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CERN finds neutrinos faster than light

Forum Index > General Forum
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Sanitarium14
Profile Joined April 2010
United States141 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-25 01:05:51
September 22 2011 19:33 GMT
#1
Just hit BBC news. Does this mess with all of science?

Physics kids at the universty claim that neutrinos have always been able to violate natural laws because the really do not exist, or we cannot percieve them. Or I shouldn't listen to my roomate

Taken from the BBC website

Neutrinos sent through the ground from Cern toward the Gran Sasso laboratory 732km away seemed to show up a tiny fraction of a second early.

The result - which threatens to upend a century of physics - will be put online for scrutiny by other scientists.

In the meantime, the group says it is being very cautious about its claims.

"We tried to find all possible explanations for this," said report author Antonio Ereditato of the Opera collaboration.

"We wanted to find a mistake - trivial mistakes, more complicated mistakes, or nasty effects - and we didn't," he told BBC News.

"When you don't find anything, then you say 'Well, now I'm forced to go out and ask the community to scrutinise this."


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-15017484

Edit: Did some further research into the Japanese research facilites on the reasearch of these muon neutrinos
Website: http://jnusrv01.kek.jp/public/t2k/
Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T2K_experiment
Some other press releases from CERN: http://press.web.cern.ch/press/PressReleases/Releases2010/PR08.10E.html

I have no idea what this means, I should update this is the information the Japanese experiment has garnered, but I only have an interest in physics if somebody could describe what is in this, it would be much appreciated. :
http://jnusrv01.kek.jp/public/t2k/sites/default/files/t2k-nue1st.pdf

Edit 2: It may have actually been Gran Sasso working on this project in conjucture with CERN, or they were relaying information, its not quite clear.

Source for Gran Sasso (thanks Stealthblue) http://www.nature.com/news/2011/110922/full/news.2011.554.html

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


This new program is called OPER (Oscillation Project with Emulsion-tRacking Apparatus)

Edit 3: It seems to all come from this guys blog post, which has since been taken down, and what do you know, he has since taken the information off. Here is the google cache of what he said.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?sclient=psy-ab&hl=en&w=fd0a4525,deb929bb&sig=R6oVQRndSqRxImKDgqX9rQ--&biw=1366&bih=624&source=hp&q=cache:www.science20.com/quantum_diaries_survivor/sixsigma_signal_superluminal_neutrinos_opera-82744&pbx=1&oq=cache:www.science20.com/quantum_diaries_survivor/sixsigma_signal_superluminal_neutrinos_opera-82744&aq=f&aqi=&aql=1&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=9030l13537l1l13839l13l11l6l0l0l2l486l1902l2-1.2.2l11l0


Edit number 4: Somebody found a more scientific article for those of you who dislike sensationalist main stream papers. (Thanks ArcMan)
http://news.sciencemag.org/sciencenow/2011/09/neutrinos-travel-faster-than-lig.html?ref=hp

ALSO, CERN is having a press conference tomorrow to annouce their findings which got leaked, time is tomorrow 16:00 to 18:00 CET, which is 10:00 AM EST (Thanks Gullberg)

http://indico.cern.ch/conferenceDisplay.py?confId=155620

Edit Number 5: Published thing with lots of great info. Thanks to Ausfailia
http://static.arxiv.org/pdf/1109.4897.pdf
eh?
Bibdy
Profile Joined March 2010
United States3481 Posts
September 22 2011 19:34 GMT
#2
PRECIPITOUS PRETENTIOUS PREPOSTEROUSNESS!

Nothing moves faster than the speed of light and I base this assumption on my physics professors telling me so. So there.
kmkkmk
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany418 Posts
September 22 2011 19:35 GMT
#3
I certainly does mess with all the people here, that have an option on any topic and are always right, obviously.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
September 22 2011 19:36 GMT
#4
Perhaps they are mistaking the distance between the source and the detection.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
See.Blue
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States2673 Posts
September 22 2011 19:36 GMT
#5
Badass stuff. Go science!
Gatsbi
Profile Joined April 2010
United States1134 Posts
September 22 2011 19:36 GMT
#6
I was just about to make an OP for this.

Pretty fucking crazy if it's true, right? Kind of turns upside down everything about Physics?
"IF WHAT YOU DO NOT KNOW IS MORE THAN WHAT YOU HAVE KNOWN. THEN YOU HAVE NOT KNOWN ANYTHINIG YET." - Rev Kojo Smith
cptKewk
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden87 Posts
September 22 2011 19:36 GMT
#7
Just about to start this thread, a friend sent the link. It could be huge but I'm skeptical until it is repeated over and over. Don't want it to be true; have to learn new stuff instead of what I know already ;P
Science cannot move forward without heaps!
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
September 22 2011 19:36 GMT
#8
motion at a distance
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
RandomAccount#49059
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2140 Posts
September 22 2011 19:36 GMT
#9
--- Nuked ---
Stijx
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States804 Posts
September 22 2011 19:37 GMT
#10
This could be very interesting indeed... I await the announcement of an error.
DarkEnergy
Profile Joined June 2011
Netherlands542 Posts
September 22 2011 19:38 GMT
#11
According to my limited experience and narrow understanding of physics thats very unlikely.
Interesting tough, if we want to explore space. We need to be able to bend the laws of physics mainly the one that nothing can exceed the speed of light.
Thats right stimmed marines can outrun aeroplanes.Tasteless
SomeONEx
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden641 Posts
September 22 2011 19:39 GMT
#12
I have never really understood my good 'ole teacher when he told me that things can't be faster then the speed of light. "It's only a matter of time before "we" break the laws" said to him, and it seems (for now) as though I was right.
BW hwaiting!
Mowr
Profile Joined November 2010
Sweden791 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-22 19:42:28
September 22 2011 19:41 GMT
#13
"CERN CAN CREATE BLACK HOLES!" Oh, that wasn't really true.
"CERN FINDS DARK MATTER PARTICLES!" Oh, that was one of the regular statistical anomalies.
"CERN FINDS COSMIC PARTICLES GOVERN CLOUD FORMATION!" Oh, they just found the opposite.

News media simply cannot report about science since they do not care at all about the scientific process. Never trust any headlines. Ever.
Kill one man and they'll call you a murderer. Kill an army of men and they'll call you a general. But kill all men and they'll call you a god.
Supert0fu
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States499 Posts
September 22 2011 19:41 GMT
#14
This is shocking. I don't even know how this is possible.
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
September 22 2011 19:43 GMT
#15
On September 23 2011 04:41 Mowr wrote:
"CERN CAN CREATE BLACK HOLES!" Oh, that wasn't really true.
"CERN FINDS DARK MATTER PARTICLES!" Oh, that was one of the regular statistical anomalies.
"CERN FINDS COSMIC PARTICLES GOVERN CLOUD FORMATION!" Oh, they just found the opposite.

News media simply cannot report about science since they do not care at all about the scientific process. Never trust any headlines. Ever.


Then you might want to read the article, along with the headline.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
Ramong
Profile Joined March 2011
Denmark1706 Posts
September 22 2011 19:43 GMT
#16
SERN wants to take over the world with their new time machine!
"Yeah buddy"
Tuba
Profile Joined June 2011
United States45 Posts
September 22 2011 19:43 GMT
#17
Most of me expects them to discover it was some kind of error... But the kid in me wants it to be some kind of new groundbreaking science that takes us closer to cruising around the galaxy in spaceships.
gurrpp
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States437 Posts
September 22 2011 19:43 GMT
#18
I'm pretty sure they've rechecked their calculations many times. Still, sometimes many times isn't enough. We'll see if independent parties can replicate their results, then we can freak out about fundamental laws of physics.
hot fuh days
askTeivospy
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
1525 Posts
September 22 2011 19:43 GMT
#19
i'll wait until scientists scrutinize it.

if its said to be on the level then i'll wait until other papers come out and support the claim
hihihi
Warlike Prince
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
371 Posts
September 22 2011 19:44 GMT
#20
my guess, the curvature of the earth is to blame. 700km is enough distance on land that if it went right through the ground it would not have to travel quite than far.
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