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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
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Benjamin might be shipping in the special blend of Colombian nose candy Trump needs to stay strong during these trying times.
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On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 03:42 Jockmcplop wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:On April 07 2025 02:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Wtf is LibHorizon? GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. I'll be honest I like GH and he makes interesting posts but i stopped reading them altogether when this started. GH: Please stop. + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. On April 07 2025 06:00 Zambrah wrote:
Honestly making wank material probably brings 10x as much joy into people's lives as the average TL'ers job does. If 5% of the population was doing porn then it sounds like there are a lot of horny people who are getting to enjoy their horny whims.
I dont see how OF is any worse or more coercive a career than any other job under capitalism, like if you're literally being coerced into doing an OF by a significant other, or a family member or something thats obviously horrible, but thats also just true of being coerced into doing anything else. This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:22 Sermokala wrote:On April 07 2025 04:02 Biff The Understudy wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:On April 07 2025 02:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Wtf is LibHorizon? GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. That’s a bit intense lol. Its a lot werider when you find out that the only real difference in his posting is that these personas are, in his opinion, okay with genocide. That he presents them as the morally superior version of the other posters of the thread is unsurprisingly on brand for him. LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide. Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. ' The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't. Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem.
+ Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide.
People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing.
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On April 07 2025 23:41 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 03:42 Jockmcplop wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:On April 07 2025 02:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Wtf is LibHorizon? GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. I'll be honest I like GH and he makes interesting posts but i stopped reading them altogether when this started. GH: Please stop. + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. On April 07 2025 06:00 Zambrah wrote:
Honestly making wank material probably brings 10x as much joy into people's lives as the average TL'ers job does. If 5% of the population was doing porn then it sounds like there are a lot of horny people who are getting to enjoy their horny whims.
I dont see how OF is any worse or more coercive a career than any other job under capitalism, like if you're literally being coerced into doing an OF by a significant other, or a family member or something thats obviously horrible, but thats also just true of being coerced into doing anything else. This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:22 Sermokala wrote:On April 07 2025 04:02 Biff The Understudy wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:On April 07 2025 02:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Wtf is LibHorizon? GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. That’s a bit intense lol. Its a lot werider when you find out that the only real difference in his posting is that these personas are, in his opinion, okay with genocide. That he presents them as the morally superior version of the other posters of the thread is unsurprisingly on brand for him. LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide. Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. ' The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't. Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem. + Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide. People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing.
Why is it "gawking" and "stupid" to point out that Trump's tariffs are destroying both national and international economies?
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You are the equivalent of a guy walking into a bar where everyone is talking about serious and non-serious things about the US and then scream: why aren't you all talking about this thing that I want you to talk about!
Meanwhile we all just look up and go right back to talking, after all, you've done this a few times already. Sometimes you go extra hard and walk by every table to preach a little bit.
You can always sit at the table and talk with us, it's kinda fun. It can sometimes get heated. I'm sometimes (almost always) making a fool out of myself.
But if you're not interested and just want to open the door of the bar and scream about the Hamster Wheel once again, it's not tue call to deep reflexive thought you sometimes think it seems to be.
You're an activist in a den of armchair time killers. I'm fine reading your stuff, I'm fine engaging with you, but I feel you'll just remain more frustrated at the end of the day simply because "we're not seeing the simplest of truth, like come on it's so obvious".
I wish you'd not be so serious on a gaming forum literally all the time. 95%, sure, but come on man, I don't think I've ever seen you smile.
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On April 07 2025 23:25 Sermokala wrote:
Does GH think LH's material support for genocide constitutes a deal-breaker for working with him? If GH thinks that Liberals like LH materially support genocide why does he not have an issue with working with them? I personally would have an issue with working with someone whos values conflict with my own value of genocide being bad but is this not as much of an issue to GH? If Material support for genocide isn't a deal breaker then why didn't GH vote for Kamala Harris and help her win the election?
We were told repeatedly that genocide was a red line before the election but now after the election it doesn't seem like one for the GH types. I wonder why.
GH: I consider it something they did (or may be doing). I also regularly work with people convicted of various crimes, some very heinous. I'm an abolitionist.
I didn't vote for Harris because it would make me materially complicit in genocide without actually helping Harris win. I did however spend a fair amount of effort trying to help Harris win. I suggested not going against her voters preferences and still assuring them she would continue to aid and abet genocide against their wishes. She chose otherwise and lost.
On April 07 2025 23:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2025 23:41 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 03:42 Jockmcplop wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:On April 07 2025 02:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Wtf is LibHorizon? GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. I'll be honest I like GH and he makes interesting posts but i stopped reading them altogether when this started. GH: Please stop. + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. On April 07 2025 06:00 Zambrah wrote:
Honestly making wank material probably brings 10x as much joy into people's lives as the average TL'ers job does. If 5% of the population was doing porn then it sounds like there are a lot of horny people who are getting to enjoy their horny whims.
I dont see how OF is any worse or more coercive a career than any other job under capitalism, like if you're literally being coerced into doing an OF by a significant other, or a family member or something thats obviously horrible, but thats also just true of being coerced into doing anything else. This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:22 Sermokala wrote:On April 07 2025 04:02 Biff The Understudy wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:On April 07 2025 02:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Wtf is LibHorizon? GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. That’s a bit intense lol. Its a lot werider when you find out that the only real difference in his posting is that these personas are, in his opinion, okay with genocide. That he presents them as the morally superior version of the other posters of the thread is unsurprisingly on brand for him. LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide. Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. ' The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't. Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem. + Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide. People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing. Why is it "gawking" and "stupid" to point out that Trump's tariffs are destroying both national and internal economies?
+ Show Spoiler + The gawking feels self-explanatory. Lately you've been just posting some awful/stupid thing Trump is doing and gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking.
One thing that's stupid about that behavior is it is complemented by the ubiquitous/your steadfast refusal to engage seriously with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it.
EDIT: Right on cue Jimmy is here to lead you all into another bad faith distraction like Micro has been trying to resolve for several posts now.
Let's see if you all can resist the temptation.
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The Dow is all over the place today.
I have neighbours who pay $10,000+ a year in car insurance whining about the stock market. LOL. These neighbours make fun of my 6 year old Toyota Corolla. I wonder if they're making fun of the top notch piece of engineering I own now?
I figure this is how my neighbours view me and my car.
On April 07 2025 22:55 KwarK wrote:
You may not like that the electoral system takes a host of issues off of the ballot and reduces it to a series of fairly binary choices that don't address your specific concerns but whether or not you like it, that's what it does. Voting for the puppies to live cannot be seen as a vote for keeping the bases open because base closures were never on the table.
The question is.. what can an individual person do about this?
Nation builders like Pierre Trudeau and Brian Mulroney offered up an alternative solution to this. In Canada, being a "World Citizen" is a revered accomplishment primarily due to the influences of guys like Pierre Trudeau and Mulroney on Nationalism's proper place in a citizen's thought process.
Get your skills up and be capable of working in multiple countries. Then, select from several imperfect places to live.
Lots of migration in and out of Texas.
https://www.fox4news.com/news/californians-moving-to-texas-2023
They are voting with their feet. They are prolly moving to a better job.
Again, though all one can do is select between a series of imperfect places. No one will make the world right for you... there will always be BS with which to deal.
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On April 07 2025 23:59 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2025 23:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:41 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 03:42 Jockmcplop wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:On April 07 2025 02:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Wtf is LibHorizon? GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. I'll be honest I like GH and he makes interesting posts but i stopped reading them altogether when this started. GH: Please stop. + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. On April 07 2025 06:00 Zambrah wrote:
Honestly making wank material probably brings 10x as much joy into people's lives as the average TL'ers job does. If 5% of the population was doing porn then it sounds like there are a lot of horny people who are getting to enjoy their horny whims.
I dont see how OF is any worse or more coercive a career than any other job under capitalism, like if you're literally being coerced into doing an OF by a significant other, or a family member or something thats obviously horrible, but thats also just true of being coerced into doing anything else. This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:22 Sermokala wrote:On April 07 2025 04:02 Biff The Understudy wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:
[quote]
GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. That’s a bit intense lol. Its a lot werider when you find out that the only real difference in his posting is that these personas are, in his opinion, okay with genocide. That he presents them as the morally superior version of the other posters of the thread is unsurprisingly on brand for him. LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide. Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. ' The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't. Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem. + Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide. People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing. Why is it "gawking" and "stupid" to point out that Trump's tariffs are destroying both national and internal economies? + Show Spoiler + The gawking feels self-explanatory. Lately you've been just posting some awful/stupid thing Trump is doing and gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking. One thing that's stupid about that behavior is it is complemented by the ubiquitous/your steadfast refusal to engage seriously with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it.
Posting stupid things that Donald Trump is doing is appropriate for this thread, given that he is a U.S. politician. But it's good to know that I should take your flippant remarks as seriously as everyone else takes your remarks.
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United States42973 Posts
On April 08 2025 00:00 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
The question is.. what can an individual person do about this?
An average individual, nothing. And it'd be impossible for average individuals to shape policy because there are millions of them and they don't agree on what the policy should be.
A group of motivated individuals can primary challenge the party closest to their stances to move it.
Though a random guy who happens to be in a room with Trump can have him sign an executive order without him reading it.
What a world.
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Just having a voice of disapproval helps with changing things imo. As long as it‘s the intention.
If you just keep voicing your disapproval about immutable things, it‘s for show, or someone satisfying their inner arsehole for catharsis or something.
If enough people protest what he‘s doing, he might feel compelled to make better decisions.
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On April 08 2025 00:10 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2025 23:59 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 23:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:41 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 03:42 Jockmcplop wrote:On April 07 2025 02:31 Simberto wrote:
[quote]
GH has for some reason started to roleplay about 3-4 different personas. I'll be honest I like GH and he makes interesting posts but i stopped reading them altogether when this started. GH: Please stop. + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. On April 07 2025 06:00 Zambrah wrote:
Honestly making wank material probably brings 10x as much joy into people's lives as the average TL'ers job does. If 5% of the population was doing porn then it sounds like there are a lot of horny people who are getting to enjoy their horny whims.
I dont see how OF is any worse or more coercive a career than any other job under capitalism, like if you're literally being coerced into doing an OF by a significant other, or a family member or something thats obviously horrible, but thats also just true of being coerced into doing anything else. This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:22 Sermokala wrote:On April 07 2025 04:02 Biff The Understudy wrote:
[quote]
That’s a bit intense lol. Its a lot werider when you find out that the only real difference in his posting is that these personas are, in his opinion, okay with genocide. That he presents them as the morally superior version of the other posters of the thread is unsurprisingly on brand for him. LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide. Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. ' The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't. Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem. + Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide. People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing. Why is it "gawking" and "stupid" to point out that Trump's tariffs are destroying both national and internal economies? + Show Spoiler + The gawking feels self-explanatory. Lately you've been just posting some awful/stupid thing Trump is doing and gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking. One thing that's stupid about that behavior is it is complemented by the ubiquitous/your steadfast refusal to engage seriously with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it. Posting stupid things that Donald Trump is doing is appropriate for this thread, given that he is a U.S. politician. But it's good to know that I should take your flippant remarks as seriously as everyone else takes your remarks.
It's clearly not the posting of the stupid things Trump does I find problematic. It's the gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking, while steadfastly refusing to seriously engage with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it that I find demonstrative of why Democrats continuously lose, even when they win the elections.
I know everyone thinks it is easier/better to shoot the messenger/distract themselves by having bad faith discussions with the Jimmy and oBlade types, but I'm making this argument from a functional perspective, not a moral or personal animosities perspective.
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United States42973 Posts
I'm glad we have GH's pretend posters here to keep us from engaging in bad faith discussions with troll types.
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Problem is GH, you've become so preachy that you can't even get down to normal level discussion. I'm not saying that you have to, but people neither have to take your divine messages of a higher calling seriously.
Like, what does a GH that's relaxed and content with things even look like?
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Northern Ireland25665 Posts
On April 08 2025 00:23 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2025 00:10 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:59 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 23:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:41 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 03:42 Jockmcplop wrote:
[quote]
I'll be honest I like GH and he makes interesting posts but i stopped reading them altogether when this started.
GH: Please stop. + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. On April 07 2025 06:00 Zambrah wrote:
Honestly making wank material probably brings 10x as much joy into people's lives as the average TL'ers job does. If 5% of the population was doing porn then it sounds like there are a lot of horny people who are getting to enjoy their horny whims.
I dont see how OF is any worse or more coercive a career than any other job under capitalism, like if you're literally being coerced into doing an OF by a significant other, or a family member or something thats obviously horrible, but thats also just true of being coerced into doing anything else. This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:22 Sermokala wrote:
[quote]
Its a lot werider when you find out that the only real difference in his posting is that these personas are, in his opinion, okay with genocide. That he presents them as the morally superior version of the other posters of the thread is unsurprisingly on brand for him. LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide. Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. ' The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't. Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem. + Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide. People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing. Why is it "gawking" and "stupid" to point out that Trump's tariffs are destroying both national and internal economies? + Show Spoiler + The gawking feels self-explanatory. Lately you've been just posting some awful/stupid thing Trump is doing and gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking. One thing that's stupid about that behavior is it is complemented by the ubiquitous/your steadfast refusal to engage seriously with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it. Posting stupid things that Donald Trump is doing is appropriate for this thread, given that he is a U.S. politician. But it's good to know that I should take your flippant remarks as seriously as everyone else takes your remarks. It's clearly not the posting of the stupid things Trump does I find problematic. It's the gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking, while steadfastly refusing to seriously engage with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it that I find demonstrative of why Democrats continuously lose, even when they win the elections. I know everyone thinks it is easier/better to shoot the messenger/distract themselves by having bad faith discussions with the Jimmy and oBlade types, but I'm making this argument from a functional perspective, not a moral or personal animosities perspective.
It’s less shooting the messenger, and more opening the court doors, receiving the messenger, reading the message and letting them depart safely while considering said message, only for the messenger to continually return and interrupt everyone at 5 minute intervals for the rest of time.
Some times I just couldn’t be fucking arsed with certain topics. Others, something else might take my fancy. Sometimes I might even learn a thing or two that I didn’t prior from a good-faith response to even a bad faith post.
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On April 08 2025 00:00 JimmyJRaynor wrote:The question is.. what can an individual person do about this?
Keep voting for CONservatives. ;-)
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Now that's a D slogan for 2028
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On April 08 2025 00:23 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2025 00:10 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:59 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 23:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:41 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 03:42 Jockmcplop wrote:
[quote]
I'll be honest I like GH and he makes interesting posts but i stopped reading them altogether when this started.
GH: Please stop. + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. On April 07 2025 06:00 Zambrah wrote:
Honestly making wank material probably brings 10x as much joy into people's lives as the average TL'ers job does. If 5% of the population was doing porn then it sounds like there are a lot of horny people who are getting to enjoy their horny whims.
I dont see how OF is any worse or more coercive a career than any other job under capitalism, like if you're literally being coerced into doing an OF by a significant other, or a family member or something thats obviously horrible, but thats also just true of being coerced into doing anything else. This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:22 Sermokala wrote:
[quote]
Its a lot werider when you find out that the only real difference in his posting is that these personas are, in his opinion, okay with genocide. That he presents them as the morally superior version of the other posters of the thread is unsurprisingly on brand for him. LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide. Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. ' The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't. Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem. + Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide. People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing. Why is it "gawking" and "stupid" to point out that Trump's tariffs are destroying both national and internal economies? + Show Spoiler + The gawking feels self-explanatory. Lately you've been just posting some awful/stupid thing Trump is doing and gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking. One thing that's stupid about that behavior is it is complemented by the ubiquitous/your steadfast refusal to engage seriously with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it. Posting stupid things that Donald Trump is doing is appropriate for this thread, given that he is a U.S. politician. But it's good to know that I should take your flippant remarks as seriously as everyone else takes your remarks. It's clearly not the posting of the stupid things Trump does I find problematic. It's the gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking, while steadfastly refusing to seriously engage with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it that I find demonstrative of why Democrats continuously lose, even when they win the elections. I know everyone thinks it is easier/better to shoot the messenger/distract themselves by having bad faith discussions with the Jimmy and oBlade types, but I'm making this argument from a functional perspective, not a moral or personal animosities perspective.
All I'm going to say is that while Jimmy and oBlade are indeed making themselves pariahs in this thread, so are you, and the enmity you experience from others isn't because they simply can't handle your ingenuity, or your ability to speak hard truths, or your "functional perspective" lol. Best of luck though.
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Vote R for recession.
Edit: If democrats want to win they need a couple of Ben Shapiro like media persons who starts "asking questions".
Don't go after Trump (because republicans rally around dear leader) but just keep on insinuating that the people in his orbit and administration are stealing money. Take the numbers DOGE (or even better, republican "sources" commenting about DOGE) throw out and run with it.
"DOGE cut 12 trillion dollars. Why do we still have a deficit? Where did that money got transferred to? Have anyone checked Elon Musks off-shore bank accounts?"
Where does the money from tariffs go? How much money did Pam Bondi get for the pardons? Who shorted all those stocks in the WH just before the tariffs?
Just hammer it in. Run with "Take it back!" (officially democracy, unofficially all the money of course). Have your pundits claim that Musk stole 60bn dollars or whatever.
Do NOT go with tax the rich. You will just turn every billionaire against you. Go after the ones directly interfering with you.
When you win, THEN tax the rich and claim that you took it back.
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On April 08 2025 00:53 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2025 00:23 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 08 2025 00:10 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:59 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 23:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 07 2025 23:41 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 22:49 Uldridge wrote:On April 07 2025 22:46 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 07 2025 21:58 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:[quote] + Show Spoiler +That's actually funnier than you realize. As several people have pointed out, LibHorizons posting isn't really that different from mine, other than the most important aspect of what I and most of the rest of the posters disagree on. LibHorizons is expressly and sincerely trying to map out and engage in the best plan forward electorally through the Democratic party as a progressive that voted for Hillary, Biden, and Harris. Turns out no one is actually interested in doing that here (regardless of whether they do it with me/Libhorizons or not). Having LibHorizons be the primary/only poster trying to win the next elections with the Democratic party makes them and their mean girl liberalism look ridiculous and shallow. Perhaps that's your point though? You don't like me giving any credence to the idea there's a path out of this electorally for Democrats, even if Lib/ThirdHorizons are the only ones here posting as if there is and they want to pursue it? All of our time is obviously much better spent on discussing the NYC Mayoral race, the latest constitutional crisis, a plan to move forward electorally, sorry, *checks notes* the rate of OF workers among Gen Z. [quote] This is bog-standard social democrat/democratic socialist analysis basically no one except the right wingers that are driving this discussion should disagree with. That being said, it's still acutely more insightful than most posting on the subject thus far. In the absence of a general politics and society thread, and as USPol is by far the most active of the politics thread, people are gonna talk about more general political or social issues here. I engaged on your NYC Mayoral race, there looks positive momentum, hopefully it builds further. It’s also months out, at this stage there’s plenty of room for further movement. What I assume is the groundwork is being done and the positive aspirational stuff, when we get closer in, the attacks on Cuomo in addition will surely follow. What happens then shall be more instructive. His behaviour should be disqualifying in the first place, I think most would agree here. But will that hold in a tight race, versus a procession? That’s the interesting, and illustrative question to me but we’re far from getting the answer to it. We know the Dems are liable to go with the usual suspects generally, it’s the handicap the left have to deal with in trying to punch through. The question now to me is can they punch through, and if so, will the party and its benefactors bend at all? If no to the latter, well folks of my leanings are kind of fucked as two Trump victories haven’t taught them jack shit. The second component of course being the electorate itself. Money and sleaze go a hell of a long way, but if the body politic would still rather go with the neoliberal sex offender, that’s what they’re gonna do. + Show Spoiler +: It's too bad most AI sucks or we could have it analyze the ~400 pages since the election and give us a fair assessment of the ratios, but I'm pretty confident that very few of those ~400 pages are about anything other than mocking and gawking at right wingers and other mean girlesque posting. You can pick pretty much any of them at random and it's mocking and gawking at Republicans, save for when I drag/push you guys into discussing something else (which is frequently just mean girling at me) or you all get distracted by some random tangent on architecture or whatever. Acknowledging that it's bad for the US government to be kidnapping people, locking them up in foreign prisons without due process, only to say it was an oopsie that the courts can't make them fix (and they claim they couldn't anyway) is an insanely low bar for engagement. That you're basically the only other poster to do that much is shameful and a devastating signal for the future of the US. As for the NYC mayoral race, that Democrats prefer a corrupt sexual offender to anyone else, including a social democrat/democratic socialist that would improve their lives, already tells us tons about why Democrats continue to lose to the "stupid people", even when Democrats win the elections. On April 07 2025 22:08 WombaT wrote:On April 07 2025 21:55 GreenHorizons wrote:
[quote]
LibHorizons: The majority of us 2020 Joe Biden voters believe Israel is committing genocide. Biden and Harris were openly aiding and abetting that genocide.
Your notion that by voting for people openly aiding and abetting a genocide one isn't supporting that genocide is as ridiculous as saying Trump voters don't support his bigotry. '
The difference is us having good reasons to support someone doing terrible things, whereas Trump supporters don't.
Missing from this particular poll is ‘Do you think a vote for Joe Biden would stop the genocide?’ Or ‘Is Joe Biden doing enough to prevent genocide’ or anything like that. If someone answered no to both, I’d consider them wrong on both counts, but it’s not the same thing as mashing x amount of people consider Israel policy genocide, ergo voting for Joe Biden means they support genocide + Show Spoiler + I feel like you mean "if someone answered yes"? I can personally oppose genocide while also materially supporting it with my vote. Don't forget us being distracted by the n-th iteration of the trolley problem. + Show Spoiler + Pretty funny folks went immediately back into their mocking the US inviting a wanted war criminal to the white house, gawking at Trump's tariffs, and idiotic trolleys about supporting genocide. People can argue what they are doing isn't as stupid as it apparently is, but they can't seriously argue that it isn't what they are doing. Why is it "gawking" and "stupid" to point out that Trump's tariffs are destroying both national and internal economies? + Show Spoiler + The gawking feels self-explanatory. Lately you've been just posting some awful/stupid thing Trump is doing and gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking. One thing that's stupid about that behavior is it is complemented by the ubiquitous/your steadfast refusal to engage seriously with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it. Posting stupid things that Donald Trump is doing is appropriate for this thread, given that he is a U.S. politician. But it's good to know that I should take your flippant remarks as seriously as everyone else takes your remarks. It's clearly not the posting of the stupid things Trump does I find problematic. It's the gawking at it mixed in with bits of mocking, while steadfastly refusing to seriously engage with what Democrats/we are going to meaningfully do about it that I find demonstrative of why Democrats continuously lose, even when they win the elections. I know everyone thinks it is easier/better to shoot the messenger/distract themselves by having bad faith discussions with the Jimmy and oBlade types, but I'm making this argument from a functional perspective, not a moral or personal animosities perspective. All I'm going to say is that while Jimmy and oBlade are indeed making themselves pariahs in this thread, so are you, and the enmity you experience from others isn't because they simply can't handle your ingenuity, or your ability to speak hard truths, or your "functional perspective" lol. Best of luck though. I read Jimmy and oBlade, I might roll my eyes but I read (almost) all their posts. I haven't read a GH post since his split personally disorder manifested. Nothing of value is in there.
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On April 08 2025 00:56 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote:
Vote R for recession.
The D: vote for it or take it.
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EPT
