EPT50% Omniscient
40% groundhog
9% timefreeze
1% deathnote
0% teleport
It comes down to how smart these guys are, and how seriously they will play.
who would win? - Page 21
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Sea_Food
Finland1612 Posts
50% Omniscient 40% groundhog 9% timefreeze 1% deathnote 0% teleport It comes down to how smart these guys are, and how seriously they will play. | ||
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Paljas
Germany6926 Posts
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HaruRH
Singapore2780 Posts
On October 03 2012 19:48 saltywet wrote: how are you, as guy 4, going to find out all the information with 1 question? furthermore, at the beginning of the game no one has any idea what abilities the other guys have, the number of people involved, etc. how is guy 4 (omni) going to find out: 1. abilities of the enemies 2. picture of each enemies' physical features 3. name of each enemy 4. location of each enemy 5. future movements of each enemy with just one question? the only way guy 4 can win is random guess question which allows him to be able to kill guy 5 on the first day such as "what can I do to kill one of my enemies" and the omniscience happens to give him the ability to kill guy 5 his ability is to have an omniscience which gives him the true answer to one question, not to grant wishes, so if he asks for database online with details of his enemies he isn't going to get anything, since more likely than not prior to this game none of the guys are related to eachother, so no database will contain the information of all of the guys. you may get one database for one guy. edit: guy 3 (death note) can win if he commits mass genocide, otherwise guy 5 (GHG) will win. the others don't have a realistic probability of winning Lets analyse the OP properly before you ask theoritical questions. GHG He gets to choose when his 3 days begin, but once it starts, he cannot stop it, he has to do the full time. he gets "100 years worth of days" before the time loop ends. however if he dies on day 1 of a cycle, he will lose all 3 days of time. (this is equivalent to 12'175 resets of the 3-day period) he also gets no warning for when he is out of time, and the world progresses to "day 4" The only way GHG have a chance to win is if he chooses the loop on the very first or second day of the 'game'. If he chooses any other day, there is no way he could even come close to win as he will continuously die on the 5th day (3rd day of his cycle). Also, remember that They get approximately a year to play around with their ability, learn it's ins and outs. With this in mind, know that the omni guy fully understands his powers and know how to ask intelligent questions. Also, since this game is in the 365 days period, there are only 2 ways that this game can go. Let's go through the options and tell me if you agree or not. Scenario 1: Omni guy kills DN guy within 4 days ( by asking 1) What are the other powers 2/3) What is the Death note power/GHG power 4) What is the address of DN guy currently ) and kill the rest within the next day ( by asking 5)where can I find the other's pictures and then trade half his lifespan for a shinigami eye, so he could see the person's name by simply looking at their picture ) . GHG did not select his starting day so therefore, he dies without activating his abilities. Scenario 2: GHG guy activates his abilities on the very first day, causing a repeat on the 1st-3rd day for 12175 cycles. In this cycle, anything can happen, but one thing can never happen: GHG cannot kill either teleport guy or time freezing guy in time as if he chooses to find teleport guy and kill him, the teleport guy could simply teleport out and be fine. So can the time freezing guy. Also, by the example given by OP, it can be concluded that every cycle is different and so, GHG cannot find teleport guy, time freeze guy or DN guy within the 100 years (albeit 100 years of 3 days repeated) when he have NO information of any of them. It will take him more than 3 consecutive days to find DN on random (he could be in his house on the first cycle, but he could also be in a bunker on the next, so on and so forth). Therefore, GHG still cannot win as Omni guy can just do all the things stated in scenario 1 once the cycle ends. There is also no way that DN guy and teleport guy could randomly lynch a person and kill one of the 5 superpowers by accident WITHIN 5 DAYS as 'none of them draw huge attention to themselves' and 'they never meet or become aware of each others existence during this year'. Can you really accidentally kill any of the 4 others randomly by searching some random person on facebook? No. TL;DR Omni guy wins no matter what as GHG cannot kill the rest in time. EDIT: Remember that DN guy have played with his deathnote and knows how to use it, so he do not need to experiment with it and thus, not cause him to be in the limelight for GHG to find him. | ||
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Silencioseu
Cyprus493 Posts
On October 03 2012 14:36 aeroblaster wrote: Here's how I think it will go down. Spoiler, contains solution. Main Solution + Show Spoiler + Day 1 Time Freezer: Korean. Freezes time for 5 hours a day to have time to think. Get's increasingly bored and frustrated. Teleport Guy: Australian. Abuses his teleport ability to mess with people, he doesn't know how it will help while he doesn't know where the other's are. Decides to save time on traveling with it. Death Note Guy: Japanese. Can't do anything, tries to research, comes up with nothing. Omniscient: British. Asks what powers the other guys have. Now he knows if he's safe. He is, for now. He still doesn't know their locations, so he hides until tomorrow. GHG: American. Relives the same days trying to figure out where they are with research, comes up with nothing. Day 2 Omniscient: Asks for the home locations of the others. He is definitely safe, and decides to get on a plane and go after Death Note Guy. The Others still have no leads. Day 3 Omniscient: Asks where Death Note is more specifically to have an easier time finding him now that he's near his apartment. He stalks Death Note and tries to sneaky kill him. He kills him after a long struggle, but has his face caught on camera. The others see Omniscient guy on the news. Death Note guy dead* Teleport Guy: Finally getting a lead, he quickly googles the location of the murder. The news doesn't say specifically, but he finds the name of the building and teleports there with a gun. He sees the broken window of the apartment. He runs in, finds Omniscient with the Death Note and shoots him. Omniscient guy dead* Time Freezer: Lives in Korea and sees that Death Note's murder was in Japan. Knowing Omniscient is there, he takes a short trip to Japan. Arrives and finds Teleport Guy at the building. Freezes time so he can't escape and kills him. Teleport guy dead* GHG: Already knew of the murders and events having already lived the 3 days and seen the news of the murders. Arrives at the perfect time and kills Time Freezer. Time Freezer dead* Groundhog Guy wins. This game is a bit flawed as GHG can't lose. Even if he's killed, his ability to remember in the next cycle gives him more intel than Omniscient. The others have no way of killing all of their opponents and GHG in order to win by being the last one standing. All he has to do to win is wait during the first cycle, and make his trip during the second cycle to kill the last guy alive. However, there is an alternative solution written below in which Omniscient can win. Alternative Solution + Show Spoiler + If Omniscient is rich, he hires assassins around the world to take out the 4 other contestants. All he has to is ask for their coordinates and then tell the assassins. He wins on day 1. If he's not rich, he asks how to get rich. Hires assassins on day 2 and wins. Omniscient wins because he is the last one standing. Remember that even if GhG knows how's his been killed by omniscient and tries to make up a new strategy the next day, omniscient voice will give a different answer on how to kill GHG, because GHG will try for something else, and the voice is all knowing. | ||
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saltywet
Hong Kong1316 Posts
On October 03 2012 20:38 HaruRH wrote: Lets analyse the OP properly before you ask theoritical questions. The only way GHG have a chance to win is if he chooses the loop on the very first or second day of the 'game'. If he chooses any other day, there is no way he could even come close to win as he will continuously die on the 5th day (3rd day of his cycle). Also, remember that exactly, why would he wait one or two days to use his ability? it's obvious to get the most advantage out of this sort of game is to give no room for the enemy to attack, so use the GHG ability immediately at the start of the game. he doesn't need to die at the end of his cycle, the cycles will still keep on going. moreover, if he dies on the first day, the cycles end for him, but if he dies on day 2 or 3, the cycles keep going and he can learn from his mistakes. With this in mind, know that the omni guy fully understands his powers and know how to ask intelligent questions. Also, since this game is in the 365 days period, there are only 2 ways that this game can go. Let's go through the options and tell me if you agree or not. he knows how to ask intelligent questions, it still does not make him all knowing or give him the ability to ask impossible questions. i challenge you to spend one year to think of a single question that answers all possible information about 4 different people. Scenario 1: Omni guy kills DN guy within 4 days ( by asking 1) What are the other powers 2/3) What is the Death note power/GHG power 4) What is the address of DN guy currently ) and kill the rest within the next day ( by asking 5)where can I find the other's pictures and then trade half his lifespan for a shinigami eye, so he could see the person's name by simply looking at their picture ) . GHG did not select his starting day so therefore, he dies without activating his abilities. GHG selects the first day as the starting day, so therefore you lose already. Scenario 2: GHG guy activates his abilities on the very first day, causing a repeat on the 1st-3rd day for 12175 cycles. In this cycle, anything can happen, but one thing can never happen: GHG cannot kill either teleport guy or time freezing guy in time as if he chooses to find teleport guy and kill him, the teleport guy could simply teleport out and be fine. So can the time freezing guy. Also, by the example given by OP, it can be concluded that every cycle is different OP already made it clear that every cycle is not different, the GHG can learn from his mistakes. it only seems different but its due to the actions of GHG that makes each cycle different. it would not be difficult to kill the teleport guy, as he needs to teleport back to the area (return teleport). killing the timefreeze guy would be a more difficult task, however not impossible; the GHG should develop a strategy that forces the time freeze guy to use up all of his time freeze power within the three days, and then guy 1 would be powerless eg: cycle 3 is exactly same as cycle 1, cycle 2 is different because GHG decides to kill someone, altering the timeline. otherwise everything is exactly the same as cycle 1. and so, GHG cannot find teleport guy, time freeze guy or DN guy within the 100 years (albeit 100 years of 3 days repeated) when he have NO information of any of them. It will take him more than 3 days to find DN on random (he could be in his house on the first cycle, but he could also be in a bunker on the next, so on and so forth). Therefore, GHG still cannot win as Omni guy can just do all the things stated in scenario 1 once the cycle ends. ^this whole paragraph is thus useless There is also no way that DN guy and teleport guy could randomly lynch a person and kill one of the 5 superpowers by accident WITHIN 5 DAYS as 'none of them draw huge attention to themselves' and 'they never meet or become aware of each others existence during this year'. Can you really accidentally kill any of the 4 others randomly by searching some random person on facebook? No. Yes. It is possible to cause mass genocide to a nation, if you cite the cause of death for a person as "died due to nationwide nuclear explosion". The teleport guy cannot, however. TL;DR Omni guy wins no matter what as GHG cannot kill the rest in time. you lose, since omni either dies in the mass nuclear explosion caused by death note guy or by GHG eventually finding out everything in the 100 years | ||
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pedduck
Thailand468 Posts
Still, If I have to choose to be 1 of them, I would be the Omniscient. At least I can spread the info that I know to others and let them kill each other. This way at least I have 50/50 chance with the last survivor. | ||
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laszmosis
Australia112 Posts
On October 03 2012 21:07 pedduck wrote: The way I see it, only the Omniscient can find other super human. However, I dont think he can kill 1 and 2. Still, If I have to choose to be 1 of them, I would be the Omniscient. At least I can spread the info that I know to others and let them kill each other. This way at least I have 50/50 chance with the last survivor. If omniscient can kill 3 and get his book, he could kill 1, 2 or any other, because he can use question to reveal identity. | ||
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HaruRH
Singapore2780 Posts
On October 03 2012 21:05 saltywet wrote: exactly, why would he wait one or two days to use his ability? it's obvious to get the most advantage out of this sort of game is to give no room for the enemy to attack, so use the GHG ability immediately at the start of the game. he doesn't need to die at the end of his cycle, the cycles will still keep on going. moreover, if he dies on the first day, the cycles end for him, but if he dies on day 2 or 3, the cycles keep going and he can learn from his mistakes. he knows how to ask intelligent questions, it still does not make him all knowing or give him the ability to ask impossible questions. i challenge you to spend one year to think of a single question that answers all possible information about 4 different people. GHG selects the first day as the starting day, so therefore you lose already. OP already made it clear that every cycle is not different, the GHG can learn from his mistakes. it only seems different but its due to the actions of GHG that makes each cycle different. it would not be difficult to kill the teleport guy, as he needs to teleport back to the area (return teleport). killing the timefreeze guy would be a more difficult task, however not impossible; the GHG should develop a strategy that forces the time freeze guy to use up all of his time freeze power within the three days, and then guy 1 would be powerless eg: cycle 3 is exactly same as cycle 1, cycle 2 is different because GHG decides to kill someone, altering the timeline. otherwise everything is exactly the same as cycle 1. ^this whole paragraph is thus useless Yes. It is possible to cause mass genocide to a nation, if you cite the cause of death for a person as "died due to nationwide nuclear explosion". The teleport guy cannot, however. you lose, since omni either dies in the mass nuclear explosion caused by death note guy or by GHG eventually finding out everything in the 100 years ^ What are the chances that DN guy kills by mass genocide every cycle of the 12175 cycles? What are the chances that GHG finds out the name of 4 complete strangers whom he have no idea of who they even are (only silhouettes known) and what are their powers within a given time? Sorry for the misunderstanding on the GHG's powers, but it still changes nothing. Given that he have to find these people on random, he would have 1/7,000,000,000 chances to find out each person. So, it would be (1/7,000,000,000)^4 = 1 out of 2.401 x 10^39 ) chance that he finds out the identity of each of the 4 people. Moreover, he HAVE to find out the real name of that person, or else he still loses as after the 12175 cycles, he becomes a normal person with the extra knowledge of 100 years. Yes ,it is possible to cause nationwide mass genocide, but not all the 4 others will die. Remember that. What are the chances that #4 becomes witty and ask this question on the first day : tell me what happened on the past cycle? More percentage than the chances of #5 finding the other 4. ALSO: There is no way that the DN guy could cause a mass genocide. Even in the manga/anime, the way that they die via a planned accident is to become psyched and simply commit suicide that way. There is no way that nukes could be used as a method of death as it would require so much permission from so many people that... it is impossible. Unless, the DN guy plans a worldwide nuke assault by mind controlling every single president, army commander, nuclear scientist, owner of said nuke plant, scientists that activates the nuclear missile and many others, WITHIN 3 DAYS. If this doesn't happen, Omni guy still wins. | ||
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laszmosis
Australia112 Posts
Also, it would be near impossible for him to tell when his last cycle has come. He can only use his memory, nothing physical carries him on. Best way that I think of is to write the cycle on your hand at the beginning of each cycle, and remember the cycle number at the end of each one. It is 12175 cycles though, it would be near impossible for anyone to not screw up in all that time though. Think of how many times you have forgotten to do something. Now think of that probability against the number 12175 and you are definitely going to screw up and miss the cycle number. | ||
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saltywet
Hong Kong1316 Posts
On October 03 2012 21:19 HaruRH wrote: What are the chances that DN guy kills by mass genocide every cycle of the 12175 cycles? as long as DN decides to use this strategy, he will do it every single time. then the cycles end because GHG dies. What are the chances that GHG finds out the name of 4 complete strangers who he have no idea of who they even are (only silhouettes known) and what are their powers within a given time? Sorry for the misunderstanding on the GHG's powers, but it still changes nothing. Given that he have to find these people on random, he would have 1/7,000,000,000 chances to find out each person. So, it would be (1/7,000,000,000)^4 chance (such a huge number) that he finds out the identity of each of the 4 people. Moreover, he HAVE to find out the real name of that person, or else he still loses as after the 12175 cycles, he becomes a normal person with the extra knowledge of 100 years. the OP already said that "they all leave signs that would be noticeable if someone were to look for them.". moreover, he can do basic elimination by, on day 2, going to each country/province and seeing if he would be killed. He also doesn't have to kill the other guys with the death note, if he can find out the weaknesses of the others abilities. timefreeze - waste his 5 hours of timefreeze then he will be powerless. teleport - he must make a return teleport to his original location death note - needs name/face omni - useless until cycles end Yes ,it is possible to cause nationwide mass genocide, but not all the 4 others will die. Remember that. What are the chances that #4 becomes witty and ask this question on the first day : tell me what happened on the past cycle? More percentage than the chances of #5 finding the other 4. it's a voice, not a mass of instant knowledge given. so you will waste the entire day listening to the voice talk about the first few minutes of the cycle. besides, it's not impossible, but an improbable question given the circumstances. I said that the people with realistic probabilities of winning are DN guy and guy 5. with nationwide mass genocide, the only person who has the ability to survive is the teleport guy, who would probably disintegrate upon returning the the radioactive land. | ||
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HaruRH
Singapore2780 Posts
On October 03 2012 21:31 saltywet wrote: as long as DN decides to use this strategy, he will do it every single time. then the cycles end because GHG dies. the OP already said that "they all leave signs that would be noticeable if someone were to look for them.". moreover, he can do basic elimination by, on day 2, going to each country/province and seeing if he would be killed. He also doesn't have to kill the other guys with the death note, if he can find out the weaknesses of the others abilities. timefreeze - waste his 5 hours of timefreeze then he will be powerless. teleport - he must make a return teleport to his original location death note - needs name/face omni - useless until cycles end it's a voice, not a mass of instant knowledge given. so you will waste the entire day listening to the voice talk about the first few minutes of the cycle. besides, it's not impossible, but an improbable question given the circumstances. I said that the people with realistic probabilities of winning are DN guy and guy 5. with nationwide mass genocide, the only person who has the ability to survive is the teleport guy, who would probably disintegrate upon returning the the radioactive land. There is no way that the DN guy could cause a mass genocide. Even in the manga/anime, the way that they die via a planned accident is to become psyched and simply commit suicide that way. There is no way that nukes could be used as a method of death as it would require so much permission from so many people that... it is impossible. Unless, the DN guy plans a worldwide nuke assault by mind controlling every single president, army commander, nuclear scientist, owner of said nuke plant, scientists that activates the nuclear missile and many others, WITHIN 3 DAYS. If this doesn't happen, Omni guy still wins. It will take less than an hour for that voice to explain every single happening on the last cycle. And yes, you are correct on that part about them leaving a trace if they were to look for them. However, if the only knowledge he will be given are those silhouettes, there is still no chance that GHG could get any useful information out of his 36500 days of repeated days. He could not even know basic info about them, e.g. their age, sex or language, how would he even begin his search? Based on trial and error? How? Kill every person he meets on the streets? Or kill everyone suspected with superpowers? | ||
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laszmosis
Australia112 Posts
Ofcourse, also, he could also spend a lot of time studying different things that could be useful. | ||
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saltywet
Hong Kong1316 Posts
On October 03 2012 21:43 HaruRH wrote: It will take less than an hour for that voice to explain every single happening on the last cycle. And yes, you are correct on that part about them leaving a trace if they were to look for them. However, if the only knowledge he will be given are those silhouettes, there is still no chance that GHG could get any useful information out of his 36500 days of repeated days. He could not even know basic info about them, e.g. their age, sex or language, how would he even begin his search? Based on trial and error? How? Kill every person he meets on the streets? Or kill everyone suspected with superpowers? the voice would still not tell him about guy 5 or anything that guy 5 knows unless he asks specifically. guy 5 can bait. go to a country's national television, tell them he has super powers and that he will be alone, and if he dies, then theres an enemy. then he can do state by state, region by region so narrowing the number of people he has to go through by a significant amount. death note, timefreeze, teleport guys would have no reason to not try and kill him, since they have abilities to kill without leaving their identity. once he obtains the death note, he can just do trial and error by killing off the entire world with natural disasters. once all of his enemies are dead, he wins, cycles end and he can be god On October 03 2012 21:19 HaruRH wrote: There is no way that the DN guy could cause a mass genocide. Even in the manga/anime, the way that they die via a planned accident is to become psyched and simply commit suicide that way. There is no way that nukes could be used as a method of death as it would require so much permission from so many people that... it is impossible. Unless, the DN guy plans a worldwide nuke assault by mind controlling every single president, army commander, nuclear scientist, owner of said nuke plant, scientists that activates the nuclear missile and many others, WITHIN 3 DAYS. If this doesn't happen, Omni guy still wins. mass nukes are just an example. there are other ways such as earthquake. there are no restrictions on natural disasters in the anime, the only reason why light yagami didnt use this was due to his goal of only eliminating the rotten. | ||
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Clerseri
Australia150 Posts
I'm banking on whoever can get enough money to literally carpet bomb the other countries from the first second of game time. I suspect that omni getting the exact correct lotto numbers/combination bets/roulette answers/stock futures for 365 days could net him a genuine bucketload of cash, and probably in a way where he could stay annonymous. From there, you just have to build up your personal nuclear army :D First question you ask is which cities should I nuke to win the game. | ||
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Orek
1665 Posts
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HaruRH
Singapore2780 Posts
On October 03 2012 21:54 saltywet wrote: the voice would still not tell him about guy 5 or anything that guy 5 knows unless he asks specifically. guy 5 can bait. go to a country's national television, tell them he has super powers and that he will be alone, and if he dies, then theres an enemy. then he can do state by state, region by region so narrowing the number of people he has to go through by a significant amount. death note, timefreeze, teleport guys would have no reason to not try and kill him, since they have abilities to kill without leaving their identity. once he obtains the death note, he can just do trial and error by killing off the entire world with natural disasters. once all of his enemies are dead, he wins, cycles end and he can be god mass nukes are just an example. there are other ways such as earthquake. there are no restrictions on natural disasters in the anime, the only reason why light yagami didnt use this was due to his goal of only eliminating the rotten. How to Use: X 1.“Suicide” is a valid cause of death. Basically, all humans are thought to possess the possibility to commit suicide. It is, therefore, not something “unbelievable to think of." 2.Whether the cause of the individual’s death is either a suicide or accident. If the death leads to the death of more than the intended, the person will simply die of a heart attack. This is to ensure that other lives are not influenced. Deathnote mass killings not possible. | ||
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antilyon
Brazil2546 Posts
On October 03 2012 21:44 laszmosis wrote: Another thought on GHG, could he do martial arts training all that time? Doing progression in training somehow. Are muscle control part of memory? Ofcourse I don't mean muscle strength or anything, but the ability to use a muscle consistently in a certain way (muscle memory). Ofcourse, also, he could also spend a lot of time studying different things that could be useful. I don't think he could do that, he conserve his memories, but muscle memories is body related right? | ||
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Mataza
Germany5364 Posts
On October 03 2012 22:52 antilyon wrote: I don't think he could do that, he conserve his memories, but muscle memories is body related right? If muscle memory is body related, then so is regular memory too. For sake of clarity we can assume(from the groundhog day film) that muscle memory carrier over i.e. perfect card throwing technique(Bill Murray was bored). In case anyone of you forgot, all 5 had time to fuck around with their super powers(god knows what that´s supposed to mean for GHD guy), but during that time they didn´t know about the upcoming deathmatch. So I kinda doubt anyone of them would have stockpiled nukes "just in case". I think however, if we take for granted that every single one of the guys did leave traces you can track them down by, it will again massively favor GHD guy. He has more years at his disposal than anyone of us has lived their entire life. And day 1 everyone starts with the same information except for Voice-guy. Assuming that he cannot win during his 12k cycles because they will still autorevert, he can still gather information, plan ahead and optimize his run. The only who has a reasonable chance to not be surprisekilled from behind is Voiceguy. For all we know GDH guy could use his first 10 years of the cycle to become a badass ninja, then spend the next 60 years gathering information about people since everyone left clues around. Then the rest of the time on planning his perfect schedule to kill the 4 people. | ||
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Grumbels
Netherlands7031 Posts
On October 03 2012 22:52 antilyon wrote: I don't think he could do that, he conserve his memories, but muscle memories is body related right? Memory is body related too, so what's the difference? | ||
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ShatterZer0
United States1843 Posts
Questions: How does time stopping work? Does time still go and everyone is stopped in place (Every plane crashes at once. This also assumes that by the time the battle has begun the entire world is in a gigantic crisis for losing 5 hours per week and having all mechanized travel stop working)? Or is time STOPPED and nothing really works except within his "field of time movement"? Can he extend this field (this one also applies to the Teleporter)? Can the Teleporter teleport into solid objects? Does the teleporter need sight of his place of teleportation? If he doesn't, what's stopping him from grabbing a spoon and thinking "I want to teleport behind one of the other guys with the tip of this spoon being in his cerebellum."? If he does, holy shit his power is fucking useless... Does GHG's body change change in any way but altered brain pathways as he goes through his cycles? In the end it just ends up being like this: GHG is a basically perfect human being in every respect via 100 years of intense training. Batman without money. OmniGuy is a guy with basically unlimited resources. Batman without very much training. Batman Skills vs Batman Money... OmniGuy wins. | ||
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