EPTPoliticians are in a similar boat, but I guess the fact that Trump is both of those makes it just that much less likely.
US Politics Mega-thread - Page 3510
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
Politicians are in a similar boat, but I guess the fact that Trump is both of those makes it just that much less likely. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23246 Posts
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
A fairly Republican (i.e. warmongery and bombastic) take on the situation, but by the standards of American political commentary it's pretty good. | ||
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Vivax
21991 Posts
On February 17 2022 08:26 LegalLord wrote: I kind of liked this take from Macro Rubio on the "invasion Feb 16th at 3AM" thing: + Show Spoiler + https://twitter.com/marcorubio/status/1493934512639811589 A fairly Republican (i.e. warmongery and bombastic) take on the situation, but by the standards of American political commentary it's pretty good. He just forgot to mention that € politicians have been flying into the US as well (which is rather symbolic for the importance of the matter when you're a phone call away). I found the cyberattack part on ukr. financial institutions more interesting, as it's the same tool of coercion being used as in Canada at the trucker protests. Probably the best argument for crypto out there. When a nation loses sovereignty over their own banking system, you can make them do anything not-worse than that. | ||
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mierin
United States4943 Posts
On February 17 2022 00:27 Zambrah wrote: Yeah, America makes a lot more sense if you view things not through a right/left/Republican/Democrat but through a rich/not rich lens imo. Amen! I'd be a card carrying member of Poor Lives Matter. | ||
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gobbledydook
Australia2603 Posts
On February 17 2022 06:09 GreenHorizons wrote: There's also the added problem that Trump's favorability rating is better than Biden, Harris, Pelosi, and Schumer. When a "corrupt Russian agent" has better favourability ratings than all the top Democrats you know they fucked up real bad and are about to get wiped off the electoral map in the mid-terms. | ||
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15690 Posts
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Belisarius
Australia6231 Posts
I'm not happy with his performance but it's not like he'd be cruising if he'd just ignored student loans or whatever. He's dealing with arguably the most challenging environment for any president since the cold war. Playing Mr Bipartisanship was clearly not the right approach, but even if he had governed by EO from the beginning there would be a pile of challenges waiting to be stamped by the blood-red SC instead, and none of those EOs could have made the pandemic disappear, the global economy reassemble or the autocracies stop warmongering anyway. There's simply no way for him to achieve what people expect of him, and to make it worse the main obstructors pretend they're on his own team so he can't even externalise them. He's just screwed. In hindsight, "winning" the senate was about the worst thing that could have happened to the administration, and probably the country. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18004 Posts
On February 17 2022 15:15 Mohdoo wrote: What is funniest about both Trump and Biden's really low approval ratings is that they had such an easy setup to be viewed very positively. They each needed to twist and bend in exactly the wrong way, like 20 times in a row, to get to be as unpopular as they are. I disagree. Between the pandemic and the economy I don't think any president would be very popular right now. It's just a shitty time to be in charge. Is Biden doing particularly well at managing those things? No. But there's a limit to what he even can do. The pandemic is being "managed" at a state level, and the economy is globally messed up. It's just a question of what breaks first where at this point. | ||
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Zambrah
United States7308 Posts
On February 17 2022 15:57 Belisarius wrote: Look, a fair chunk of Biden's optics issues are from a nominally blue senate that refuses to pass anything but red legislation. That's not him twisting exactly the wrong way, that's baked in. I'm not happy with his performance but it's not like he'd be cruising if he'd just ignored student loans or whatever. He's dealing with arguably the most challenging environment for any president since the cold war. Playing Mr Bipartisanship was clearly not the right approach, but even if he had governed by EO from the beginning there would be a pile of challenges waiting to be stamped by the blood-red SC instead, and none of those EOs could have made the pandemic disappear, the global economy reassemble or the autocracies stop warmongering anyway. There's simply no way for him to achieve what people expect of him, and to make it worse the main obstructors pretend they're on his own team so he can't even externalise them. He's just screwed. In hindsight, "winning" the senate was about the worst thing that could have happened to the administration, and probably the country. I agree that the SC would be fucking with him if he tried to do things by EO, but at the same time at least trying is showing that you're willing to try and fight. I think people would be more amenable to Biden if it seemed like he was actively fighting, I dont mean backroom-talking with Manchin, people are sick of the backroom bullshit, but going out and saying, "West Virginians, your Senator thinks you're too poor and stupid to spend money we want to give you to feed your families, are you going to let him sit in his big fancy office and drive his big fancy Maserati while he belittles you like that?" If someone or something is being an impediment to what he wants to do he should be loudly decrying it and telling the people why they should be pissed and who they should be pissed at. You're right that playing Mr. Bipartisanship is not the right approach, and he has to be generally adversarial to those who are are his adversaries. People like fighters, even fighters who lose, they're not going to like someone whose given up preemptively. | ||
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Belisarius
Australia6231 Posts
It's fine and constructive to criticise him for things he's actually done. It's absurd to claim some magical fairyland where things would have been fine if not for Joe Biden. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25446 Posts
Good job or bad job, that approval rating will drop until the next lot are in and subject to the same process. Does this phenomena present in countries that are less two party in nature? | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18004 Posts
On February 17 2022 19:31 Zambrah wrote: I agree that the SC would be fucking with him if he tried to do things by EO, but at the same time at least trying is showing that you're willing to try and fight. I think people would be more amenable to Biden if it seemed like he was actively fighting, I dont mean backroom-talking with Manchin, people are sick of the backroom bullshit, but going out and saying, "West Virginians, your Senator thinks you're too poor and stupid to spend money we want to give you to feed your families, are you going to let him sit in his big fancy office and drive his big fancy Maserati while he belittles you like that?" If someone or something is being an impediment to what he wants to do he should be loudly decrying it and telling the people why they should be pissed and who they should be pissed at. You're right that playing Mr. Bipartisanship is not the right approach, and he has to be generally adversarial to those who are are his adversaries. People like fighters, even fighters who lose, they're not going to like someone whose given up preemptively. People didn't vote for a fighter though. Joe Biden has spent 50! years in politics at a federal level. In that time he has never been known as a fighter. A bridge builder. A boring legislator. A guy who puts his foot in his mouth a lot. An everyman. But not a fighter. So expecting him to fight now all of a sudden is a bit... weird. That said, if I recall he was never your candidate. You were feeling the Bern, who *is* a fighter. So the question isn't why Biden lost your approval as he never really had it. The question is why Biden lost the approval of some of those who *did* vote for him in the primary. Or maybe he hasn't, and it's just the people who "reluctantly" voted for him because he was the democratic candidate, but were never really all that convinced that he'd do a good job in the first place who feel that that is now confirmed. Maybe those people wanted a fighter. But Biden being a fighter is not a reasonable expectation having seen the previous 50 years of his career. | ||
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Zambrah
United States7308 Posts
On February 17 2022 22:35 Acrofales wrote: People didn't vote for a fighter though. Joe Biden has spent 50! years in politics at a federal level. In that time he has never been known as a fighter. A bridge builder. A boring legislator. A guy who puts his foot in his mouth a lot. An everyman. But not a fighter. So expecting him to fight now all of a sudden is a bit... weird. That said, if I recall he was never your candidate. You were feeling the Bern, who *is* a fighter. So the question isn't why Biden lost your approval as he never really had it. The question is why Biden lost the approval of some of those who *did* vote for him in the primary. Or maybe he hasn't, and it's just the people who "reluctantly" voted for him because he was the democratic candidate, but were never really all that convinced that he'd do a good job in the first place who feel that that is now confirmed. Maybe those people wanted a fighter. But Biden being a fighter is not a reasonable expectation having seen the previous 50 years of his career. In this case its not about me, his approval ratings are generally low. As to whether or not people were at large resigned to him being a do-nothing-president, I disagree, his approval rating hasnt dropped indicating people had some sort of expectations of him that he is managing to fall below. I think we're living in unreasonable times and the idea of "reasonable expectations," for our most important leaders is how the Republicans and their neo-fascy bullshit firmly plants America into a neo-fascy hellscape. We should hold our leaders to beyond America's usual bar-buried-six-feet-below-the-dirt standards and start demanding they rise to the occasion. This is no time to just lull ourselves into a dead status quo. If Joe Biden can't meet the times then hes going to go down as a failure and lead the Democrats along with him. He can learn to fight or lay down and die, I don't think its reasonable to be okay with the latter. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
I don't think people should be carrying water for Biden by making excuses for his legion of failures as president. He's not the first nor the last president to have a hard time legislating because of lack of support, but he sure does have a lot of people ready to make excuses for why he isn't any good and why that doesn't actually mean he isn't any good. You can simultaneously accept that you'd rather have him than Trump and that it's good that Trump is gone, while fully acknowledging that he's a failure as president. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
On February 18 2022 00:20 JimmiC wrote: I think people in this thread, as well as people in general in the US do not understand their system well enough and that ends up giving the President too much blame when things are bad and too much credit when its good, with a lot more too much blame. For example it was not Biden who did not do BBB it was Republicans and the rightest of Dems. If you want more of his policies passed it comes down to primarying the rightest of Dems and electing more Dems. Electing more Reps will lead to more of Trump policies like long term tax cuts for the rich and short term ones for the poor and middle, wildly expensive walls to build and maintain that do not do much, horrible foreign policy so bad that you blame the new guy for not knowing better about how bad it was, and a huge amount of charging the American tax payers at his own places to make profit along with breaking every rule and convention to enrich himself. Except the leftwing posters in this thread like GreenHorizons, Moodoo, and Zambrah live in states that have two democratic senators. Who are they voting for fix the senate exactly? There is an expectation that the president is the defacto leader of the party and should be able to whip votes to push his or her policy. Hate Trump for whatever reasons you have, but he could rile up a crowd and steer the national conversation. You won't see Biden doing that. | ||
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Sermokala
United States13955 Posts
On February 18 2022 02:12 Blitzkrieg0 wrote: Except the leftwing posters in this thread like GreenHorizons, Moodoo, and Zambrah live in states that have two democratic senators. Who are they voting for fix the senate exactly? There is an expectation that the president is the defacto leader of the party and should be able to whip votes to push his or her policy. Hate Trump for whatever reasons you have, but he could rile up a crowd and steer the national conversation. You won't see Biden doing that. Except that crowd was filled with white supremists and nazis and the steering he did was always in an objectively negative direction for everyone, explicitly for the people he was speaking to. That biden isn't going out and running public rallies with throngs of people shoulder to shoulder in the middle of the plague is something that normal people should consider is a good thing. | ||
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