On March 15 2012 01:25 LlamaNamedOsama wrote: On the other hand, there's a clear difference between SC2 and LoL. LoL is a bunch of heroes fighting along three corridors lined with towers, where troops automatically spawn in regular intervals. Please tell me where, anywhere in reality, a person thinks of war as a bunch of people earning money from every kill in order to buy combat-enhancing items that allow them to destroy towers and therefore defeat the opposing faction.
Because war is CLEARLY better defined as having training facilities that churn out one soldier at a time, in regular intervals.
Or people running faster because they have a knife pulled out instead of a pistol, and shoot people in the head with sniper rifles while jumping through hallways.
People need to actually read posts before responding to them. The paragraph immediately after very clearly explained:
On March 15 2012 01:25 LlamaNamedOsama wrote:Now, I'll grant that LoL still in some senses simulates war, that spawns are supposed to be the small sampling of squads in a larger army and so on, but the degree in which it abstracts war is without a doubt much less intuitive to a third party than the traditional RTS of gathering resources and building and army.
Figured this was coming, LoL is extremely accessible to casual online gamers and perfectly fun to watch for a lot of people. Ever since Riot expanded to Korea it's only been gaining popularity.
On March 15 2012 01:23 Juicyfruit wrote: Then you've just proven how difficult the game is, as the people who dedicated such a large portion of their time to a game havn't even begun to scratch the surface of optimizing their gameplay.
maybe if good people bothered with the game we would see a difference.
On March 15 2012 01:25 Josh111 wrote: LOL, your proud for getting to 1500 elo? You do realize 1500 ELO when comparing it to high level play is a joke right? 1500 is comparable to low plat.
proud? no.
but top 10% of the active ranked playerbase is still top 10% of a large player base.
I managed to do this while, and this is the important part, having almost no time to play the game because I was busy with graduate school.
why?
because the game is pathetically easy and the people who play it are stupid.
see when you hear it from someone who spends 40 hours a week streaming, it's ok. but when you hear it from someone else, it's not. I mean I get it, you like the game and you have deluded yourself into thinking it's a good competitive game so when someone points out an inconvenient reality it's much easier to just attack them then to be introspective and think about why people feel that way.
all Im saying is that no one has to have this conversation about DotA 2.
correct me if im wrong (too lazy to go sc2 ranks) but wouldnt as a diamond player I would top 15% (or maybe 10%) of sc2 and i devote very LITTLE time to playing sc2. Infact i spend or time playing lol and i am just hitting 1400 elo. Sc2 is not easy, its just getting in the top 15% or 10% isnt hard...
On March 15 2012 01:37 LF9 wrote: You guys are looking at this ALL wrong. It's no longer just about Korea. This shit is worldwide now, that's all.
SC2 is easily the #1 esport, i have no idea why people are taking an opinion piece from a mainstream retard as gospel. Look at what is going on worldwide. What is happening is that korea IS big on esports, but the COMPETITIVE esports scene is no longer SOLELY in korea. it has exploded onto the world map, where players are moving OUT of korea to compete in bigger money, more prestigious USA based and European leagues and tournaments. Korea is like the breeding ground for all the good players, like college football is for the NFL, then once they get really good in GSL they start going to MLG and IEM and all that to make money and get famous worldwide. basically, korean players are starting to look OUTWARD at the possibility of a huge worldwide fanbase (and money) the way foreign SC players/fans used to look INWARD at them. which obviously signifies an explosion of growth and popularity in esports. it's no longer solely confined to one country, and is gaining momentum in the outside world. why might Laugh out Loud be more popular in korea? maybe because korean companies can no longer keep up with all the foreign money being dumped into REAL, COMPETITIVE esports. Which is obviously a good thing.
Numbers don't support this from what I know.
And the players in SC2 are moving out from Korea because Korea doesn't give a shit about SC2 compared to other games such as BW and LoL.
On March 15 2012 01:37 setzer wrote: SC2 vs LoL aside I would like to know from those who play LoL competitively and follow pro LoL what makes their game better suited as the ultimate MOBA e-sport.
Looking at BW, CS, Quake it is quite obvious those three are the deepest, most competitive, and most challenging of their genre, thus happening to be the most successful in e-sports. Where exactly does LoL distinguish itself in gameplay apart from DotA as a competitive title? I've played about 600 games of LoL and have yet to see why it should be LoL, and not DotA, that carries the MOBA genre as a true competitive title.
It's more popular.
You guys aren't understanding something - eSports follows success, not the other way around. A game built for eSport, but which doesn't draw in the casual audience, will fail. Sponsors flock to the games that have the biggest potential market and right now Riot has the market cornered.
If Dota 2 overtakes LoL in popularity Dota 2 will be the premier eSport. If not, LoL will be.
On March 15 2012 01:37 LF9 wrote: You guys are looking at this ALL wrong. It's no longer just about Korea. This shit is worldwide now, that's all.
SC2 is easily the #1 esport, i have no idea why people are taking an opinion piece from a mainstream retard as gospel. Look at what is going on worldwide. What is happening is that korea IS big on esports, but the COMPETITIVE esports scene is no longer SOLELY in korea. it has exploded onto the world map, where players are moving OUT of korea to compete in bigger money, more prestigious USA based and European leagues and tournaments. Korea is like the breeding ground for all the good players, like college football is for the NFL, then once they get really good in GSL they start going to MLG and IEM and all that to make money and get famous worldwide. basically, korean players are starting to look OUTWARD at the possibility of a huge worldwide fanbase (and money) the way foreign SC players/fans used to look INWARD at them. which obviously signifies an explosion of growth and popularity in esports. it's no longer solely confined to one country, and is gaining momentum in the outside world. why might Laugh out Loud be more popular in korea? maybe because korean companies can no longer keep up with all the foreign money being dumped into REAL, COMPETITIVE esports. Which is obviously a good thing.
not sure why you're bringing global scene when the scope of this discussion is korea but okay
On March 15 2012 01:25 LlamaNamedOsama wrote: On the other hand, there's a clear difference between SC2 and LoL. LoL is a bunch of heroes fighting along three corridors lined with towers, where troops automatically spawn in regular intervals. Please tell me where, anywhere in reality, a person thinks of war as a bunch of people earning money from every kill in order to buy combat-enhancing items that allow them to destroy towers and therefore defeat the opposing faction.
Because war is CLEARLY better defined as having training facilities that churn out one soldier at a time, in regular intervals.
Or people running faster because they have a knife pulled out instead of a pistol, and shoot people in the head with sniper rifles while jumping through hallways.
I lol'ed so hard at this
So much unreasonable hate towards LoL as if it molested your kids...
FACT: there are millions of people out there in the world who enjoy playing LoL, and it has become big in Korea due to it being free and OGN becoming a major promoter (the new LoL tourney is now taking place of the old OSL timeslot). No amount of nerd rage here about it being too easy/lacking skill/not similar to real warfare (LOL) will change that.
On March 15 2012 01:39 coddan wrote: All the exchange services I can find, as well as Google's built-in currency conversion tool, says that 2 billion won is 1.8 million dollars. Where do you find that 2,000,000,000 KRW is 180,000 USD? The conversion rate Kotaku reports also matches with the GSL KRW/USD prize money. Are you sure you are correct about it being a mistranslation?
Sorry i can't count in english lol 8 zeros so 0.2 billion, not 2... my bad lol
On March 15 2012 01:37 LF9 wrote: You guys are looking at this ALL wrong. It's no longer just about Korea. This shit is worldwide now, that's all.
SC2 is easily the #1 esport, i have no idea why people are taking an opinion piece from a mainstream retard as gospel. Look at what is going on worldwide. What is happening is that korea IS big on esports, but the COMPETITIVE esports scene is no longer SOLELY in korea. it has exploded onto the world map, where players are moving OUT of korea to compete in bigger money, more prestigious USA based and European leagues and tournaments. Korea is like the breeding ground for all the good players, like college football is for the NFL, then once they get really good in GSL they start going to MLG and IEM and all that to make money and get famous worldwide. basically, korean players are starting to look OUTWARD at the possibility of a huge worldwide fanbase (and money) the way foreign SC players/fans used to look INWARD at them. which obviously signifies an explosion of growth and popularity in esports. it's no longer solely confined to one country, and is gaining momentum in the outside world. why might Laugh out Loud be more popular in korea? maybe because korean companies can no longer keep up with all the foreign money being dumped into REAL, COMPETITIVE esports. Which is obviously a good thing.
No, I actually think LoL is bigger than SC2. Look at the viewer numbers, they are ridiculous! People say that the stream is open in the game client, but it's a bit iffy as to whether this actually counts as a viewer. And individual players that stream often get 30k+ viewers. I don't play LoL but we can't just lie to ourselves. I think SC2 has much better infrastructure in terms of like tournaments and what-not, as aren't most LoL tourneys paid for by Riot?
On March 15 2012 01:37 setzer wrote: SC2 vs LoL aside I would like to know from those who play LoL competitively and follow pro LoL what makes their game better suited as the ultimate MOBA e-sport.
Looking at BW, CS, Quake it is quite obvious those three are the deepest, most competitive, and most challenging of their genre, thus happening to be the most successful in e-sports. Where exactly does LoL distinguish itself in gameplay apart from DotA as a competitive title? I've played about 600 games of LoL and have yet to see why it should be LoL, and not DotA, that carries the MOBA genre as a true competitive title.
It's more popular. Simple.
You guys aren't understanding something - eSports follows success, not the other way around. A game built for eSport, but which doesn't draw in the casual audience, will fail. Sponsors flock to the games that have the biggest potential market and right now Riot has the market cornered.
If Dota 2 overtakes LoL in popularity Dota 2 will be the premier eSport. If not, LoL will be.
On March 15 2012 01:39 coddan wrote: All the exchange services I can find, as well as Google's built-in currency conversion tool, says that 2 billion won is 1.8 million dollars. Where do you find that 2,000,000,000 KRW is 180,000 USD? The conversion rate Kotaku reports also matches with the GSL KRW/USD prize money. Are you sure you are correct about it being a mistranslation?
Sorry i can't count in english lol 8 zeros so 0.2 billion, not 2... my bad lol
On March 15 2012 01:37 LF9 wrote: You guys are looking at this ALL wrong. It's no longer just about Korea. This shit is worldwide now, that's all.
SC2 is easily the #1 esport, i have no idea why people are taking an opinion piece from a mainstream retard as gospel. Look at what is going on worldwide. What is happening is that korea IS big on esports, but the COMPETITIVE esports scene is no longer SOLELY in korea. it has exploded onto the world map, where players are moving OUT of korea to compete in bigger money, more prestigious USA based and European leagues and tournaments. Korea is like the breeding ground for all the good players, like college football is for the NFL, then once they get really good in GSL they start going to MLG and IEM and all that to make money and get famous worldwide. basically, korean players are starting to look OUTWARD at the possibility of a huge worldwide fanbase (and money) the way foreign SC players/fans used to look INWARD at them. which obviously signifies an explosion of growth and popularity in esports. it's no longer solely confined to one country, and is gaining momentum in the outside world. why might Laugh out Loud be more popular in korea? maybe because korean companies can no longer keep up with all the foreign money being dumped into REAL, COMPETITIVE esports. Which is obviously a good thing.
Numbers don't support this from what I know.
And the players in SC2 are moving out from Korea because Korea doesn't give a shit about SC2 compared to other games such as BW and LoL.
It's about what you think #1 Esport means. If it's higest amount of tournaments and prize money overall than it's SC2. If it's highest amount of viewer than it's LoL.
honestly LoL will blow all the other games out of the water in way of people watching/participation. With that said I still think sc2 is a much more challenging game which is why (masses of people) wont enjoy it and like the LoL aspect
I play SC2 and LoL, I will continue to play both because I like them. Granted, in my personal opinion I probably like SC2 a little more but that doesn't mean anything in terms of my relationship to LoL. Some of these arguments are like saying, I drive a Chevrolet, you drive a Ford, every time I hear something about a Ford I'm going to tell you how bad your car is and how much better mine is. Really, it's all about preference and I know the latter example happens quite a bit. I guess people are just overly opinionated when they don't need to me.
On March 15 2012 01:39 coddan wrote: All the exchange services I can find, as well as Google's built-in currency conversion tool, says that 2 billion won is 1.8 million dollars. Where do you find that 2,000,000,000 KRW is 180,000 USD? The conversion rate Kotaku reports also matches with the GSL KRW/USD prize money. Are you sure you are correct about it being a mistranslation?
Sorry i can't count in english lol 8 zeros so 0.2 billion, not 2... my bad lol
On March 15 2012 01:39 coddan wrote: All the exchange services I can find, as well as Google's built-in currency conversion tool, says that 2 billion won is 1.8 million dollars. Where do you find that 2,000,000,000 KRW is 180,000 USD? The conversion rate Kotaku reports also matches with the GSL KRW/USD prize money. Are you sure you are correct about it being a mistranslation?
Sorry i can't count in english lol 8 zeros so 0.2 billion, not 2... my bad lol
EPT
