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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 124

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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!

NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.


If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 17 2018 00:03 GMT
#2461
I don’t mind your existence, but keep your terrible legal arguments out of my courtroom.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
April 17 2018 00:26 GMT
#2462
On April 17 2018 02:45 farvacola wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2018 02:03 ticklishmusic wrote:
+1 on Strunk & White.

One thing I like is that most law schools teach a class on legal writing, which ensures some level of sanity in their documents. But when I read a legal doc and the lawyer felt the need to use 'know all by these presents' I want to scream.

Having taken a legal writing class, I can tell you that in many if not most cases, the writer's habits are already set such that those classes end up being too little, too late for those in most need of skill development. One of my professors said that 90% of the students he sees are terrible writers and there's almost nothing they can do about it, clinical writing profs included.


as mozoku pointed out previously, nobody learns anytbing after primary school. if we rank-ordered writing samples from a class at harvard with a class from florida coastal, would all the florida coastal be median or below?
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18856 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-17 00:30:47
April 17 2018 00:29 GMT
#2463
Actually no, if what I've experienced and observed is any indicator, the dispersal of talent among lower ranked law schools would probably be more random with a downward weight than outright inferior across the board.

As for the "nobody learns anything past primary school," I think that take turns on a far too one dimensional view of how people learn across the span of their lives (particularly as it relates to their ability to express what they learn).
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
April 17 2018 00:40 GMT
#2464
but have you SEEN florida coastal's bar pssage rate?
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45395 Posts
April 17 2018 00:41 GMT
#2465
On April 17 2018 09:26 IgnE wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2018 02:45 farvacola wrote:
On April 17 2018 02:03 ticklishmusic wrote:
+1 on Strunk & White.

One thing I like is that most law schools teach a class on legal writing, which ensures some level of sanity in their documents. But when I read a legal doc and the lawyer felt the need to use 'know all by these presents' I want to scream.

Having taken a legal writing class, I can tell you that in many if not most cases, the writer's habits are already set such that those classes end up being too little, too late for those in most need of skill development. One of my professors said that 90% of the students he sees are terrible writers and there's almost nothing they can do about it, clinical writing profs included.


as mozoku pointed out previously, nobody learns anytbing after primary school. if we rank-ordered writing samples from a class at harvard with a class from florida coastal, would all the florida coastal be median or below?


This is sarcasm right? Not necessarily that mozoku may have implied this, but that such a remark about not learning anything after primary school is actually true.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 17 2018 01:05 GMT
#2466
Poe's law is a hell of a drug.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
semantics
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
10040 Posts
April 17 2018 01:57 GMT
#2467
On April 17 2018 00:08 Plansix wrote:
Calling Joe Biden “pro-business” is a bit of a mis-characterization however. The man has always openly supported Unions and I can’t find anything in his history where he tried to limit them. And I don’t know where the “Against any meaningful reform” is coming from either.

i fail to see how pro-business is anti-union. Unions only exist if business exists, it's kinda like tipping your hand into saying pro business is more anti-worker. Unions don't exist in a vacuum they exist to fill a role of increased negotiating power by workers to business, likely due to the inherent lopsided nature of information and power business has in that area. Being pro-union is about as anti-business as suggesting that to be pro-business you need to only ever support "the business" not it's workers.
On April 17 2018 06:35 IyMoon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2018 06:30 Plansix wrote:
I also don’t understand how he represents a host for a news network and a presidential candidate at the same time. That would be a conflict of interest at a basic level.


The president of the United States is still involved with a business that directly profits form him being president. Does anyone really care about the lawyer also having conflicts? Do conflicts matter anymore?

Plus i wouldn't say it's a conflict of interest more as it's just incestuous, a conflict of interest would be say representing the president and a former fbi director
Lazare1969
Profile Joined September 2014
United States318 Posts
April 17 2018 03:51 GMT
#2468
On April 17 2018 10:57 semantics wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2018 00:08 Plansix wrote:
Calling Joe Biden “pro-business” is a bit of a mis-characterization however. The man has always openly supported Unions and I can’t find anything in his history where he tried to limit them. And I don’t know where the “Against any meaningful reform” is coming from either.

i fail to see how pro-business is anti-union. Unions only exist if business exists, it's kinda like tipping your hand into saying pro business is more anti-worker. Unions don't exist in a vacuum they exist to fill a role of increased negotiating power by workers to business, likely due to the inherent lopsided nature of information and power business has in that area. Being pro-union is about as anti-business as suggesting that to be pro-business you need to only ever support "the business" not it's workers.
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2018 06:35 IyMoon wrote:
On April 17 2018 06:30 Plansix wrote:
I also don’t understand how he represents a host for a news network and a presidential candidate at the same time. That would be a conflict of interest at a basic level.


The president of the United States is still involved with a business that directly profits form him being president. Does anyone really care about the lawyer also having conflicts? Do conflicts matter anymore?

Plus i wouldn't say it's a conflict of interest more as it's just incestuous, a conflict of interest would be say representing the president and a former fbi director

When describing a politician as "pro-business" it is generally understood to mean he or she approves of anti-union legislation ("Right-to-work", Taft-Hartley Act, et al.), the abolishing of worker and environmental regulations/protections, the reduction of corporate taxes, the privatization of state-provided services, and so on. Likewise, a "pro-unionist" would be someone who supports the opposite of those policies, but generally still believes in maintaining the capitalist economy through the Keynesian lens. And yes, there is a contradiction, but people would prefer to think it's not there.
6 trillion
Kyadytim
Profile Joined March 2009
United States886 Posts
April 17 2018 04:09 GMT
#2469
A broadband advisor selected by Federal Communications Commission Chairman Ajit Pai to run a federal advisory committee was arrested last week on claims she tricked investors into pouring money into a multi-million dollar investment fraud scheme, according to The Wall Street Journal.

The advisor, Elizabeth Pierce, is the former chief executive of Quintillion, an Alaska-based fiber optic cable provider operating out of Anchorage. In her capacity as CEO, Pierce allegedly raised more than $250 million from two New York-based investment companies using forged contracts with other companies guaranteeing hundreds of millions of dollars in future revenue. Pierce resigned from Quintillion in August of last year, and she stepped down from her role in Pai’s Broadband Deployment Advisory Committee (BDAC) the following month.
"Pai picked Pierce last year to chair his newly created broadband advisory group"

“As it turned out, those sales agreements were worthless because the customers had not signed them,” US attorney Geoffrey Berman said in prepared remarks, as reported by the WSJ. “Instead, as alleged, Pierce had forged counter-party signatures on contract after contract. As a result of Pierce’s deception, the investment companies were left with a system that is worth far less than Pierce had led them to believe.” Pierce was trying to raise money to help build out a fiber optic system that would wire Alaska with high-speed internet and better help connect it to networks in other US states. Pierce was charged with wire fraud last Thursday and faces a maximum sentence of 20 years in prison.

www.theverge.com
The number of people appointed by Trump or picked by those Trump appointees to work in the executive branch who have had some corruption, crime, or abuse of office scandal is starting to get implausible. If you were to have asked a group of people with appropriate experience with politics and relevant fields to put together a pool of possible candidates for all of these major government positions, Trump is doing an amazing job of picking unsubtly unethical people or people who are drawn to working with unsubtly unethical people compared to what a random sampling of those candidate pools might produce.
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
Netherlands30548 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-17 09:12:28
April 17 2018 09:11 GMT
#2470
The GOP made a website for THE TRUTH™ to be spread. A work of art.

https://lyincomey.com/
Neosteel Enthusiast
Reivax
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden214 Posts
April 17 2018 11:53 GMT
#2471
On April 17 2018 02:04 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2018 01:53 Acrofales wrote:
On April 17 2018 01:09 Plansix wrote:
On April 17 2018 00:43 Simberto wrote:
On April 16 2018 23:52 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
You try that, and then you get slandered for being too simplistic :D


I can also see how you would be very careful with simplifying your language if you are in a position that would make you liable if an action someone took as a result of what you said turned out to have bad results, like as a doctor or a lawyer. In that situation, it is possibly rational to still use the careful and exact terminology of the trade, even if the client doesn't understand a word of it, just to protect yourself.

The key is that you provide them with both the complex, fully fleshed out version and a simplified break down with key points you think they will care about. It also helps to ask what features the client is looking for. We have plenty of clients that are very interested taking the conservative route to avoid liability, but hate protracted cases that are open a year or longer. Those two things are directly opposed to each other, so we always provide the most conservative, aka longest time frame.

Also, I don’t providing the full, terminology filled explanation is the best way to avoid potential liability. They are just as likely to bring a malpractice action because the doctor/attorney was unwilling to frame their advice in terms the client/patient could easily understand.

Lets face it, most people are simply bad communicators, probably moreso in writing than spoken word. Strunks "Elements of Style" should be mandatory for anybody who has to write texts longer than an email for a living and explain something complex (not even necessarily to non-experts, many scientific articles I read are needlessly obtuse). Just because the concept is complex doesn't mean your language use has match it (or worse still, be intentionally fluffy).

And yes, I know, my own prose is nothing to write home about. Writing well is hard.

"There is no such thing as good writing, only good rewriting." - a quote from someone that is so commonly used that Google couldn't quickly provide me the origin.

On a side note: Desiree Linden is the first American to win the Boston Marathon since 1985. Which is super as impressive since it was dumping hail and freezing rain on the runners this morning.


The men's winner and the women's runnerup are both amateurs. That's even more amazing.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43794846
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18856 Posts
April 17 2018 12:02 GMT
#2472
One of my best friends ran in Boston this year and even though he was planning on only getting into the top 4000, he cracked the top 1200 because, as he put it, Midwesterners know how to deal with snow and wind better than a lot of the international competitors. I'd wager the weather played a big role in how well Americans did this year.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Excludos
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Norway8246 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-17 12:44:13
April 17 2018 12:44 GMT
#2473
On April 17 2018 06:13 Howie_Dewitt wrote:
I've decided that I'm going to read from the first post mentioning Donald Trump announcing his candidacy until now because I want to watch how the thread and the views of its posters have evolved. It'll be quite a lot of reading, but I've been reading every day almost since summer 2016 anyway. Wish me luck!

On a more topical note, Hannity seems like he has too much of a following to have the public turn on him. I'm not sure it won't affect his prosecution.


My condolences. Do you want me to hire you a therapist now or after you rip your hair out?
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 17 2018 12:47 GMT
#2474
On April 17 2018 21:02 farvacola wrote:
One of my best friends ran in Boston this year and even though he was planning on only getting into the top 4000, he cracked the top 1200 because, as he put it, Midwesterners know how to deal with snow and wind better than a lot of the international competitors. I'd wager the weather played a big role in how well Americans did this year.

It was full blown hail and freezing rain when the race started. It must have hurt like a bitch to run in that. I was surprised there were so few injuries given the conditions.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Wulfey_LA
Profile Joined April 2017
932 Posts
April 17 2018 15:56 GMT
#2475
On April 17 2018 18:11 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
The GOP made a website for THE TRUTH™ to be spread. A work of art.

https://lyincomey.com/


This is a ripoff of talkingpointsmemo's theme. And their web developer almost added cool javascript scrolling effects, and then he gave up. The whole arrangement is silly. Who is going to click videos? There needs to be easy to read quotes and talking points.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 17 2018 16:10 GMT
#2476
So Maggie Haberman won a Pulitzer for her reporting this year, which is great because she did a good job. Apparently in response to this people decided harassing her son online the way to go, because some people are human garbage. Which is standard for these days, but I really question if this shit is sustainable. Being a reporter for the NYT should not require people to fear their children being targeted for harassment or worse. At least not the level and regularity we see today. And the only reason that people are able to find these kids is because they exist someplace on internet. And keeping all kids off of social media isn’t a viable solution to the problem either.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Jockmcplop
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom9794 Posts
April 17 2018 16:17 GMT
#2477
On April 18 2018 01:10 Plansix wrote:
So Maggie Haberman won a Pulitzer for her reporting this year, which is great because she did a good job. Apparently in response to this people decided harassing her son online the way to go, because some people are human garbage. Which is standard for these days, but I really question if this shit is sustainable. Being a reporter for the NYT should not require people to fear their children being targeted for harassment or worse. At least not the level and regularity we see today. And the only reason that people are able to find these kids is because they exist someplace on internet. And keeping all kids off of social media isn’t a viable solution to the problem either.


What is the solution?
Crackdown on threatening behaviour online?
RIP Meatloaf <3
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-17 16:38:43
April 17 2018 16:37 GMT
#2478
On April 18 2018 01:17 Jockmcplop wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2018 01:10 Plansix wrote:
So Maggie Haberman won a Pulitzer for her reporting this year, which is great because she did a good job. Apparently in response to this people decided harassing her son online the way to go, because some people are human garbage. Which is standard for these days, but I really question if this shit is sustainable. Being a reporter for the NYT should not require people to fear their children being targeted for harassment or worse. At least not the level and regularity we see today. And the only reason that people are able to find these kids is because they exist someplace on internet. And keeping all kids off of social media isn’t a viable solution to the problem either.


What is the solution?
Crackdown on threatening behaviour online?

Offer better controls for people to prevent people from contacting them? Allow more nuanced, controllable options that don’t default to ‘Completely open facing, taking all messages” and “completely locked down, no one can contact me”? Instagram doesn’t even let you turn off comments all posts. You need to do it for each new post. You can’t set it so anyone can see your account, but people still need to ask to follow it. Its completely lock down or completely open. Twitter is even worse, unless you are a celebrity. Then you get special features. Same with Facebook, where the CEO and others have special chat features.

These companies are eating away at “traditional media” while also enabling the worst actors to thrive on their services. And much like how the gun debate blew up after Parkland, at some point a very angry group of voters is going to emerge that isn’t going to buy the “It is just the internet, it’s always like that” reasoning. That harassment is a force of nature that people on the internet need to prepare for like a winter storm. Because it isn’t.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Emnjay808
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
United States10665 Posts
April 17 2018 18:15 GMT
#2479
On April 18 2018 01:17 Jockmcplop wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2018 01:10 Plansix wrote:
So Maggie Haberman won a Pulitzer for her reporting this year, which is great because she did a good job. Apparently in response to this people decided harassing her son online the way to go, because some people are human garbage. Which is standard for these days, but I really question if this shit is sustainable. Being a reporter for the NYT should not require people to fear their children being targeted for harassment or worse. At least not the level and regularity we see today. And the only reason that people are able to find these kids is because they exist someplace on internet. And keeping all kids off of social media isn’t a viable solution to the problem either.


What is the solution?
Crackdown on threatening behaviour online?

You cant impose on how others behave online.

You also cant impose that the victim dont use social media.

The solution here is that the user of social media grow thick skin.
Skol
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 17 2018 18:24 GMT
#2480
On April 18 2018 03:15 Emnjay808 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2018 01:17 Jockmcplop wrote:
On April 18 2018 01:10 Plansix wrote:
So Maggie Haberman won a Pulitzer for her reporting this year, which is great because she did a good job. Apparently in response to this people decided harassing her son online the way to go, because some people are human garbage. Which is standard for these days, but I really question if this shit is sustainable. Being a reporter for the NYT should not require people to fear their children being targeted for harassment or worse. At least not the level and regularity we see today. And the only reason that people are able to find these kids is because they exist someplace on internet. And keeping all kids off of social media isn’t a viable solution to the problem either.


What is the solution?
Crackdown on threatening behaviour online?

You cant impose on how others behave online.

You also cant impose that the victim dont use social media.

The solution here is that the user of social media grow thick skin.

Poe’s law is in full effect. Are you claiming that the moderation on this website has no impact on how people behave on this online website?
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
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