard swing right that would make them far more amenable towards supporting the current Republican Party than they historically would be.
Maybe Libertarians technically did hold their noses to vote Trump but I don’t think his linked article really disagrees with what the people arguing with Jimmy are saying?
Again, it’s not like his article actually proves anything either way because it’s just people spouting opinion in an interview and not like some more rigorous article published by Cook Political Report or some pollster.
I don’t have a horse in this race but he does this shit all the time and is incredibly annoying to read because you can’t actually assume he’s actually read or watched whatever source he’s using to bludgeon you with.
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On January 27 2026 11:15 Mohdoo wrote:
I think Trump is hoping that giving Walz an easy off-ramp will be warmly accepted and quickly utilized. And he’s probably right.
Protests are only an actual problem for fascists when Joe Shmoe is pissed off enough to join in. All he needs to do is throw a bone to get the centrists to go back to being cowards and ICE can continue with a new leader.
Probably. Homan is the type of "competent" fascist that most people are concerned about though.
He's basically planning to break his own records on deportations and depravity from the Obama administration.
He was a relatively low-key but influential figure on immigration enforcement in the Obama administration, heading ICE’s Enforcement and Removal Operations arm
Under Obama, the U.S. carried out 432,000 deportations in 2013, the highest annual total since records were kept. Deportations under the first Trump administration never topped 350,000.
Homan, who is widely associated with immigration enforcement actions that separated families, was given a Presidential Rank Award by the Obama administration to tout his efficacy in 2015.
apnews.com
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On January 27 2026 12:49 Sermokala wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2026 11:15 Mohdoo wrote:
I think Trump is hoping that giving Walz an easy off-ramp will be warmly accepted and quickly utilized. And he’s probably right.
Protests are only an actual problem for fascists when Joe Shmoe is pissed off enough to join in. All he needs to do is throw a bone to get the centrists to go back to being cowards and ICE can continue with a new leader. We are allowed to have victories. Take wins where we can get them. ICE has become toxic and poison for everyone. The lines have moved forward and we have done more than we should be expected to do.
Its not like the wins are risked by remaining firm. What you are describing is the cold feet/anxiety people feel when they are surprised by things going well and they think they were lucky and don't want to push their luck.That is not the case here. The reason the confederates regained power in the country is because they pushed every win they've ever gotten and never considered relinquishing gains.
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"Every social theory undergirding Trumpism has been broken on the steel of Minnesotan resolve. The multiracial community in Minneapolis was supposed to shatter. It did not. It held until Bovino was forced out of the Twin Cities with his long coat between his legs.
The secret fear of the morally depraved is that virtue is actually common, and that they’re the ones who are alone. In Minnesota, all of the ideological cornerstones of MAGA have been proved false at once. Minnesotans, not the armed thugs of ICE and the Border Patrol, are brave. Minnesotans have shown that their community is socially cohesive—because of its diversity and not in spite of it. Minnesotans have found and loved one another in a world atomized by social media, where empty men have tried to fill their lonely soul with lies about their own inherent superiority."
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/2026/01/the-neighbors-defending-minnesota-from-ice/685769/
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On January 27 2026 23:26 KwarK wrote:
Not sure if you mean Chairman Mao’s Little Rand Book or JK Randing. Could be John Rand Rand Tolkien too.
All wrong. It's clearly Rand Orwell.
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I'm wondering, and genuinely curious, how were you guys feeling about Obama's deportations?
For me, as an outsider, I was both pretty young and not as interested in politics back then so this deporter in chief is something that I begun to see in the 2024 campaign and discussions on immigration policies and I was surprised, then, as I educated myself a bit on this I started realizing how weird US immigration system is, with different tiers and statuses and everything got even more confusing, like many other things in the USA, it's a unique and weird system.
In every other country, and I hope people will correct me if I'm wrong, it's impossible to be employed as an illegal immigrant, Croatia, as an example has huge fines for businesses who don't register their workers properly and hiring people who don't have work visas is, to my knowledge unheard of. I believe this is the case in most, if not all EU countries.
Since that is the case, for me, having a well organized, not cruel or aggressive but still firm policy that people who didn't go through the proper process of immigration should be removed form the country, with, of course, ability to, if jumped through proper hoops and with good enough reasons to appeal their case and stay.
From outside looking in, the system in the USA, set up as it is, is there because it helps Republicans, they have people they can scare monger about, they don't go after businesses who hire them and they can terrorize blue cities.
With that being said, isn't it in everyone's interest to make sure that there is as low number as imaginable of actual unregistered immigrants?
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On January 28 2026 01:58 Jankisa wrote:
I'm wondering, and genuinely curious, how were you guys feeling about Obama's deportations?
For me, as an outsider, I was both pretty young and not as interested in politics back then so this deporter in chief is something that I begun to see in the 2024 campaign and discussions on immigration policies and I was surprised, then, as I educated myself a bit on this I started realizing how weird US immigration system is, with different tiers and statuses and everything got even more confusing, like many other things in the USA, it's a unique and weird system.
In every other country, and I hope people will correct me if I'm wrong, it's impossible to be employed as an illegal immigrant, Croatia, as an example has huge fines for businesses who don't register their workers properly and hiring people who don't have work visas is, to my knowledge unheard of. I believe this is the case in most, if not all EU countries.
Since that is the case, for me, having a well organized, not cruel or aggressive but still firm policy that people who didn't go through the proper process of immigration should be removed form the country, with, of course, ability to, if jumped through proper hoops and with good enough reasons to appeal their case and stay.
From outside looking in, the system in the USA, set up as it is, is there because it helps Republicans, they have people they can scare monger about, they don't go after businesses who hire them and they can terrorize blue cities.
With that being said, isn't it in everyone's interest to make sure that there is as low number as imaginable of actual unregistered immigrants?
Deportations are not the issue, and no one here has said that they are.
We didn't have gangs of unidentified masked thugs dragging children out of homes while executing members of the public in cold blood under Obama.
The # of deported citizens isn't the issue. its the manner in which they are conducted.
As so often with Republican policy, the cruelty is the point.
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On January 28 2026 01:58 Jankisa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I'm wondering, and genuinely curious, how were you guys feeling about Obama's deportations?
For me, as an outsider, I was both pretty young and not as interested in politics back then so this deporter in chief is something that I begun to see in the 2024 campaign and discussions on immigration policies and I was surprised, then, as I educated myself a bit on this I started realizing how weird US immigration system is, with different tiers and statuses and everything got even more confusing, like many other things in the USA, it's a unique and weird system.
In every other country, and I hope people will correct me if I'm wrong, it's impossible to be employed as an illegal immigrant, Croatia, as an example has huge fines for businesses who don't register their workers properly and hiring people who don't have work visas is, to my knowledge unheard of. I believe this is the case in most, if not all EU countries.
Since that is the case, for me, having a well organized, not cruel or aggressive but still firm policy that people who didn't go through the proper process of immigration should be removed form the country, with, of course, ability to, if jumped through proper hoops and with good enough reasons to appeal their case and stay.
From outside looking in, the system in the USA, set up as it is, is there because it helps Republicans, they have people they can scare monger about, they don't go after businesses who hire them and they can terrorize blue cities. With that being said, isn't it in everyone's interest to make sure that there is as low number as imaginable of actual unregistered immigrants?
Going to recommend "This Nonviolent Stuff’ll Get You Killed" by Charles E. Cobb again, but there's a remarkable amount of overlap with the US navigating attempting to end chattel slavery so there's plenty of good stuff out there. I'd also recommend "Black Reconstruction in America" by W. E. B. Du Bois for a better understanding of how we got here.
To grossly oversimplify, the US wants/needs the inexpensive labor, but can't afford to/fears giving them rights/citizenship
Joe Biden had a pretty notable 2020 campaign moment that showed how Democrats also use Republicans to rationalize their own role in oppressing immigrants.
I was shocked to hear the 2020 Democratic front-runner tell me to my face to vote for Trump, simply because I pressed him on a question about basic dignity for immigrants
https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/biden-south-carolina-immigration/
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On January 28 2026 02:17 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2026 01:58 Jankisa wrote:
I'm wondering, and genuinely curious, how were you guys feeling about Obama's deportations?
For me, as an outsider, I was both pretty young and not as interested in politics back then so this deporter in chief is something that I begun to see in the 2024 campaign and discussions on immigration policies and I was surprised, then, as I educated myself a bit on this I started realizing how weird US immigration system is, with different tiers and statuses and everything got even more confusing, like many other things in the USA, it's a unique and weird system.
In every other country, and I hope people will correct me if I'm wrong, it's impossible to be employed as an illegal immigrant, Croatia, as an example has huge fines for businesses who don't register their workers properly and hiring people who don't have work visas is, to my knowledge unheard of. I believe this is the case in most, if not all EU countries.
Since that is the case, for me, having a well organized, not cruel or aggressive but still firm policy that people who didn't go through the proper process of immigration should be removed form the country, with, of course, ability to, if jumped through proper hoops and with good enough reasons to appeal their case and stay.
From outside looking in, the system in the USA, set up as it is, is there because it helps Republicans, they have people they can scare monger about, they don't go after businesses who hire them and they can terrorize blue cities.
With that being said, isn't it in everyone's interest to make sure that there is as low number as imaginable of actual unregistered immigrants?
Deportations are not the issue, and no one here has said that they are. We didn't have gangs of unidentified masked thugs dragging children out of homes while executing members of the public in cold blood under Obama. The # of deported citizens isn't the issue. its the manner in which they are conducted. As so often with Republican policy, the cruelty is the point.
In any given year under Obama about a quarter of deportations were of people with US citizen children.
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Tech billionaire from the US buys TikTok from the Chinse.
Instant increase in political censorship lmao.
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On January 28 2026 02:34 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote:
Tech billionaire from the US buys TikTok from the Chinse.
Instant increase in political censorship lmao.
Thank god we're teaching those commies about real freedom.
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On January 28 2026 02:25 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2026 02:17 Gorsameth wrote:On January 28 2026 01:58 Jankisa wrote:
I'm wondering, and genuinely curious, how were you guys feeling about Obama's deportations?
For me, as an outsider, I was both pretty young and not as interested in politics back then so this deporter in chief is something that I begun to see in the 2024 campaign and discussions on immigration policies and I was surprised, then, as I educated myself a bit on this I started realizing how weird US immigration system is, with different tiers and statuses and everything got even more confusing, like many other things in the USA, it's a unique and weird system.
In every other country, and I hope people will correct me if I'm wrong, it's impossible to be employed as an illegal immigrant, Croatia, as an example has huge fines for businesses who don't register their workers properly and hiring people who don't have work visas is, to my knowledge unheard of. I believe this is the case in most, if not all EU countries.
Since that is the case, for me, having a well organized, not cruel or aggressive but still firm policy that people who didn't go through the proper process of immigration should be removed form the country, with, of course, ability to, if jumped through proper hoops and with good enough reasons to appeal their case and stay.
From outside looking in, the system in the USA, set up as it is, is there because it helps Republicans, they have people they can scare monger about, they don't go after businesses who hire them and they can terrorize blue cities.
With that being said, isn't it in everyone's interest to make sure that there is as low number as imaginable of actual unregistered immigrants?
Deportations are not the issue, and no one here has said that they are. We didn't have gangs of unidentified masked thugs dragging children out of homes while executing members of the public in cold blood under Obama. The # of deported citizens isn't the issue. its the manner in which they are conducted. As so often with Republican policy, the cruelty is the point. In any given year under Obama about a quarter of deportations were of people with US citizen children.
And there was no outrage, at least no big one, so what exactly is your issue? Why is doing what Trump does necessary?
Aside from looking stronk for the idiots of your ilk.
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On January 28 2026 02:25 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2026 02:17 Gorsameth wrote:On January 28 2026 01:58 Jankisa wrote:
I'm wondering, and genuinely curious, how were you guys feeling about Obama's deportations?
For me, as an outsider, I was both pretty young and not as interested in politics back then so this deporter in chief is something that I begun to see in the 2024 campaign and discussions on immigration policies and I was surprised, then, as I educated myself a bit on this I started realizing how weird US immigration system is, with different tiers and statuses and everything got even more confusing, like many other things in the USA, it's a unique and weird system.
In every other country, and I hope people will correct me if I'm wrong, it's impossible to be employed as an illegal immigrant, Croatia, as an example has huge fines for businesses who don't register their workers properly and hiring people who don't have work visas is, to my knowledge unheard of. I believe this is the case in most, if not all EU countries.
Since that is the case, for me, having a well organized, not cruel or aggressive but still firm policy that people who didn't go through the proper process of immigration should be removed form the country, with, of course, ability to, if jumped through proper hoops and with good enough reasons to appeal their case and stay.
From outside looking in, the system in the USA, set up as it is, is there because it helps Republicans, they have people they can scare monger about, they don't go after businesses who hire them and they can terrorize blue cities.
With that being said, isn't it in everyone's interest to make sure that there is as low number as imaginable of actual unregistered immigrants?
Deportations are not the issue, and no one here has said that they are. We didn't have gangs of unidentified masked thugs dragging children out of homes while executing members of the public in cold blood under Obama. The # of deported citizens isn't the issue. its the manner in which they are conducted. As so often with Republican policy, the cruelty is the point. In any given year under Obama about a quarter of deportations were of people with US citizen children.
Main differences seem to be the detention policy and the focus on collateral arrests. While ICE had the authority to go out and detain immigrants, it made up, at most, a minor part of deportations. Furthermore, its detention policy focused on "dangerous criminals" and they weren't allowed to arrest other people they encountered when going to find said "dangerous criminals".
Clearly whatever ICE is doing now is more damaging to the social fabric of communities and thus leading to greater resistance. Which ICE has dealt with in the same way any authoritarian organization deals with resistance: violence and terror. Which obviously begs the question whether the point was deportation of "dangerous criminals", which Obama's policy achieved with relative peace and quiet, or whether the real point was violence and terror to political opposition. Judged by it's outcomes I can only conclude it's the latter.
E: forgot the source for the difference in policies: https://www.voanews.com/a/comparing-immigration-raids-under-trump-and-obama/3727706.html
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On January 27 2026 14:52 oBlade wrote:
Apparently Maple Grove police, a suburb of Minneapolis, declared an unlawful assembly in front of the Springhill by Marriott (which is a different hotel than the one broken last night). This is after Walz and Trump's call obviously but it's not clear if there's any connection between the willingness of police to come out tonight vs. last night, whether each local police are that different in their policies now, or it's unknown to me whether Maple Grove police have any particular partisan slant to begin with.
In the video you can see reflective material, I don't think these are the same as the vests the National Guard are supposed to be wearing. Seems like it's just their uniform/night gear. But certainly reminiscent of what the NG were wearing after the governor sent NG at the request of mayor Frey.
It does look like Walz allowed state patrol units to intervene. KSTP/Channel 5 Minneapolis. This could be a new tack from Walz in letting state resources control crowds, conduct arrests, and break up protests that violate the law. More video.
It's amazing to see videos with sufficient police presence to keep the crowd back and conduct arrests when protesters break the law.
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EPT
