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On October 28 2011 08:11 ayaz2810 wrote:
"I don't understand why religion still exists at all. Thousands of years.... so much knowledge gained... and yet we as a race still cling to faith in invisible sky wizards. What kind of all powerful being creates AN ENTIRE UNIVERSE, shows up briefly thousands of years ago to fuck with his creations, and then disappears. Then, to top it all off. This absentee god demands worship and respect.. even though he is all powerful and all knowing. Think about that. ALL POWERFUL. As in, he can literally do anything. Create universes. Turn back time. Give everyone 2 heads. And... ALL KNOWING. He knows what you have done, are doing, and will do. Yet he threatens you with eternal damnation. Why if he already knows what you will do? The logic of religious people just baffles me. It is sad that so many people dedicate their lives to their imaginary gods instead of living their lives and truly thinking for themselves. People wonder why atheists are such dicks. I'll tell you why: It's because we have to watch religious people walk around like braindead zombies. Passing the disease of religion onto their children and communities, while we know the truth. It's frustrating as shit.
Fuck religion. It's a business and it's a dirty one to boot. Enlighten yourselves and grow the fuck up."
Just want to quote this as it pretty much encompasses my view entirely, although I don't think this has much to do with this particular incident - it is so true none the less.
On the video however, it's fucking horrible. That wasn't a "school fight", that was a larger, stronger kid picking on a weaker, smaller kid. Bullying, extreme physical bullying. I think this whole hate crime stuff is total bullshit though, if everyone is equal (Which is what I believe.) why is a hate crime seen as worse? Makes no sense.
Kid should get some serious repercussions for what he did though, I still can't get over how brutal it was - I mean i've seen people lose fights badly, but he got him on the ground, got on top of him and STILL didn't stop.. It was like the gay guy had raped and killed his entire family or something, totally crazy. He has something wrong with him, seriously. Normal people don't do that.
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I swear, this retard deserves so much more than a three day suspension. When I was in high school, someone got a week suspension for stepping on another kid's shoelaces and tripping him. That same year, someone got expelled for ramming another student's head into a locker. Then a student assaults another for no other reason than sexual orientation and gets THREE DAYS?! Whoever decided that must either really not care or surely sympathizes with the bully. Where is Casey when you need him?
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On October 28 2011 08:05 WTFZerg wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2011 07:59 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:52 WTFZerg wrote:On October 28 2011 07:49 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:46 WTFZerg wrote:I used to make kids like this (the bully) lives living hell in high school. Be a dick all you want, just don't pick on people smaller than you because you have some kind of massive inferiority complex. Seeing as how we can't just cane the shit out of the kid like they do in Singapore, have him tried as an adult for premeditated aggravated assault. Little bastard. On October 28 2011 07:45 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:42 Millitron wrote:On October 28 2011 07:37 Whitewing wrote:
Hate crime, throw the kid in prison. I don't like the term "Hate crime". Aren't all crimes hate crimes? The term makes it seem like some crimes are worse than others just because the victim belonged to a minority. What difference does it make that the victim was gay, and targeted because of this? If justice actually IS blind, it can't be reasonably taken into account. Hate crime is a legal term (at least in sweden), and its used when someone attacks you for either you sexuality or you ethnicity and maybe someting more(edit, see above post)... It doesnt have to be a minority, if 3 black kids beat up a white kid just because he is white they will be charge with hate crime. I actually think the law makes perfect sense. "Hate crimes" are a stupid concept that only further the ideology that people are different from one another. No its not.. Its there to make sure that we dont see one different better then the other different. We are different, its not a problem, the problem is when people like this(the bully) beats up/murders people for being different. Thats why its good to have a law that makes the crimes worse. So if I kill someone who is straight, and you kill someone who is gay, you've committed a worse crime? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. You clearly missed the point about it not automatically being a hate crime if its towards a minority. Its just as discrimination, but on a broader(worse) scale. If you kick someone out of your restaurant just b/c he wheres a t-shirt with a sportteam you dont like, and if you kick someone out of your restaurant b/c he is black... which one is worse? The law is there to make sure that we dont tolerate doing bad things to people just for being different. I can kick someone out of my privately owned restaurant for whatever I want, so bad example. Hate crime-laws are stupid. There is no reason to discriminate between sexual orientation or race in criminal law. Murder is murder, assault is assault, and robbery is robbery. And I'm pretty sure the U.S. Supreme Court ruled in basically the same way.
not at all
there is 1st and 2nd degree murder, also murder based on heat of the moment and murder which was planned. heat of moment carries less harsh punishment. Premeditated murder largely based on how you killed the person and you're reasons for it. There is also murder while in self defense which varies from state to state. Ofc legally speaking there is murder and manslaughter. There is also lawful murder in which say a state police officer kills a bank robber or being put on death row. There is ever variable taken into account when sentencing. And Hate crimes are on the books in the US by the states not the fed i do not know why you said US supreme court rules the same way becuase what they ruled is that they don't have jurisdiction over a personal crime as it doesn't pertain to dealing with interstate matters and thus it's a state's issue.
On October 28 2011 08:20 DeathIncarna wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2011 07:59 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:52 WTFZerg wrote:On October 28 2011 07:49 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:46 WTFZerg wrote:I used to make kids like this (the bully) lives living hell in high school. Be a dick all you want, just don't pick on people smaller than you because you have some kind of massive inferiority complex. Seeing as how we can't just cane the shit out of the kid like they do in Singapore, have him tried as an adult for premeditated aggravated assault. Little bastard. On October 28 2011 07:45 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:42 Millitron wrote:On October 28 2011 07:37 Whitewing wrote:
Hate crime, throw the kid in prison. I don't like the term "Hate crime". Aren't all crimes hate crimes? The term makes it seem like some crimes are worse than others just because the victim belonged to a minority. What difference does it make that the victim was gay, and targeted because of this? If justice actually IS blind, it can't be reasonably taken into account. Hate crime is a legal term (at least in sweden), and its used when someone attacks you for either you sexuality or you ethnicity and maybe someting more(edit, see above post)... It doesnt have to be a minority, if 3 black kids beat up a white kid just because he is white they will be charge with hate crime. I actually think the law makes perfect sense. "Hate crimes" are a stupid concept that only further the ideology that people are different from one another. No its not.. Its there to make sure that we dont see one different better then the other different. We are different, its not a problem, the problem is when people like this(the bully) beats up/murders people for being different. Thats why its good to have a law that makes the crimes worse. So if I kill someone who is straight, and you kill someone who is gay, you've committed a worse crime? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. You clearly missed the point about it not automatically being a hate crime if its towards a minority. Its just as discrimination, but on a broader(worse) scale. If you kick someone out of your restaurant just b/c he wheres a t-shirt with a sportteam you dont like, and if you kick someone out of your restaurant b/c he is black... which one is worse? The law is there to make sure that we dont tolerate doing bad things to people just for being different. Yeah, but kicking out someone for wearing a t-shirt with a sports team that you don't like isn't illegal, where as racial discrimination is.
You have to be arbitrarily discriminated on not specially called out, also being a race is a federally protected class. But that's only when refusing service, you can however hand out discounts and treat your customers differently.
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The mom is pressing charges. The school cannot press charges against the bully since they aren't the victim, they could however expel him, and it's not uncommon for schools to suspend a student and roll that into expulsion, using the suspension period to investigate if the issue warrants more action.
I doubt this ends with 3 days of suspension, I was suspended for 3 days in 11th grade for lightly kicking an empty plastic garbage can over in a field... el oh el >.>
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"It gets better" though, right guys?
So much ugliness 
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People voted for no punishment? The fuck is wrong with you guys.
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On October 28 2011 08:20 DeathIncarna wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2011 07:59 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:52 WTFZerg wrote:On October 28 2011 07:49 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:46 WTFZerg wrote:I used to make kids like this (the bully) lives living hell in high school. Be a dick all you want, just don't pick on people smaller than you because you have some kind of massive inferiority complex. Seeing as how we can't just cane the shit out of the kid like they do in Singapore, have him tried as an adult for premeditated aggravated assault. Little bastard. On October 28 2011 07:45 aderum wrote:On October 28 2011 07:42 Millitron wrote:On October 28 2011 07:37 Whitewing wrote:
Hate crime, throw the kid in prison. I don't like the term "Hate crime". Aren't all crimes hate crimes? The term makes it seem like some crimes are worse than others just because the victim belonged to a minority. What difference does it make that the victim was gay, and targeted because of this? If justice actually IS blind, it can't be reasonably taken into account. Hate crime is a legal term (at least in sweden), and its used when someone attacks you for either you sexuality or you ethnicity and maybe someting more(edit, see above post)... It doesnt have to be a minority, if 3 black kids beat up a white kid just because he is white they will be charge with hate crime. I actually think the law makes perfect sense. "Hate crimes" are a stupid concept that only further the ideology that people are different from one another. No its not.. Its there to make sure that we dont see one different better then the other different. We are different, its not a problem, the problem is when people like this(the bully) beats up/murders people for being different. Thats why its good to have a law that makes the crimes worse. So if I kill someone who is straight, and you kill someone who is gay, you've committed a worse crime? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. You clearly missed the point about it not automatically being a hate crime if its towards a minority. Its just as discrimination, but on a broader(worse) scale. If you kick someone out of your restaurant just b/c he wheres a t-shirt with a sportteam you dont like, and if you kick someone out of your restaurant b/c he is black... which one is worse? The law is there to make sure that we dont tolerate doing bad things to people just for being different. Yeah, but kicking out someone for wearing a t-shirt with a sports team that you don't like isn't illegal, where as racial discrimination is.
But you did understand what point i was trying to make though? Maybe i should have said firing someone for liking a different team vs being black? Then you see what point i am making?
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Crimes should be punished for the act, not the motivation. We are not omniscient and should not pretend to be. The entire principle behind a 'hate' crime is dangerous. That said, of course this should be punished.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
On October 28 2011 08:12 Gorguts wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2011 08:10 Plexa wrote:
These are kids guys... they will pick on people for being different. Be it because you have a dumb haircut, are asian or in this case your sexual orientation. I don't really think this is a hate crime, rather your standard bullying story - person is different, they get picked on for being different. 3 day suspension sounds inline with your standard bullying offence, so the punishment fits the crime. Obviously if there was any hint of a repeat offender then harsher punishments are called for. punishment fits the crime my ASS. The kid got a concussion if he was beat any harder he would've had brain damage. The kid needs some counseling. I got expelled from high school for smoking weed and I had to go to counseling before I got let back in!
Counselling is good too. I don't know where you grew up by I've had kids get concussions from bullying and the bullies weren't expelled.
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On October 28 2011 08:11 ayaz2810 wrote:Fuck religion. It's a business and it's a dirty one to boot. Enlighten yourselves and grow the fuck up."
While I agree, I nevertheless support the right of people to believe what they wish, no matter how stupid. The solution is to educate, not to ban free thought.
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On October 28 2011 08:20 ZealotMaster wrote:
...
First, hate crimes may be reflective of a widely held view that people of a certain race, gender, religion or sexual orientation are somehow inferior or "less of a human being" that other people. ...
And hate crime legislation just furthers that by suggesting that the minority needs extra protection than the general populace.
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3 day suspension is a serious joke. I'm surprised the victim wasn't seriously injured because it looked like the guy was just going to town on him hitting him as hard as he could over and over.
He should go to juvenile hall or prison for kiddies w/e it's called.
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United States5162 Posts
On October 28 2011 08:26 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2011 08:12 Gorguts wrote:On October 28 2011 08:10 Plexa wrote:
These are kids guys... they will pick on people for being different. Be it because you have a dumb haircut, are asian or in this case your sexual orientation. I don't really think this is a hate crime, rather your standard bullying story - person is different, they get picked on for being different. 3 day suspension sounds inline with your standard bullying offence, so the punishment fits the crime. Obviously if there was any hint of a repeat offender then harsher punishments are called for. punishment fits the crime my ASS. The kid got a concussion if he was beat any harder he would've had brain damage. The kid needs some counseling. I got expelled from high school for smoking weed and I had to go to counseling before I got let back in! Counselling is good too. I don't know where you grew up by I've had kids get concussions from bullying and the bullies weren't expelled.
Which is completely wrong. I'm not one of those people who thinks kids getting picked on in school is some reprehensible offense, but when you 100% assault someone, you should be prosecuted.
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On October 28 2011 08:26 sunprince wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2011 08:11 ayaz2810 wrote:Fuck religion. It's a business and it's a dirty one to boot. Enlighten yourselves and grow the fuck up." While I agree, I nevertheless support the right of people to believe what they wish, no matter how stupid. The solution is to educate, not to ban free thought.
I agree. I would never dream of making religion illegal or anything. Please don't misunderstand.
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i don't agree that the answer is a harsher punishment (someone posted that bullies should be executed? lol?). i think this kid (the bully) obviously needs help. comparing this with anecdotes about students being punished for lesser offenses doesn't really prove anything.
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Kids fight over stupid shit all the time and it would be silly to actually press charges against bullying like this. I guess they should get something extra just for the specific reason behind the bullying, but seriously, actual police involvement is silly.
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Bullying and social manipulation definitely isn't punished enough in schools in general, regardless of the motivations
I've had people perform straight up aggravated assault on me, which an adult would get years in jail for
In school there is little to no punishment, usually the victim is equally punished
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The bully should be put to death. Shrug. People with this kind of complex, most likely have serious issues, and will most likey never contribute to society in a postive way. Don't waste money, time, breath on him and put him down.
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On October 28 2011 08:30 Odal wrote:
Kids fight over stupid shit all the time and it would be silly to actually press charges against bullying like this. I guess they should get something extra just for the specific reason behind the bullying, but seriously, actual police involvement is silly.
So.. did you watch the video? that was not a "fight"... that was assault on someone who was completely defense less.
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Punitive punishments are extremely ineffective. Restorative justice focused on rehabilitation is the way to go.
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EPT
