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On August 02 2013 15:16 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 15:12 FarmI3oy wrote:
I applaud Russia for standing up in what they believe in.
They aren't restricting gays from being in their country. Just restricting them from making publicly scenes of gayness.
I don't care what anyone says, but since the laws starting getting passed in different states the number of bisexual men and women has increased. The whole thing has just become OK with everyone it seems. Russia hopes to thwart that. What are they thwarting? What moral peril is being averted that necessitates preventing these people from expressing themselves? As to your suggestion that, I don't know people are becoming bisexual because it's trendy or something?
Actually what they are thwarting would be russian sovereignty. If you would boycott the olympics because of this law, you should boycott everything russia. If the olympics are hold on russian territory they have the right to enforce their laws. I do not agree with these laws, but I am gonna have to comply if I am in Russia. The Olympics do not impose an exceptional state of peace love and tolerance. "When in Rome, do as the Romans do!"
Interesting questions:
Why did the Olympic Committee give the games to Russia? (Although I think the law is a recent one)
Why are there no prerequisites to host the olympic games regarding human rights etc.?
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this is a road to disaster for Russia. There are plenty of athletes who will consider violating the law just for the good press it will bring them. I mean $3000 and a week in prison in exchange for a "hero" status? And that is excluding those who actually care about the cause. Chances are because of this law the actual exposure of the Russian population to the info on sexual minorities will increase.
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To this day, i still don't understand how immature people can become leaders of countries, or in possesion of seriious power. It's gradeschool fighting on global scale.
(Random list of immature things people will say):
"Being gay is unnatural!"
"Women are second class citizen!"
"Somebody defied my religion!"
"White people are racists!"
________
Seriously, if the leader of a fcking country says or support statements like these, you know your country will take a turn toward the dark ages of ignorance, because he/she will be incapable of respecting the privacy of his citizen...
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On August 02 2013 11:21 YangJia wrote:
It's funny how voraciously people argue in support of homosexuals, claiming to be accepting of all others' ideas then BASH on people that have an opposing view. Bunch of fucking jokers. There is one thing that I do not tolerate and that is intolerance. Problem?
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On August 02 2013 20:14 Steveling wrote:
Putin is a boss.
Go russia!
A sexy sexy, homerotic boss: http://www.buzzfeed.com/copyranter/16-homoerotic-photos-of-vladimir-putin
Anywhoo;
I just don't know what to say to people who are on board with this in any form. It blows my mind that people are okay with the effective elimination of all social support for gay and transgendered people. Why is it okay for a straight couple to hold hands on the street and gays not? Why is it okay for a straight couples to be depicted in the media and it considered breaking the law if gay people are?
Not only that but you can be jailed for speaking out about marriage equality. You can be jailed for being a gay rights advocate! Homosexuals are often severely beaten in russia if they show public affection, what makes this okay? In what way is it morally acceptable to even think of denying a large minority a part of their fundemental identity? To take away all hope of having any normal and happy life because at every turn you must strive to keep a part of you secret.
For the straight people who don't understand what a nightmare this creates for gay people I'll try and give you an analogy. Imagine it is now illegal to talk about how women are attractive, talk about how your date went last night, tell someone you are interested in finding a woman to date, to be seen being close to a woman in public, or even have a date in a public place with a woman. But you're a prudent law abiding citizen and think this is okay but because of these restrictions it is really hard to find a woman and you want to try and find a way to 'manage' this part of yourself but you can't find help because no one wants to go to jail just to help you. Maybe now you want to speak out about it, but you can't because you would go to jail just like that friend who couldn't help you. To top it off if you were to try to spread word random people would physically beat you.
That is fucked up.
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I support Russian decision.
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I admit to not having read this entire thread, but I think this has more to do with the practical nature of security during a big event like the Olympics. I don't know whether or not official Russia persecutes gays, but I do know that there are a lot of Russians that do.
Almost every time you hear of a Pride parade or the like in Russia, you also hear of violent rioting and fighting in the streets. Obviously the authorities want to prevent such a thing happening during the Olympics and this law, while embarassing in western eyes, is pretty much all they can do.
So I don't think the Russian authorities deserve all this condemnation ITT. They just want to get the Olympics off without bullshit and I don't blame them.
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On August 02 2013 21:23 beef42 wrote:
I admit to not having read this entire thread, but I think this has more to do with the practical nature of security during a big event like the Olympics. I don't know whether or not official Russia persecutes gays, but I do know that there are a lot of Russians that do.
Almost every time you hear of a Pride parade or the like in Russia, you also hear of violent rioting and fighting in the streets. Obviously the authorities want to prevent such a thing happening during the Olympics and this law, while embarassing in western eyes, is pretty much all they can do.
So I don't think the Russian authorities deserve all this condemnation ITT. They just want to get the Olympics off without bullshit and I don't blame them.
the law is not done especially for olympia.
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On August 02 2013 20:26 Evilmystic wrote:
As long as Russian so-called elite is free to launder and invest the money that they steal from Russian people in Western countries without any reaction from local authorities whatsoever, shit like this will continue. Russian crooks will continue to buy palaces of gold and marble in London and Nice, their children will continue to study, work and live in Europe and the US, while locally the crackdown on all kinds of freedom and the growth of already widespread corruption and lawlessness will go on too.
That is no way connected to LGBT rights.
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On August 02 2013 21:26 hfglgg wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 21:23 beef42 wrote:
I admit to not having read this entire thread, but I think this has more to do with the practical nature of security during a big event like the Olympics. I don't know whether or not official Russia persecutes gays, but I do know that there are a lot of Russians that do.
Almost every time you hear of a Pride parade or the like in Russia, you also hear of violent rioting and fighting in the streets. Obviously the authorities want to prevent such a thing happening during the Olympics and this law, while embarassing in western eyes, is pretty much all they can do.
So I don't think the Russian authorities deserve all this condemnation ITT. They just want to get the Olympics off without bullshit and I don't blame them. the law is not done especially for olympia.
Yes it is. Fining and detaining foreigners for gay rights agitation? What the hell else would it be for?
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On August 02 2013 21:29 beef42 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 21:26 hfglgg wrote:On August 02 2013 21:23 beef42 wrote:
I admit to not having read this entire thread, but I think this has more to do with the practical nature of security during a big event like the Olympics. I don't know whether or not official Russia persecutes gays, but I do know that there are a lot of Russians that do.
Almost every time you hear of a Pride parade or the like in Russia, you also hear of violent rioting and fighting in the streets. Obviously the authorities want to prevent such a thing happening during the Olympics and this law, while embarassing in western eyes, is pretty much all they can do.
So I don't think the Russian authorities deserve all this condemnation ITT. They just want to get the Olympics off without bullshit and I don't blame them. the law is not done especially for olympia. Yes it is. Fining and detaining foreigners for gay rights agitation? What the hell else would it be for?
the law is in place for a while now (a few weeks). the IOC just stated that during the time of olympia this law would not be enforced (opposoed to the other 50 weeks of the year) which turns out to be not true. its no special anti-gay-olympia law.
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On August 02 2013 21:31 hfglgg wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 21:29 beef42 wrote:On August 02 2013 21:26 hfglgg wrote:On August 02 2013 21:23 beef42 wrote:
I admit to not having read this entire thread, but I think this has more to do with the practical nature of security during a big event like the Olympics. I don't know whether or not official Russia persecutes gays, but I do know that there are a lot of Russians that do.
Almost every time you hear of a Pride parade or the like in Russia, you also hear of violent rioting and fighting in the streets. Obviously the authorities want to prevent such a thing happening during the Olympics and this law, while embarassing in western eyes, is pretty much all they can do.
So I don't think the Russian authorities deserve all this condemnation ITT. They just want to get the Olympics off without bullshit and I don't blame them. the law is not done especially for olympia. Yes it is. Fining and detaining foreigners for gay rights agitation? What the hell else would it be for? the law is in place for a while now (a few weeks). the IOC just stated that during the time of olympia this law would not be enforced (opposoed to the other 50 weeks of the year) which turns out to be not true. its no special anti-gay-olympia law.
It might not say so in the text, but dude. Think about it. Why else would Russian authorities care what foreigners are up to? Note that the law is specifically aimed at foreigners.
Since when does Putin & Co need to legislate to get rid of troublemakers? Remember Pussy Riot?
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well done russia. the olympics is not a place to hold a stupid gay rights rally. try somewhere else.
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On August 02 2013 11:21 YangJia wrote:
It's funny how voraciously people argue in support of homosexuals, claiming to be accepting of all others' ideas then BASH on people that have an opposing view. Bunch of fucking jokers.
To use one's freedom of speech to 'bash' nations that violate human rights is rather different from taking away those rights through legislation. You're the (fucking) joker, or just flat out stupid.
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On August 02 2013 21:33 beef42 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 21:31 hfglgg wrote:On August 02 2013 21:29 beef42 wrote:On August 02 2013 21:26 hfglgg wrote:On August 02 2013 21:23 beef42 wrote:
I admit to not having read this entire thread, but I think this has more to do with the practical nature of security during a big event like the Olympics. I don't know whether or not official Russia persecutes gays, but I do know that there are a lot of Russians that do.
Almost every time you hear of a Pride parade or the like in Russia, you also hear of violent rioting and fighting in the streets. Obviously the authorities want to prevent such a thing happening during the Olympics and this law, while embarassing in western eyes, is pretty much all they can do.
So I don't think the Russian authorities deserve all this condemnation ITT. They just want to get the Olympics off without bullshit and I don't blame them. the law is not done especially for olympia. Yes it is. Fining and detaining foreigners for gay rights agitation? What the hell else would it be for? the law is in place for a while now (a few weeks). the IOC just stated that during the time of olympia this law would not be enforced (opposoed to the other 50 weeks of the year) which turns out to be not true. its no special anti-gay-olympia law. It might not say so in the text, but dude. Think about it. Why else would Russian authorities care what foreigners are up to? Note that the law is specifically aimed at foreigners. Since when does Putin & Co need to legislate to get rid of troublemakers? Remember Pussy Riot?
are you saying that the law is only there for / because of olympia? because if so thats just not true. if they didnt pass this law, there wouldnt even be a discussion about lgbt rights during that time. up until now, russia wasnt overly oppressive against gays when you compare it to other countries like i.e. china.
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Russia hopes everyone will boycot the games now, so that they can win all the medals
Its a conspiracy.
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On August 02 2013 21:36 PerryHooter wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 11:21 YangJia wrote:
It's funny how voraciously people argue in support of homosexuals, claiming to be accepting of all others' ideas then BASH on people that have an opposing view. Bunch of fucking jokers. To use one's freedom of speech to 'bash' nations that violate human rights is rather different from taking away those rights through legislation. You're the (fucking) joker, or just flat out stupid.
so forcing your own normative notion of human rights upon unwilling nations is also acceptable?
see, that turned out well for america did it?
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On August 02 2013 21:37 hfglgg wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 21:33 beef42 wrote:On August 02 2013 21:31 hfglgg wrote:On August 02 2013 21:29 beef42 wrote:On August 02 2013 21:26 hfglgg wrote:On August 02 2013 21:23 beef42 wrote:
I admit to not having read this entire thread, but I think this has more to do with the practical nature of security during a big event like the Olympics. I don't know whether or not official Russia persecutes gays, but I do know that there are a lot of Russians that do.
Almost every time you hear of a Pride parade or the like in Russia, you also hear of violent rioting and fighting in the streets. Obviously the authorities want to prevent such a thing happening during the Olympics and this law, while embarassing in western eyes, is pretty much all they can do.
So I don't think the Russian authorities deserve all this condemnation ITT. They just want to get the Olympics off without bullshit and I don't blame them. the law is not done especially for olympia. Yes it is. Fining and detaining foreigners for gay rights agitation? What the hell else would it be for? the law is in place for a while now (a few weeks). the IOC just stated that during the time of olympia this law would not be enforced (opposoed to the other 50 weeks of the year) which turns out to be not true. its no special anti-gay-olympia law. It might not say so in the text, but dude. Think about it. Why else would Russian authorities care what foreigners are up to? Note that the law is specifically aimed at foreigners. Since when does Putin & Co need to legislate to get rid of troublemakers? Remember Pussy Riot? are you saying that the law is only there for / because of olympia? because if so thats just not true. if they didnt pass this law, there wouldnt even be a discussion about lgbt rights during that time. up until now, russia wasnt overly oppressive against gays when you compare it to other countries like i.e. china.
not official Russia, no. But among common people in the large country there are a lot of conservatives that will hit the streets to fight and throw stones at anyone who is too loudly gay. Surely you've heard of riots at Pride parades. Not only Russia, most of eastern Europe is like this. Pretty widespread culture.
Now cue the olympics. Thousands of foreign athletes, coaches, journalists, tourists, etc etc will come to this town at once. The authorities don't know what will happen. They're worried. They don't want rioting during the Olympics which is a big prestige thing, so they pass this clumsy but symbolic law. They're saying "don't start any shit please, foreigners."
What other motivation could there be for this law, other than keeping shit safe at this event? Why do you think they passed it then? Because Putin hates gays? Dude, then he would round them all up and throw them in jail.
I will repeat; sure it doesn't mention the Olympics in the official text but man. Think. Why else?
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Northern Ireland23759 Posts
On August 02 2013 20:34 Voyage wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 15:16 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 02 2013 15:12 FarmI3oy wrote:
I applaud Russia for standing up in what they believe in.
They aren't restricting gays from being in their country. Just restricting them from making publicly scenes of gayness.
I don't care what anyone says, but since the laws starting getting passed in different states the number of bisexual men and women has increased. The whole thing has just become OK with everyone it seems. Russia hopes to thwart that. What are they thwarting? What moral peril is being averted that necessitates preventing these people from expressing themselves? As to your suggestion that, I don't know people are becoming bisexual because it's trendy or something? Actually what they are thwarting would be russian sovereignty. If you would boycott the olympics because of this law, you should boycott everything russia. If the olympics are hold on russian territory they have the right to enforce their laws. I do not agree with these laws, but I am gonna have to comply if I am in Russia. The Olympics do not impose an exceptional state of peace love and tolerance. "When in Rome, do as the Romans do!" Interesting questions: Why did the Olympic Committee give the games to Russia? (Although I think the law is a recent one) Why are there no prerequisites to host the olympic games regarding human rights etc.?
I was referring to the poster in particular rather than the topic overall.
Because the IOC is corrupt, or it lacks moral/political desires I guess
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Russian Federation266 Posts
On August 02 2013 21:28 ZeRoX-45 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 20:26 Evilmystic wrote:
As long as Russian so-called elite is free to launder and invest the money that they steal from Russian people in Western countries without any reaction from local authorities whatsoever, shit like this will continue. Russian crooks will continue to buy palaces of gold and marble in London and Nice, their children will continue to study, work and live in Europe and the US, while locally the crackdown on all kinds of freedom and the growth of already widespread corruption and lawlessness will go on too. That is no way connected to LGBT rights.
There is a direct connection. Briefly speaking Russian authorities are going with this anti-LGBT agenda in order to win support of conservative and less advanced part of Russian society. It also helps to fuel this external enemy idea, because western civil rights groups and governments criticise our government for violating the civil rights and a part of our society interprets it as an attack on our values and demographic policy.
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EPT
