European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread - Page 536

On August 26 2016 05:25 WhiteDog wrote:

Even during the third reich, the germans were culturally europeans.
But are you saying Russia under Putin is similar to the third reich ?

On August 26 2016 05:40 LegalLord wrote:
Russia is definitely more authoritarian than average for European nations. The idea that it's getting worse, or that Putin is some sort of Hitler/Stalin/czar figure, is just opportune fearmongering.

On August 26 2016 04:35 WhiteDog wrote:

And that superpower will speak german ?

Russia has been an important piece of europe, next to Germany, France, the UK - think about it from a cultural standpoint and it's pretty clear.
And Europe will always be that : a complex space structured around various alliances and opposition that change from time to time. Somehow, since the end of the second world war, we've taken more and more distances with Russia and now it's seen as a foreign force willing to invade a "us" that is not unified nor clearly defined (Turkey is in or out lolz ?).
Yes, I feel like talking and negociating is a good way to get out of such conflicts with what is a cousin-state more than anything.

RvB you are entirely right. The problem is that it has been 30 years that europe showed it was not able to move, that's why people want sovereignty now : because Europe as an institution does not have what it takes to make a decent enough compromise between the very diverse interests that made it. Russia, on the other hand, seems willing to find a common ground.

On August 26 2016 05:20 Nyxisto wrote:
It's just a bunch of historical romanticism. Russia is authoritarian, has no real independent legal authority, acts on European territory by use of force and essentially disregards most basic democratic rights. That's not compatible with European political values.

On August 26 2016 06:01 WhiteDog wrote:

I disagree a whole lot with you on this.
French kings unified the nation through brute force and generations of opression. You want the same for europe ?

I don't know where you got those pillars of western european culture. There's no unified european culture, France is pretty far off from the UK and Germany in many aspects, the only thing we really have in common is shared history, litterature, philosophy and art and we have that in common with Russia.

On August 26 2016 06:14 WhiteDog wrote:

Yeah I see where you come from but at the same time the influence this history had on all of us is very diverse. Russia and Greece are non conformist christians, France is very laïc, Italy very catholic, Germany very protestant, etc. Our form of government are also different.


In the mind of europeans, the european culture is the enlightment without the revolution and without the anti church rhetoric, so it's basically the enlightment depleted of everything that made it such an historical force.

On August 26 2016 05:58 stilt wrote:


Russia being part of Europe is part of a bunch of historical romanticism... lel
There is a lot of revisionnism here. Russia has been part culturaly (russian literature, architecture can not be understood as a non European stuff, basically, Tolstoï or Kryzanowski are not part of European literature? Moreover, they have been united by Christian values just like us and their writing comes from it), geographically and historically with Europe. You and Russians can deny it as much as you want but it is historical reality and only the political context makes you state this absolutely wrong assertion.
Btw, you're European values stuff are laughable, you think that Europe has been culturally structured around Human rights? No it has not been, I am a deeply anti religious person, I think all religion has the seed of the most hardcore totalitarism but this is a point, the cultural unifying Europe has been christiannity.

On August 26 2016 05:57 LegalLord wrote:

Going to have to ask you to be a lot more specific about what you mean. As it has been defined so far your "more authoritarian" claim is pretty nebulous. The Russian government holds a lot of "strategic companies" under its control, and their relative value is pretty high right now if looking at nominal GDP values, but I'm not seeing what you claim to be true.

The EU and Turkey are poised for a fresh round of diplomacy in an attempt to keep their migration pact working, despite the rancorous downward spiral in relations since Ankara’s crackdown on tens of thousands of people it says are supporters of the exiled cleric it blames for a failed military coup.

The two sides will reach a moment of truth in September, when the European commission is due to report on whether Turkey has done enough to gain visa-free travel to Europe’s borderless Schengen zone, a linchpin of the migration deal.

A delegation of EU officials is expected in Ankara in the coming weeks to assess Turkey’s progress, while a visit by the EU commissioner responsible for migration, Dimitris Avramopoulos, is also being discussed.

The diplomatic move comes amid an increase in migrants crossing the eastern Mediterranean to Europe. In August, 109 people a day on average have been arriving on Greek shores, compared to 62 in July, although still far below January’s tally of 2,000. The UN refugee agency warned that Europe could see a repeat of last year’s chaotic mass arrivals, unless EU governments did more to help asylum seekers in the Middle East as well as resettling more refugees.

“The feeling in Europe is that the problem has been solved,” UNHCR spokesman William Spindler said. “People have forgotten about the problem, because they do not see the immediacy of it.”

Around 50,000 people are stranded in Greece, many living in dire conditions in reception centres, not knowing when they will move on. Save the Children reported this week that Greek refugee camps were bursting at the seams: people are living in dirty and unsafe conditions, as camps lack sufficient drinking water, showers and toilets.

Under the pact with Ankara, Europe promised an initial €3bn aid for Syrian refugees in Turkey, in exchange for being able to send back irregular migrants who had arrived in Greece. The deal was sweetened by the promise of visa-free travel for Turks throughout continental Europe.

But even before the botched coup in Turkey, the deal had been hanging by a thread with Turkey’s president, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, insisting he would not re-write Turkey’s counter-terrorism laws - a key condition of the visa deal.

On August 26 2016 09:59 WhiteDog wrote:
Nyx you mix everything up ... Just because France and Germany have deep historical ties does not mean that the first and the second world war were okay. We're not saying Russia is great and fun and everything, we're just saying we're stuck with it, so we need to find a common ground.