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On July 11 2024 17:39 KT_Elwood wrote: In Germany we have Personalausweisgesetz.
Simply everyone has to carry a valid, federal picture ID starting at 16.
You also don't have a first or second amendment and your history with "papers please" is checkered. The US has direct voting for direct representation. You have had two elections overturned and redone recently. It's extraordinary that one thriving democracy can have such secure elections, whereas one has such apparent issues? Remember, to do that in the US if god forbid there was an election problem, once certain things are in motion it's not clear that even the Supreme Court has jurisdiction. The only sure way is a constitutional amendment.
Would you mind explaining what your actual point is here? Because it seems as if you mostly just want to throw shade on Germany and imply we lack "freedoms" without actually saying anything relevant.
On July 11 2024 22:54 oBlade wrote: I gave it a shot, but at first glance, and even upon perusing, the incompetence of government bureaucracy doesn't sound like a strong argument against election security measures.
The argument against election security measures is coming solely from the right. We know how an election would be stolen, the 2020 conspirators documented how they were going to do it in an email. They would do a concerted effort in their media to delegitimize the election, they would use the allegations of fraud to pressure partisan officials to change the results, they would send fake electors to DC, and then they’d muddy the waters so much that they could claim the states would have to decide.
Most of your complaints here were addressed in the 2022 revision of the Electoral Count Act, except for the fact that media aren't illegal (which comes from the 1st amendment) and the fact that there was never any mechanism to send something back to the states, despite what anybody might have claimed (people can claim the Earth is hollow but it doesn't require legislative correction).
On July 11 2024 23:28 KwarK wrote:Then they implemented that conspiracy. We all saw it happen. That’s how an election is stolen. So why aren’t they being punished? Why isn’t anything being done to stop them doing it again? Why are you so opposed to common sense election security? And why are you now playing your role in undermining our elections by continuing to parrot this bullshit about voter fraud which exists only as a right wing talking point as part of their attempt to steal elections?
All this is documented, so why don’t you care?
You lost me when you concluded that an election is stolen by not being stolen, I'm sorry. So to your following inquiries, they're better addressed towards whoever actually made the claims you're railing against - perhaps the ghost of Andrew Breitbart is in your ear at the moment.
On July 11 2024 17:39 KT_Elwood wrote: In Germany we have Personalausweisgesetz.
Simply everyone has to carry a valid, federal picture ID starting at 16.
You also don't have a first or second amendment and your history with "papers please" is checkered. The US has direct voting for direct representation. You have had two elections overturned and redone recently. It's extraordinary that one thriving democracy can have such secure elections, whereas one has such apparent issues? Remember, to do that in the US if god forbid there was an election problem, once certain things are in motion it's not clear that even the Supreme Court has jurisdiction. The only sure way is a constitutional amendment.
Would you mind explaining what your actual point is here? Because it seems as if you mostly just want to throw shade on Germany and imply we lack "freedoms" without actually saying anything relevant.
My point is that if even Personalausweisgesetz is insufficient to keep an election being so messed up that it has to be repeated, it's clearly not sufficient to guarantee elections in a country that has no mechanism to redo elections. And that direct representation is superior. Don't think of it as "shade" because there's enough in this thread to bankrupt every solar company in America.
On July 11 2024 17:39 KT_Elwood wrote: In Germany we have Personalausweisgesetz.
Simply everyone has to carry a valid, federal picture ID starting at 16.
You also don't have a first or second amendment and your history with "papers please" is checkered. The US has direct voting for direct representation. You have had two elections overturned and redone recently. It's extraordinary that one thriving democracy can have such secure elections, whereas one has such apparent issues? Remember, to do that in the US if god forbid there was an election problem, once certain things are in motion it's not clear that even the Supreme Court has jurisdiction. The only sure way is a constitutional amendment.
Would you mind explaining what your actual point is here? Because it seems as if you mostly just want to throw shade on Germany and imply we lack "freedoms" without actually saying anything relevant.
My point is that if even Personalausweisgesetz is insufficient to keep an election being so messed up that it has to be repeated, it's clearly not sufficient to guarantee elections in a country that has no mechanism to redo elections. And that direct representation is superior. Don't think of it as "shade" because there's enough in this thread to bankrupt every solar company in America.
Okay, i agree on that, but that is kinda not an interesting point to make. Obviously a law that means everyone has to have government ID doesn't mean that you cannot have problems with elections.
That would be like claiming that having a car doesn't protect you from measles. They are unrelated and barely connected issues. A car could protect you from measles if you use it to go to a doctor to get vaccinated, but it doesn't generally do that just by existing.
Where's the conclusion coming from that an election system is messed up if elections are being redone? Sounds to me like people in power are being held to a higher standard in such a system. Sufficient evidence of fraudulant action can result in a repeat. Why on earth would that be the worse scenario? Here in Austria we had to redo the presidential vote (twice!) due to suspicions of tampering. As a consequence of that no one gets to complain about voter fraud, people simply have to accept our president and that's the end of the debate. It makes the presidency far more stable when people have no reason to object.
AOC has introduced articles of impeachment against SCJs Thomas and Alito for years of corruption, misconduct, the hiding of bribes, and the failure to recuse themselves from cases where they have clear conflicts of interest. While they deserve to be removed, it would require several House Republicans to agree with the Democrats and give up some Supreme Court power, which certainly won't happen.
This can't be good for Biden. His campaign is polling Harris vs Trump.
As President Biden faces mounting pressure over the future of his candidacy, his campaign is quietly testing the strength of Vice President Kamala Harris against former President Donald J. Trump in a survey of voters, according to three people informed about the effort.
This NATO press conference is going to be awkward. Especially for the other NATO leaders that may also be worried about Biden losing and might get asked about it.
On July 11 2024 22:54 oBlade wrote: I gave it a shot, but at first glance, and even upon perusing, the incompetence of government bureaucracy doesn't sound like a strong argument against election security measures.
The argument against election security measures is coming solely from the right. We know how an election would be stolen, the 2020 conspirators documented how they were going to do it in an email. They would do a concerted effort in their media to delegitimize the election, they would use the allegations of fraud to pressure partisan officials to change the results, they would send fake electors to DC, and then they’d muddy the waters so much that they could claim the states would have to decide.
Most of your complaints here were addressed in the 2022 revision of the Electoral Count Act, except for the fact that media aren't illegal (which comes from the 1st amendment) and the fact that there was never any mechanism to send something back to the states, despite what anybody might have claimed (people can claim the Earth is hollow but it doesn't require legislative correction).
On July 11 2024 23:28 KwarK wrote:Then they implemented that conspiracy. We all saw it happen. That’s how an election is stolen. So why aren’t they being punished? Why isn’t anything being done to stop them doing it again? Why are you so opposed to common sense election security? And why are you now playing your role in undermining our elections by continuing to parrot this bullshit about voter fraud which exists only as a right wing talking point as part of their attempt to steal elections?
All this is documented, so why don’t you care?
You lost me when you concluded that an election is stolen by not being stolen, I'm sorry. So to your following inquiries, they're better addressed towards whoever actually made the claims you're railing against - perhaps the ghost of Andrew Breitbart is in your ear at the moment.
On July 11 2024 17:39 KT_Elwood wrote: In Germany we have Personalausweisgesetz.
Simply everyone has to carry a valid, federal picture ID starting at 16.
You also don't have a first or second amendment and your history with "papers please" is checkered. The US has direct voting for direct representation. You have had two elections overturned and redone recently. It's extraordinary that one thriving democracy can have such secure elections, whereas one has such apparent issues? Remember, to do that in the US if god forbid there was an election problem, once certain things are in motion it's not clear that even the Supreme Court has jurisdiction. The only sure way is a constitutional amendment.
Would you mind explaining what your actual point is here? Because it seems as if you mostly just want to throw shade on Germany and imply we lack "freedoms" without actually saying anything relevant.
My point is that if even Personalausweisgesetz is insufficient to keep an election being so messed up that it has to be repeated, it's clearly not sufficient to guarantee elections in a country that has no mechanism to redo elections. And that direct representation is superior. Don't think of it as "shade" because there's enough in this thread to bankrupt every solar company in America.
This sure seems like you are suggesting because they didnt succeed that a crime didnt happen. We know that is not how crime and the law works. There are thinkings like attempted murder for example. Just because they didnt succeed in stealing the election doesn't mean they didnt commit a crime or try to steal the election.
As President Biden faces mounting pressure over the future of his candidacy, his campaign is quietly testing the strength of Vice President Kamala Harris against former President Donald J. Trump in a survey of voters, according to three people informed about the effort.
This NATO press conference is going to be awkward. Especially for the other NATO leaders that may also be worried about Biden losing and might get asked about it.
4 months until the election is a wonderful time to be doing this shit.
Democrats should have been putting pressure on him like this 2 years ago.
On July 12 2024 01:41 GreenHorizons wrote: This can't be good for Biden. His campaign is polling Harris vs Trump.
As President Biden faces mounting pressure over the future of his candidacy, his campaign is quietly testing the strength of Vice President Kamala Harris against former President Donald J. Trump in a survey of voters, according to three people informed about the effort.
This NATO press conference is going to be awkward. Especially for the other NATO leaders that may also be worried about Biden losing and might get asked about it.
4 months until the election is a wonderful time to be doing this shit.
Democrats should have been putting pressure on him like this 2 years ago.
Funny you would say that. From 2 years ago to the day:
The question is whether establishment Democrats and their sycophants will go the "you petulant progressives are going to make him lose, now fall in line!" route like they typically do or abandon him.
We already know that either way if Democrats lose they will blame progressives ahead of their own trash policy and resounding impotency.
Extremely unlikely that Democrats nominate anyone that's substantially/functionally different from Biden though. People are mostly talking about pushing the same policy turds with less obviously repulsive packaging.
Some Dems were putting pressure on him 2 years ago.
The result was even more lopsided among young Democrats, with 94 percent of Democratic voters ages 18 to 29 saying that someone other than Biden should be the 2024 nominee.
I did not expect establishment/sycophantic Dems to both scold/ignore progressive and young Dems saying Biden shouldn't run/be the nominee and also abandon Biden at the last minute. That takes a special blend of hubris and incompetence only Democrats seem capable of.
It is possible this preparation has already taken place and it is a closely guarded secret. Its possible the logic diagram for how to handle Biden's age isn't quite at the previously agreed upon threshold to initiate his replacement. The Biden administration is highly incentivized to pretend there is no issue and no reason to replace him. That remains true right up until the moment they decide he will not be the nominee. But I am going to just assume everything we have been told is true and that there is no secret plan B.
A potential Biden replacement should have been investigated and ironed out a long time ago. Even if we ignore a variety of components to this situation, is negligent and irresponsible to have no other options lined up when Biden would be 81 at the time of the 2024 election.
We have a wealth of data showing Harris is deeply unpopular with key groups. The whole "but he had a vice president" excuse is not valid because the goal is to win the election. Deferring to title is not appropriate when it includes major harm to % chance of beating Trump.
I'd go so far as to say this remains true even if Biden was a cool and crisp 40 years old. In any situation where the VP is uniquely unlikely to win a presidential election, having a backup plan is appropriate because the stakes are just so amazingly high.
I know the whole Trump fascism thing has been going on so long that people are numb to it, but its important to listen to what he says and take him at his word. Even if we do not read between the lines, he openly declares desire and intention to do deeply terrible things. If we assume he is being truthful, it would be extremely negligent for democrats to not obsess over planning for all possibilities to prevent it.
Its such an illustration of the Democrats issues with talent cultivation and the US' issues with gerontocracy that it feels too dumb for even a C-tier poltiical drama on tv
On July 12 2024 07:05 Zambrah wrote: Its such an illustration of the Democrats issues with talent cultivation and the US' issues with gerontocracy that it feels too dumb for even a C-tier poltiical drama on tv
The Democrats have PLENTY of talent, but they're being kept in the lower rungs of the party by the gerontocracy and their archaic notions of "paying your dues" to rise up the ranks of the party.
Barack Obama shattered those rules a few years ago and it SERIOUSLY pissed off the DNC. They've been extra keen on enforcing those rules ever since he took office.
If theyre keepin' the talent in the lower rungs they aren't cultivating it, its wild that this is the party that we have to rely on to deal with Republican fascist types, its something people could read in a textbook in 300 years and go, "lol, how did they even let it get to this point, its so obviously stupid how bad they fucked that up/almost fucked that up"
On July 12 2024 07:49 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: That gaffe is already going viral, as expected.
At this point the illusion is shattered. The emperor doesn't have any clothes anymore. The Democrats aren't doing themselves any favors by letting Biden try and rebound back from these things, the media scrutiny is only going to keep getting more intense every time he does it.
We're 4 months out from the election and even if Biden wins are we supposed to just tolerate 4 years of this nonsense? There needs to be a plan in place here and the American public needs to hear what that plan is.
If the plan is have Biden step down shortly after the election and Kamala Harris take over, then they need to hurry up and say that and start running her as the actual candidate. I don't even like Kamala Harris, in fact I STRONGLY dislike her, but she's at least mentally cognizant, which is better than what Biden has been showing us lately. The DNC has to really believe that she doesn't have a chance of winning the election as the face of it to keep from pushing her forward, and if that's the case then why the fuck is she the VP in the first place?
On July 12 2024 07:30 WombaT wrote: Oh my fucking god, there’s gaffes and there’s that
This one is up there with Bush criticizing the 'decision of one man to launch a wholly unjustified and brutal invasion of Iraq - I mean Ukraine'.
With the added baggage of advanced age. I know it was very popular back in the day to make fun of various ‘Bushisms’, I personally took those as silly gaffes or slips of the tongue rather than evidence of the guy being a complete idiot.
Whereas making such gaffes in a situation where you’re frequently showing issues with communication, maybe indicative of a problem
EPT
