On March 15 2012 05:36 archonOOid wrote: the problem i have with SC2 is that the e-sports scene has been shoved down people's throats by Blizzard while on the other the e-sports scene in BW was founded by a grassroots movement that slowly built its way in Korea
Secondly the game itself isn't original because it's more like a copy of a original.
thirdly the game-play has been so simplified in stark contrast to the original that it feels watered down.
Fixed.
Oh look, a BW elitist, who'd of thought we'd find one of them in this thread [/sarcasm]
Oh look. Someone who didn't even understand that I was pointing out a double standard set by the poster and my BW elitism was a secondary priority to showing how narrow minded he was. Who'd thought we'd one of them in this thread. [/sarcasm]
On March 14 2012 20:04 NeonFlare wrote: Is the game still stuck on the single viable lane composition?
At the recent IEM in Hanover, several teams showcased a lot of weird lane compositions. M5 in a few games went 1-1-1 with a pure Roamer + Jungler (and CRUSHED some games with it, while playing "standard" in others) and CLG has been known for swapping their duo lane from bottom to top (and even swapping repeatedly) to force weird situations/bad lane matchups on an enemy team.
On March 15 2012 05:36 archonOOid wrote: the problem i have with SC2 is that the e-sports scene has been shoved down people's throats by Blizzard while on the other the e-sports scene in BW was founded by a grassroots movement that slowly built its way in Korea
Secondly the game itself isn't original because it's more like a copy of a original.
thirdly the game-play has been so simplified in stark contrast to the original that it feels watered down.
Fixed.
Oh look, a BW elitist, who'd of thought we'd find one of them in this thread [/sarcasm]
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
I used Soccer Vs Hockey earlier in the thread...
It the same thing really. What is harder running and controlling a ball or skating and controlling a small object with a stick?
Switch out free climbing with Hockey and his arguement is legitimately awesome.
Well hockey you need more coordination/agility, soccer you need more stamina since you're actually running places instead of skidding.
So IDK you can make an argument that either game takes different skill or something
I'm going to assume you have never skated before... much less skated at a hard pace while trying to backcheck/race for a puck if you think Hockey doesn't require stamina.
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
I used Soccer Vs Hockey earlier in the thread...
It the same thing really. What is harder running and controlling a ball or skating and controlling a small object with a stick?
Switch out free climbing with Hockey and his arguement is legitimately awesome.
Well hockey you need more coordination/agility, soccer you need more stamina since you're actually running places instead of skidding.
So IDK you can make an argument that either game takes different skill or something
I'm going to assume you have never skated before... much less skated at a hard pace while trying to backcheck/race for a puck if you think Hockey doesn't require stamina.
He didn't say it didn't. He said it required MORE stamina. Quite the difference.
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
What is chess then? Doesn't require extreme precision nor speed.
Ever heard of the term "think three moves ahead"?
Chess and several other board games have an extreme mental agility requirement because it requires your mind to process a lot of data and recognize extremely complex patterns. A game of chess is actually a rather exhausting experience.
Oh wow, I guess I kind of expected this, but it's still kind of depressing for a sc2 enthusiast like myself. On the bright side, E-sports growing as a whole is good for sc2 as well!
On March 14 2012 20:54 Kickboxer wrote: Keep in mind spectator gaming isn't about which game you like, enjoy or play, or shich game has an insane mechanical skill ceiling. It's about which game your uncle or fiancee can sit down and watch with you and not be utterly confused or bored.
lol is the absolute worst in this. the game is fun, but it's a terrible spectator game.
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
I used Soccer Vs Hockey earlier in the thread...
It the same thing really. What is harder running and controlling a ball or skating and controlling a small object with a stick?
Switch out free climbing with Hockey and his arguement is legitimately awesome.
Well hockey you need more coordination/agility, soccer you need more stamina since you're actually running places instead of skidding.
So IDK you can make an argument that either game takes different skill or something
I'm going to assume you have never skated before... much less skated at a hard pace while trying to backcheck/race for a puck if you think Hockey doesn't require stamina.
I read this and then proceeded to slam my head against the desk really hard.
I think this whole debate has happened thousands of times before, just with different subjects. For anyone with knowledge of latin: "de gustibus non disputatem est" (of taste there can be no argument). It's the same thing as taste in food, I hate mushrooms on a pizza, but some people love them. In the same way, LoL casts bore the hell out of me, but SC2 and BW I find to be fascinating and entertaining. Eventually I may stop liking SC2 or BW, or I may watch LoL casts all the time, but right now I simply want to spend my time watching/playing SC2.
The only other thing I'd like to contribute is that I hope that LoL does very well without taking all the money away from SC2 and BW. The more that large companies see investments into video-game communities as a good thing, the happier I'll be.
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
What is chess then? Doesn't require extreme precision nor speed.
Ever heard of the term "think three moves ahead"?
Chess and several other board games have an extreme mental agility requirement because it requires your mind to process a lot of data and recognize extremely complex patterns. A game of chess is actually a rather exhausting experience.
And unless you're playing time limited turns, how does this in any way relate to extreme precision or speed that he listed? Yea, it doesn't.
Its just bullshit for me.. when i read these words i dont even read rest of this article.
"I guess Koreans are finally starting to get sick of StarCraft II and Fifa Online 2, because League of Legends (LoL) has made its way to the top spot in e-sports "
Its clear to me , that author of this is playing LoL , simple as that
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
I used Soccer Vs Hockey earlier in the thread...
It the same thing really. What is harder running and controlling a ball or skating and controlling a small object with a stick?
Switch out free climbing with Hockey and his arguement is legitimately awesome.
Well hockey you need more coordination/agility, soccer you need more stamina since you're actually running places instead of skidding.
So IDK you can make an argument that either game takes different skill or something
I'm going to assume you have never skated before... much less skated at a hard pace while trying to backcheck/race for a puck if you think Hockey doesn't require stamina.
I read this and then proceeded to slam my head against the desk really hard.
"Soccer you need more stamina"...
I know, that just not true though. If you think pro hockey players average shift time is a minute because they have less stamina than Pro soccer players you just wrong.
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
I used Soccer Vs Hockey earlier in the thread...
It the same thing really. What is harder running and controlling a ball or skating and controlling a small object with a stick?
Switch out free climbing with Hockey and his arguement is legitimately awesome.
Well hockey you need more coordination/agility, soccer you need more stamina since you're actually running places instead of skidding.
So IDK you can make an argument that either game takes different skill or something
I'm going to assume you have never skated before... much less skated at a hard pace while trying to backcheck/race for a puck if you think Hockey doesn't require stamina.
I read this and then proceeded to slam my head against the desk really hard.
"Soccer you need more stamina"...
I think where that comes from is that people don't actually realize that you still have to put in energy to accelerate, decelerate and change directions while skating. Also, soccer players are on the pitch for ~48 minutes at a time, but the thing is, they are standing, walking, or slow jog for probably 80% of that time. Average first liners in hockey get 25-30% icetime, but they are expected to be going damn near 100% for their icetime.
On March 15 2012 05:25 Juicyfruit wrote: People just have such difficulty understanding that competition is driven by the players, and that any seemingly easy task can be made challenging when you are trying to outplay another human being.
As I previously posted, if being intrinsically "harder" makes for better sports, then soccer would you be your "casual" and free climbing would be your 400APM hardcore games, and that we should all be trashing soccer for being an illegitimate sports because kicking a ball is so damn simple.
Are you kidding? Have you ever played sports before? I don't even like soccer that much but I recognize the skill you need to be good at it. It takes incredible footwork and stamina. There's nothing like that in games so they have to be either about extreme precision or speed and lol has none of that. It only has teamwork which any game with team play has.
What is chess then? Doesn't require extreme precision nor speed.
Ever heard of the term "think three moves ahead"?
Chess and several other board games have an extreme mental agility requirement because it requires your mind to process a lot of data and recognize extremely complex patterns. A game of chess is actually a rather exhausting experience.
Chess is easily the best game on the planet, imo, with no exceptions. I don't like to call it a, "sport," necesarilly, but it is the most competetive thing I've ever experienced. You don't need speed, precision, or real "multi-tasking," (though you're required to keep multiple factors/ideas in your head for long periods of time), but if its requirements for strategy, thinking, mental endurance, and analysis are not the epitome of a competetive mental game, I could not begin to fathom what is. The only imbalance in that game is arguably white vs. black.
If you think how jacked you are has anything to do with stamina you're just wrong too. I don't even care in the slightest about Hockey or Soccer. I think they both are a horrific bore. But soccer cleats don't have something attached to the bottom to allow them to glide across the grass, hockey does.
On March 15 2012 06:01 tetsuosc wrote: i dont want to live on this planet anymore.
really? thats your first post on tl.net? i mean really?
@topic great to hear lol getting bigger in korea. can absolutely see why the koreans with their pc bangs could really like league of legends. riot is doing a great job promoting their game. they should be an example for any game developer who wants to grow the competitive community.
![[image loading]](http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg687/scaled.php?server=687&filename=lidsw.jpg&res=medium)
![[image loading]](http://images.paraorkut.com/img/soccer/images/r/ronaldinho-854.jpg)
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